Blueshound wrote:
Before I bought my A7CR, I did a fair amount of drilling down into reviews, Youtube videos, etc. I own an A7RIV, which I quite like. I've resisted the A7RV, in spite of that gorgeous new EVF. My resistance wasn't about cost, it was about the upward weight bloat. Have to draw the line somewhere, and I've chosen to do it at the body weight of the A7RIV. At the same time, I was balking at a smaller, lower resolution EVF on the 7CR, as I find this an important part of the use experience.
I came across the Youtube video by Hugh Brownstone on the new compact bodies. Hugh positions the A7CII and A7CR in context of the rest of the market, not only in relation to other Sony offerings. He very nicely discusses the entire paradigm around the new Sony offerings, and in a way that is not solely about the usual tech differences.
To me this is the best overview of why the two petite sisters are compelling. Well done Hugh.
He does do a great job. But he was way off on the fact that these will be in such demand there will be a backlog. Heck they are not even selling at 2650 & 1950 here on FM. It's to bad because Sony got so many things right in these bodies. I'm still holding out a glimmer of hope Sony see's the error in their ways and make an A7ciia and A7cra. Just fix the EVF and rear LCD screen then sit back and enjoy the backlog like Hugh thought. One can dream.
nhsonyshooter wrote:
He does do a great job. But he was way off on the fact that these will be in such demand there will be a backlog. Heck they are not even selling at 2650 & 1950 here on FM. It's to bad because Sony got so many things right in these bodies. I'm still holding out a glimmer of hope Sony see's the error in their ways and make an A7ciia and A7cra. Just fix the EVF and rear LCD screen then sit back and enjoy the backlog like Hugh thought. One can dream.
How do you know that they are not selling even at $2650 and $1950?
I wish thy had a better evf but im still considering one as they pack so much I to a small body. My Fuji is similarly sized with the same size etc but that’s about where the comparison stops I think.
I still fail to understand why people compare A7RV and A7CR. They are not the same camera despite using the same sensor and they are not competing with each other. Buy an A7RV if you are ok with size/weight and do not want to miss out on any feature it has to offer. Buy an A7CR if you prefer a smaller/lighter camera and if you are ok with the compromises the smaller size comes with. A7CR is not a replacement for A7RV. It does not matter if they are the same price. If you value smaller package then go for A7CR. If you value more features then go for A7RV. It is as simple as that.
nepali wrote:
I still fail to understand why people compare A7RV and A7CR. They are not the same camera despite using the same sensor and they are not competing with each other. Buy an A7RV if you are ok with size/weight and do not want to miss out on any feature it has to offer. Buy an A7CR if you prefer a smaller/lighter camera and if you are ok with the compromises the smaller size comes with. A7CR is not a replacement for A7RV. It does not matter if they are the same price. If you value smaller package then go for A7CR. If you value more features then go for A7RV. It is as simple as that....Show more →
For me, the a7cr, in some situations, is a replacement for the a7rV. I can have a very small and light package with the same IQ. In my book, the main disadvantage I must consider is the EVF. Often, I would have taken a7rV before a7cr was available, hence the comparison.
A larger body with the additional features of a7rV will always be a better alternative for some situations. I do not think that a7cr threatens a7rV. On the other hand, if we do not consider cost, I no longer see a reason for getting a Sony APS-C body.
The simple fact is if they were in demand they would not be discounted at all this early in the life cycle. Again no one is saying they are bad. I have wanted a FF sensor in an APS-C body for years, long before the C was even rumored. Sony just missed a few important opportunities to appeal to many more people. I promise the the flip/LCD and EVF will be different when ever the version 3 units come out. It's just to bad many of us have to wait when we would have gladly given Sony money now. We are not talking about big money items either. The irony is these discounts could have easily paid for the improvements many are looking for. Oh well. I'll keep waiting.
nepali wrote:
I still fail to understand why people compare A7RV and A7CR. They are not the same camera despite using the same sensor and they are not competing with each other. Buy an A7RV if you are ok with size/weight and do not want to miss out on any feature it has to offer. Buy an A7CR if you prefer a smaller/lighter camera and if you are ok with the compromises the smaller size comes with. A7CR is not a replacement for A7RV. It does not matter if they are the same price. If you value smaller package then go for A7CR. If you value more features then go for A7RV. It is as simple as that....Show more →
Being 61 vs 61 folks have made it a comparison factor and mostly it's the size debate . But more importantly it's about the feature sets as the A7Rc is limited here. Now the debate comes can you deal with those limitations. Seriously it may have been a better move on Sonys end to not limit the limitations and drop the mpx to 42 and keep the price the same. Tourist shooting which this is aimed at really don't need 61mpx but all the feature sets of the A7RV with the reduced size and weight and make up those costs with a lower MPX camera like 42 maybe the better solution. I simply can't buy this A7Rc because of those missing feature sets. So in turn I need two different bodies
Now that's assuming a 42 vs a 61 are at different cost factors Not sure they are
.nhsonyshooter wrote:
.. I have wanted a FF sensor in an APS-C body for years, long before the C was even rumored...
Same with me, and now we even have two models!
nhsonyshooter wrote:
... Sony just missed a few important opportunities to appeal to many more people. I promise the the flip/LCD and EVF will be different ..
I don't think so and don't hope this will ever happen!
A larger EVF will make the whole Body bigger.
Sony has to keep the Body small, no matter about restrictions.
If you miss a better EVF or this flippy display, it's better to go for a bigger body like A7 IV oder A7R V.
Most people buy a c-class Sony due to the small size and weight!
SrMi wrote:
For me, the a7cr, in some situations, is a replacement for the a7rV. I can have a very small and light package with the same IQ. In my book, the main disadvantage I must consider is the EVF. Often, I would have taken a7rV before a7cr was available, hence the comparison.
A larger body with the additional features of a7rV will always be a better alternative for some situations. I do not think that a7cr threatens a7rV. On the other hand, if we do not consider cost, I no longer see a reason for getting a Sony APS-C body.
I really like the A7cr as it is today. Would I love a better viewfinder, who wouldn’t, but that won’t stop me from purchasing this camera for my travel needs. The weight and size is much more important for my shooting than an improved viewfinder. I typically shoot AF lenses and all I need the viewfinder for is to compose…which the current one will work.
As far as Aps-c cameras…I see zero need for them given the A7cr in crop mode basically duplicates their functionality. I still have an a6000 which I’ll hold onto since it’s worth zero, but I can’t see using it when the A7cr is available.
EVIL_guy wrote:
Same with me, and now we even have two models!
I don't think so and don't hope this will ever happen!
A larger EVF will make the whole Body bigger.
Sony has to keep the Body small, no matter about restrictions.
If you miss a better EVF or this flippy display, it's better to go for a bigger body like A7 IV oder A7R V.
Most people buy a c-class Sony due to the small size and weight!
Yep, putting everything from the A7r5 into the A7cr gets you…well an A7r5…kind of defeats the whole idea of a compact light camera. I’m pretty happy Sony has decided to put focus onto the size and weight of the A7cr rather trying to cram every feature under the sun creating bulk and bloat…the A7r5.
chez wrote:
As far as Aps-c cameras…I see zero need for them given the A7cr in crop mode basically duplicates their functionality. I still have an a6000 which I’ll hold onto since it’s worth zero, but I can’t see using it when the A7cr is available.
You're absolutely right!
The A7c r contains a complete A6700 and people who don't need a backup body don't need any Sony APS-C body from now on.
nhsonyshooter wrote:
The simple fact is if they were in demand they would not be discounted at all this early in the life cycle. Again no one is saying they are bad. I have wanted a FF sensor in an APS-C body for years, long before the C was even rumored. Sony just missed a few important opportunities to appeal to many more people. I promise the the flip/LCD and EVF will be different when ever the version 3 units come out. It's just to bad many of us have to wait when we would have gladly given Sony money now. We are not talking about big money items either. The irony is these discounts could have easily paid for the improvements many are looking for. Oh well. I'll keep waiting. ...Show more →
Just because some dealer is selling it at discounted price here on this forum does not mean they are not selling well. Big retailers like BH, Adorama, Best Buy, etc. have not discounted these cameras at all.
chez wrote:
Yep, putting everything from the A7r5 into the A7cr gets you…well an A7r5…kind of defeats the whole idea of a compact light camera. I’m pretty happy Sony has decided to put focus onto the size and weight of the A7cr rather trying to cram every feature under the sun creating bulk and bloat…the A7r5.
Haha, exactly! If one wants a bigger/higher quality EVF, dual card slots, etc. then they should just buy an A7RV rather than wishing A7CR had these features.
Also, people who say that A7CR is only slightly smaller than A7RV because there is no EVF hump should first hold one in hand. I sold my A7IV to buy an A7CR and the size/weight is very noticeable.
I used to joke that the A7riv was the super aps-c camera that folks had been asking for. But aps-c users were/are looking for a "fast" nature/wildlife/sports body, even if it meant a current "D500" type with the aps-c sensor in a full size body. That's not the A7CR nor A7Rv.
And price is a factor. Aps-c began as an attempt to counter the high prices of ff. There are a lot of aps-c users who can't or won't double their budget just to get an extra stop. It's still a reasonable alternative.
The A7CR is not an A7Rv in miniature, it's missing features to be smaller. It's not just an expensive A6700, either. It's missing A6700 features, too. It hasn't got the mechanical shutter or the video features. It's not $1400.
Craig Gillette wrote:
It's not just an expensive A6700, either. It's missing A6700 features, too. It hasn't got the mechanical shutter or the video features. It's not $1400.
Craig Gillette wrote:
.... It's not just an expensive A6700, either. It's missing A6700 features, too. It hasn't got the mechanical shutter or the video features. It's not $1400.
If you only need APS-C your right!
A lot of of people use APS-C beside FF for a smaller body and 1.5x crop.
These users don't need a seperate APS-C body from now on!
And, substract your $1400 from the A7c r price and you'll get the cheapest 61mp body ever
If I could only afford one it would be the A7RV. No real limitations of any kind other than matching the fps of the A1. Great viewfinder and rear LCD and would never shoot professionally without two memory card slots and like the capability supported by CFexpress. The larger GMII f/2.8 trinity and GM primes are a great fit for it as well and its ability to take the battery grip make it extremely flexible for everything a one camera solution has to offer.
That said I also need a smaller lighter body and lenses for travel so I own both A7RV and A7CR and even a A6700 which I might sell but its small lenses give it some unique advantages. If the two Rs are too expensive the A7CII is a great alternative if a small full frame is what you need or want.
EVIL_guy wrote:
Same with me, and now we even have two models!
I don't think so and don't hope this will ever happen!
A larger EVF will make the whole Body bigger.
Sony has to keep the Body small, no matter about restrictions.
If you miss a better EVF or this flippy display, it's better to go for a bigger body like A7 IV oder A7R V.
Most people buy a c-class Sony due to the small size and weight!
The resolution and magnification can be increased with out changing the size and weight. Heck they had a higher magnification EVF in the Rx1rii which is a smaller body and that was 8 years ago. That camera had a tilting and higher resolution LCD again 8 years ago. Don't kid your self, Sony didn't add or not change those things because they couldn't. They did it to save a buck. Which I could see on the A7cii because it is more budget oriented. But on the the A7cr they just cheaped out. Even the biggest Sony youtube fan boys twist themselves in knots trying to word their reviews carefully about the EVF and flip screen in that camera. Hey, I'm still a Sony fan boy and I have been waiting along time. What is another 3 years.
Yeah, that math works. I'm going to tell my wife I'm going to buy a $3000 camera so I don't have to buy a $1400 camera.
That one never "needed" a second body just to shoot cropped or use cropped lenses is true. But one expensive (or inexpensive) body isn't two bodies. One lens is not two lenses.
I already have the cheapest 61mp body ever. It's just that my A7riv plummeted in value.
Craig Gillette wrote:
Yeah, that math works. I'm going to tell my wife I'm going to buy a $3000 camera so I don't have to buy a $1400 camera.
That one never "needed" a second body just to shoot cropped or use cropped lenses is true. But one expensive (or inexpensive) body isn't two bodies. One lens is not two lenses.
I already have the cheapest 61mp body ever. It's just that my A7riv plummeted in value.
Actually that math works perfectly in many situations. Right now I carry a A6000 during travels for a small compact camera to take out when I’m not focussed on shooting images, but still like to snap a few if they present themselves…like going out for dinner or to a museum etc… With the A7cr I would not need another camera as it is compact enough, just slip a nice small aps-c prime and I’m all set.
I read many posts here with members asking about a small compact camera for travelling…well now we have one that can play the role of big brother and handle the dedicated shoots and then become the little brother out on a trip.
Not sure they are