Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
p.3 #1Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Juha Kannisto wrote:
Some of my samples with various M-mount lenses (my M-mount selection works reasonably on Sony as well but some of them are working clearly better on fp):
Thanks for sharing, Juha!
Some of my samples with various M-mount lenses (my M-mount selection works reasonably on Sony as well but some of them are working clearly better on fp):
Thanks for sharing, Juha!
Feb 15, 2020 at 12:40 PM
p.3 #2Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Thanks Serhan.
I'm considering the fp as a compact second body. The bigger issue for me would be the lack of viewfinder. I might rent one and see if I can live with that. If only the CL and the fp could make a full-frame baby.
serhan_ wrote:
Here is other reviews with 18mm 3.4 and summilux shots:
http://findingrange.com/2019/12/02/sigma-fp-mirrorless-camera-review-a-photographers-perspective/
http://shinobuosawa.com/blog/sigma-fp/
It depends on your use also. Even leica cl apsc exposes 50mm summilux'es dip for landscape shots esp at f4 shot:
http://tobinators.com/blog/2017/12/gear-and-kit/leica-cl-55-135-tl-v-90mm-summicron-and-50mm-summilux/
https://medium.com/%E6%94%9D%E5%BD%B1%E4%BA%8C%E4%B8%89%E4%BA%8B/sigmafp-e6afe0a8ceb4Ha, thanks! I actually found that article a day or two ago, but I didn't read far enough to see the bit about the Leica lenses. 
And he actually covered the exact 3 WA lenses I would be interested in using on the fp: the 21mm f/3.4, 28mm f/1.4, and 28mm f/2.0 (although I have the 2nd version).
These images seems to bear out what Serhan was suggesting: that it lies somewhere in between Sony and Nikon in adapted lens performance.
I'm considering the fp as a compact second body. The bigger issue for me would be the lack of viewfinder. I might rent one and see if I can live with that. If only the CL and the fp could make a full-frame baby.
serhan_ wrote:
Here is other reviews with 18mm 3.4 and summilux shots:
http://findingrange.com/2019/12/02/sigma-fp-mirrorless-camera-review-a-photographers-perspective/
http://shinobuosawa.com/blog/sigma-fp/
It depends on your use also. Even leica cl apsc exposes 50mm summilux'es dip for landscape shots esp at f4 shot:
http://tobinators.com/blog/2017/12/gear-and-kit/leica-cl-55-135-tl-v-90mm-summicron-and-50mm-summilux/
Lids wrote
AndereObjektiv wrote
sigma fp tested with a few lenses including some leica m:https://medium.com/%E6%94%9D%E5%BD%B1%E4%BA%8C%E4%B8%89%E4%BA%8B/sigmafp-e6afe0a8ceb4
And he actually covered the exact 3 WA lenses I would be interested in using on the fp: the 21mm f/3.4, 28mm f/1.4, and 28mm f/2.0 (although I have the 2nd version). These images seems to bear out what Serhan was suggesting: that it lies somewhere in between Sony and Nikon in adapted lens performance.
Feb 15, 2020 at 01:06 PM
p.3 #3Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
In the first link above, where he has some M18/3.8 images, you can see cyan/green color shift on the FP quite clearly in the corners.
The Andrew Tobin CL review(s) definitely show that on APS-C you're seeing some corner degradation (where the FF mid zone would be), even at f/11, with the 50 Lux. His other review comparing the 18-56 against the 24 and 50 Luxes shows this as well with both M lenses (the 24 and 50 both have mid zone dips). I've recently been playing with a Canon M6II and have tried some of my Leica M glass on it, such as the 50 Lux ASPH and 90AA. Edge performance on APS-C by the 50 Lux is not ideal, though stopped down a fair amount and it's not that noticeable. I think some of the Canon glass, particularly the 32/1.4, outperforms the M glass, in respect to sheer resolution at or near wide open (ignoring subjective factors such as rendering). So if I was looking at the CL, I wouldn't be surprised if the APS-C specific L mount lenses do better on it than some adapted M lenses.
Probably not a surprise, but IMO many M lenses really do best on the Leica digital Ms, compared to adapting to Sony, Nikon, etc. The 24MP FF sensor doesn't stress out the lenses, many of which are now somewhat dated designs and the thinner sensor cover glass makes all the difference at optimizing across-frame performance
Sorry, a bit OT...
The Andrew Tobin CL review(s) definitely show that on APS-C you're seeing some corner degradation (where the FF mid zone would be), even at f/11, with the 50 Lux. His other review comparing the 18-56 against the 24 and 50 Luxes shows this as well with both M lenses (the 24 and 50 both have mid zone dips). I've recently been playing with a Canon M6II and have tried some of my Leica M glass on it, such as the 50 Lux ASPH and 90AA. Edge performance on APS-C by the 50 Lux is not ideal, though stopped down a fair amount and it's not that noticeable. I think some of the Canon glass, particularly the 32/1.4, outperforms the M glass, in respect to sheer resolution at or near wide open (ignoring subjective factors such as rendering). So if I was looking at the CL, I wouldn't be surprised if the APS-C specific L mount lenses do better on it than some adapted M lenses.
Probably not a surprise, but IMO many M lenses really do best on the Leica digital Ms, compared to adapting to Sony, Nikon, etc. The 24MP FF sensor doesn't stress out the lenses, many of which are now somewhat dated designs and the thinner sensor cover glass makes all the difference at optimizing across-frame performance
Sorry, a bit OT...
Feb 15, 2020 at 08:12 PM
p.3 #4Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Leica Q2 with 28-50mm usable range might be the closest to the CL+FP combination, but it is not that compact either. Sony Rx1R II with an interchangeable lens or FF CL/a6600 might be close... FP with a grip and a top evf is close to original Sony A7/A7r.
GR III is small, but no evf... I like the Canon G1X M3 for landscape use though the lens is heavily corrected, still sharp. It has nd filter and hand holdable to slow shutter speeds at base ISO with IS+evf...
Lids wrote:
Thanks Serhan.
I'm considering the fp as a compact second body. The bigger issue for me would be the lack of viewfinder. I might rent one and see if I can live with that. If only the CL and the fp could make a full-frame baby.
http://findingrange.com/2019/12/02/sigma-fp-mirrorless-camera-review-a-photographers-perspective/
http://shinobuosawa.com/blog/sigma-fp/
It depends on your use also. Even leica cl apsc exposes 50mm summilux'es dip for landscape shots esp at f4 shot:
http://tobinators.com/blog/2017/12/gear-and-kit/leica-cl-55-135-tl-v-90mm-summicron-and-50mm-summilux/
https://medium.com/%E6%94%9D%E5%BD%B1%E4%BA%8C%E4%B8%89%E4%BA%8B/sigmafp-e6afe0a8ceb4Ha, thanks! I actually found that article a day or two ago, but I didn't read far enough to see the bit about the Leica lenses. And he actually covered the exact 3 WA lenses I would be interested in using on the fp: the 21mm f/3.4, 28mm f/1.4, and 28mm f/2.0 (although I have the 2nd version).
These images seems to bear out what Serhan was suggesting: that it lies somewhere in between Sony and Nikon in adapted lens performance.
GR III is small, but no evf... I like the Canon G1X M3 for landscape use though the lens is heavily corrected, still sharp. It has nd filter and hand holdable to slow shutter speeds at base ISO with IS+evf...
Lids wrote:
Thanks Serhan.
I'm considering the fp as a compact second body. The bigger issue for me would be the lack of viewfinder. I might rent one and see if I can live with that. If only the CL and the fp could make a full-frame baby.
serhan_ wrote
Here is other reviews with 18mm 3.4 and summilux shots:http://findingrange.com/2019/12/02/sigma-fp-mirrorless-camera-review-a-photographers-perspective/
http://shinobuosawa.com/blog/sigma-fp/
It depends on your use also. Even leica cl apsc exposes 50mm summilux'es dip for landscape shots esp at f4 shot:
http://tobinators.com/blog/2017/12/gear-and-kit/leica-cl-55-135-tl-v-90mm-summicron-and-50mm-summilux/
Lids wrote
AndereObjektiv wrote
sigma fp tested with a few lenses including some leica m:https://medium.com/%E6%94%9D%E5%BD%B1%E4%BA%8C%E4%B8%89%E4%BA%8B/sigmafp-e6afe0a8ceb4
And he actually covered the exact 3 WA lenses I would be interested in using on the fp: the 21mm f/3.4, 28mm f/1.4, and 28mm f/2.0 (although I have the 2nd version). These images seems to bear out what Serhan was suggesting: that it lies somewhere in between Sony and Nikon in adapted lens performance.
Feb 15, 2020 at 10:58 PM
p.3 #5Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Sigma announced firmware update plans for fp:
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/02/2581/
-------------------------------------
Firmware update Ver.2.00 will be released in summer 2020. It will improve the camera’s capability with the addition or improvement of a number of functions including CinemaDNG playback, cinemagraph functionality and movie recording with the Director’s Viewfinder.
[Benefits of the update]
・Supports CinemaDNG 120/100fps (FHD 8bit) shooting.
・Supports cinemagraph functionality.
・Supports still image shooting during live view and movie shooting in Cine mode.
・Supports HDR shooting.
・Supports Director’s Viewfinder recording function.
・Supports SDK (Software Development Kit).
SIGMA is also developing firmware Ver.1.02, which corrects card errors when using certain SD cards, and introduces added lens aberration correction processing. This is scheduled to be released on Wednesday 18th March 2020.
-------------------------------------
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/02/2581/
-------------------------------------
Firmware update Ver.2.00 will be released in summer 2020. It will improve the camera’s capability with the addition or improvement of a number of functions including CinemaDNG playback, cinemagraph functionality and movie recording with the Director’s Viewfinder.
[Benefits of the update]
・Supports CinemaDNG 120/100fps (FHD 8bit) shooting.
・Supports cinemagraph functionality.
・Supports still image shooting during live view and movie shooting in Cine mode.
・Supports HDR shooting.
・Supports Director’s Viewfinder recording function.
・Supports SDK (Software Development Kit).
SIGMA is also developing firmware Ver.1.02, which corrects card errors when using certain SD cards, and introduces added lens aberration correction processing. This is scheduled to be released on Wednesday 18th March 2020.
-------------------------------------
Mar 02, 2020 at 12:06 AM
p.3 #6Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Ok, so I bit the bullet and reserved a 10-day rental. Taking a little trip to Florida with the family, so should have plenty of time to mess around with it, shooting stills and video. I already purchased a generic M-to-L adapter, because it was cheaper than renting one.
I've now had the chance to read through the manual and am pretty excited to get my hands on it. There are a few things the manual neglected to mention, though:
*What size is the HDMI *out* cable? I have an external monitor and a bunch of mounting accessories, so I was going to try to hack a "tilt screen" setup, but I don't know which cable to buy. Monitor is standard HDMI input.
*Digital zoom. Is it available? I only mess with it shooting video with my Sony, and it is super handy. It seems odd if it's not included on the Sigma, which otherwise seems to kick Sony's ass in the features department.
I'm really impressed by reading the manual, not that I'll use most of it, but things like in-camera editing, manual tone curve adjustment, multiple aspect ratios, and custom adjustments to offset color shading are very thoughtful.
I've now had the chance to read through the manual and am pretty excited to get my hands on it. There are a few things the manual neglected to mention, though:
*What size is the HDMI *out* cable? I have an external monitor and a bunch of mounting accessories, so I was going to try to hack a "tilt screen" setup, but I don't know which cable to buy. Monitor is standard HDMI input.
*Digital zoom. Is it available? I only mess with it shooting video with my Sony, and it is super handy. It seems odd if it's not included on the Sigma, which otherwise seems to kick Sony's ass in the features department.
I'm really impressed by reading the manual, not that I'll use most of it, but things like in-camera editing, manual tone curve adjustment, multiple aspect ratios, and custom adjustments to offset color shading are very thoughtful.
Mar 06, 2020 at 11:10 PM
p.3 #7Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
The HDMI port is Type D (Ver 1.4), which is Micro HDMI.
I haven't noticed anything about digital zoom... I have never used it on my Sony either though so I haven't checked carefully but I guess there might be no support.
Looking forward to your impressions after you've had a chance to use it
imagesfromobjects wrote:
Ok, so I bit the bullet and reserved a 10-day rental. Taking a little trip to Florida with the family, so should have plenty of time to mess around with it, shooting stills and video. I already purchased a generic M-to-L adapter, because it was cheaper than renting one.
I've now had the chance to read through the manual and am pretty excited to get my hands on it. There are a few things the manual neglected to mention, though:
*What size is the HDMI *out* cable? I have an external monitor and a bunch of mounting accessories, so I was going...Show more →
I haven't noticed anything about digital zoom... I have never used it on my Sony either though so I haven't checked carefully but I guess there might be no support.
Looking forward to your impressions after you've had a chance to use it
imagesfromobjects wrote:
Ok, so I bit the bullet and reserved a 10-day rental. Taking a little trip to Florida with the family, so should have plenty of time to mess around with it, shooting stills and video. I already purchased a generic M-to-L adapter, because it was cheaper than renting one.
I've now had the chance to read through the manual and am pretty excited to get my hands on it. There are a few things the manual neglected to mention, though:
*What size is the HDMI *out* cable? I have an external monitor and a bunch of mounting accessories, so I was going...Show more →
Mar 07, 2020 at 02:55 AM
p.3 #8Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
I stumbled upon this forum post the other day:
https://www.eoshd.com/comments/topic/38460-sigma-fp-review-part-1-and-interview-cinema-dng-raw-internal-recording/
*EDIT - long thread, started before release. You can safely jump to the end and make your way in reverse to get more hands-on experience.
It's by far the most in-depth discussion I've come across, many folks commenting seem to know their stuff. Definitely worth a read, includes stuff about stills and video.
My takeaway is that the fp still has a number of bugs, but not a deal breaker - I sold my Sony yesterday hahaha. Main concern is the apparent bug that gives inconsistent brightness - and subsequently exposure - off the LCD, even when shooting dumb adapter / full manual with "preview exposure" on and "adjust screen brightness" off, the screen apparently shows a misleading preview and images can be wildly under or overexposed in stills mode. Discussed around page 35 of the above thread, IIRC. I'll look into it when my rental arrives, because that's generally how I shoot. I know it's not the best way to get the most information into a raw file, but it's always been good enough for me, as I generally have an idea where I'll prioritize the "subject" versus highlight and shadow, as I'm shooting.
Bug has been reported, fingers crossed for firmware, but anyone care to comment?
https://www.eoshd.com/comments/topic/38460-sigma-fp-review-part-1-and-interview-cinema-dng-raw-internal-recording/
*EDIT - long thread, started before release. You can safely jump to the end and make your way in reverse to get more hands-on experience.
It's by far the most in-depth discussion I've come across, many folks commenting seem to know their stuff. Definitely worth a read, includes stuff about stills and video.
My takeaway is that the fp still has a number of bugs, but not a deal breaker - I sold my Sony yesterday hahaha. Main concern is the apparent bug that gives inconsistent brightness - and subsequently exposure - off the LCD, even when shooting dumb adapter / full manual with "preview exposure" on and "adjust screen brightness" off, the screen apparently shows a misleading preview and images can be wildly under or overexposed in stills mode. Discussed around page 35 of the above thread, IIRC. I'll look into it when my rental arrives, because that's generally how I shoot. I know it's not the best way to get the most information into a raw file, but it's always been good enough for me, as I generally have an idea where I'll prioritize the "subject" versus highlight and shadow, as I'm shooting.
Bug has been reported, fingers crossed for firmware, but anyone care to comment?
Mar 12, 2020 at 08:12 AM
p.3 #9Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
I suppose that bug is specific to M-mode. I've never run into it but I use A-mode and Auto ISO 100-6400 and I just set shutter speed lowest limit based on the focal length (usually 1/50 or 1/100). Most of my shooting is with adapted M-mount lenses so there is no electronic communication between camera and lens. I use AE Evaluative Metering mode + Auto brightness setting for the LCD and exposure on LCD has always appeared to be accurate compared to actual shots for me. Sometimes I see the camera underexposing or overexposing a bit based on the screen (although I use display modes that don't show histogram or zebras) and then I use exposure compensation by turning the control wheel in the back of the camera in either direction. I also have Preview Exposure in M Mode set to On but I don't know if it does something at all or something different in other modes besides M.
The main bug or issue I still see is:
Sometimes my fp freezes when I try to magnify focus point area in viewfinder view, and it needs battery removal for recovery. This doesn't happen often though.
imagesfromobjects wrote:
I stumbled upon this forum post the other day:
https://www.eoshd.com/comments/topic/38460-sigma-fp-review-part-1-and-interview-cinema-dng-raw-internal-recording/
*EDIT - long thread, started before release. You can safely jump to the end and make your way in reverse to get more hands-on experience.
It's by far the most in-depth discussion I've come across, many folks commenting seem to know their stuff. Definitely worth a read, includes stuff about stills and video.
My takeaway is that the fp still has a number of bugs, but not a deal breaker - I sold my Sony yesterday hahaha. Main concern is the apparent bug that gives inconsistent brightness - and subsequently exposure - off...Show more →
The main bug or issue I still see is:
Sometimes my fp freezes when I try to magnify focus point area in viewfinder view, and it needs battery removal for recovery. This doesn't happen often though.
imagesfromobjects wrote:
I stumbled upon this forum post the other day:
https://www.eoshd.com/comments/topic/38460-sigma-fp-review-part-1-and-interview-cinema-dng-raw-internal-recording/
*EDIT - long thread, started before release. You can safely jump to the end and make your way in reverse to get more hands-on experience.
It's by far the most in-depth discussion I've come across, many folks commenting seem to know their stuff. Definitely worth a read, includes stuff about stills and video.
My takeaway is that the fp still has a number of bugs, but not a deal breaker - I sold my Sony yesterday hahaha. Main concern is the apparent bug that gives inconsistent brightness - and subsequently exposure - off...Show more →
Mar 13, 2020 at 12:19 AM
p.3 #10Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Ok, I've had a couple days to play with it now. Made it to Florida, and everyone is healthy in my family - knock on wood.
I love the camera, but there are DEFINITELY bugs that need fixing. On a dumb adapter, the metering and histogram and "preview exposure" are pretty much useless, and consistently give wildly underexposed shots or blown highlights. Being a "tinkerer" I've played with just about every variation of metering modes, shooting modes, JPEG previews and color/tone adjustments and ALL of them give the same wonky results. It makes very little sense and I've literally resorted to using my light meter app on my phone instead of the histogram or live view preview. In Aperture or Shutter Priority - and in M, also, you can take a shot, then pull up the JPEG on the review screen and it always looks different. Totally bizarre.
All that said, I'm going to buy it. The size and the output are a dream, and quirks aside, it's very 'manual focus friendly"
Still tinkering with video settings, but I think I need a faster card to get the full potential of on-board recording.
Also, I wish there was a way to get rid of the white focus box that's always in the frame.
Maybe some of this is dumb-adapter specific? Let me know.
I love the camera, but there are DEFINITELY bugs that need fixing. On a dumb adapter, the metering and histogram and "preview exposure" are pretty much useless, and consistently give wildly underexposed shots or blown highlights. Being a "tinkerer" I've played with just about every variation of metering modes, shooting modes, JPEG previews and color/tone adjustments and ALL of them give the same wonky results. It makes very little sense and I've literally resorted to using my light meter app on my phone instead of the histogram or live view preview. In Aperture or Shutter Priority - and in M, also, you can take a shot, then pull up the JPEG on the review screen and it always looks different. Totally bizarre.
All that said, I'm going to buy it. The size and the output are a dream, and quirks aside, it's very 'manual focus friendly"
Still tinkering with video settings, but I think I need a faster card to get the full potential of on-board recording.
Also, I wish there was a way to get rid of the white focus box that's always in the frame.
Maybe some of this is dumb-adapter specific? Let me know.
Mar 15, 2020 at 01:31 PM
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p.3 #11Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
I use my fp with dumb adapters almost all the time (~95% of my use) but I haven't really run into such big metering issues or incorrect metering info in viewfinder before shot vs. actual shot. I have configured my standard viewfinder display mode to show Electronic Level (a must for me) and I have Peaking enabled and set to Red, but I have disabled Brightness Level Monitor and Zebra Pattern from being shown in my default viewfinder view (I felt Brightness Level Monitor was too intrusive and interfering with composition and Zebras can't be visible together with Peaking).
I mostly shoot with the LVF-11 LCD viewfinder attached which blocks environmental light effectively and the viewfinder image (magnified LCD view) looks accurate to me so when there is some overexposure or underexposure I can see it directly on the viewfinder / LCD image and can adjust the exposure a bit either way before taking a shot. I usually let the camera choose the exposure by having exposure compensation set to 0, while using auto ISO in Aperture priority mode, and most of the time the exposure is fine in final images and I've never noticed that it would have been inaccurate or different in the viewfinder prior to taking the shot(s). I have Shutter blackout set to off and Quick Preview set to off as well so I don't usually see the images immediately after each shot though, but whenever I've checked shots I've just taken, they have looked as I would have expected in terms of exposure.
I notice some tendency to blow out bright highlights (Evaluative Metering Mode) when I'm shooting some cityscapes that have bright sunshine in some buildings and deep shadows in other areas, in those cases I often use exposure compensation to dial down exposure a little bit (usually around 2/3 of a stop). And in some other conditions in dull weather I've sometimes noticed some tendency to underexpose in which case I may dial in positive exposure compensation, around 1/3 or 2/3 of a stop. I always shoot DNG + JPEG (Bit Depth set to 14 bit for DNG). I usually keep Color Mode set to Standard and Tone set to Auto (Strong) by default.
Have you used Auto ISO or fixed ISO in your trials so far? Do you have any systematic way to reproduce the problem which I could try to replicate with my fp?
New firmware should come out in 2 days, hopefully it will fix more issues than what they have mentioned in the early info.
I would also be happy if there was a way to hide the focus frame totally when not wanted to be seen... I just make it as small as possible.
imagesfromobjects wrote:
Ok, I've had a couple days to play with it now. Made it to Florida, and everyone is healthy in my family - knock on wood.
I love the camera, but there are DEFINITELY bugs that need fixing. On a dumb adapter, the metering and histogram and "preview exposure" are pretty much useless, and consistently give wildly underexposed shots or blown highlights. Being a "tinkerer" I've played with just about every variation of metering modes, shooting modes, JPEG previews and color/tone adjustments and ALL of them give the same wonky results. It makes very little sense and I've literally resorted to...Show more →
I mostly shoot with the LVF-11 LCD viewfinder attached which blocks environmental light effectively and the viewfinder image (magnified LCD view) looks accurate to me so when there is some overexposure or underexposure I can see it directly on the viewfinder / LCD image and can adjust the exposure a bit either way before taking a shot. I usually let the camera choose the exposure by having exposure compensation set to 0, while using auto ISO in Aperture priority mode, and most of the time the exposure is fine in final images and I've never noticed that it would have been inaccurate or different in the viewfinder prior to taking the shot(s). I have Shutter blackout set to off and Quick Preview set to off as well so I don't usually see the images immediately after each shot though, but whenever I've checked shots I've just taken, they have looked as I would have expected in terms of exposure.
I notice some tendency to blow out bright highlights (Evaluative Metering Mode) when I'm shooting some cityscapes that have bright sunshine in some buildings and deep shadows in other areas, in those cases I often use exposure compensation to dial down exposure a little bit (usually around 2/3 of a stop). And in some other conditions in dull weather I've sometimes noticed some tendency to underexpose in which case I may dial in positive exposure compensation, around 1/3 or 2/3 of a stop. I always shoot DNG + JPEG (Bit Depth set to 14 bit for DNG). I usually keep Color Mode set to Standard and Tone set to Auto (Strong) by default.
Have you used Auto ISO or fixed ISO in your trials so far? Do you have any systematic way to reproduce the problem which I could try to replicate with my fp?
New firmware should come out in 2 days, hopefully it will fix more issues than what they have mentioned in the early info.
I would also be happy if there was a way to hide the focus frame totally when not wanted to be seen... I just make it as small as possible.
imagesfromobjects wrote:
Ok, I've had a couple days to play with it now. Made it to Florida, and everyone is healthy in my family - knock on wood.
I love the camera, but there are DEFINITELY bugs that need fixing. On a dumb adapter, the metering and histogram and "preview exposure" are pretty much useless, and consistently give wildly underexposed shots or blown highlights. Being a "tinkerer" I've played with just about every variation of metering modes, shooting modes, JPEG previews and color/tone adjustments and ALL of them give the same wonky results. It makes very little sense and I've literally resorted to...Show more →
Mar 16, 2020 at 06:02 AM
p.3 #12Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
New firmware 1.02 is now available:
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/18/2588/
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/download/cameras/firmware/
@imagesfromobjects@ Display exposure related issues are included in the fix list so it might have resolved the issues you were experiencing.
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/18/2588/
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/download/cameras/firmware/
@imagesfromobjects@ Display exposure related issues are included in the fix list so it might have resolved the issues you were experiencing.
Mar 17, 2020 at 11:16 PM
p.3 #13Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
I'll write Lensrentals and see if I'm allowed to do that. Started using the highlight zebras, and set it to 100%, so that way I can just dial it in until I see them, then bump shutter speed up until they disappear and the raw files are well exposed. The flickering black levels issue is there in video, which is more annoying, but I guess we've all got bigger things to worry about right now.
How are things with y'all?
Juha Kannisto wrote:
New firmware 1.02 is now available:
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/18/2588/
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/download/cameras/firmware/
@imagesfromobjects@@ Display exposure related issues are included in the fix list so it might have resolved the issues you were experiencing.
How are things with y'all?
Juha Kannisto wrote:
New firmware 1.02 is now available:
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/18/2588/
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/download/cameras/firmware/
@imagesfromobjects@@ Display exposure related issues are included in the fix list so it might have resolved the issues you were experiencing.
Mar 18, 2020 at 08:51 AM
p.3 #14Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Good to hear In Tokyo things are quite calm as the virus has not spreading too fast and it started already 2 months ago. Shops and restaurants are operating pretty normally but crowds are smaller everywhere. No panic shopping in general but masks and toilet paper are out of stock for the most part. Schools are out for an extended holiday at the end of the study year until early April at least... I've been teleworking from home for the last 3 weeks. No trouble going out but trying to avoid crowded places. Family and everybody I know are well.
imagesfromobjects wrote:
I'll write Lensrentals and see if I'm allowed to do that. Started using the highlight zebras, and set it to 100%, so that way I can just dial it in until I see them, then bump shutter speed up until they disappear and the raw files are well exposed. The flickering black levels issue is there in video, which is more annoying, but I guess we've all got bigger things to worry about right now.
How are things with y'all?
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/18/2588/
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/download/cameras/firmware/
@imagesfromobjects@@@ Display exposure related issues are included in the fix list so it might have resolved the issues you were experiencing.
In Tokyo things are quite calm as the virus has not spreading too fast and it started already 2 months ago. Shops and restaurants are operating pretty normally but crowds are smaller everywhere. No panic shopping in general but masks and toilet paper are out of stock for the most part. Schools are out for an extended holiday at the end of the study year until early April at least... I've been teleworking from home for the last 3 weeks. No trouble going out but trying to avoid crowded places. Family and everybody I know are well.imagesfromobjects wrote:
I'll write Lensrentals and see if I'm allowed to do that. Started using the highlight zebras, and set it to 100%, so that way I can just dial it in until I see them, then bump shutter speed up until they disappear and the raw files are well exposed. The flickering black levels issue is there in video, which is more annoying, but I guess we've all got bigger things to worry about right now.
How are things with y'all?
Juha Kannisto wrote
New firmware 1.02 is now available:https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2020/03/18/2588/
https://www.sigma-global.com/en/download/cameras/firmware/
@imagesfromobjects@@@ Display exposure related issues are included in the fix list so it might have resolved the issues you were experiencing.
Mar 18, 2020 at 11:13 AM
p.3 #15Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Ok, so I bought one. Last gear purchase for a while, for obvious reasons, but NO REGRETS.
Still tweaking my video settings, but I'm super impressed with the IQ overall. I've been using it with no grip whatsoever, and it's perfect for my small M lenses that way. I've also been using it a good deal with an external HDMI monitor as a flip-screen and it's still compact. I'm sure I'll get the LVF at some point, or hack a way to get an optical finder centered over the lens.
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to see sorted out:
*Basic settings (Shutter speed, White Balance etc) are lost when camera goes into Power Save, or is switched off.
*The white focus box that's always there.
*Can't assign ISO to scroll wheel (actually very limited on what can be assigned where)
*Can't magnify focus while recording video.
*Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
*Needs a Log profile
The folks over at EOSHD are going to town testing things, and a few have noted odd behavior with CinemaDNG black levels flickering, or the first frame of a sequence being brighter. I'm not there yet in my work flow, but there's some serious knowledge over there, so it seems legit.
All that aside, and considering the state of the world right now, I'm thrilled to have my hands on it. I'm so glad that someone finally bucked the trend of "cameras need to be BIG" and made this beautiful little guy. It does exceptionally well with the lenses I'm using (Elmarit-M 28 Asph, Skopar 35/2.5, Nokton 40/1.2, M-Hexanon 90/2.8) with only the color shading as a downside. Sharpness and tones are outstanding. I'll post some pictures soon.
Hope everyone is doing ok.
Still tweaking my video settings, but I'm super impressed with the IQ overall. I've been using it with no grip whatsoever, and it's perfect for my small M lenses that way. I've also been using it a good deal with an external HDMI monitor as a flip-screen and it's still compact. I'm sure I'll get the LVF at some point, or hack a way to get an optical finder centered over the lens.
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to see sorted out:
*Basic settings (Shutter speed, White Balance etc) are lost when camera goes into Power Save, or is switched off.
*The white focus box that's always there.
*Can't assign ISO to scroll wheel (actually very limited on what can be assigned where)
*Can't magnify focus while recording video.
*Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
*Needs a Log profile
The folks over at EOSHD are going to town testing things, and a few have noted odd behavior with CinemaDNG black levels flickering, or the first frame of a sequence being brighter. I'm not there yet in my work flow, but there's some serious knowledge over there, so it seems legit.
All that aside, and considering the state of the world right now, I'm thrilled to have my hands on it. I'm so glad that someone finally bucked the trend of "cameras need to be BIG" and made this beautiful little guy. It does exceptionally well with the lenses I'm using (Elmarit-M 28 Asph, Skopar 35/2.5, Nokton 40/1.2, M-Hexanon 90/2.8) with only the color shading as a downside. Sharpness and tones are outstanding. I'll post some pictures soon.
Hope everyone is doing ok.
Mar 31, 2020 at 09:24 PM
p.3 #16Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
So since I never received a response from Sigma America about the sensor glass thickness of the fp, I mailed Sigma Japan directly and received a prompt reply. They responded that they “cannot provide that kind of information openly” and “…We have to ask you to use the “Color Shading” correction feature when you want to use some old lens…”
@imagesfromobjects: First, thanks for the update. Second, menu issues aside, could you comment on the usefulness of the color shading correction?
Also wondering if any users here are noticing any shutter lag. I read somewhere about a 1/10th of sec. delay between shutter press and the captured image.
Lids
imagesfromobjects wrote:
Ok, so I bought one. Last gear purchase for a while, for obvious reasons, but NO REGRETS.
...
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to see sorted out:
*Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
Apr 01, 2020 at 09:48 PM
p.3 #17Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
All of my experience is based on using manual lenses on a dumb adapter, so I wonder how much any issues (or lack therof) are present when using AF lenses or smart adapters. The color shading is a phenomenal feature, but be advised that it only affects JPEG or video shot in MOV. Raw files have none of that info baked in, at least not in a way that LR can understand at present. I haven't noticed any lag, and I've shot plenty of action, so it could be an AF issue?
It does a wonderful job just removing the color in the corners without going overboard on basic vignetting correction. I've just used it on a grey card, or with a white tissue over the lens, set wide open and at whatever distance seems to give the most cast. Snap a sample and it's usually spot on. From there you can adjust the 4 way axis of the color correction, but I haven't found that necessary. Just aggravating that it won't save more than one entry - there are multiple entries available, with the ability to add text (eg Make / Focal length) but it only saves one. Clearly a bug.
Lids wrote:
So since I never received a response from Sigma America about the sensor glass thickness of the fp, I mailed Sigma Japan directly and received a prompt reply. They responded that they “cannot provide that kind of information openly” and “…We have to ask you to use the “Color Shading” correction feature when you want to use some old lens…”
@imagesfromobjects@@: First, thanks for the update. Second, menu issues aside, could you comment on the usefulness of the color shading correction?
Also wondering if any users here are noticing any shutter lag. I read somewhere about a 1/10th of sec. delay...Show more →
...
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to see sorted out:
*Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
It does a wonderful job just removing the color in the corners without going overboard on basic vignetting correction. I've just used it on a grey card, or with a white tissue over the lens, set wide open and at whatever distance seems to give the most cast. Snap a sample and it's usually spot on. From there you can adjust the 4 way axis of the color correction, but I haven't found that necessary. Just aggravating that it won't save more than one entry - there are multiple entries available, with the ability to add text (eg Make / Focal length) but it only saves one. Clearly a bug.
Lids wrote:
So since I never received a response from Sigma America about the sensor glass thickness of the fp, I mailed Sigma Japan directly and received a prompt reply. They responded that they “cannot provide that kind of information openly” and “…We have to ask you to use the “Color Shading” correction feature when you want to use some old lens…”
@imagesfromobjects@@: First, thanks for the update. Second, menu issues aside, could you comment on the usefulness of the color shading correction?
Also wondering if any users here are noticing any shutter lag. I read somewhere about a 1/10th of sec. delay...Show more →
imagesfromobjects wrote
Ok, so I bought one. Last gear purchase for a while, for obvious reasons, but NO REGRETS....
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to see sorted out:
*Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
Apr 01, 2020 at 11:36 PM
p.3 #18Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Thanks for the explanation! Very helpful and much appreciated. Good to hear lag is a non-issue for you as well.
Lids
Lids
Apr 02, 2020 at 12:17 AM
p.3 #19Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
imagesfromobjects wrote:
Ok, so I bought one. Last gear purchase for a while, for obvious reasons, but NO REGRETS.
Still tweaking my video settings, but I'm super impressed with the IQ overall. I've been using it with no grip whatsoever, and it's perfect for my small M lenses that way. I've also been using it a good deal with an external HDMI monitor as a flip-screen and it's still compact. I'm sure I'll get the LVF at some point, or hack a way to get an optical finder centered over the lens.
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to...Show more →
Glad to hear you got one and enjoy it Did you update to firmware 1.02 already?
I have some questions about 2 of your reported findings as I haven't been seen those 2 problems with my fp:
> *Basic settings (Shutter speed, White Balance etc) are lost when camera goes into Power Save, or is switched off.
I use AWB while shooting pretty much all the time and I keep minimum shutter speed set based focal length with auto ISO (100-6400) so I might not even notice easily if WB or Shutter speed were not retained, but when I tried now to modify WB setting via the menu to something other than AWB, and then turned the camera off/on, the setting was still the same as I had last set it after power cycle when going back to menu to check. I also tested once more so that I pulled out the battery while the camera was off, and the setting still remained the same as last set after restoring battery and turning the camera on. I wonder if the bug is specific to some mode or particular settings... What kind of settings did you use when observing this? I'm currently using Still mode with Aperture Priority + Auto ISO with a dummy adapter and the new CV 35/1.2 III.
> *Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
I also haven't seen this problem, I just started playing with the Color shading settings this week and I saved 4 different settings for the CV 35/1.2 III, i.e. 35mm / f5.6, f4, f1.2 and f2. I took individual compensation frames for each by shooting a cloudy sky with an expodisc in front of the lens (I used infinity for f5.6 and f4 and a about 1m for f1.2 and f2) and it seemed to work. All 4 settings were saved and can be selected individually, but I can't tell for sure if the compensation effect was exactly correct and individually different for each of the 4 settings or not, I didn't compare the resulting shots with different settings very carefully on my PC yet but it seemed OK at a glance. I added the Color Shading selection to Quick Settings also... How did you test this one and what was the specific outcome?
I notice some bluish color shading with most of my RF glass (especially with the wides) but it's quite mild and I haven't made up my mind if I want to compensate for it with color shading options in the long run yet. It hasn't bothered me a lot so far outdoors in sunny weather and I mostly shoot in that kind of light. It seems to be more noticeable in cloudy shooting conditions.
Ok, so I bought one. Last gear purchase for a while, for obvious reasons, but NO REGRETS.
Still tweaking my video settings, but I'm super impressed with the IQ overall. I've been using it with no grip whatsoever, and it's perfect for my small M lenses that way. I've also been using it a good deal with an external HDMI monitor as a flip-screen and it's still compact. I'm sure I'll get the LVF at some point, or hack a way to get an optical finder centered over the lens.
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to...Show more →
Glad to hear you got one and enjoy it
Did you update to firmware 1.02 already?I have some questions about 2 of your reported findings as I haven't been seen those 2 problems with my fp:
> *Basic settings (Shutter speed, White Balance etc) are lost when camera goes into Power Save, or is switched off.
I use AWB while shooting pretty much all the time and I keep minimum shutter speed set based focal length with auto ISO (100-6400) so I might not even notice easily if WB or Shutter speed were not retained, but when I tried now to modify WB setting via the menu to something other than AWB, and then turned the camera off/on, the setting was still the same as I had last set it after power cycle when going back to menu to check. I also tested once more so that I pulled out the battery while the camera was off, and the setting still remained the same as last set after restoring battery and turning the camera on. I wonder if the bug is specific to some mode or particular settings... What kind of settings did you use when observing this? I'm currently using Still mode with Aperture Priority + Auto ISO with a dummy adapter and the new CV 35/1.2 III.
> *Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
I also haven't seen this problem, I just started playing with the Color shading settings this week and I saved 4 different settings for the CV 35/1.2 III, i.e. 35mm / f5.6, f4, f1.2 and f2. I took individual compensation frames for each by shooting a cloudy sky with an expodisc in front of the lens (I used infinity for f5.6 and f4 and a about 1m for f1.2 and f2) and it seemed to work. All 4 settings were saved and can be selected individually, but I can't tell for sure if the compensation effect was exactly correct and individually different for each of the 4 settings or not, I didn't compare the resulting shots with different settings very carefully on my PC yet but it seemed OK at a glance. I added the Color Shading selection to Quick Settings also... How did you test this one and what was the specific outcome?
I notice some bluish color shading with most of my RF glass (especially with the wides) but it's quite mild and I haven't made up my mind if I want to compensate for it with color shading options in the long run yet. It hasn't bothered me a lot so far outdoors in sunny weather and I mostly shoot in that kind of light. It seems to be more noticeable in cloudy shooting conditions.
Apr 03, 2020 at 09:49 AM
p.3 #20Sigma fp: Discussion and Image Thread
Hmmmm. I think you may be on to something.
I'm almost always using C1/C2/C3 settings I've saved. C1 is my point-and-shoot option: Shutter priority with auto ISO, which is a "hack" so the scroll wheel is assigned to EV Comp, and effectively becomes the ISO switch. Shutter set to 1/60 to alleviate banding in the US. WB I set to K at 5800, then adjust as necessary. With these settings, I can optimize for street stuff by jacking up the SS to >1/250 and using scale focus at f/8 on a wider lens. Had great luck shooting from the hip like this, with the EV set from 0 to -0.3. The metering seems to do a great job.
Problem arises when the camera goes into power save and wakes up- my 1/250 is back at 1/60 and my WB is reset to 5800. So it could be that it's just defaulting to the C settings and ignoring adjustments I've made. I'll try an experiment and see if starting from C and changing the *shooting mode* to S changes the behavior. I suspect it might...
Additionally, I'm going to try to save *all* color shading adjustments to the individual C entries.
The other two C entries are both M, but one is optimized for video and the other for stills. The stills one has the sharpening cranked all the way up to mimic focus peaking, the video one has sharpness all the way down, to reduce artifacts in video. I haven't transitioned fully into shooting CinemaDNG video yet, because (for what I shoot 90% of the time) the workflow is a pain in the ass and MOV is good enough. Really wish there were a way to turn off sharpening altogether, because the lack of AA filter reeeally creates some issues in MOV with artifacts.
I really like the color out of camera. The Teal amd Orange is awesome, but a little bit too stylized to want to use all the time, so I've settled (after MUCH tinkering) on Vivid set to -1, with contrast at -0.6 and saturation at -0.2. This seems to give the most accurate colors, with manageable contrast and nice rolloff. The Tone Curve I've just left alone in that setting.
Will test some more later- thanks for the insight!
Juha Kannisto wrote:
imagesfromobjects wrote
Ok, so I bought one. Last gear purchase for a while, for obvious reasons, but NO REGRETS.Still tweaking my video settings, but I'm super impressed with the IQ overall. I've been using it with no grip whatsoever, and it's perfect for my small M lenses that way. I've also been using it a good deal with an external HDMI monitor as a flip-screen and it's still compact. I'm sure I'll get the LVF at some point, or hack a way to get an optical finder centered over the lens.
There are still a number of quirks that I'd like to see sorted out:
*Basic settings (Shutter speed, White Balance etc) are lost when camera goes into Power Save, or is switched off.
*The white focus box that's always there.
*Can't assign ISO to scroll wheel (actually very limited on what can be assigned where)
*Can't magnify focus while recording video.
*Color shading only saves 1st custom entry
*Needs a Log profile
The folks over at EOSHD are going to town testing things, and a few have noted odd behavior with CinemaDNG black levels flickering, or the first frame of a sequence being brighter. I'm not there yet in my work flow, but there's some serious knowledge over there, so it seems legit.
All that aside, and considering the state of the world right now, I'm thrilled to have my hands on it. I'm so glad that someone finally bucked the trend of "cameras need to be BIG" and made this beautiful little guy. It does exceptionally well with the lenses I'm using (Elmarit-M 28 Asph, Skopar 35/2.5, Nokton 40/1.2, M-Hexanon 90/2.8) with only the color shading as a downside. Sharpness and tones are outstanding. I'll post some pictures soon.
Hope everyone is doing ok.
Did you update to firmware 1.02 already?I have some questions about 2 of your reported findings as I haven't been seen those 2 problems with my fp:
> *Basic settings (Shutter speed, White Balance etc) are lost when camera goes into Power Save, or is switched off.
I use AWB while shooting pretty much all the time and I keep minimum shutter speed set based focal length with auto ISO (100-6400) so I might not even notice easily if WB or Shutter speed were not retained, but when I tried now...Show more →
Apr 03, 2020 at 11:15 AM