p.22 #1 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
Each lens has it's own pro's & con's, even at the same focal length, so why can't camera bodies? We're used to lens compromises, want a fast lens and it's generally going to be bigger/heavier than a slower lens of the same FL. Those things are a given, and I see the A7cR the same way.
If anything I'm glad Sony has worked to separate models, especially evident in the A7cR & A9III, where the buyer can really hone in on their specific needs, assuming their needs are specific. And if they need a wide range of uses, you've got the A7R5, A1, and plenty of slightly older choices.
Apr 28, 2024 at 08:01 PM
foto16 Offline • • [X]
p.22 #2 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
catacore wrote:
That's an approach I will never get into.
I have just picked my poison: carrying a full size, fully satisfactory performing camera instead of a crippled, smaller, rangefinder-style camera (which I happen to love, from a form factor point of view).
Of course I got frustrated by the launch of those Cii/Cr cameras given the fact I wanted a "small, travel-friendly, rangefinder-style" camera to be able to use also with my Voigts 40/1.2 or 50 APO, and to serve me as a second camera body alongside A7Riv. Now, if I am going to have a second camera, will also be a full size one. Most likely a used A1......Show more →
The fact is that most people live in not the most expensive house on the street, marry with not the most beautiful wife in the town, have not the smartest kids in the college... I don't understand when it comes to a piece of electronics, why people don't understand they are all compromises among performance, price, size, ergonomics, etc. There is no perfect camera that fits everyone. People who look for an A7C form factor are very likely a different group than those who are looking for an A7RV. In the end, it's what you do with the tool that counts.
Apr 28, 2024 at 08:56 PM
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p.22 #3 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
AGeoJO wrote:
Does anyone here know how well or how bad this A7c II and/or A7c R is selling, BTW?
There are monthly reports of top selling cameras from major Japanese stores. A7C II is consistent among the bestsellers, but A7CR is not. It's really not difficult to see why. The A7C II, to most people, has a better price performance ratio, so it has a wider appeal (probably similar to A7III vs. A7RIV, A7IV vs. A7RV). But both are excellent cameras, and one should get the model that suits her needs the best, and it may not be the most popular model.
p.22 #4 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
Jeff Kott wrote:
Very good point. I value the smaller size over the "missing" features that would satisfy everyone, but make the camera bigger. Why complain about the A7CR when you can buy an A7Riv or v?
One reason might be that the classic Sony A7 series are DSLR style "serious cameras" by design. Boring A7c cameras follow rangefider layout and have a bit of retro and "lifestyle" flavor. Technically this is not important, but the c-series design takes Sony to the marget segment dominated by Leica and Fuji. Just look around at the internet, and you see how much interest there is: A7cr being alternative to Leica Q etc.
Personally I like cameras with style, but embracing style over functionalism is not a good trade off. Sony has plenty to win in c-series, and even more by doing the c-series right.
p.22 #5 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
I appreciate the camera's compact design, but the flip-out LCD is a significant drawback for me personally. It not only makes the camera more noticeable but also, the LCD becomes obscured if you're using camera strap.
Additionally, the absence of an eye shade makes the EVF susceptible to smudges from eyelashes. Overall, it seems this camera is tailored more for vloggers than for photographers.
p.22 #6 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
catacore wrote:
That's an approach I will never get into.
I have just picked my poison: carrying a full size, fully satisfactory performing camera instead of a crippled, smaller, rangefinder-style camera (which I happen to love, from a form factor point of view).
Of course I got frustrated by the launch of those Cii/Cr cameras given the fact I wanted a "small, travel-friendly, rangefinder-style" camera to be able to use also with my Voigts 40/1.2 or 50 APO, and to serve me as a second camera body alongside A7Riv. Now, if I am going to have a second camera, will also be a full size one. Most likely a used A1......Show more →
p.22 #7 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
Has there been any further price erosion on the Cr? If I could snag one for 2400 or less I'd probably take the plunge (like I need another camera ). The thought was it'd be a fun body to dedicate to one of the very fine manual lenses out there such as the 35 APO.
p.22 #8 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
DES-1 wrote:
Has there been any further price erosion on the Cr? If I could snag one for 2400 or less I'd probably take the plunge (like I need another camera ). The thought was it'd be a fun body to dedicate to one of the very fine manual lenses out there such as the 35 APO.
I’m not sure the A7cr would be your best camera for manual focus given it’s viewfinder.
p.22 #10 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
My issue with either the a7cii and a7cr is more with their size. After putting on a smallish lens, it's imply not that much smaller than carrying around my a7rV. At which point, I'd rather just have my a7rV, maybe I'm just used it to more. But I'm sure the a7cii, and a7cr have their place.
p.22 #11 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
hlansing wrote:
My issue with either the a7cii and a7cr is more with their size. After putting on a smallish lens, it's imply not that much smaller than carrying around my a7rV. At which point, I'd rather just have my a7rV, maybe I'm just used it to more. But I'm sure the a7cii, and a7cr have their place.
When the original C came out, I noticed that the body was essentially the same size as the r4 if you subtract the viewfinder bump - so you make a valid point. I think I made that critique in a long ago post. If I were smart, I'd forget this and just occasionally switch one of my cameras to manual focus! Confessions of a gadget person...
May 03, 2024 at 08:55 AM
foto16 Offline • • [X]
p.22 #12 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
foto16 wrote:
There are monthly reports of top selling cameras from major Japanese stores. A7C II is consistent among the bestsellers, but A7CR is not. It's really not difficult to see why. The A7C II, to most people, has a better price performance ratio, so it has a wider appeal (probably similar to A7III vs. A7RIV, A7IV vs. A7RV). But both are excellent cameras, and one should get the model that suits her needs the best, and it may not be the most popular model.
For what it's worth, this is the Mapcamera store's list of the most sold 20 cameras during their fiscal year 2023 (April 1 2023 to March 31 2024):
Nikon Z8
Nikon Z f
Sony α7C II
Canon EOS R6 Mark II
Sony α7RV
Sony α7IV
Fujifilm X-T5
Ricoh GR IIIx
Sony α6700
Canon EOS R8
OM system OM-1
Fujifilm X-H2
Fujifilm X-T30 II
Ricoh GR III
Nikon Z fc
Fujifilm X-S10
Sony ZV-E10
Leica Q3
Canon EOS R10
Sony ZV-E1
May 03, 2024 at 09:14 AM
foto16 Offline • • [X]
p.22 #13 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
hlansing wrote:
My issue with either the a7cii and a7cr is more with their size. After putting on a smallish lens, it's imply not that much smaller than carrying around my a7rV. At which point, I'd rather just have my a7rV, maybe I'm just used it to more. But I'm sure the a7cii, and a7cr have their place.
The A7RV is 723g, while the A7CR is 514g. It makes a difference in the hand. I've used both shaped bodies, and the viewfinder does make a different in which camera bag (depending on the bag, of course) they can fit, even if the volumes of the bodies (except the viewfinder) are similar.
p.22 #14 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
foto16 wrote:
The A7RV is 723g, while the A7CR is 514g. It makes a difference in the hand. I've used both shaped bodies, and the viewfinder does make a different in which camera bag (depending on the bag, of course) they can fit, even if the volumes of the bodies (except the viewfinder) are similar.
That 209gm definitely makes a difference with the camera in hand.
p.22 #15 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
foto16 wrote:
For what it's worth, this is the Mapcamera store's list of the most sold 20 cameras during their fiscal year 2023 (April 1 2023 to March 31 2024):
Nikon Z8
Nikon Z f
Sony α7C II
Canon EOS R6 Mark II
Sony α7RV
Sony α7IV
Fujifilm X-T5
Ricoh GR IIIx
Sony α6700
Canon EOS R8
OM system OM-1
Fujifilm X-H2
Fujifilm X-T30 II
Ricoh GR III
Nikon Z fc
Fujifilm X-S10
Sony ZV-E10
Leica Q3
Canon EOS R10
Sony ZV-E1
Thank you for the info. The "tracking" covers the period between April 2023 and March 2024. Both the A7c II and A7c R were announced in August 2023, making the result, well, not quite "valid"...
May 03, 2024 at 09:34 AM
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p.22 #16 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
AGeoJO wrote:
Thank you for the info. The "tracking" covers the period between April 2023 and March 2024. Both the A7c II and A7c R were announced in August 2023, making the result, well, not quite "valid"...
You are welcome. The fact that the A7C II ranked the 3rd despite being announced in the middle of the FY is still quite telling. This is only Japan, and there are many reasons why each camera is occupying each position. So, there can be many interpretations.
p.22 #19 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
Gunigaon wrote:
My two cents on these bodies. Apologies about being harsh but this is about Sony's design language and not functionality (which is top notch). I think Sony wanted to create a look with these so design is an important part of these two bodies.
I do not see these cameras as retro bodies from any angle. These are just smaller bodies.
Sony's best looking camera was RX1, no wonder it was developed from scratch. Nobody perhaps said, we should use parts of this body elsewhere. But for ILCs they basically made a brick and kept sticking dials and knobs on it. This rectangular brick carries through model after another model. a7, you get a blank space on the left top. a9 it's filled with a knob. But the rectangular brick is same.
Fuji/Nikon, every model looks like it was designed ground up, all knobs and dials are part of design and well integrated. They look and feel like cameras.
They should take a99 Mark II and make a camera based on that body. ...Show more →
Who says a camera needs to look like it came from the 60’s to be regarded as a “real” camera.
p.22 #20 · Why are people not buying Sony's Swiss Army knife "A7cr"
I think the perception of a 'real' camera is dependent on what you started with. This is only speaking about the 35mm format world of course. The α7/9 series remind me most of the manual focus film cameras I used up until 2006.
A7c cameras follow rangefider layout and have a bit of retro and "lifestyle" flavor. Technically this is not important, but the c-series design takes Sony to the marget segment dominated by Leica and Fuji. Just look around at the internet, and you see how much interest there is: A7cr being alternative to Leica Q etc. 
