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Archive 2015 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!

  
 
mttran
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p.16 #1 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


dhphoto wrote:
Better maybe to just get the exposure right and not push 5 stops and expect miracles then. Problem solved.


Not it's not. Which version of the DR will contaminate your data more



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:43 AM
Monito
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p.16 #2 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


Imagemaster wrote:
Is this the maximum number of letters you can type on one line, or do you just want people to scroll more


When you look up readability studies, you will find that limiting columns to 60 or 72 characters is about right for having greatest ease of readability and greater comprehension. Much greater than 150 or 200 characters wide as you often get on modern wide screen monitors.

I suggest a scroll wheel mouse as a handy device for you.
I'm sure you have one now that it is 2015.



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:44 AM
dhphoto
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p.16 #3 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


mttran wrote:
Not it's not. Which version of the DR will contaminate your data more


I'm sure that's clever but I don't understand it. My bad I expect.



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:44 AM
jcolwell
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p.16 #4 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


adrianb wrote:
I have never seen so much useless talk on this forum,when new gear was announced....


Hi Adrian,

Take a deep breath and then just ignore all of the useless talk. I agree it's getting worse, especially with respect to the 5Ds/5DsR, but there's still lots of good information around. The trick is to navigate between the trolls and haters, without getting too pissed off.



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:46 AM
dhphoto
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p.16 #5 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


jcolwell wrote:
Hi Adrian,

Take a deep breath and then just ignore all of the useless talk. I agree it's getting worse, especially with respect to the 5Ds/5DsR, but there's still lots of good information around. The trick is to navigate between the trolls and haters, without getting too pissed off.


...and it's not as if us Canon fans are throwing our hats in the air today, we see the potential failings in these new offerings just as much as the haters.



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:47 AM
howard
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p.16 #6 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


adrianb wrote:
Jesus Christ !!! when I first signed up on this forum it used to be more about photography and the process of creating photographs ..



There is a forum (or forums) for that. This is a gear forum as such.



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:53 AM
Ziffl3
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p.16 #7 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


snapsy wrote:
The model photograph was a head and shoulders portrait @ 170mm so DOF is thin. Additionally, as pixel density increases the viewing magnification at 1:1 increases along with it, which reduces the effective DOF as DOF is a perceptual measurement based on viewing distance and magnification. This is one of the conundrums of higher MP imaging esp for DOF-limited shooting scenarios where you have to stop down; more MP means a smaller CoC which means a smaller aperture but higher MP also means diffraction effects become more noticeable at 1:1 at smaller apertures so you have a limited range of
...Show more

Snapsy ... I know this has been discussed.
Since I am a visual person... your explanation with the image tied it all together.
Really appreciate the assist.

I need to really see if this camera will fit into my work flow for wedding coverage.

-Mark





Edited on Feb 06, 2015 at 11:55 AM · View previous versions



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:53 AM
AndereObjektiv
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p.16 #8 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


snapsy wrote:
I agree, there are plenty of Canon lenses up to the task but it doesn't solve the DOF MP riddle, at least not without focus stacking. Good point on ML - hopefully Canon kept the dual ISO hardware logic in place for ML to utilize.


Ahh quite right, I missed the point you were making. It seems like a physics/physical limitation barrier. I've noticed this shooting medium format telephoto lenses on the D810.

Perhaps Canon can Innovate with the Worlds First Autofocus Perspective Control / Tilt Shift F/1.2 Telephoto 50-500 zoom lens.



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:53 AM
Matt Grum
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p.16 #9 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


Monito wrote:
How did all these complainers ever manage to make photos
5 or 10 or 20 years ago? Well, a lot of them didn't and couldn't
have.


Sometimes it's annoying when certain companies do certain things. I reserve the right to complain about said things and express my opinion.

Monito wrote:
So many people complain that

* It only has 5 fps. It is not possible to make good photos
with less than 6.

* It only has 11 stops (not verified, may be more) DR. It
is not possible to make photos with less than 14 stops.


These are very poor straw man arguments, no-one is claiming it is impossible to take photos with less than 14 stops (or fewer than six frames per second). But if you are processing a RAW image it's preferable to have more information there to work with, it allows you to do more.

Monito wrote:
* The camera does not do all photography as well as the
best of all other cameras. It is not an all-in-one camera.
It can't be used to make good photos.


There was a rare opportunity here to produce a body that could fill both the high resolution full frame sensor use cases and the APS-C high speed use cases, in the same body, without compromise. It's a shame that this path was not taken, in favour of making a camera that is unnecessarily specialised. It's an old fashioned business practice that irks me, to be honest. And it's unnecessary. Some people in Apple didn't want any MP3 player functionality in the iPhone, for fear it would cost iPod sales. Jobs disagreed, the iPhone did massively cannibalise sales of the iPod, but they made a load of money anyway.

Monito wrote:
* This still camera, optimized for some situations like studio
work, does not have 4K video with cinematography
functions. It is therefore useless.


Again I think the complaint is that they seem to have gone backwards with regards to video features. Which kind of smacks of artificial compartmentalisation of camera bodies. As in this body is for landscape photographers, this body is for videographers. If you're a landscape photographer that also likes to shoot videos, well then you can buy both.

Monito wrote:
The Dynamic Range issue is a key axis for angst (or smug
self-satisfaction for one who can't stop talking up his
non-Canon choice).


No smugness here, I could write a list as long as my arm of criticisms of the A7R but it is quite relevant to the discussion at hand so I'm not going to avoid mentioning it.

Monito wrote:
If you show up at high noon to
make an interior photo with a window pouring in sunlight
the capable photographer has many choices available
beyond making an instant snap and pushing it in post.
They can add fill light with flash or reflectors or increase
the ambient light levels, they can plan ahead and choose
a better time of day or a time when weather has bright
overcast for soft light, they can use HDR, or other options.
Or, they can creatively use dark shadow compositionally
and keep it dark.


Yes, you could buy/rent/drag along a flash system, a load of reflectors, rearrange things for different times, accept that your photos will have to look a certain way, or simply throw your hands up and say, I'm not going to bother trying to shoot this. Or you could buy a Sony/Nikon/Pentax/Other camera.

Monito wrote:
At the same time, some players spend little or no cash
and enjoy the challenge of seeing what they can do with
brains and not cash. They play longer and get more
satisfaction out of their play.


Who here isn't satisfied with their photography? There's some incredible sweeping judgements in your post about people who you really know nothing about.

Monito wrote:
But the gnashing
of teeth and the agonized screams that follow any
release are an indication that having the very best
gear is more important than actually making photos
for too many people here.


It comes down to this. Personally I don't think it's unreasonable to ask Canon to do better in certain areas, such as dynamic range, because after all they are asking us for $4,000.

Edited on Feb 06, 2015 at 11:59 AM · View previous versions



Feb 06, 2015 at 11:54 AM
borno
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p.16 #10 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


Dual cam mirror reminds me of the Ducati Desmondo valve train (pretty cool)


Feb 06, 2015 at 11:54 AM
Harry.C
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p.16 #11 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


Anyone else find it strange that Canon didn't add the new multi-controller design they used for the 7Dii (the joystick with the wheel on the outside)?


Feb 06, 2015 at 11:55 AM
Ziffl3
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p.16 #12 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


Harry.C wrote:
Anyone else find it strange that Canon didn't add the new multi-controller design they used for the 7Dii (the joystick with the wheel on the outside)?

Nope ... action oriented camera vs studio / landscape oriented camera body.

Different shooting environments.

-Mark



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:00 PM
goosemang
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p.16 #13 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


I think at this point if dynamic range is that important to your work, you simply need to switch systems or adapt to other bodies as is needed. There's not a lot of sense in dragging on complaining about Canon; certainly nothing is going to change for a while.

That out of the way, if you've got the cash and aren't hung up on the DR issue, Canon's pro bodies and glass are about as good as it gets for a DSLR system. The bodies are so well fleshed out, and operate incredibly fluidly for such complex tools. The glass is fantastic and they continue to refresh and release new lenses.

The problem is everybody wants all their refinement in a body the size of a Leica with Sony image quality, and it just ain't happening. I suppose Canon simply doesn't see it worthwhile to chase such a small segment of the market. Whether that's a smart decision or not isn't for me to decide. But it seems like Canon's writing is pretty clear on the wall: Want a top notch DSLR system? We've got it. Want a Sony sensor? Look elsewhere. Want a MILC, look elsewhere. Perhaps they're hanging on to a dying technology - that may very well be true. But it seems like they're betting that the market is going to split in two: Cell Phones and Professional Cameras and lenses, and they're putting their eggs in the latter basket. The thousands of people buying these bodies aren't fixated on dynamic range, so if you take that out of the equation they're still likely to take the lions share of the business.

edit:

Canon is simply in a different business than a company like Fuji who are being very responsive to a very, very small percentage of the market. Canon is basically like the Microsoft of cameras. Yeah, it's not terribly exciting and the ultra-nerds aren't really into you, but the vast majority of consumers buy your products because they work extremely well.

Edited on Feb 06, 2015 at 12:06 PM · View previous versions



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:01 PM
snapsy
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p.16 #14 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


Harry.C wrote:
Anyone else find it strange that Canon didn't add the new multi-controller design they used for the 7Dii (the joystick with the wheel on the outside)?


They might have figured the multi-controller AF area selector lever is more useful/essential for action-oriented cameras like the 7DII.



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:02 PM
Gunzorro
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p.16 #15 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


dacop wrote:
I understand what you are saying, and that only applies when you have the time to deal with all three numbers manually...shitter, f stop and ISO. When I am shooting indoor plays and concerts and need all images at -1 exposure. If all three numbers are manual, the exposure is constantly changing as the lighting changes on stage. Exposure comp in Manual (as in the 7d2 and DX) allows me to auto the ISO (because I dont care about that setting) and dial in the sutter and f stop i want, and still keep it at -1. The ISO changes
...Show more

Why not shoot in Tv mode to freeze motion, and allow shifting aperture and Auto ISO to control exposure changes? Is there something I'm not getting?



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:02 PM
LizWangPhotog
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p.16 #16 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


I wonder if they're going to fix the AF points issue where the AF point doesn't light up in your viewfinder. I'm guessing not, since they are aiming this towards studio and landscape. Personally going to wait until after the first few months of kinks are ironed out. The D750 and 5d3 had light leak issues, the D800e had left AF issues, and both the 5d3 and 1dx needed firmware just to have a bandaid fix on the AF points not lighting up. (They technically still don't).


Feb 06, 2015 at 12:05 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.16 #17 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


mttran wrote:
I can't wait to see 5Dsr/A7R/A9 and same canon lens shots. Let see which one is a better pair compared to those who guessing here


I can't wait to test them side by side with the retail models. Should be interesting but we'll have to wait until June.
It's a new sensor with a stronger CFA and I'm hoping for better colors. There is always hope for lower noise shadows.

As far as video, Canon had no other option but downgrade the specs. Imagine outputting 4k from a 50MP body... It would look soft and full of aliasing. Rolling shutter should be more pronounced when compared to the 5D3.



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:06 PM
burningheart
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p.16 #18 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


jcolwell wrote:
Hi Adrian,

Take a deep breath and then just ignore all of the useless talk. I agree it's getting worse, especially with respect to the 5Ds/5DsR, but there's still lots of good information around. The trick is to navigate between the trolls and haters, without getting too pissed off.



Or Maybe its time to use the HIDE ME button that would sure thin down the posts to go through.

I can't wait to go under the bridges where the trolls are hanging out in the shadows and test out the DR.
Then again I would rather shoot something photogenic.



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:09 PM
Jeff
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p.16 #19 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


adrianb wrote:
...I have never seen so much useless talk on this forum, when new gear was announded... Jesus Christ !!! when I first signed up on this forum it used to be more about photography and the process of creating photographs ...


In 2010?

Now that's funny...



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:09 PM
Harry.C
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p.16 #20 · Official: Canon 5DS, 5DS R and 11-24mm lens announced!


Ziffl3 wrote:
Nope ... action oriented camera vs studio / landscape oriented camera body.

And yet they have 1.3 and 1.6 crop modes in your "studio/landscape" camera body.



Feb 06, 2015 at 12:11 PM
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