Leica M EV - overpriced?
p.3 #1Leica M EV - overpriced?
Fred Miranda wrote:
Is the sensor in the M11 not the IMX455BQK?
I don't think I've seen the AQK sensor variants in any cameras outside of scientific, but maybe Leica convinced Sony to supply them.
Fwiw my mono astro camera has the ALK variant which states it lacks the pdaf pixels. However, when pushing data hard (as one does with astro) I can expose pdaf banding that I then calibrate out. The pdaf may be disabled at a hardware level but the pixels still exist. Given its in an M camera Leica probably didn't engineer a solution.
The M11 base sensor doesn't actually have PDAF to start with, so Leica doesn't have to strip anything out for the M EV1 (based on the M11 sensor)...phase-detection pixels are only baked in for their autofocus lines like the SL3. Skipping PDAF entirely on the manual-focus M series is actually a win for image quality because it keeps the pixel matrix completely uniform. Without those split or masked phase-detection pixels, you avoid subtle digital artifacts or banding under harsh lighting, ensuring every single pixel delivers pure, micro-contrast and raw detail...so that's the direction Leica took with the M EV1. The Nikon Zf is an AF camera anyways, so PDAF was already there for AF and Nikon used that for focus confirmation. Now, how much degradation PDAF causes is debatable.I haven't gone too deep down that rabbit hole myself, but imagine if Leica drops a firmware update for the M11 series (including the M EV1) that magically enables focus confirmation. Then we'd know the PDAF pixels were secretly baked in all along! 
I know, pure wishful thinking.Leica doesn't even have manual focus confirmation on the SL3 for manually focusing their SL AF lenses.Yep. I think the first sign will be seeing an SL3 series firmware update address this...or waiting all the way for the SL4. In other words, if Leica figures focus magnification and peaking are already "good enough", it's going to be a very long wait (if it happens at all). Meantime I will continue enjoying the Zf mainly for this feature alone!
Perhaps on the SL4, but only for electronically coupled SL-lenses then.
For M-lenses I am pretty sure they would only add it if at the same time they can do it on the M-EV2 and M12 as well.
highdesertmesa wrote
Fred Miranda wrote
thrice wrote
Hi Fred,Is the sensor in the M11 not the IMX455BQK?
I don't think I've seen the AQK sensor variants in any cameras outside of scientific, but maybe Leica convinced Sony to supply them.
Fwiw my mono astro camera has the ALK variant which states it lacks the pdaf pixels. However, when pushing data hard (as one does with astro) I can expose pdaf banding that I then calibrate out. The pdaf may be disabled at a hardware level but the pixels still exist. Given its in an M camera Leica probably didn't engineer a solution.
Fred Miranda wrote
RoamingScott wrote
What is the benefit for Leica and IQ, if any, of them stripping out the PDAF that is already in the Sony sensor they are using? I know, pure wishful thinking.Perhaps on the SL4, but only for electronically coupled SL-lenses then.
For M-lenses I am pretty sure they would only add it if at the same time they can do it on the M-EV2 and M12 as well.
Sep 09, 2026 at 06:32 AM
p.3 #2Leica M EV - overpriced?
highdesertmesa wrote:
Is the sensor in the M11 not the IMX455BQK?
I don't think I've seen the AQK sensor variants in any cameras outside of scientific, but maybe Leica convinced Sony to supply them.
Fwiw my mono astro camera has the ALK variant which states it lacks the pdaf pixels. However, when pushing data hard (as one does with astro) I can expose pdaf banding that I then calibrate out. The pdaf may be disabled at a hardware level but the pixels still exist. Given its in an M camera Leica probably didn't engineer a solution.
I haven't gone too deep down that rabbit hole myself, but imagine if Leica drops a firmware update for the M11 series (including the M EV1) that magically enables focus confirmation. Then we'd know the PDAF pixels were secretly baked in all along! I know, pure wishful thinking.Leica doesn't even have manual focus confirmation on the SL3 for manually focusing their SL AF lenses.Yep. I think the first sign will be seeing an SL3 series firmware update address this...or waiting all the way for the SL4. In other words, if Leica figures focus magnification and peaking are already "good enough", it's going to be a very long wait (if it happens at all). Meantime I will continue enjoying the Zf mainly for this feature alone!If only Nikon and Canon allowed the focus confirmation to happen for non-electronically connected lenses without requiring an electronically-connected adapter to trick the camera into thinking it's an electronically connected lens! It should be enough to enter the focal length as is already done to enable IBIS.
Manual lens data entry to allow IBIS is what I miss most on the Nikon ZR. With most cine glass being electronics free mechanical focus, there is really no excuse. The Z Voigtländer lenses provide focus confirmation and 3 axis IBIS; for 5-axis distance scale would need to be communicated to the body.
A 2nd generation EV1 could advantageously use the RF cam to provide distance readout for IBIS. But as there is no way of predicting how long it will take Leica to get to a shutterless, IBIS equipped M body, the EV1 seemed to provide reasonable value proposition to me at the beginning of 2026. The magnified focus view, without any other assists, on the ZR and EV1 seem equally functional. Things will get very interesting if Nikon can pull out a ZS rangefinder style EVF variant of the ZR, and remove their deliberate dumb lens software cripple that blocks focus confirmation and IBIS.
Fred Miranda wrote
highdesertmesa wrote
Fred Miranda wrote
thrice wrote
Hi Fred,Is the sensor in the M11 not the IMX455BQK?
I don't think I've seen the AQK sensor variants in any cameras outside of scientific, but maybe Leica convinced Sony to supply them.
Fwiw my mono astro camera has the ALK variant which states it lacks the pdaf pixels. However, when pushing data hard (as one does with astro) I can expose pdaf banding that I then calibrate out. The pdaf may be disabled at a hardware level but the pixels still exist. Given its in an M camera Leica probably didn't engineer a solution.
Fred Miranda wrote
The M11 base sensor doesn't actually have PDAF to start with, so Leica doesn't have to strip anything out for the M EV1 (based on the M11 sensor)...phase-detection pixels are only baked in for their autofocus lines like the SL3. Skipping PDAF entirely on the manual-focus M series is actually a win for image quality because it keeps the pixel matrix completely uniform. Without those split or masked phase-detection pixels, you avoid subtle digital artifacts or banding under harsh lighting, ensuring every single pixel delivers pure, micro-contrast and raw detail...so that's the direction Leica took with the M EV1. The Nikon Zf is an AF camera anyways, so PDAF was already there for AF and Nikon used that for focus confirmation. Now, how much degradation PDAF causes is debatable. I know, pure wishful thinking.Manual lens data entry to allow IBIS is what I miss most on the Nikon ZR. With most cine glass being electronics free mechanical focus, there is really no excuse. The Z Voigtländer lenses provide focus confirmation and 3 axis IBIS; for 5-axis distance scale would need to be communicated to the body.
A 2nd generation EV1 could advantageously use the RF cam to provide distance readout for IBIS. But as there is no way of predicting how long it will take Leica to get to a shutterless, IBIS equipped M body, the EV1 seemed to provide reasonable value proposition to me at the beginning of 2026. The magnified focus view, without any other assists, on the ZR and EV1 seem equally functional. Things will get very interesting if Nikon can pull out a ZS rangefinder style EVF variant of the ZR, and remove their deliberate dumb lens software cripple that blocks focus confirmation and IBIS.
Sep 09, 2026 at 07:02 AM
p.3 #4Leica M EV - overpriced?
SlowDriver wrote:
What is the benefit for Leica and IQ, if any, of them stripping out the PDAF that is already in the Sony sensor they are using?The M11 base sensor doesn't actually have PDAF to start with, so Leica doesn't have to strip anything out for the M EV1 (based on the M11 sensor)...phase-detection pixels are only baked in for their autofocus lines like the SL3. Skipping PDAF entirely on the manual-focus M series is actually a win for image quality because it keeps the pixel matrix completely uniform. Without those split or masked phase-detection pixels, you avoid subtle digital artifacts or banding under harsh lighting, ensuring every single pixel delivers pure, micro-contrast and raw detail...so that's the direction Leica took with the M EV1. The Nikon Zf is an AF camera anyways, so PDAF was already there for AF and Nikon used that for focus confirmation. Now, how much degradation PDAF causes is debatable.The next logical question then, why does my now almost 8-year-old Canon EOS R have focus confirmation whereas the latest Leica SL3-P does not?
Your last point does not jive with latest comments. The SL line does give a green indication when focus point is locked on.
Fred Miranda wrote
RoamingScott wrote
Fred Miranda wrote
If Leica ever firmware updates the M EV1 to support focus confirmation like the Nikon Zf, I'd buy one immediately. The catch is that the Zf relies on sensor-level PDAF pixels to calculate distance and confirm focus. If the M EV1 sensor lacks PDAF hardware (which may be the case), a firmware update alone won't do it...meaning Leica would have to save that feature for the next generation, assuming they even make a successor.Your last point does not jive with latest comments. The SL line does give a green indication when focus point is locked on.
Sep 09, 2026 at 10:50 AM
p.3 #5Leica M EV - overpriced?
Fred Miranda wrote:
Is the sensor in the M11 not the IMX455BQK?
I don't think I've seen the AQK sensor variants in any cameras outside of scientific, but maybe Leica convinced Sony to supply them.
Fwiw my mono astro camera has the ALK variant which states it lacks the pdaf pixels. However, when pushing data hard (as one does with astro) I can expose pdaf banding that I then calibrate out. The pdaf may be disabled at a hardware level but the pixels still exist. Given its in an M camera Leica probably didn't engineer a solution.
The M11 base sensor doesn't actually have PDAF to start with, so Leica doesn't have to strip anything out for the M EV1 (based on the M11 sensor)...phase-detection pixels are only baked in for their autofocus lines like the SL3. Skipping PDAF entirely on the manual-focus M series is actually a win for image quality because it keeps the pixel matrix completely uniform. Without those split or masked phase-detection pixels, you avoid subtle digital artifacts or banding under harsh lighting, ensuring every single pixel delivers pure, micro-contrast and raw detail...so that's the direction Leica took with the M EV1. The Nikon Zf is an AF camera anyways, so PDAF was already there for AF and Nikon used that for focus confirmation. Now, how much degradation PDAF causes is debatable.I haven't gone too deep down that rabbit hole myself, but imagine if Leica drops a firmware update for the M11 series (including the M EV1) that magically enables focus confirmation. Then we'd know the PDAF pixels were secretly baked in all along! I know, pure wishful thinking.Leica doesn't even have manual focus confirmation on the SL3 for manually focusing their SL AF lenses.Yep. I think the first sign will be seeing an SL3 series firmware update address this...or waiting all the way for the SL4. In other words, if Leica figures focus magnification and peaking are already "good enough", it's going to be a very long wait (if it happens at all). Meantime I will continue enjoying the Zf mainly for this feature alone!
Interesting, thanks, Fred, sir. Just as well that I recently decided to disregard researching an SL purchase.
I could never warm-up to the ZF. Handled several; in-store demonstrators, and a friend’s gripped ZF. Then, that same friend, in his role as a camera store store employee, put a Nikon ZR into my hands. Planets aligned. Angels sang. Who needs an EVF, anyway? Direct from OVF to 4” articulating LCD. I o’er-leaped the EVF! 🙂
highdesertmesa wrote
Fred Miranda wrote
thrice wrote
Hi Fred,Is the sensor in the M11 not the IMX455BQK?
I don't think I've seen the AQK sensor variants in any cameras outside of scientific, but maybe Leica convinced Sony to supply them.
Fwiw my mono astro camera has the ALK variant which states it lacks the pdaf pixels. However, when pushing data hard (as one does with astro) I can expose pdaf banding that I then calibrate out. The pdaf may be disabled at a hardware level but the pixels still exist. Given its in an M camera Leica probably didn't engineer a solution.
Fred Miranda wrote
RoamingScott wrote
What is the benefit for Leica and IQ, if any, of them stripping out the PDAF that is already in the Sony sensor they are using? I know, pure wishful thinking.Interesting, thanks, Fred, sir. Just as well that I recently decided to disregard researching an SL purchase.
I could never warm-up to the ZF. Handled several; in-store demonstrators, and a friend’s gripped ZF. Then, that same friend, in his role as a camera store store employee, put a Nikon ZR into my hands. Planets aligned. Angels sang. Who needs an EVF, anyway? Direct from OVF to 4” articulating LCD. I o’er-leaped the EVF! 🙂
Sep 09, 2026 at 11:03 AM
p.3 #6Leica M EV - overpriced?
Nielk Mike wrote:
The price for the M series is high - and I always justified it because of the rangefinder OVF. The M-EV is basically no different from the Q - but comes without a lens. What justifies the price?
You’re asking about Leica if the price is justified?
That’s looking at it backwards. It’s only justified because people are willing to pay those prices, not by what the product costs to produce.
The price for the M series is high - and I always justified it because of the rangefinder OVF. The M-EV is basically no different from the Q - but comes without a lens. What justifies the price?
You’re asking about Leica if the price is justified?
That’s looking at it backwards. It’s only justified because people are willing to pay those prices, not by what the product costs to produce.
Sep 09, 2026 at 11:56 AM
p.3 #7Leica M EV - overpriced?
stgrove wrote:
What is the benefit for Leica and IQ, if any, of them stripping out the PDAF that is already in the Sony sensor they are using?The M11 base sensor doesn't actually have PDAF to start with, so Leica doesn't have to strip anything out for the M EV1 (based on the M11 sensor)...phase-detection pixels are only baked in for their autofocus lines like the SL3. Skipping PDAF entirely on the manual-focus M series is actually a win for image quality because it keeps the pixel matrix completely uniform. Without those split or masked phase-detection pixels, you avoid subtle digital artifacts or banding under harsh lighting, ensuring every single pixel delivers pure, micro-contrast and raw detail...so that's the direction Leica took with the M EV1. The Nikon Zf is an AF camera anyways, so PDAF was already there for AF and Nikon used that for focus confirmation. Now, how much degradation PDAF causes is debatable.The next logical question then, why does my now almost 8-year-old Canon EOS R have focus confirmation whereas the latest Leica SL3-P does not?Your last point does not jive with latest comments. The SL line does give a green indication when focus point is locked on.
Only with AF, not when manually focusing is my understanding, then you can only fall back on peaking and magnification.
SlowDriver wrote
Fred Miranda wrote
RoamingScott wrote
Fred Miranda wrote
If Leica ever firmware updates the M EV1 to support focus confirmation like the Nikon Zf, I'd buy one immediately. The catch is that the Zf relies on sensor-level PDAF pixels to calculate distance and confirm focus. If the M EV1 sensor lacks PDAF hardware (which may be the case), a firmware update alone won't do it...meaning Leica would have to save that feature for the next generation, assuming they even make a successor.Only with AF, not when manually focusing is my understanding, then you can only fall back on peaking and magnification.
Sep 09, 2026 at 12:07 PM
p.3 #8Leica M EV - overpriced?
Jorge Torralba wrote:
focus peaking sucks and is really only reliable if focusing with the lens wide open.
focus confirmation requires the camera to calculate distance based on data from the lens. manual lenses have no way of communicating this data to the camera. So no can do the little green box on SLx , or EV1 with existing hardware. Another reason the EV1 is NOT WORTH the price.
the zf a beautiful 1900.00 camera handles manual focus differently because of of the following.
the expeed 7 subject recognition which function differently depending on whether the lens has electronic contacts. And guess what, those...Show more →
If focus confirmation requires distance data from the lens, how is it you can trick a Nikon/Canon into accurate focus confirmation for dumb manual focus lenses by using an electronically connected adapter? I don’t think it’s required since said adapters only transmit focal length back to the camera.
focus peaking sucks and is really only reliable if focusing with the lens wide open.
focus confirmation requires the camera to calculate distance based on data from the lens. manual lenses have no way of communicating this data to the camera. So no can do the little green box on SLx , or EV1 with existing hardware. Another reason the EV1 is NOT WORTH the price.
the zf a beautiful 1900.00 camera handles manual focus differently because of of the following.
the expeed 7 subject recognition which function differently depending on whether the lens has electronic contacts. And guess what, those...Show more →
If focus confirmation requires distance data from the lens, how is it you can trick a Nikon/Canon into accurate focus confirmation for dumb manual focus lenses by using an electronically connected adapter? I don’t think it’s required since said adapters only transmit focal length back to the camera.
Sep 09, 2026 at 04:37 PM
p.3 #9Leica M EV - overpriced?
If you want focus confirmation while using a AF lens in manual focus, I wouldn’t be buying a Leica. I’d be buying an X2D/X2D2 with the focus clutch lenses. A super manual focus experience with native lenses.
Personally I find between the punch in focus and the *shimmer* you get with some objects that I don’t have any real issues manually focusing on an SL3 or EV-1. Sure I’d like the AF confirmation of the Zf but I’m not into low resolution cameras generally. And the last thing I need is another camera system.
Gordon
Personally I find between the punch in focus and the *shimmer* you get with some objects that I don’t have any real issues manually focusing on an SL3 or EV-1. Sure I’d like the AF confirmation of the Zf but I’m not into low resolution cameras generally. And the last thing I need is another camera system.
Gordon
Sep 09, 2026 at 04:38 PM
p.3 #10Leica M EV - overpriced?
flash wrote:
If you want focus confirmation while using a AF lens in manual focus, I wouldn’t be buying a Leica. I’d be buying an X2D/X2D2 with the focus clutch lenses. A super manual focus experience with native lenses.
Personally I find between the punch in focus and the *shimmer* you get with some objects that I don’t have any real issues manually focusing on an SL3 or EV-1. Sure I’d like the AF confirmation of the Zf but I’m not into low resolution cameras generally. And the last thing I need is another camera system.
Gordon
Additionally, the green confirmation box has the same drawbacks as autofocus, that being your intended point of focus isn’t always what the camera thinks it should be (due to af box size versus area of contrast — eyelashes versus eyeballs, etc.). Even with super accurate focus confirmation, the subject only has to move a few millimeters to throw off focus at wide apertures. Not saying it’s not a great feature, but it’s not going to beat using an AF lens that allows snapping the shot at the instant focus is achieved.
If you want focus confirmation while using a AF lens in manual focus, I wouldn’t be buying a Leica. I’d be buying an X2D/X2D2 with the focus clutch lenses. A super manual focus experience with native lenses.
Personally I find between the punch in focus and the *shimmer* you get with some objects that I don’t have any real issues manually focusing on an SL3 or EV-1. Sure I’d like the AF confirmation of the Zf but I’m not into low resolution cameras generally. And the last thing I need is another camera system.
Gordon
Additionally, the green confirmation box has the same drawbacks as autofocus, that being your intended point of focus isn’t always what the camera thinks it should be (due to af box size versus area of contrast — eyelashes versus eyeballs, etc.). Even with super accurate focus confirmation, the subject only has to move a few millimeters to throw off focus at wide apertures. Not saying it’s not a great feature, but it’s not going to beat using an AF lens that allows snapping the shot at the instant focus is achieved.
Sep 09, 2026 at 04:47 PM
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p.3 #11Leica M EV - overpriced?
The myth that focus confirmation needs distance from the lens is not quite true.
On-sensor PDAF doesn't need the lens to report how far you turned the helicoid. It just compares two views of the same point on the sensor and asks if they're lined up. When the phase difference hits zero, that spot is in focus...chip or no chip. Peaking is even simpler: it just paints contrast edges on the live image.
What does need electronics on a Zf is the green-box UI. A dumb adapter still gets subject boxes/recognition. They don't turn green unless the body thinks a CPU lens is attached. That's a firmware gate.
Chipped M-Z adapters allow for the green box to work (since the firmware requires it). They also feed FL for IBIS. However that IBIS part doesn't apply to the M11 or M EV1 since Leica M bodies don't offer IBIS and therefore don’t need FL for stabilization.
I believe Leica didn't include green-box PDAF confirmation for the M EV1 for the obvious reason: Its 60MP sensor does not have on-sensor PDAF pixels, since they use a different 60MP variant from the Q3/SL3.
If Leica puts the Q3/SL3 hybrid PDAF sensor in a future M EV2 or M12, a native green-box confirm for fully mechanical M glass is a software choice, not a physics problem.
Leica you can do it!
On-sensor PDAF doesn't need the lens to report how far you turned the helicoid. It just compares two views of the same point on the sensor and asks if they're lined up. When the phase difference hits zero, that spot is in focus...chip or no chip. Peaking is even simpler: it just paints contrast edges on the live image.
What does need electronics on a Zf is the green-box UI. A dumb adapter still gets subject boxes/recognition. They don't turn green unless the body thinks a CPU lens is attached. That's a firmware gate.
Chipped M-Z adapters allow for the green box to work (since the firmware requires it). They also feed FL for IBIS. However that IBIS part doesn't apply to the M11 or M EV1 since Leica M bodies don't offer IBIS and therefore don’t need FL for stabilization.
I believe Leica didn't include green-box PDAF confirmation for the M EV1 for the obvious reason: Its 60MP sensor does not have on-sensor PDAF pixels, since they use a different 60MP variant from the Q3/SL3.
If Leica puts the Q3/SL3 hybrid PDAF sensor in a future M EV2 or M12, a native green-box confirm for fully mechanical M glass is a software choice, not a physics problem.
Leica you can do it!
Sep 09, 2026 at 05:19 PM
p.3 #12Leica M EV - overpriced?
New deal coming soon to maybe try and move these?
Just lower the price of the body ~ $1000
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/2000696-REG/leica_20263_m_ev1_mirrorless_camera.html/
Just lower the price of the body ~ $1000
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/2000696-REG/leica_20263_m_ev1_mirrorless_camera.html/
Sep 10, 2026 at 12:35 PM
p.3 #13Leica M EV - overpriced?
What justifies the price of the EV-1 M? Nothing. Because Leica "can".
More interesting is to ask why Leica did not initially set the price similar to a Leica Q. This also answers the original question about justification - the price is set high enough to avoid in house competition with both the Q- and the SL-series. I am convinced that this is the case especially when manufacturing of the EV-1 should be much lower than a rangefinder based M camera with more mechanical parts. With a high price tag for an EVF-based camera, Leica decided rather to compromise on the amount of new users within the M-system - for example such, who would jump ship from the fixed-lens Q-system towards EV-1 M at similar price. Similar story with the SL - this series is plagued with lower than expected sales since introduction - very different than the Q-series which might be the best selling Leica Camera series now - so Leica didn't want to risk losing even few SL series to the EV-1 M. Especially those who use the SL series always with adapted M lenses since no other option was available in the Leica environment before the EV-1 M came out - now the EV-1 M price tag is much too high in comparison to switch.
Leica was more afraid of in-house competition than getting more new customers for the EV-1 M series is my interpretation in a nutshell. This behavior is in line with Leica's strategy since the M10 and SL releases where video was left out of M cameras and only found in the SL series. Also seen by removing more affordable f/2.4 and f/2.4 Summarit lines biting into Summicron f/2.0 lens sales. Leica's first priority is to make each of their camera (and lens) lines unique and separate enough from other lines with negligible overlap if possible.
Edited on Sep 10, 2026 at 01:02 PM · View previous versions
More interesting is to ask why Leica did not initially set the price similar to a Leica Q. This also answers the original question about justification - the price is set high enough to avoid in house competition with both the Q- and the SL-series. I am convinced that this is the case especially when manufacturing of the EV-1 should be much lower than a rangefinder based M camera with more mechanical parts. With a high price tag for an EVF-based camera, Leica decided rather to compromise on the amount of new users within the M-system - for example such, who would jump ship from the fixed-lens Q-system towards EV-1 M at similar price. Similar story with the SL - this series is plagued with lower than expected sales since introduction - very different than the Q-series which might be the best selling Leica Camera series now - so Leica didn't want to risk losing even few SL series to the EV-1 M. Especially those who use the SL series always with adapted M lenses since no other option was available in the Leica environment before the EV-1 M came out - now the EV-1 M price tag is much too high in comparison to switch.
Leica was more afraid of in-house competition than getting more new customers for the EV-1 M series is my interpretation in a nutshell. This behavior is in line with Leica's strategy since the M10 and SL releases where video was left out of M cameras and only found in the SL series. Also seen by removing more affordable f/2.4 and f/2.4 Summarit lines biting into Summicron f/2.0 lens sales. Leica's first priority is to make each of their camera (and lens) lines unique and separate enough from other lines with negligible overlap if possible.
Edited on Sep 10, 2026 at 01:02 PM · View previous versions
Sep 10, 2026 at 12:55 PM
RoamingScott
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p.3 #14Leica M EV - overpriced?
Being afraid of outselling your fixed lens camera and dissuading possible Leica lens buyers has got to be one of the most braindead marketing strategies since Canon's 5D line if that's true.
There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.
There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.
Sep 10, 2026 at 01:01 PM
p.3 #15Leica M EV - overpriced?
RoamingScott wrote:
Being afraid of outselling your fixed lens camera and dissuading possible Leica lens buyers has got to be one of the most braindead marketing strategies since Canon's 5D line if that's true.
There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.
In Leica terms, this in-house competition "trauma" for Leica started with the Leica CL film camera which quickly outsold for much lower price any M camera on the market. Leica suffered significant losses with introduction of this affordable film camera. It sticks to this day as we can see.
Being afraid of outselling your fixed lens camera and dissuading possible Leica lens buyers has got to be one of the most braindead marketing strategies since Canon's 5D line if that's true.
There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.
In Leica terms, this in-house competition "trauma" for Leica started with the Leica CL film camera which quickly outsold for much lower price any M camera on the market. Leica suffered significant losses with introduction of this affordable film camera. It sticks to this day as we can see.
Sep 10, 2026 at 01:06 PM
p.3 #16Leica M EV - overpriced?
RoamingScott wrote:
Being afraid of outselling your fixed lens camera and dissuading possible Leica lens buyers has got to be one of the most braindead marketing strategies since Canon's 5D line if that's true.
There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.
It’s crazy that neither Sigma nor Panasonic have made a rangefinder-style EVF M body. One could almost assume there is an unspoken non-compete regarding M mount bodies in order for them to be part of the L-mount alliance.
Being afraid of outselling your fixed lens camera and dissuading possible Leica lens buyers has got to be one of the most braindead marketing strategies since Canon's 5D line if that's true.
There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.
It’s crazy that neither Sigma nor Panasonic have made a rangefinder-style EVF M body. One could almost assume there is an unspoken non-compete regarding M mount bodies in order for them to be part of the L-mount alliance.
Sep 10, 2026 at 01:21 PM
RoamingScott
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p.3 #17Leica M EV - overpriced?
highdesertmesa wrote:
There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.It’s crazy that neither Sigma nor Panasonic have made a rangefinder-style EVF M body. One could almost assume there is an unspoken non-compete regarding M mount bodies in order for them to be part of the L-mount alliance.
I'm not surprised by Sigma/Panny for that exact reason, but...DJI? We need a Chinese stakeholder going for blood and cutting the legs out from Leica to bring them back to earth. Where are the modern-day Bessas?
RoamingScott wrote
Being afraid of outselling your fixed lens camera and dissuading possible Leica lens buyers has got to be one of the most braindead marketing strategies since Canon's 5D line if that's true.There's a reason every other brand has pretty affordable bodies and expensive lenses...lenses are the profit drivers.
I'm not surprised by Sigma/Panny for that exact reason, but...DJI? We need a Chinese stakeholder going for blood and cutting the legs out from Leica to bring them back to earth. Where are the modern-day Bessas?
Sep 10, 2026 at 01:22 PM
p.3 #18Leica M EV - overpriced?
RoamingScott wrote:
Where are the modern-day Bessas?
I think that the 6 bit encoding may be a reason: Leica has patents and without supporting it, building such a camera makes less sense.
Also, I'm not sure if Bessa made a lot of money.
And if you are building a rangefinder, it is hard to compete with Leica. If not, what kind of focusing on a camera where lenses are no preset aperture?
BTW, I'm just guessing and throwing ideas, I have no insight.
Where are the modern-day Bessas?
I think that the 6 bit encoding may be a reason: Leica has patents and without supporting it, building such a camera makes less sense.
Also, I'm not sure if Bessa made a lot of money.
And if you are building a rangefinder, it is hard to compete with Leica. If not, what kind of focusing on a camera where lenses are no preset aperture?
BTW, I'm just guessing and throwing ideas, I have no insight.
Sep 10, 2026 at 01:30 PM
RoamingScott
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p.3 #19Leica M EV - overpriced?
pmeheut wrote:
I think that the 6 bit encoding may be a reason: Leica has patents and without supporting it, building such a camera makes less sense.
Also, I'm not sure if Bessa made a lot of money.
And if you are building a rangefinder, it is hard to compete with Leica. If not, what kind of focusing on a camera where lenses are no preset aperture?
BTW, I'm just guessing and throwing ideas, I have no insight.
Why do you need 6 bit encoding when you can simply have a menu in the camera to set up your lenses manually?
RoamingScott wrote
Where are the modern-day Bessas?Also, I'm not sure if Bessa made a lot of money.
And if you are building a rangefinder, it is hard to compete with Leica. If not, what kind of focusing on a camera where lenses are no preset aperture?
BTW, I'm just guessing and throwing ideas, I have no insight.
Why do you need 6 bit encoding when you can simply have a menu in the camera to set up your lenses manually?
Sep 10, 2026 at 01:34 PM
p.3 #20Leica M EV - overpriced?
RoamingScott wrote:
Why do you need 6 bit encoding when you can simply have a menu in the camera to set up your lenses manually?
You do not need it indeed. This is just less convenient making it harder to sell such a camera in a competitive market.
Why do you need 6 bit encoding when you can simply have a menu in the camera to set up your lenses manually?
You do not need it indeed. This is just less convenient making it harder to sell such a camera in a competitive market.
Sep 10, 2026 at 01:50 PM