Personally these new Canon releases give me the same sinking feeling I have about Nikon's mirrorless. All these cameras and lenses are fantastic, but the prices are getting really out of hand. Its very hard to visualise what the enthusiast (affordable) camera and lens systems will look like in say a year or two - that seems to me to apply to both Canon and Nikon.
rscheffler wrote:
It's only a matter of time until prices settle, as they nearly always do. But it will depend on factors such as initial and sustained sales vs. Canon's forecast. Given these cameras will appeal to wedding/event photographers in the upgrade cycle, another question is how soon this group will jump in, given that many/most likely have lost a lot of revenue this year. For example, I haven't had a shoot since March with virtually zero revenue since, but these are pretty much the cameras I've been waiting for Canon to release and finally transition to mirrorless. Without Covid, I'd pay the early adopter premium, but now will likely wait until next year. ...Show more →
Covid is like Beano....it gets rid of the GAS.
And with that said, I think many will realize this new shiny toy isn't going to produce any better photos than their 5D3 or 5D4. It might make it easier to capture them, but after all said and done we haven't really seen an improvement to images in a long time other than at high ISO's. I see photos from my 16 year old 1DmkII and they are just as good as today's 1DXII photos (in good light of course).
David Baldwin wrote:
Personally these new Canon releases give me the same sinking feeling I have about Nikon's mirrorless. All these cameras and lenses are fantastic, but the prices are getting really out of hand. Its very hard to visualise what the enthusiast (affordable) camera and lens systems will look like in say a year or two - that seems to me to apply to both Canon and Nikon.
Yes, and Canon takes it up a good step further with the R5. It is a camera for professionals as Canon keeps insisting, and the R6 is for "professionals and advanced amateurs".
But the R6 is 20mp, and that alone only underscores how relevant APS-C crop mode cameras still are. A mirrorless alternative to the 7DII for all those that cannot simply plunk out 4500,- to get 20mp on a crop surface.
So I find this whole Canon campaign a truly mixed bag: nice for the sheer advancements in the R5, but a truly gloomy event for crop shooters that have no hope whatsoever that the tech will trickle down into an affordable crop body, like with the Nikon D5 and D500 pair, or the Canon 1DX and 7D pair.
For birders/wildlife shooters: if only Canon had brought out a 200-600mm with f6.3 minimal aperture, then the R6 and a 1.4TC would at least have been a serious option. As it is, who is this RF system for?
I suppose most of the hype was about the video. I don't use it, but assume that meets the needs of users.
At least the 5R is not as crippled as I feared.
The rear display doesn't look good, but I could live with it.
I would have preferred the 1DX III AF controller, but at least it has the joystick.
The removal of the GPS is inexcusable, and the most obvious flaw so far.
ChrisMak wrote:
Yes, and Canon takes it up a good step further with the R5. It is a camera for professionals as Canon keeps insisting, and the R6 is for "professionals and advanced amateurs".
But the R6 is 20mp, and that alone only underscores how relevant APS-C crop mode cameras still are. A mirrorless alternative to the 7DII for all those that cannot simply plunk out 4500,- to get 20mp on a crop surface.
So I find this whole Canon campaign a truly mixed bag: nice for the sheer advancements in the R5, but a truly gloomy event for crop shooters that have no hope whatsoever that the tech will trickle down into an affordable crop body, like with the Nikon D5 and D500 pair, or the Canon 1DX and 7D pair.
For birders/wildlife shooters: if only Canon had brought out a 200-600mm with f6.3 minimal aperture, then the R6 and a 1.4TC would at least have been a serious option. As it is, who is this RF system for?...Show more →
I don't think $400 USD more than the release price of the 5D4 5 years ago should come as surprise. I was hoping it would have been the same price but I kinda knew it wouldn't/couldn't be.
Who is the RF system for? How about Canon users that have a ton of EF glass that performs even better when adapted to the RF bodies?
It's hilarious to see the only negative other brand users can come up with is a $400 increase over a 5 year period for a camera that blows it's predecessor as well as all the competition away on nearly every level.
lighthound wrote:
It's hilarious to see the only negative other brand users can come up with is a $400 increase over a 5 year period for a camera that blows it's predecessor as well as all the competition away on nearly every level.
David Baldwin wrote:
Personally these new Canon releases give me the same sinking feeling I have about Nikon's mirrorless. All these cameras and lenses are fantastic, but the prices are getting really out of hand. Its very hard to visualise what the enthusiast (affordable) camera and lens systems will look like in say a year or two - that seems to me to apply to both Canon and Nikon.
Just wait and buy them used for a huge discount. These new toys are fun to own but they are most likely not going to improve your images enough to warrant spending the introductory price. I held onto my 5DII and 5DIII for years and just upgraded to some cheap 5DIV's not too long ago. The old cameras can hang with the new cameras all day long unless it's in extreme lighting situations or if you happen to need 8K for some reason.
slowdad wrote:
I am a wedding photographer who does wildlife photography for hobby- I have captured over 600 weddings
Here is the bottom line for me with this R5
1- It has to be better than a 5D4 and be close to my 1Dx2 for performance
2- It has to focus in the dark and be able to hit moving objects at wedding receptions....the EOS R struggles here
Every wedding photographer I know that has both DSLR and Mirrorless...Puts the mirrorless away at receptions because they dont play well with flash assisted needs....The exception would be A9 users. They seem to have things figured out and work arounds for rolling shutter issues
R5 appears to be a massive upgrade for videographers. Wedding stills photographers may be better served with DSLR's if Canon mirrorless still has same issues as EOSR and Nikons Z6 systems
ask any reputable wedding photographer who uses both systems and you will get the same answers.
R5 must be better then current DSLR's for our needs...Show more →
Like another poster.... for me... depends which lens... but i shoot both at reception (5DIV and EOS R) for the last year.
slowdad wrote:
I am a wedding photographer who does wildlife photography for hobby- I have captured over 600 weddings
Here is the bottom line for me with this R5
1- It has to be better than a 5D4 and be close to my 1Dx2 for performance
2- It has to focus in the dark and be able to hit moving objects at wedding receptions....the EOS R struggles here
Every wedding photographer I know that has both DSLR and Mirrorless...Puts the mirrorless away at receptions because they dont play well with flash assisted needs....The exception would be A9 users. They seem to have things figured out and work arounds for rolling shutter issues
R5 appears to be a massive upgrade for videographers. Wedding stills photographers may be better served with DSLR's if Canon mirrorless still has same issues as EOSR and Nikons Z6 systems
ask any reputable wedding photographer who uses both systems and you will get the same answers.
R5 must be better then current DSLR's for our needs...Show more →
For the money it has to be better than the D850/D500 in AF performance, something even the 1DXII couldn't achieve. The hope here is based on how well the 1DXIII performed in LV mode against the A9II, that the R5 can match that; if so it should be very good. Hopefully it has none of the AF foibles of the Canon DSLRs.
lighthound wrote:
I don't think $400 USD more than the release price of the 5D4 5 years ago should come as surprise. I was hoping it would have been the same price but I kinda knew it wouldn't/couldn't be.
Who is the RF system for? How about Canon users that have a ton of EF glass that performs even better when adapted to the RF bodies?
It's hilarious to see the only negative other brand users can come up with is a $400 increase over a 5 year period for a camera that blows it's predecessor as well as all the competition away on nearly every level.
Just my opinion as a current Canon crop shooter....Show more →
You are missing the point, perhaps being to eager to read negativity in my post. The R5 appears to be a groundbreaking camera, but it's questionable whether the majority of Canon shooters are well served with a 4500,- body that centres on 8k video delivery.
Canon appears to be sacrificing what must have been a very substantial user base, and doing so for the benefit of some ultra high end shooters. No 7DIII, no crop R camera to let the tech trickle down. I did not sell the 400DOII lightheartedly, but have zero regrets. I really wonder if the EF lenses will get their best performance adapted to the R5 at all?
I don't doubt that the R5 is a great body, but I don't doubt that it will not bring the masses of wildlife and birding shooters back to Canon either, even with affordable f11 lenses. And of course I realize that Canon does not care a slightest bit about that, they just want to realize their own agenda. All fine, but I am personally glad I switched away from Canon, they are simply too unreliable regarding supporting my type of shooter with the budget I have. Nikon offers more reliability if you are not a pro shooter.
I have been saying that for a while. This is from another forum.
I'm not sure if I or we will ever know how much difference it will make to have a dedicated RF lens that takes full advantage of the 3 extra pins for high speed transmission. That is one reason why I'm doing this. I have never experienced what it is like to shoot with a 1DX series camera or a Sony A9 II, etc but I figure the R5 is will be pretty close.
Heck the R AF is/was better than my 7D2/5D4, 400 DO II and 2X. Both those bodies were not great at acquiring initial AF in Servo while following a moving object. It also made me question the tracking accuracy after initial AF was acquired (when it felt like doing so). The R focuses pretty quickly with that combo but it lacks the horsepower, etc.
This camera seems like a terrific action shooter with great DR and resolution. So far though the only hands-on testing I’ve seen are with non-supertelephoto lenses. Very fast glass. Can’t wait to see someone test it for BIF with a big white.
I’m mostly a medium format landscape shooter now using Fuji GFX 100, but have owned Canon gear for 30 years using it mostly for wildlife and macro. I’ve drifted away from Canon (and FF in general) as my interest in printing immense landscape with great scope in DR and tonal gradation has increased. But the R5 seems like a must-have as an excellent action-oriented compliment to the Fuji. It helps that I can use some of my EF lenses on both systems to great effect.
So, I’m getting this camera as soon as I can - probably in 5 years used. It’s not so much the cost of the R5, but after dropping about $20k on Fuji over the last 10 months my wife has me thinking about the even higher cost of GAS-induced divorce.😆
