what do you recommend, A7Cr or A7RV if they're the same price for Black Friday? I value traveling light and fast, with a camera as an everyday carry. Mostly family/travel photography. Also do a lot of hiking/landscape photography.
Currently have a A7iii with 40mm/f2.5 which is on my camera 90% of the time. Use a 70-300mm for my 4 year old's soccer games. I crop a bunch so that's why I'm going for the R-series and in the past I've printed for photos around the house 11x17". Maybe eventually I'll get a GM lens, but right now sticking with the two lenses.
I had an A7C in the past, didn't really mind the ergonomics. However I hated not having a front-dial, the A7CR fixes that.
I like the tilt screen of the A7RV because I have a bad back and often need to get the camera down to kid-height. Also value its EVF.
brettgoulder wrote:
what do you recommend, A7Cr or A7RV if they're the same price for Black Friday? I value traveling light and fast, with a camera as an everyday carry. Mostly family/travel photography. Also do a lot of hiking/landscape photography.
Currently have a A7iii with 40mm/f2.5 which is on my camera 90% of the time. Use a 70-300mm for my 4 year old's soccer games. I crop a bunch so that's why I'm going for the R-series and in the past I've printed for photos around the house 11x17". Maybe eventually I'll get a GM lens, but right now sticking with the two lenses.
I had an A7C in the past, didn't really mind the ergonomics. However I hated not having a front-dial, the A7CR fixes that.
I like the tilt screen of the A7RV because I have a bad back and often need to get the camera down to kid-height. Also value its EVF.
The differences in size and weight are substantial: Sony A7R V is 6% (7.3 mm) wider and 36% (25.8 mm) taller than Sony Alpha a7CR.
Sony A7R V is 30% (19 mm) thicker than Sony Alpha a7CR.
Sony A7R V [723 g] weights 40% (208 grams) more than Sony Alpha a7CR [515 g] (*inc. batteries and memory card).
For the reduction in size, you give up the tilt-screen (though the A7Cr screen folds out nicely), one stop of IBIS (7 instead of 8), a full mechanical shutter, and a better EVF and LCD.
For me, the differences in size and weight were much more important than the minor differences, so I went with the A7Cr. I found the EVF and LCD on the A7CR perfectly fine, but YMMV.
The A7RV has some advantages function wise, but is bigger and heavier than the A7CR.
(there might be some new software function that the A7CR got that the A7RV don't have, I think it got the auto framing in video from the ZV, but I am not 100% sure, video is not my interest area).
So what it comes down to is if you can live with the missing/lower quality of some functions on the A7CR to gain the more compact size and lower weight.
And that answer only you can answer really since it in much comes down to what and how you shot.
When I did the pros and cons on how I will use it and what I normally shot, I ended up getting the A7CII since I will use it as my everyday camera and for travel. So I want small and light. I don't have the need for 61 Mpix in those situations normally either and also I don't want to drag around such an expensive camera as the A7CR is. For planned shooting I have other bodys with double card slots, shutter that can sync well with HSS flash, good EVF etc.
Tough question. There are some technical/feature differences which could drive one to the A7Rv. Those can be found in plenty of comparisons. I'd start with checking the viewfinder, its image resolution, etc., size and placement, rear panel movements and full mechanical shutter (only on A7Rv).
The viewfinder on the two different body types is sometimes a serious sticking point. Since you've experienced the A7c, you know the issues but the finder has been improved some.
It seems the A7Cs and aps-c bodies tend to fit better in the "mirror-less" bags and the A7Rs more towards the "dslr" bags, depends on bags, other stuff to be carried, etc.
I have an A7Riv and A6700, so close, but not exactly the same. With my lenses, I find that with the Tamron 28-200/2.8-5.6 - which is pretty much the same size as the Tamron 28-75/2.8s, that while it's OK on the small body, I'd prefer something smaller. I'd guess most users would find a point where they'd prefer the larger body for larger lenses. so, consider where you might go with morelenses in the future?
Most discussions revolve around whether the difference in specs is worth the cost and weight savings. In my opinion, for an average shooter, the specs differences are not that impactful, the cost saving is significant when comparing discounted prices (a7CR prices on GT are quite competitive), and the weight saving is really nice. That said, other people will weigh these factors differently depending on how they shoot. For example, a photographer who wants to shoot outdoor portraits with fast lenses will dislike the slow sync speed and ECFS's effect on bokeh. So knowing your own preferences and shooting style is key!
Some photographers do not yet know their own preferences, so to these photographers, I'd recommend either get the a7rv and not worry about camera limitations while they hone their craft, or get the a7cr and know that the spec differences will have minimal impact on their photos, and save some money for lenses in the process.
Don't trivialize the weight savings of more than 200g either. it can be quite significant if the a7CR is paired with appropriately sized lenses. In fact, you can use small APS-C lenses in crop mode, and switch to heavier FF lenses for situations when you really want to take advantage of the full 60 mp. For example, pair a sigma 56mm 1.4 APSC with a sony 24mm 1.4 GM FF and enjoy 3 focal lengths at f1.4. Slower FF lenses at f2/2.5/2.8 are also really nice options! In fact, now that I think about it, if you don't need an image of 60mp anyway, then think of it as adding digital zoom to your arsenal, which is a form of weight saving in itself. This fact might even sway people from the a7cii to a7cr
Note to self: Specs differences between a7rv and a7cr--> IBIS, EVF and LCD res, full mechanical shutter, flash sync speed, best-in-class flip-out screen, FPS, dual card slot, ultrasonic dust remover, more custom buttons etc.
brettgoulder wrote:
what do you recommend, A7Cr or A7RV if they're the same price for Black Friday? I value traveling light and fast, with a camera as an everyday carry. Mostly family/travel photography. Also do a lot of hiking/landscape photography.
Currently have a A7iii with 40mm/f2.5 which is on my camera 90% of the time. Use a 70-300mm for my 4 year old's soccer games. I crop a bunch so that's why I'm going for the R-series and in the past I've printed for photos around the house 11x17". Maybe eventually I'll get a GM lens, but right now sticking with the two lenses.
I had an A7C in the past, didn't really mind the ergonomics. However I hated not having a front-dial, the A7CR fixes that.
I like the tilt screen of the A7RV because I have a bad back and often need to get the camera down to kid-height. Also value its EVF.
If you can try and physically hold them both that’d be best. The space between the mount and the hand grip is closer and if you have average size hands you’d probably add some sort of grip on the CR. This makes the difference in the footprint between the two a lot less.
For me personally the price difference ($300 or so) and the size/weight difference is negligible. The size weight is tempting but you gain so much more by getting the A7R5.
Googling common items that weighs around 200 grams and its about a cup of sugar or 1/2 can of soda. One might feel the difference if hand holding the camera all day but not me.
I had the A6600 and never liked the viewfinder on the side. As one gets older, their hands get shakier and your nose against the camera (if right eye dominant) makes a big difference as well as the better ibis.
As Jbantillo mentioned the difference in weight is not that great...heck, I pack more weight than that in snacks while hiking . The comparison in hand of the A6600 and the A7R4 which I owned at the same time felt insignificant to me.
Jbantillo wrote:
If you can try and physically hold them both that’d be best. The space between the mount and the hand grip is closer and if you have average size hands you’d probably add some sort of grip on the CR. This makes the difference in the footprint between the two a lot less.
For me personally the price difference ($300 or so) and the size/weight difference is negligible. The size weight is tempting but you gain so much more by getting the A7R5.
Googling common items that weighs around 200 grams and its about a cup of sugar or 1/2 can of soda. One might feel the difference if hand holding the camera all day but not me. ...Show more →
Yet we all claim the Nikon D8 as an overweight pig, but it weighs only 175g more than the A7r5. I own both an A7r and A7r3 and I can definitely feel their weight difference when carrying them.
The a7CR specs are really quite a bit weaker on paper even if they don't affect most types of photography significantly. If we ignore price, or assume both cameras cost the same, is the weight savings enough to justify the weaker specs? For people who say yes, then the a7CR is a no-brainer. If not, then that's where the price comes in. Depending on how you compare the prices, the difference can vary widely. At MSRP, the difference is ~$900. I have heard of discount prices of $2500 for the a7cR (look around the forum) and $2900 a7RV, so about $400. The difference may widen again as we see more discounts for the a7cr. YMMV
Is $400 (potentially more) and 200g savings enough to justify the slightly weaker specs of the a7CR? Personally, I think yes, weight is a big factor for me. But I can also see how 200g might feel like nothing if you generally use bigger lenses, and $400 isn't a lot when there are these many compromises.
macadphotos wrote:
It is such a tricky comparison.
The a7CR specs are really quite a bit weaker on paper even if they don't affect most types of photography significantly. If we ignore price, or assume both cameras cost the same, is the weight savings enough to justify the weaker specs? For people who say yes, then the a7CR is a no-brainer. If not, then that's where the price comes in. Depending on how you compare the prices, the difference can vary widely. At MSRP, the difference is ~$900. I have heard of discount prices of $2500 for the a7cR (look around the forum) and $2900 a7RV, so about $400. The difference may widen again as we see more discounts for the a7cr. YMMV
Is $400 and 200g savings enough to justify the weaker specs of the a7CR? Hmmm...Show more →
Specs don’t make photos. If one does not utilize those specs, they just become print on paper.
If you are going to continue shooting sports and eventually get the 70-200GMii - which many of us cannot recommend enough - get the larger camera. You will find the upgrade from the 70-300G startling. Good luck with the decision!
No question I would go A7RV and I have. For me it's all about feature sets and abilities and the A7RC is limited on both. That does not cut it in the Professional world. I need those features Want light and travel than get light with a body . Maybe even a 6700. Lightweight buys you absolutely nothing except except some energy you need to put in and frankly the A7RV is not big at all compared to the A7RC it's a hump to deal with. Yes the days of 4x5 and medium format are mostly gone with today's cameras we are simply spoiled even in 35mm bodies they have been reduced so far down. Most important thing for me is getting the shot and if im camera limited than im screwed.
chez wrote:
Specs don’t make photos. If one does not utilize those specs, they just become print on paper.
This sounds smart but the reality is probably more complex.
From @macadphotos: "Specs differences between a7rv and a7cr--> IBIS, EVF and LCD res, full mechanical shutter, flash sync speed, best-in-class flip-out screen, FPS, dual card slot, ultrasonic dust remover, more custom buttons etc."
We all use IBIS, dust remover, custom buttons, and occasionally full mechanical shutter. The other specs can be important as well. Thus, the differences are not insignificant, like "print on paper" - there is a real and rather substantial functional difference between the two cameras. Thus, one must badly need the cost and weight savings to go with a7cr. I do respect the weight-conscious FMers, and I well understand that the weight of a camera system is a major consideration for some photographers.
There is another point: while a7rv can be used with any lens, using a7cr with the larger and heavier lenses is possible but wouldn't make as much sense. E.g., a7cr would make less sense, compared to a7rv, to use with some fast GM lenses. Sony a7rc would make more sense to pair with compact and light lenses that tend to be slower. There are still some good options available, but there are more lenses to choose from for a7rv.
The bottom line: a7cr can be veiewd as a special camera for special needs, such as the need for an ultra-light FF system.
Personal choice. I have both sizes (a7cii, not R) and I much prefer the a7RV because of the EVF, the customization buttons, the flippy screen, and the overall handling. The output/files might be the same, but the process is very different.
GMPhotography wrote:
No question I would go A7RV and I have. For me it's all about feature sets and abilities and the A7RC is limited on both. That does not cut it in the Professional world. I need those features Want light and travel than get light with a body . Maybe even a 6700.....
The limited ability of no mechanical shutter still confuses me as to whether a non Sony flash will work with these new A7C bodies. On my A6700, which has a mechanical shutter, it will fire my Godox V350S flash on camera or transmitter for external flash, but only with the mechanical shutter selected. If the camera is set to electronic shutter all flash setting are grayed out and the flash will not fire. So how does this work with the new A7CR and A7CII if there is no "true" mechanical shutter? Sony online Web manual is of no help other than to say it will work with Sony compatible flashes, but I use multiple Godox flash/transmitters and they work just fine with my A7RIV and A6700.
While I wanted a A7CR, if it doesn't work with my existing flash, then I will be getting an A7RV instead.
For flash you have to use a mechanical shutter the 6700 has one. Electronic shutter won’t flash
The A7Rc will use a limited mechanical shutter for flash but sync speed is reduced. For me it’s LED use of anti flicker with flash. Have not looked much at the A7Rc but I know it’s not full boat features.
Really have to look at feature sets on the A7Rc on what you want to use it for. For me it won’t work just like I was limited with Leica and Phase One medium format. The A7Rc functionality is more geared for travel and casual use and that’s fine just need to figure out your needs
If 40mm 2.5 is your main use case, the a7cr is perfect if you value the smaller package, which as a second camera for me is most important. The a7rv objectively has more features and is more capable but you give some of that up for smaller size.
The a7cr handles fine with the 70-200 when grip is attached though if lenses like that were main use case I'd definitely opt for the a7rv.
. The comparison in hand of the A6600 and the A7R4 which I owned at the same time felt insignificant to me.