artsupreme wrote:
Sony will probably soon respond...
Yes. And then Nikon. And Canon. And Sony.
All photographers should look forward to the continuous competition between these companies (and others) and the steady improvements in our already-excellent photographic tools.
Lather, rinse, repeat...
...with another TKO uppercut.
"Another" knockout? If the there had been a previous "knock out," the match would have ended, a winner declared, and the loser would have left the ring.
That didn't happen.
Perhaps the "T" in this "TKO" stands for "temporarily?" ;-)
Looking at these back and forth swings over a longer period of time — say five years or more — makes the whole thing look a lot less frantic.
alundeb wrote:
Leapfrogging is good, but it seems that people take it as given that Sony will respond soon. I am not so sure about that.
I don't think Sony will respond until earliest late 2021. That would be the earliest we would see an A9III and I really doubt they are ever doing an A9R. A7IV will be out next but that won't be an R5 competitor. A7RV is a long ways out seeing it is still very recent as is the A9II. Who knows what Nikon is doing...there hasn't been a rumor of a new Z camera for ages. Nikon may very well just disappear if things continue like they have been for them over the past few years.
gdanmitchell wrote:
Yes. And then Nikon. And Canon. And Sony.
All photographers should look forward to the continuous competition between these companies (and others) and the steady improvements in our already-excellent photographic tools.
Lather, rinse, repeat...
"Another" knockout? If the there had been a previous "knock out," the match would have ended, a winner declared, and the loser would have left the ring.
That didn't happen.
Perhaps the "T" in this "TKO" stands for "temporarily?" ;-)
Looking at these back and forth swings over a longer period of time — say five years or more — makes the whole thing look a lot less frantic.
The point is that Canon is trying to catch up with old Sony tech. With that said, there is no back and forth of the leaders. It's more like Leapfrog, narrow the gap, leapfrog, narrow the gap, leapfrog, narrow the gap.
Yes, Canon has been TKO'd but they do return to the mat in an attempt to close the gap. They have been in the dust trail for several years. Canon's "home run" nowadays usually means catching up to competitors old tech.
Holger wrote:
You are dreaming to think a non-flagship R5 to even surpass the 1dxiii, all that with a higher MP sensor and in a much cheaper body. How realistic is that? We don't even know what the R5 will bring to the table in detail (20fps with AF frozen or not, etc., 12fps with frozen AF, or not, nothing is clear right now).
You seem to think this (likely) 45MP camera to surpass A9ii AF, won't happen. So your comment sound like a fanboy delusional comment, sorry to say that. And that comes from someone like me, even thinking of adding an R5 (I am not brand addicted). ...Show more →
I suggest you slow down and read what I wrote again. Where did I say the R5 would surpass the 1DXIII or the A9II?
I believe my words were that I hope the R5 gets the same AF features as the 1DXIII. Which appears to equal the A9II for all intensive purposes based on the video you posted.
Is it likely? Probably not. But like I said, I'm hopeful.
Now as for your affectionate "fanboy delusional" comment. Might I remind you that I'm posting my personal optimism right here on the CANON forum in a thread about an exciting new CANON product. And although I am often delusional, according to my wife, I am not a fanboy. I'm simply a Canon supporting member.
Now if we really want to get into pointing fingers at "fanboys" perhaps we should look at all the fresh new faces we see here suddenly posting on the Canon forum for some strange reason.
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arbitrage wrote:
Don't count your chickens before they hatch. Until we see what Canon does with the R5 and whether they ever move to a R1 (and if they do how far out it is) it is premature to really compare an R5 to an A9II. By the time an R1 shows up there could be an A9III or an A9R or who knows what....one can wish for anything but until I see a full spec sheet and can read all the caveats in the user manuals I'm not going to place my bets or my $$$ onto either system.
The Cripple Hammer may still rear its ugly head with the R5 especially if the price point is $3500 (I'd bet an extra $1K onto that price). The Youtuber that made that phrase is a M43 shooter for the most part and he isn't a stills shooter, all he talks about is video. I think he occasionally uses an A6400 but that is it for his Sony use....Show more →
Not counting any chickens Geoff. Simply pointed out a few facts relative to the video posted and just expressing my enthusiasm and excitement as a Canon supporting member.
And I agree, we can "wish" for anything we choose, which is what I said in my post.
I find it very strange when a Canon user post a comment on the CANON forum expressing any form of support or excitement for the new product being discussed and then expresses their "hopes" for the product, then this person is jumped on as if they had posted this comment over on the Sony forum as some form of troll post.
Don't hate on me because Sony slapped SD cards in flagship body.
or because it takes 6 months for the buffer to clear. (according to Jared)
or because it only shoots at 10 fps in mechanical.
I didn't design it. Just pointing out a couple of facts that are often overlooked.
But hey, I get it! If I was a Sony user and they didn't fix these major issues when they released the A9II, I'd be pissed off too!
Just don't bring this hate over here in the Canon forum. We all live in peace and harmony over here.
My sincere apologies if my enthusiasm of Canon products offended anyone here on the CANON forum.
Just FYI, I saw the R5 at WPPI this afternoon. They have it in a case so you can't hold it, but it is clearly smaller than a 5D Mark IV. It is also slightly larger than an EOS R with the body looking just like an R except maybe 10% upsized. The people working there weren't able to say anything about the camera other than what Cqnon has already announced.
lighthound wrote:
I suggest you slow down and read what I wrote again. Where did I say the R5 would surpass the 1DXIII or the A9II?
I believe my words were that I hope the R5 gets the same AF features as the 1DXIII. Which appears to equal the A9II for all intensive purposes based on the video you posted.
Is it likely? Probably not. But like I said, I'm hopeful.
Now as for your affectionate "fanboy delusional" comment. Might I remind you that I'm posting my personal optimism right here on the CANON forum in a thread about an exciting new CANON product. And although I am often delusional, according to my wife, I am not a fanboy. I'm simply a Canon supporting member.
Now if we really want to get into pointing fingers at "fanboys" perhaps we should look at all the fresh new faces we see here suddenly posting on the Canon forum for some strange reason.
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Not counting any chickens Geoff. Simply pointed out a few facts relative to the video posted and just expressing my enthusiasm and excitement as a Canon supporting member.
And I agree, we can "wish" for anything we choose, which is what I said in my post.
I find it very strange when a Canon user post a comment on the CANON forum expressing any form of support or excitement for the new product being discussed and then expresses their "hopes" for the product, then this person is jumped on as if they had posted this comment over on the Sony forum as some form of troll post.
Don't hate on me because Sony slapped SD cards in flagship body.
or because it takes 6 months for the buffer to clear. (according to Jared)
or because it only shoots at 10 fps in mechanical.
I didn't design it. Just pointing out a couple of facts that are often overlooked.
But hey, I get it! If I was a Sony user and they didn't fix these major issues when they released the A9II, I'd be pissed off too!
Just don't bring this hate over here in the Canon forum. We all live in peace and harmony over here.
My sincere apologies if my enthusiasm of Canon products offended anyone here on the CANON forum.
Hugs and kisses
A Canon supporting member ...Show more →
Everyone walking back into the Canon forum like Indiana Jones through a cave full of cobwebs.
gdanmitchell wrote:
As they say, "'Don't get ahead of your skis."
The more likely (continuing) reality...
1. At times any of several companies could have the most compelling photographic tool, with your assessment of "most compelling" being somewhat subjective and different depending on what/how you photograph. The "lead" among companies rotates over time.
2. In a truly objective sense, the differences are far less important that we imagine — the fact is that all of these companies are making extremely competent equipment, and the difference between the best thing and the second-best thing in some aspect of camera performance is actually not that great. In addition, the second-best thing is almost certainly better in some other area of performance.
Regarding #2, I think there's a sort of inverse proportion principle: The more strongly you regard your camera company affiliation as if it were that of fan of a sports team, the larger you imagine the differences to be when they favor your brand and the smaller you regard them to be when they favor another brand/team.
I am beginning to think the proper analogy is battle bots instead of sports team at this point.
I guess people use cameras for different purposes that I do. I have asked the question before and I do not recall a good answer. If I got one and forgot I apologize. If I sell all of my Canon gear, and I have and buy into Sony what will I get out of all the effort? Specifically?
No offense to Sony if I owned them I am sure I would be happy, but the only cameras that have really interested me outside of the Canon world was the D850 and the medium format Fuji. I am going to hold out for the Canon R5 which should make a good all rounder. I have my 1d cameras, and I bought a 4x5 instead of the Fuji. Anything you buy is a compromise. I come from the perspective of not being a technical guy when it comes to cameras. I just like to use them. I like the end result.
If there was a perfect camera then there would be only one brand and one model, and we would not have camera conspiracies youtube channel. That would be a dull world.
As a current 1Dx2 and 5D4 owner who dislikes the EOS R
my thoughts are
A- the R5 must be better than the 5D4 in AF performance or whats the point of buying one
B- It has to be able to hit a moving subject ( example BIF) in servo mode- EOS R struggles
C- It has to be able to lock in dark conditions and lock on moving subjects in dark conditions- EOS R struggles
D- It has to be able to lock and perform in backlight conditions- EOS R Really struggles
And im not excited about a 40-45 MB sensor for wedding work
A- hoping it has some type of Mraw capabilities
B- Hoping some of the 1Dx3 technology with Auto AF capabilities like facial falls to the R5
I am extremely impressed with the 1Dx3 update but there is no way I would consider an upgrade until I see what this R5 is about.
I did not get an EOS R due to no dual cards. But the AF performance on the EOS R is not on par to the 5D4 especially in conditions that I listed above
Wait and see for me on the R5 but hoping it works in the AF department
slowdad wrote:
I did not get an EOS R due to no dual cards. But the AF performance on the EOS R is not on par to the 5D4 especially in conditions that I listed above
I was certain you didn't get a Canon EOS R once I read this part of your comment:
"C- It has to be able to lock in dark conditions and lock on moving subjects in dark conditions- EOS R struggles"
Throw a Canon EF 85mm 1.2 or RF 50mm 1.2 on the EOS R and it leaves a 5D mk iv wanting.
I can see a few things some folks may not be thrilled with in an EOS R. Maybe the one card. Maybe the frame rate.
alundeb wrote:
The minimum we can expect, is that it will track at 50% frame rate of what the top 1D class camera of the time does. That will be 8 fps mech and 10 fps e-shutter. This is the old Canon way and I guarantee that will happen as a minimum.
Does anyone else think that the R5 will do 8fps at minimum in mechanical AI servo? Based on history, I would say it will do 8fps at best with tracking, but what does everyone else think?
With that said if it is 8fps @ 40MP+, what would you expect the tracking performance equivalent to? Somewhere between a 7DII and 1DX?
artsupreme wrote:
Does anyone else think that the R5 will do 8fps at minimum in mechanical AI servo? Based on history, I would say it will do 8fps at best with tracking, but what does everyone else think?
With that said if it is 8fps @ 40MP+, what would you expect the tracking performance equivalent to? Somewhere between a 7DII and 1DX?
8 FPS mechanical with tracking is a good bet. The 5D3 did 6 FPS and the 5D4 did 7 FPS. By all accounts, this is the successor to that line.
