kthung2 wrote:
I don't get the point of the EVF hate. If you need a full EVF then buy the A7 series. The whole point of a different line of bodies is to offer differentiation and not cannibalize a7 sales. If I'm not mistaken the "C" series are mainly designed for video/content creation. Lightweight second body for professional photographers is probably not their target.
You don't put a 61mp sensor in a camera marketed to video creators. The R version of the C will definitely be targeted for stills and really needs a decent viewfinder. I don't care so much about a second slot or even what type of LCD I get because I've never used the second slot I currently have and I use the EVF nearly 100% of the time. I'm not saying the EVF has to be high resolution but it at least needs a better magnification than the first C camera had.
I agree. I think more than anything the A7Rc will be the hot seller. Landscape shooters can use the LCD better reduce the size from the A7RV which I have and be able to get around better without the hump. Im not buying either but if I was than I would go 61mpx
I also DO NOT shoot video
kthung2 wrote:
I don't get the point of the EVF hate. If you need a full EVF then buy the A7 series. The whole point of a different line of bodies is to offer differentiation and not cannibalize a7 sales. If I'm not mistaken the "C" series are mainly designed for video/content creation. Lightweight second body for professional photographers is probably not their target.
There are those that hate every new release. Just look at the hate with the A1's lack of updates once the A7R5 was released. People were threatening ( I'm sure Sony is shaking in their boots ) of jumping to Nikon because Sony does not add features via firmware.
My view is that if one cannot find a camera that suites them within the Sony landscape...then that's on them, not Sony.
GMPhotography wrote:
No its not I certainly am not there target but to gimp on your functionality of your product is not smart either . Pro or not people still look inside them to use. Folks look at the overall scheme of things not your personal preference that means nothing to be honest. If you're swirling around in complaints then something is wrong with your product. This is not overblown. I have been a Pro for a long ass time having a viewfinder is very critical for a lot of shooting. Many types of photography its very hard not to have your eye pressed in to actually view/focus and shoot not to mention compose.
Look im being the devils advocate here. I like sony a lot and went in on the A7r was one of the first and they have grown very well. But im also the asshole that will tell them they are doing something wrong here. Ive been an ambassador to Leica and Phase One that's what we do is tell them they are making a mistake or pat them on the back as well. The EVF is an easy fix in my mind but I know it would probably cost them more to produce . Just raise the damn price than 50 bucks.
I just got a 6700 without a damn USB cord. REALLY is that okay too
Obviously this is sensitive to some users here . I will walk away with head up but to accept this from a OEM is wrong too . I have gotten a USB cord in the many of camera brands in digital since 1991 when I started with digital. Now we don't even get a dollar value USB cord. Im sorry that's stupid and looks bad even though I may have 20 of them laying around.
I certainly don't fault consumers for expressing their feelings. I think perhaps I am playing the devil's advocate role more than you are based on the feedback in this thread. Of course it would be nice to tick off every box that every person wants, but from the manufacturers perspective where do you draw the line? Ok add the EVF as just one more feature, then people complain about the joystick, add that one more feature then it's something else. Eventually you go all the way down the list and you will just end up with an identical camera to the A7 series. No hate to you or anyone else for wishful thinking. Just enjoying the conversation while we wait for the official release. Cheers!
kthung2 wrote:
I certainly don't fault consumers for expressing their feelings. I think perhaps I am playing the devil's advocate role more than you are based on the feedback in this thread. Of course it would be nice to tick off every box that every person wants, but from the manufacturers perspective where do you draw the line? Ok add the EVF as just one more feature, then people complain about the joystick, add that one more feature then it's something else. Eventually you go all the way down the list and you will just end up with an identical camera to the A7 series. No hate to you or anyone else for wishful thinking. Just enjoying the conversation while we wait for the official release. Cheers! ...Show more →
Yes, in a forum like this - full of serious hobbyists, passionate enthusiasts and pros - we all eventually design some variation of the A1...
On the EVF...I wonder if Sony's recon is telling them those that buy the "C" models typically don't use the EVF much anyways, so the resolution isn't a deal-breaker for anyone. But- even if that's their thought process, you'd think producing an "R" version would bring about a different type of user who would also expect an EVF that more closely matches a 61MP sensor.
I have a7c and I only use EVF, being out during the day.
My sight might not be top notch, but during the day, not even a bright sun light, I cannot use screen, not on a7c or any other camera to be honest.
phinix wrote:
I have a7c and I only use EVF, being out during the day.
My sight might not be top notch, but during the day, not even a bright sun light, I cannot use screen, not on a7c or any other camera to be honest.
Interesting. I can't bring myself to use the screen to compose on my A7R series cams, it just feels so wrong. i don't enjoy it. But I'm much more able to do it on my X100V...I wonder where the A7C series would fall on my odd spectrum of usability.
But I'm also with you...even in reasonably bright light, I can't see the screen. Maybe it's aging...haha.
gocolts wrote:
On the EVF...I wonder if Sony's recon is telling them those that buy the "C" models typically don't use the EVF much anyways, so the resolution isn't a deal-breaker for anyone. But- even if that's their thought process, you'd think producing an "R" version would bring about a different type of user who would also expect an EVF that more closely matches a 61MP sensor.
Than there ambassadors are not giving them accurate data
Surely Sony is making most of its decisions based more on what people are saying with their wallets rather than relying on word of mouth from ambassadors. If this is the case it seems for most consumers, EVF is not a priority?
Probably not but they are entry level systems for better than iPhone users or social media junkies . That’s not what’s on this forum which is more serious photographers. Different market level for sure. Those systems are more video based as well.
Sony has way too many bodies in its lineups. It’s absurd at this point. But, the a7cR is getting close to my dream camera. If it surprises on price (say under 3k) I think it’ll sell to a lot landscape shooters and backcountry types. The a7cII? Maybe primarily for travel. And yes I agree with all who are criticizing the evf magnification and pixel density. A real miss by Sony. Marketing told corporate to save something for the cR Mark II and c Mark III. Joystick and second card slot too.
Justin Stone wrote:
Sony has way too many bodies in its lineups. It’s absurd at this point. But, the a7cR is getting close to my dream camera. If it surprises on price (say under 3k) I think it’ll sell to a lot landscape shooters and backcountry types. The a7cII? Maybe primarily for travel. And yes I agree with all who are criticizing the evf magnification and pixel density. A real miss by Sony. Marketing told corporate to save something for the cR Mark II and c Mark III. Joystick and second card slot too.
I think the goal for this product is minimize the size and the development team could not add a second slot or joystick without increasing the size of the camera. Why would Sony build a camera just like all the other A7(r) cameras with all their features. If a joystick or 2nd card are really important to you, just get one of many that Sony offers. The A7c(r) series are for those that value compact size at the expense of some of the features on the larger cameras.
We have plenty of camera options with Sony…let’s hope Sony keeps things this way.
When I had an A7c as my 2nd camera, I remember putting the CV 15 on it and thinking what a slick & packable little machine it was for landscapes/sunsets....but I wanted more than 24MP for those kinds of shots.
Since I'm confident my A1 will suffice for me for a hell of a long time for a lot of uses, maybe I'll justify picking up an A7cR if it comes to be, as the A1 has definitely changed my upgrade cycle for bodies. And a small 61MP body would pretty much be perfect for travel, which we do a good amount of.
In the release of the A7R5, Sony said the AI chip made better use of the IR sensor for color accuracy with skin tones. I agree with Manny Ortiz that the yellow tones went away. I wonder if this new small body will have the infrared sensor to keep this new color accuracy.
The A7C was the camera that got me into photography, I finally felt like there was a full frame camera that was small enough I wouldn't mind carrying it with me. Loved using it, but after a year I really started to miss having more hands on control, namely at least one more dial and button. Bought the A7IV and have been loving it for that, though I do notice the size a bit more (I know Sony's are relatively small compared to other brands).
The one thing I really missed from the A7C was the looks, since I had the one with the silver top. I liked that retro vibe sort of vibe, and the fact it didn't look like all the other A bodies just cut down features. Now that the new A7C has more hands on controls (we think) and I'd lose no functionality I need from the A7IV, I'm tempted to go back.
While I’ve owned two A7C and would love a better EVF I bought it as a travel/backup body and never see it replacing my A7IV which is really not that big and heavy for a camera with a better viewfinder, better sensor, two card slots and a better grip. Maybe the A7C II can but probably not except if it has the new AI based AF and other updates like the A7RV. The same will be the case of the A7CR and A7RV. Small size is nice but none of the A7x bodies are too large in my opinion when compared to the Nikon Z8 or Z9 or other large Mirrorless bodies. One reason I like the larger Sony bodies is because I like the GM lens family and their features and optical quality. Sure I can and do use smaller glass but not for real serious opportunities.
It’s almost as if people arguing that Sony can only deliver a camera that’s smaller if it excludes features that other cameras have have drinking buddies on the development team.
Whatever… I’m psyched for the smaller format cameras. It’s a good direction for Sony. I can make great pictures with close enough. Most of us can.
chez wrote:
I think the goal for this product is minimize the size and the development team could not add a second slot or joystick without increasing the size of the camera. Why would Sony build a camera just like all the other A7(r) cameras with all their features. If a joystick or 2nd card are really important to you, just get one of many that Sony offers. The A7c(r) series are for those that value compact size at the expense of some of the features on the larger cameras.
We have plenty of camera options with Sony…let’s hope Sony keeps things this way....Show more →
GMPhotography wrote:
For me the 61mpx version makes more sense , sure it's more money but I look at money as the last comparative number not the first. Get what you want then figure out the cash.
Fred I have a feeling the rumor will change at least one more time.
Haha, I wish Sony would just stick to their camera plans and spare the poor rumor sites from all the extra work!
jwpstl wrote:
You don't put a 61mp sensor in a camera marketed to video creators. The R version of the C will definitely be targeted for stills and really needs a decent viewfinder. I don't care so much about a second slot or even what type of LCD I get because I've never used the second slot I currently have and I use the EVF nearly 100% of the time. I'm not saying the EVF has to be high resolution but it at least needs a better magnification than the first C camera had.
Yes, i would settle for the higher resolution on the EVF, and that probably doesn't take up more space. I'm not sure it would cost more to produce either. The external part of the EVF on the new models looks slightly larger to me than the EVF on the A7C, so perhaps they also made it a bit deeper and better shielded from sunlight.
If the rumors are close to accurate, it sounds like Sony is making a real differentiation between the A7CII and the A7CR. Getting 8 stop IBIS on the A7CR with a better EVF would be worth a lot to me.
