Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
p.9 #1Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
mudlake wrote:
Or even a 50/2 APO on the order of the Voigtlander that is only slightly larger to accommodate autofocus. Imagine a 50/2 APO weighing around 350-400 grams.
I vaguely expect a 1.8/50 or 2/50 G lens at some point, and that could have very good colour correction.
jxhnpxxl wrote
Kind of wish they were focusing on other technologies or features for their lenses instead of a bigger aperture. I’d kill for a good Sony anamorphic lens.I vaguely expect a 1.8/50 or 2/50 G lens at some point, and that could have very good colour correction.
Mar 07, 2021 at 09:04 PM
p.9 #2Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
hiepphotog wrote:
IMO it's a mistake if Sony is going to release a GM 50/1.2 just as big and heavy as the RF 50. Canon came out with a lens first and it wouldn't really help Sony improve the mount size perception since Sigma already made an f/1.2 lens for the system. The only thing left is how Sony can still make the lightest and smallest in this class with at least great sharpness and similar smart trade-offs like the other recent GM primes.
It won’t be as big and heavy as the RF 50, which is already 130 g heavier and about the same dimensions as the 85 GM. Sony did save 100 g on the new 35 GM, compared to the old ZA 35. That’s why coming in at similar size and weight as the 85 GM for a 50 1.2, would be quite impressive.
IMO it's a mistake if Sony is going to release a GM 50/1.2 just as big and heavy as the RF 50. Canon came out with a lens first and it wouldn't really help Sony improve the mount size perception since Sigma already made an f/1.2 lens for the system. The only thing left is how Sony can still make the lightest and smallest in this class with at least great sharpness and similar smart trade-offs like the other recent GM primes.
It won’t be as big and heavy as the RF 50, which is already 130 g heavier and about the same dimensions as the 85 GM. Sony did save 100 g on the new 35 GM, compared to the old ZA 35. That’s why coming in at similar size and weight as the 85 GM for a 50 1.2, would be quite impressive.
Mar 07, 2021 at 10:25 PM
p.9 #3Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
The ZA was made many moons ago I am pretty sure it does not have fluorite elements or magnesium or plastic I am surprised that you think it will be heavier when all of their other lenses the previous couple years have been significantly lighter Fred?
I understand the element will be larger but if they built a 1.4 I think everyone would expect it to be significantly lighter so I am hoping that it comes in around 700gm myself perhaps a little less. Sony has been pretty good as surprising us the last few years with what they are able to do.
I understand the element will be larger but if they built a 1.4 I think everyone would expect it to be significantly lighter so I am hoping that it comes in around 700gm myself perhaps a little less. Sony has been pretty good as surprising us the last few years with what they are able to do.
Mar 08, 2021 at 12:26 PM
p.9 #4Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
trstahly wrote:
The ZA was made many moons ago I am pretty sure it does not have fluorite elements or magnesium or plastic I am surprised that you think it will be heavier when all of their other lenses the previous couple years have been significantly lighter Fred?
I understand the element will be larger but if they built a 1.4 I think everyone would expect it to be significantly lighter so I am hoping that it comes in around 700gm myself perhaps a little less. Sony has been pretty good as surprising us the last few years with what they are able...Show more →
Given the new 35 GM is about 100 g less than the 35 ZA, one could conclude a theoretical 50mm 1.4 GM would also shed 100 g off the 50 ZA and bring the weight down to 680 g. For the rumored 50 1.2 GM to come in under 700g, Sony would have to perform a miracle and somehow squeeze the needed glass for a 1.2 aperture in a weight budget of only 20 g. To see what’s possible, look at the series of 35mm Sigma lenses, the older DSLR derived 35 1.4 is 755 g, while their latest greatest 35 1.2 comes in at a whopping 1090 g.
The ZA was made many moons ago I am pretty sure it does not have fluorite elements or magnesium or plastic I am surprised that you think it will be heavier when all of their other lenses the previous couple years have been significantly lighter Fred?
I understand the element will be larger but if they built a 1.4 I think everyone would expect it to be significantly lighter so I am hoping that it comes in around 700gm myself perhaps a little less. Sony has been pretty good as surprising us the last few years with what they are able...Show more →
Given the new 35 GM is about 100 g less than the 35 ZA, one could conclude a theoretical 50mm 1.4 GM would also shed 100 g off the 50 ZA and bring the weight down to 680 g. For the rumored 50 1.2 GM to come in under 700g, Sony would have to perform a miracle and somehow squeeze the needed glass for a 1.2 aperture in a weight budget of only 20 g. To see what’s possible, look at the series of 35mm Sigma lenses, the older DSLR derived 35 1.4 is 755 g, while their latest greatest 35 1.2 comes in at a whopping 1090 g.
Mar 09, 2021 at 09:53 PM
p.9 #5Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
I heard Sony engineers found a way to coat lenses with special charmed and strange quarks which allowed them to make this 50/1.2 a pancake design weighing 200 grams. Should be real special. I’m surprised Sony rumors didn’t pick this up. 🙂
Mar 09, 2021 at 11:21 PM
p.9 #6Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
saxguy wrote:
I suspect it WILL be smaller than the RF counterpart (what Sony lens isn't 
) but will lack the rendering magic of that particular lens.What magic?It's a pretty special lens, and at least to my eye pops considerably at f/1.2 in a way that most lenses do not. It's very sharp wide open with a beautiful falloff, IMO. If Sony makes one that can match it, it'd be great. Though I also think the ZA50/1.4 is a very good lens. Not quite as good as the Canon, but not too far off.
Here's a shot I took with the RF 50/1.2 wide open on my R6 showing that pop you can get with the lens:
http://www.jordansteele.com/2020/x_pokemon.jpgNice shot! Looks good. I think it's tough to judge when the background is so OOF, but I wonder if the RF 50/1.2 is like the old Sony 35/1.4...nice rendering, great transition zone, complicated and somewhat unattractive background, especially with specular highlights. I can be guilty at times of judging a lens purely on how it renders a background with lots of foliage or specular highlights, rather than looking at the transition zone or the background when there is even illumination. I find different lenses do very differently in those situations.I had the R5 and the RF50 1.2 for a little while. I ended up not keeping the R5 and have the alpha 1 on order, but I did like the rendering of the RF 50 1.2...
I can't help thinking that this portrait taken with the R 50 1.2 looks a bit ... well - "lifeless" !
Dave Sanders wrote
Jman13 wrote
Holger wrote
RoamingScott wrote
trogdon wrote
Not a lens for me (not a fan of 50mm and this will be very big), but it's a great lens to see in the Sony system, and I have to imagine they'll find a way to make it smaller than the Nikon Z and Canon RF lenses.) but will lack the rendering magic of that particular lens.Here's a shot I took with the RF 50/1.2 wide open on my R6 showing that pop you can get with the lens:
http://www.jordansteele.com/2020/x_pokemon.jpg
I can't help thinking that this portrait taken with the R 50 1.2 looks a bit ... well - "lifeless" !
Mar 10, 2021 at 03:11 AM
p.9 #7Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
To bad they felt they had to chase 1.2. Personally I like the 50mm Zeiss. I think they would have sold a ton more at 1.4 which were smaller and lighter than the Zeiss. That said I'm thankful they didn't do this with the 35mm GM.
Mar 10, 2021 at 05:32 AM
p.9 #8Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
nhsonyshooter wrote:
To bad they felt they had to chase 1.2. Personally I like the 50mm Zeiss. I think they would have sold a ton more at 1.4 which were smaller and lighter than the Zeiss. That said I'm thankful they didn't do this with the 35mm GM.
I for one am glad they are going with 1.2, the excellent 50 1.4 and 55 1.8 ZA already exist for those who want something more compact. As long as this lens delivers on its wide open rendering, it will sell just fine.
Mar 10, 2021 at 05:25 PM
p.9 #9Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
People will complain if it wasn’t an f1.2, and people will complain if it is.
I am sure some one out there would complain if they came out with both.
Edited on Mar 10, 2021 at 05:39 PM · View previous versions
I am sure some one out there would complain if they came out with both.
Edited on Mar 10, 2021 at 05:39 PM · View previous versions
Mar 10, 2021 at 05:32 PM
p.9 #10Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
I don't mind that they chose f/1.2, I think there are valid reasons for doing so. But I won't buy it either. The 50ZA is a really good lens and I don't think a high end 50 f/1.4 would have come at a smaller enough size to make it worthwhile for both lenses to exist.
Mar 10, 2021 at 05:37 PM
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p.9 #11Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
I can understand why they choose to make a 35GM 1.4, since the zony was not good.
The zony 50 1.4 is definitely much better, but can also been improved: AF could be better, midzone dip can be annoying, and weight is ok but not exceptional.
These are the reasons we were a lot expecting a 50 GM 1.4.
But since the actual 50 1.4 is really not as bad as the ZONY 35mm, I can understand why they choose the 1.2 version.
Another reason is that sony is known for compact and lightweight camera and lenses whereas nikon and canon follows different ways (24 70 F/2 for canon Nikkor 50MM 1.2 or 0.95....) and some of us were not expecting that sony would want to fight on the same fields...
The zony 50 1.4 is definitely much better, but can also been improved: AF could be better, midzone dip can be annoying, and weight is ok but not exceptional.
These are the reasons we were a lot expecting a 50 GM 1.4.
But since the actual 50 1.4 is really not as bad as the ZONY 35mm, I can understand why they choose the 1.2 version.
Another reason is that sony is known for compact and lightweight camera and lenses whereas nikon and canon follows different ways (24 70 F/2 for canon Nikkor 50MM 1.2 or 0.95....) and some of us were not expecting that sony would want to fight on the same fields...
Mar 11, 2021 at 03:05 AM
p.9 #12Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !
Mar 11, 2021 at 03:57 PM
p.9 #13Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
Holger wrote:
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !
Glad to be wrong about this one.
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !
Glad to be wrong about this one.
Mar 11, 2021 at 06:06 PM
p.9 #14Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
Holger wrote:
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !
That will also make it smaller by quite a bit than the Nikkor Z 50/1.2, which weighs 1090grams and has got an 82mm filter size. If the rumour is true, how did Sony accomplish this?
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !
That will also make it smaller by quite a bit than the Nikkor Z 50/1.2, which weighs 1090grams and has got an 82mm filter size. If the rumour is true, how did Sony accomplish this?
Mar 11, 2021 at 06:31 PM
p.9 #15Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
bjornthun wrote:
That will also make it smaller by quite a bit than the Nikkor Z 50/1.2, which weighs 1090grams and has got an 82mm filter size. If the rumour is true, how did Sony accomplish this?
I don’t know of course, but two technical possibilities spring to mind, along with some compromises.
One is that Sony’s moulding technology allows more crazy surface shapes on very large aspheres, and that allows a degree of shrinkage.
The other is that Sony are keen on complex motors that make the elements move in complex ways during focus, which can also make for a more compact result than a single internal focus focussing group.
The compromises might include
Focus breathing (our video friends will care, but personally I’d much rather have compactness than less breathing, so I’m good with that)
Shading/vignetting: if it’s plain shading that just darkens the corners more than average (though average is a lot these days!) a trade off I’m also happy with.
Optical/mechanical vignetting: less happy here as it can make the bokeh a bit ugly in the corners, though of course there will be some.
I’d be very surprised if resolution and contrast aren’t superb, marketing insists on that.
It would be nice if it it has a better mid field even if worse corners wide open than the ZA. I’ve never seen a wide open at f1.4 or 1.2 image where’re corner sharpness matters, but you might well have eyes in the midfield in a portrait.
Holger wrote
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !I don’t know of course, but two technical possibilities spring to mind, along with some compromises.
One is that Sony’s moulding technology allows more crazy surface shapes on very large aspheres, and that allows a degree of shrinkage.
The other is that Sony are keen on complex motors that make the elements move in complex ways during focus, which can also make for a more compact result than a single internal focus focussing group.
The compromises might include
Focus breathing (our video friends will care, but personally I’d much rather have compactness than less breathing, so I’m good with that)
Shading/vignetting: if it’s plain shading that just darkens the corners more than average (though average is a lot these days!) a trade off I’m also happy with.
Optical/mechanical vignetting: less happy here as it can make the bokeh a bit ugly in the corners, though of course there will be some.
I’d be very surprised if resolution and contrast aren’t superb, marketing insists on that.
It would be nice if it it has a better mid field even if worse corners wide open than the ZA. I’ve never seen a wide open at f1.4 or 1.2 image where’re corner sharpness matters, but you might well have eyes in the midfield in a portrait.
Mar 11, 2021 at 07:03 PM
p.9 #16Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
If true this lens is going to be a banger. This is very exciting. I may be selling lenses to make room for this lens.
Holger wrote:
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !
Holger wrote:
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !
Mar 11, 2021 at 07:26 PM
p.9 #17Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
If it's priced at $1400 I'll just have the IRS send my stimmy to B&H
Mar 11, 2021 at 09:27 PM
p.9 #18Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
DavidBM wrote:
That will also make it smaller by quite a bit than the Nikkor Z 50/1.2, which weighs 1090grams and has got an 82mm filter size. If the rumour is true, how did Sony accomplish this?I don’t know of course, but two technical possibilities spring to mind, along with some compromises.
One is that Sony’s moulding technology allows more crazy surface shapes on very large aspheres, and that allows a degree of shrinkage.
The other is that Sony are keen on complex motors that make the elements move in complex ways during focus, which can also make for a more compact result than a single internal focus focussing group.
The compromises might include
Focus breathing (our video friends will care, but personally I’d much rather have compactness than less breathing, so I’m good with that)
Shading/vignetting: if it’s plain shading...Show more →
Great explanation. It's always worth remembering that fast lenses don't need to be huge...they only need to be huge if we also demand that they perform well across the field wide open or close to it. Fast, accurate AF complicates things as well, of course. My old Nikon 50/1.2 AIs was 400 grams but I don't think people would be pleased with its performance if it was a modern lens.
I'm willing to trade sharpness on the edges and in the corners wide open, but that's how I shoot. A lens that is sharp in the middle 70% wide open that sharpens up across the frame by f/4 (or even f/5.6) works really well for me. For others, maybe not so much, but I've never cared about vignetting or edge sharpness wide-open.
bjornthun wrote
Holger wrote
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !One is that Sony’s moulding technology allows more crazy surface shapes on very large aspheres, and that allows a degree of shrinkage.
The other is that Sony are keen on complex motors that make the elements move in complex ways during focus, which can also make for a more compact result than a single internal focus focussing group.
The compromises might include
Focus breathing (our video friends will care, but personally I’d much rather have compactness than less breathing, so I’m good with that)
Shading/vignetting: if it’s plain shading...Show more →
Great explanation. It's always worth remembering that fast lenses don't need to be huge...they only need to be huge if we also demand that they perform well across the field wide open or close to it. Fast, accurate AF complicates things as well, of course. My old Nikon 50/1.2 AIs was 400 grams but I don't think people would be pleased with its performance if it was a modern lens.
I'm willing to trade sharpness on the edges and in the corners wide open, but that's how I shoot. A lens that is sharp in the middle 70% wide open that sharpens up across the frame by f/4 (or even f/5.6) works really well for me. For others, maybe not so much, but I've never cared about vignetting or edge sharpness wide-open.
Mar 11, 2021 at 10:12 PM
p.9 #19Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
TheDeadTexan wrote:
If it's priced at $1400 I'll just have the IRS send my stimmy to B&H
I don't expect it to be near this price, however, I would love to be wrong.
If it's priced at $1400 I'll just have the IRS send my stimmy to B&H
I don't expect it to be near this price, however, I would love to be wrong.
Mar 11, 2021 at 10:53 PM
p.9 #20Pre-order: Sony FE 50mm f/1.2 GM ($1,998)
DavidBM wrote:
That will also make it smaller by quite a bit than the Nikkor Z 50/1.2, which weighs 1090grams and has got an 82mm filter size. If the rumour is true, how did Sony accomplish this?I don’t know of course, but two technical possibilities spring to mind, along with some compromises.
One is that Sony’s moulding technology allows more crazy surface shapes on very large aspheres, and that allows a degree of shrinkage.
The other is that Sony are keen on complex motors that make the elements move in complex ways during focus, which can also make for a more compact result than a single internal focus focussing group.
The compromises might include
Focus breathing (our video friends will care, but personally I’d much rather have compactness than less breathing, so I’m good with that)
Shading/vignetting: if it’s plain shading...Show more →
The focus breathing is one issue where Nikon has put a lot of attention. Nikon needs their S lenses to work well for video in a way that I don't think Sony does. There are tons of video lenses available for Sony E mount. Nikon only has Nikon lenses available for the Z mount for video. Nikon has also made their S lenses very telecentric. That is a sound design strategy, but it doesn't make lenses smaller. I expect Sony to have made some compromises with focus breathing, vignetting, maybe distortion (although this probably isn't a big issue with a 50), coma, and maybe corner sharpness wide open (although the 35 f/1.4 GM is small and didn't really compromise much there). If the lens weighs less than the ZA 50 f/1.4 it may still be about 775g. That is smaller than the Nikon by quite a bit, but IMO not unthinkably small given that the 24 f/1.4 GM is 445g, and the 35 f/1.4 GM is 524g. In fact, a 775g 50 f/1.2 GM seems to fall very much in line with what looks to be the recent philosophy at Sony of making small size an important criteria for their fast GM lenses.
bjornthun wrote
Holger wrote
SAR RUMOR: Sony 50mm f/1.2 GM has 72mm filter size, 0,4m (1.32ft) close focus distance and is lighter than the Zeiss 50mm FE !One is that Sony’s moulding technology allows more crazy surface shapes on very large aspheres, and that allows a degree of shrinkage.
The other is that Sony are keen on complex motors that make the elements move in complex ways during focus, which can also make for a more compact result than a single internal focus focussing group.
The compromises might include
Focus breathing (our video friends will care, but personally I’d much rather have compactness than less breathing, so I’m good with that)
Shading/vignetting: if it’s plain shading...Show more →
The focus breathing is one issue where Nikon has put a lot of attention. Nikon needs their S lenses to work well for video in a way that I don't think Sony does. There are tons of video lenses available for Sony E mount. Nikon only has Nikon lenses available for the Z mount for video. Nikon has also made their S lenses very telecentric. That is a sound design strategy, but it doesn't make lenses smaller. I expect Sony to have made some compromises with focus breathing, vignetting, maybe distortion (although this probably isn't a big issue with a 50), coma, and maybe corner sharpness wide open (although the 35 f/1.4 GM is small and didn't really compromise much there). If the lens weighs less than the ZA 50 f/1.4 it may still be about 775g. That is smaller than the Nikon by quite a bit, but IMO not unthinkably small given that the 24 f/1.4 GM is 445g, and the 35 f/1.4 GM is 524g. In fact, a 775g 50 f/1.2 GM seems to fall very much in line with what looks to be the recent philosophy at Sony of making small size an important criteria for their fast GM lenses.
Mar 11, 2021 at 11:05 PM