I actually posted a picture of my SP2 next to the LLL Rigid. I’m glad both lenses focus down to 0.7m!
The Panchro SP2 already has so much character. Aside from being a slower lens, I’m curious how it will compare to the new LLL 50mm f/1.5 S21 (P.ANGENIEUX) at f/2.
I’m also wondering how the S21 stacks up against the Leica Summarit 50mm f/1.5 and the Voigtlander 50mm f/1.5 Heliar.
Fred Miranda wrote:
I actually posted a picture of my SP2 next to the LLL Rigid. I’m glad both lenses focus down to 0.7m!
The Panchro SP2 already has so much character. Aside from being a slower lens, I’m curious how it will compare to the new LLL 50mm f/1.5 S21 (P.ANGENIEUX) at f/2.
I’m also wondering how the S21 stacks up against the Leica Summarit 50mm f/1.5 and the Voigtlander 50mm f/1.5 Heliar.
Fred Miranda wrote:
I would like to review the new S21. Perhaps next month.
I’m quite thrilled by that release, I indeed can’t wait for you to get your hands on one soon.
They could send me one too, it would be fitting to test a French lens replica in France, I can go to the Eiffel Tower to give it a go, how French would it be.
I hope it flares.
Sonnar-7 wrote:
I’m quite thrilled by that release, I indeed can’t wait for you to get your hands on one soon.
They could send me one too, it would be fitting to test a French lens replica in France, I can go to the Eiffel Tower to give it a go, how French would it be.
I hope it flares.
Anyone here had compared the LLL Rigid with the Voigtländer 50mm 2.2 Color Skopar?
I use a set of Laowa 9mm, CV 21mm 1.4, CV 40mm 1.2 and CV 90mm 2.0 and looking for a nice, compact 50mm. Should show a good sharpness at 2.0. A bit of character in the bokeh will be welcome but please not like the Noctilux 1.0
I just got my copy, I will test it these coming days. It doesn’t seem to flare much, I thought V2 Summicrons did flare with some orange veils and artefacts but I tried a real Leica one a couple of weeks ago and I couldn’t make it flare in any ways(maybe a faint veil if I really tried), so maybe it’s normal the LLL doesn’t.
Other than that it looks quite sharp in the center, maybe more than the Elcan.
It seems to cover the GFX sensor with only some really small dark corners at infinity, but the performance falls short quite quickly even before mid frame.
It can give hope for the Z21 though.
Sonnar-7 wrote:
Second day of testing the LLL Rigid.
LLL Rigid "R" 50mm f2 & Nikon Zf
How do you like it compared to your other characterful 50mm lenses? I thought rendering was very close to the original Leica just like their LLL 35/2 8E.
Fred Miranda wrote:
How do you like it compared to your other characterful 50mm lenses? I thought rendering was very close to the original Leica just like their LLL 35/2 8E.
I have not tested it a lot yet but I feel it renders very closely to the Elcan, there’s an hint of more swirl in certain situations and the halation of lights is more controlled. Other than that it’s quite hard to difference them. Maybe the Summicron gives some cleaner results on the extent of the frame.
The Panchro still remains quite unique, in your tests they appeared quite close but when I shot one and the other, the results are different enough. By comparing the two, it made me love the Panchro again despite a few things I don’t like about it, it’s still one of the strongest offering by LLL, it’s indeed unique.
Back to the LLL Summicron, I quite like that when I was using it, it was a lens with character that could lean toward a clean rendering and still find ways to exploit the character when needed.
I was a bit disappointed by the fact that it does not flare much, I believed that the Summicron rigid produced some oranges flares and artefacts but the LLL barely can compared to some photos I had seen from the original. Although I now wonder if I had that wrong since a friend did lend me two Leica Summicrons, a V2 and a V3 and couldn’t make them flare much either, to my surprise.
The LLL Rigid sits well in my lens collection between my Panchro and my Elcan, it has a similar rendering of both but avoid the glow of the Panchro and is better corrected than the Elcan for more « serious » work.
A few photos I like I took with my M9 and the LLL rigid, I posted them on another thread but they could be there too for the review and samples.
I have been taking my LLL Rigid out on the road and very much like the lens especially since the E39 then meshes well with my Voigtlander 21, 28, and 90 mm. But I have been very fond of my Contax Zeiss G 45/2 since my G days in the 90s. I bought a second copy from Funleader of 45/2 to keep my G system intact for film. I put the Contax 45/2 side by side with the Rigid on Nikon adaption and the Contax still remains a bit sharper, this being just a F5.6 when both lenses should be good. The Rigid is very nice and color rendition is great, but the Zeiss Contax in my lens collection still edges it in detail sharpness. This is the view out my front door.
For me and my take home assessment as Fred wrote the rigid holds its own with modern lenses, it is to my eye slightly less sharp than the Zeiss contax, but unless side by side not noticeable. The color richness of the rigid is quite nice, I like the common E39 with my other lenses so that there are less filters to fumble with being in common. The rigid is hefty for size, but it is also smaller and integrates well with the 21, 28, 90 set of voigtlanders. If I was out with just one lens I'd probably take the 45/2 but if I was out with all four to go 21-90 then I'd probably take the rigid, and the elcan is so small I can add it for good measure to have its character. I have shot the rigid wide open and the background blur is decent, not noct of course, but it is decent and worth using.
I used my 4 tiny lens set including the rigid in Montana last week, this shot is at Ennis Lake in Montana in morning with great reflections good morning light color and a cooperative bird spreading its wings in the morning light. The rigid proved to me it is a good general 50 in a tiny lens format.
Have you tried the Elcan? I revisited this lens recently and was really impressed. Its rendering reminds me of the Rigid, but with a slightly more classic character and more rounded specular highlights. It’s also noticeably smaller.
Fred Miranda wrote:
Have you tried the Elcan? I revisited this lens recently and was really impressed. Its rendering reminds me of the Rigid, but with a slightly more classic character and more rounded specular highlights. It’s also noticeably smaller.
Indeed, when I received the LLL Rigid, I was a bit disappointed at first because it looked so much like the Elcan, I felt I bought the same lens twice and if anything, the Elcan is more convenient.
I knew the rendering was similar but I hoped the Summicron replica would be a stronger performer version of the Elcan with more flare quirks based on the photos I had seen of the Summicrons.
I got that a bit wrong though.
Based on my disappointment I tried and compared quite a bit the Elcan and the LLL Summicron, they are quite similar(too much?) but I concluded that the LLL rigid still made sense for me, I live for those subtles changes of character between lenses and the overall package of the LLL rigid gives me some images I prefer(more swirl, more flares with curiously better halation control, how strange and a few things in that ballpark).
But they do share a lot, the Panchro in that regard stands out more.
How cool would a 50mm 1.5 LLL rigid would be.
The Elcan was really great on my M6, that aperture tab is so handy when shooting all manual.
I do wonder if the Elcan doesn’t have a bit more pop despite all that, I would have to do some portraits to be sure.
Do you still have your Elcan btw and did you keep your LLL Rigid?
Indeed, I have a rigid, elcan, and a rigid speed panchro, the speed panchro is different, but I have a difficult time deciding which of the two rigid and elcan to put in my bag for outing since the idea is to be light and not take it all. I am mostly not taking the elcan but the two rigids since they are "twins" in structure but not optics, but keep asking myself why not take the elcan instead of the rigid, and other than the two cousin lens housings I cannot give a really good reason. The elcan is a bit more center sharp oriented and if I was primarily capturing people, I'd probably use the elcan, but on the other hand I posted elcan shots of Greenland here in FM, and I thought it produced striking imagery with center sharp and the softer corners. I do "blame" Fred, his nice review of the rigid made me favor the rigid over the elcan, but that is just in my mind.
Sonnar-7 wrote:
Indeed, when I received the LLL Rigid, I was a bit disappointed at first because it looked so much like the Elcan, I felt I bought the same lens twice and if anything, the Elcan is more convenient.
I knew the rendering was similar but I hoped the Summicron replica would be a stronger performer version of the Elcan with more flare quirks based on the photos I had seen of the Summicrons.
I got that a bit wrong though.
Based on my disappointment I tried and compared quite a bit the Elcan and the LLL Summicron, they are quite similar(too much?) but I concluded that the LLL rigid still made sense for me, I live for those subtles changes of character between lenses and the overall package of the LLL rigid gives me some images I prefer(more swirl, more flares with curiously better halation control, how strange and a few things in that ballpark).
But they do share a lot, the Panchro in that regard stands out more.
How cool would a 50mm 1.5 LLL rigid would be.
The Elcan was really great on my M6, that aperture tab is so handy when shooting all manual.
I do wonder if the Elcan doesn’t have a bit more pop despite all that, I would have to do some portraits to be sure.
Do you still have your Elcan btw and did you keep your LLL Rigid?...Show more →
Two things to consider. While the Leica and LLL "Rigid" versions are similar in both performance and rendering, the Leica is slightly sharper off-axis. That might explain why the LLL Rigid and the Elcan feel closer in overall performance. I remember testing the Elcan when it first came out and comparing it to the Leica Rigid...the Rigid showed better resolution away from the center. I'll test this again with the copy I have now.
The Rigid also shows more optical vignetting than the Elcan, so if you're after more of a swirl effect, the Rigid delivers that. Overall, their rendering is very close, so if compactness is a priority, the Elcan is the one to go for.
For those with Elcan lenses. Does your copy has a bit of 'play' when rotating the focusing ring? It's funny that the two copies I've tried have that and I'm wondering if that's how they are made.
My elcan and rigid does have a bit of play in it, I guess it is design, it does not seem to bother me
On the rigid the only thing that sometimes bothers me is that last bit before the infinity locks down, there is a mm or two that I have once in while wanted to critically focus using enlargements on EVF and then I get the click because I went too far. Mostly the infinity lock doesn't t bother me, but there is that once in a great while... it does, then the elcan gets extra points.
Fred Miranda wrote:
Two things to consider. While the Leica and LLL "Rigid" versions are similar in both performance and rendering, the Leica is slightly sharper off-axis. That might explain why the LLL Rigid and the Elcan feel closer in overall performance. I remember testing the Elcan when it first came out and comparing it to the Leica Rigid...the Rigid showed better resolution away from the center. I'll test this again with the copy I have now.
The Rigid also shows more optical vignetting than the Elcan, so if you're after more of a swirl effect, the Rigid delivers that. Overall, their rendering is very close, so if compactness is a priority, the Elcan is the one to go for.
For those with Elcan lenses. Does your copy has a bit of 'play' when rotating the focusing ring? It's funny that the two copies I've tried have that and I'm wondering if that's how they are made....Show more →
My Elcan is super tight, it crazy well crafted. Just the paint that doesn’t want to exist on it but the LLL hoods are super scratchy.
My LLL Rigid doesn’t feel as smooth as my Elcan and it has a bit of a point where there is too much of some resistance in turning the focus ring, but it’s still alright.
