Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
p.1030 #1Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
jfreak wrote:
Thanks Gary, it helps to hear that I am not thinking wrong way. Like uhoh7 said yesterday, it is used by a lot and I need to think its just that unit and thus the decision to buy m240 over m9 earlier still holds.
Guys, could you educate me on this calibration issue. I have read about this need for the calibration thing but don't quite understand it. Does it mean I have to ship all my lens and camera to NJ leica. If it gets calibrated for one lens, does it mean others may get little off and then those...Show more →
Leica will calibrate each piece independently following some preset measurements so you don't need to send all at once.
You can make an educated guess on whether it's the camera or the lens(es).
Sometimes a miscalibrated body and a miscalibrated lens will work perfectly together
Thanks Gary, it helps to hear that I am not thinking wrong way. Like uhoh7 said yesterday, it is used by a lot and I need to think its just that unit and thus the decision to buy m240 over m9 earlier still holds.
Guys, could you educate me on this calibration issue. I have read about this need for the calibration thing but don't quite understand it. Does it mean I have to ship all my lens and camera to NJ leica. If it gets calibrated for one lens, does it mean others may get little off and then those...Show more →
Leica will calibrate each piece independently following some preset measurements so you don't need to send all at once.
You can make an educated guess on whether it's the camera or the lens(es).
Sometimes a miscalibrated body and a miscalibrated lens will work perfectly together
Nov 16, 2014 at 12:02 PM
p.1030 #2Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Crashed shopping, from 2011 with the M9 and 50 Lux
Nov 16, 2014 at 01:39 PM
p.1030 #3Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Great shot Gary.. love the deer shot
Very nice Joakim and Edward
Joakim: leaving Sony and Canon completely now ? And focusing only on Leica ?
Very nice Joakim and Edward
Joakim: leaving Sony and Canon completely now ? And focusing only on Leica ?
Nov 16, 2014 at 02:26 PM
p.1030 #4Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
jfreak wrote:
M9 does not offer so much more then my m8U that has served me quite well for last 4 years.
well that's the first time I heard that. M9 not much better than M8U!
I'm an M8 fan, but seriously.
Regardless, you should grab what you want and can afford. If that's the 240, more power to you
M9 does not offer so much more then my m8U that has served me quite well for last 4 years.
well that's the first time I heard that. M9 not much better than M8U!I'm an M8 fan, but seriously.
Regardless, you should grab what you want and can afford. If that's the 240, more power to you
Nov 16, 2014 at 02:36 PM
p.1030 #5Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
jfreak wrote:
M9 does not offer so much more then my m8U that has served me quite well for last 4 years.
well that's the first time I heard that. M9 not much better than M8U!
I'm an M8 fan, but seriously.
Regardless, you should grab what you want and can afford. If that's the 240, more power to you
I think you got me wrong here. i didnt mean m9 is not better over M8.Compared to m9 m240 for 2k more offers a lot more which i wrote before on this argument on m9 vs m240. And I would think m240 + m8 is better than m9+m8 for 2k more.
M9 does not offer so much more then my m8U that has served me quite well for last 4 years.
well that's the first time I heard that. M9 not much better than M8U!I'm an M8 fan, but seriously.
Regardless, you should grab what you want and can afford. If that's the 240, more power to you
I think you got me wrong here. i didnt mean m9 is not better over M8.Compared to m9 m240 for 2k more offers a lot more which i wrote before on this argument on m9 vs m240. And I would think m240 + m8 is better than m9+m8 for 2k more.
Nov 16, 2014 at 02:46 PM
p.1030 #6Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Ronny _Olsson wrote:
Great shot Gary.. love the deer shot
Very nice Joakim and Edward
Joakim: leaving Sony and Canon completely now ? And focusing only on Leica ?
No I've actually decided to go with Nikon instead of Sony, mostly for my landscape photography. Maybe for the next generation of the Leica M I'll go Leica only, we'll see.
Great shot Gary.. love the deer shot
Very nice Joakim and Edward
Joakim: leaving Sony and Canon completely now ? And focusing only on Leica ?
No I've actually decided to go with Nikon instead of Sony, mostly for my landscape photography. Maybe for the next generation of the Leica M I'll go Leica only, we'll see.
Nov 16, 2014 at 02:58 PM
p.1030 #7Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
I plan on dumping all of my Canon gear and switching completely to Leica M in the future especially if they come out with a more stripped down M. If not an M and maybe an M9 for backup....
Nov 16, 2014 at 03:57 PM
p.1030 #8Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Hey Vik, sorry to read about all the problems you're having.
jfreak wrote:
So I got the M240 and clicked a few with 50lux. First impression
- The focus is off
- Setting the lens to infinity is not focussing at infinity, I have to roll it back a tad to focus.
Does this mean the RF needs calibration?
My first concern is the soft nature of the stopped down photo you posted from the M. There could be a lot of variables at play, but considering your spot on results with the M8, I think we need to give you the benefit of the doubt.
Questions about this test would include where the focus was supposed to be, whether it was on a tripod, etc. The M240 focus crop samples all look to be off and the near focus one is way off... Such mis-focus could also considerably affect results at f/5.6. It's difficult to tell from the samples, but I'm wondering if the camera is back focusing and if it's also doing so at infinity, which would result in an image that has no plane of discernible good focus. As suggested, the best way to determine if you can even get anything in focus is with live view. Another variable that is typically overlooked is the sensor position. It's possible, perhaps remotely, but still possible, that the sensor is incorrectly shimmed. Or the lens mount is out of whack. The battery problem is perplexing. While charging the battery, did the charge lights ever show a solid green and orange to indicate charge completion?
Considering that the rangefinder calibration is off, and the camera will need servicing anyway, it's probably better to return it and try another one. Since the lenses are only slightly off with the M8, but at least the one you were able to try on the M was way off, I'd suspect the camera is the problem. Combined with the other weird problems, a fresh start is probably best.
For future reference, based on my discussions with Leica NJ, if the equipment is under warranty, they will provide a shipping label to send in the gear. For a camera with RF calibration problems, you can ask for expedited service and likely get it back in about a week (but no promises). The two times I've had it done this year in person, it seemed to take the tech around an hour to complete. But, as I mentioned earlier, they are a lot slower with lenses (1-2 months). A couple guys here have had good results dealing with DAG for lens calibration, and apparently if you talk to him before sending it in, may be able to turn it around quickly. So far I've been pleased with the quality of service from Leica NJ. Both times the camera was returned with perfect rangefinder calibration. Kind of a given, but out of warranty service isn't exactly cheap, though sometimes they will do something for no charge...
Regarding your M8's focus... it's probably the camera that needs a slight tweak. IMO, slight front focus is better than back focus. As mentioned by others, with use, it's pretty easy to compensate on the fly, though trickier with longer, faster lenses shot wide open.
Unfortunately, this is part of the process of getting a Leica system up an running. Its mechanical nature requires precise, accurate calibration and sometimes it's not quite right out of the box. A couple years ago when at a Leica store, while discussing servicing, the sales rep said it was common at the time for new M9 & Noctilux 'kit' purchases to immediately have to go back to Leica for calibration. 18MP & f/0.95 requires extreme precision. Imagine just having spent ~$18,000 and having to send everything in for a few weeks turnaround! But it's also the mechanical nature of the system that makes it appealing in use vs. the electronic fly by wire focusing of everything else. Like other 'performance' mechanical devices, it will require occasional servicing to keep properly tuned. It's just too bad that it can happen straight out of the box and obviously puts a huge damper on the initial fun. It's also a subjective decision for each of us whether or not this is tolerable, or acceptable. My feeling is the farther away from major metropolitan centers one lives, the more frustrating the process becomes due to a lack of relatively local support.
M240 & 3x ZM50/2, 28 Cron
jfreak wrote:
So I got the M240 and clicked a few with 50lux. First impression
- The focus is off
- Setting the lens to infinity is not focussing at infinity, I have to roll it back a tad to focus.
Does this mean the RF needs calibration?
My first concern is the soft nature of the stopped down photo you posted from the M. There could be a lot of variables at play, but considering your spot on results with the M8, I think we need to give you the benefit of the doubt.
Questions about this test would include where the focus was supposed to be, whether it was on a tripod, etc. The M240 focus crop samples all look to be off and the near focus one is way off... Such mis-focus could also considerably affect results at f/5.6. It's difficult to tell from the samples, but I'm wondering if the camera is back focusing and if it's also doing so at infinity, which would result in an image that has no plane of discernible good focus. As suggested, the best way to determine if you can even get anything in focus is with live view. Another variable that is typically overlooked is the sensor position. It's possible, perhaps remotely, but still possible, that the sensor is incorrectly shimmed. Or the lens mount is out of whack. The battery problem is perplexing. While charging the battery, did the charge lights ever show a solid green and orange to indicate charge completion?
Considering that the rangefinder calibration is off, and the camera will need servicing anyway, it's probably better to return it and try another one. Since the lenses are only slightly off with the M8, but at least the one you were able to try on the M was way off, I'd suspect the camera is the problem. Combined with the other weird problems, a fresh start is probably best.
For future reference, based on my discussions with Leica NJ, if the equipment is under warranty, they will provide a shipping label to send in the gear. For a camera with RF calibration problems, you can ask for expedited service and likely get it back in about a week (but no promises). The two times I've had it done this year in person, it seemed to take the tech around an hour to complete. But, as I mentioned earlier, they are a lot slower with lenses (1-2 months). A couple guys here have had good results dealing with DAG for lens calibration, and apparently if you talk to him before sending it in, may be able to turn it around quickly. So far I've been pleased with the quality of service from Leica NJ. Both times the camera was returned with perfect rangefinder calibration. Kind of a given, but out of warranty service isn't exactly cheap, though sometimes they will do something for no charge...
Regarding your M8's focus... it's probably the camera that needs a slight tweak. IMO, slight front focus is better than back focus. As mentioned by others, with use, it's pretty easy to compensate on the fly, though trickier with longer, faster lenses shot wide open.
Unfortunately, this is part of the process of getting a Leica system up an running. Its mechanical nature requires precise, accurate calibration and sometimes it's not quite right out of the box. A couple years ago when at a Leica store, while discussing servicing, the sales rep said it was common at the time for new M9 & Noctilux 'kit' purchases to immediately have to go back to Leica for calibration. 18MP & f/0.95 requires extreme precision. Imagine just having spent ~$18,000 and having to send everything in for a few weeks turnaround! But it's also the mechanical nature of the system that makes it appealing in use vs. the electronic fly by wire focusing of everything else. Like other 'performance' mechanical devices, it will require occasional servicing to keep properly tuned. It's just too bad that it can happen straight out of the box and obviously puts a huge damper on the initial fun. It's also a subjective decision for each of us whether or not this is tolerable, or acceptable. My feeling is the farther away from major metropolitan centers one lives, the more frustrating the process becomes due to a lack of relatively local support.
M240 & 3x ZM50/2, 28 Cron
Nov 16, 2014 at 04:33 PM
p.1030 #9Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Thanks Ron,
About the battery, well I am guilty of not letting it charge to full as I wanted to try it if that has anything to do with all this. So I let it charge for little over an hr before I used it. Then, when I decided to update the firmware, it asked me to charge it. I did that for about another hour and then it did let me update the firmware. At this point I remember seeing the battery at 67%. This is when I did the test shots I posted here. After all this was done and I was setting things up for posting here, I decided to put battery in charger coz I wanted to take live view shots and felt it is good time to charge it more. And, that was it... after that I put the battery back and the camera stayed silent, not even the tiny red LED lit up ever again. I charged it over night but nothing in morning too. I tried charging it from car with other DC connector for couple of hrs and it still did not work.
When I charged it first time I felt the charger and battery were a little warm and felt this is normal. But last time I put it in I never felt that warmth, the battery and charger just cold. The charger had been blinking one green all this time. I think I saw the orange light once but then again it was green alone at 1 second rhythm.
I have decided to send it back tomorrow. I just wonder if there is anyway to know if this is just an odd thing or the quality check is not done on these units. I will ask popflash tomorrow on this question. If all goes well and they are very supportive, I will buy another one and let them refund it when they get it. A lot of thoughts coming to my mind at this point and will depend on how popflash deals with it. The worst would be to send it to NJ leica under warranty. With sending it myself what I lose is probably time but that would make sure it is calibrated besides fixing other issues. The risk is that it may be with them for very long time.
Looking at snow through another window, summilux 50 at 1.4
L1001598 by vazad, on Flickr
Edited on Nov 16, 2014 at 05:11 PM · View previous versions
About the battery, well I am guilty of not letting it charge to full as I wanted to try it if that has anything to do with all this. So I let it charge for little over an hr before I used it. Then, when I decided to update the firmware, it asked me to charge it. I did that for about another hour and then it did let me update the firmware. At this point I remember seeing the battery at 67%. This is when I did the test shots I posted here. After all this was done and I was setting things up for posting here, I decided to put battery in charger coz I wanted to take live view shots and felt it is good time to charge it more. And, that was it... after that I put the battery back and the camera stayed silent, not even the tiny red LED lit up ever again. I charged it over night but nothing in morning too. I tried charging it from car with other DC connector for couple of hrs and it still did not work.
When I charged it first time I felt the charger and battery were a little warm and felt this is normal. But last time I put it in I never felt that warmth, the battery and charger just cold. The charger had been blinking one green all this time. I think I saw the orange light once but then again it was green alone at 1 second rhythm.
I have decided to send it back tomorrow. I just wonder if there is anyway to know if this is just an odd thing or the quality check is not done on these units. I will ask popflash tomorrow on this question. If all goes well and they are very supportive, I will buy another one and let them refund it when they get it. A lot of thoughts coming to my mind at this point and will depend on how popflash deals with it. The worst would be to send it to NJ leica under warranty. With sending it myself what I lose is probably time but that would make sure it is calibrated besides fixing other issues. The risk is that it may be with them for very long time.
Looking at snow through another window, summilux 50 at 1.4
L1001598 by vazad, on FlickrEdited on Nov 16, 2014 at 05:11 PM · View previous versions
Nov 16, 2014 at 04:50 PM
p.1030 #10Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
I'd think it's more a matter of bad luck. I can't recall any of the other M240 owners here experiencing anything remotely similar. A few of us, IIRC, also bought demo cameras, including me and I've had none of these problems. Not remotely close.
Sounds like the battery suddenly wasn't taking a charge. These batteries have chips in them and I guess it's possible something could get messed up. In discussions I've had with a Leica beta tester, it was indicated to me that some others had random lock up problems that were resolved with new batteries, implying that some battery batches might be suboptimal.
With your camera being a demo unit, I suppose there is a potential that something is not right with it, though my assumption is it would have been checked by Leica before being sent to the retailer...
I think it's the right move to send it back and try again.
Sounds like the battery suddenly wasn't taking a charge. These batteries have chips in them and I guess it's possible something could get messed up. In discussions I've had with a Leica beta tester, it was indicated to me that some others had random lock up problems that were resolved with new batteries, implying that some battery batches might be suboptimal.
With your camera being a demo unit, I suppose there is a potential that something is not right with it, though my assumption is it would have been checked by Leica before being sent to the retailer...
I think it's the right move to send it back and try again.
Nov 16, 2014 at 05:11 PM
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p.1030 #11Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
I agree here with Ron, as my second M240 was an early demo unit, and it is was great. In many ways if there was an issue, it would have shown when it was being tested in the store so it was an ideal test bench.
Another point to raise, some stores will loan an M9/M240 while your camera is away being serviced in Solms. I have had a 50 Lux Asph and M9 loaned while mine were being serviced which did take 8 weeks. This was a great courtesy provided on behalf of Leica in Australia at the time
Another point to raise, some stores will loan an M9/M240 while your camera is away being serviced in Solms. I have had a 50 Lux Asph and M9 loaned while mine were being serviced which did take 8 weeks. This was a great courtesy provided on behalf of Leica in Australia at the time
Nov 16, 2014 at 06:36 PM
p.1030 #12Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
I was skunked last week in the Banff area for sunrise but managed to snap a minimalist-type mountain abstract....
90cron pre-AA
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90cron pre-AA
Nov 16, 2014 at 08:13 PM
p.1030 #15Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Glen, better than a sunrise I'd say.
Nov 17, 2014 at 08:03 AM
p.1030 #16Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Hey, my 5K review is up at Huff's site:
Right Here!!
How did I do?
Blind Spot by unoh7, 28 cron
Right Here!!
How did I do?
Blind Spot by unoh7, 28 cron
Nov 17, 2014 at 10:22 AM
p.1030 #17Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Long time no posts.
Edward, Gary, Ron, Joakim, great images as always.
and welcome to all the new posters
Since we are discussing system quite often here, I want chime in.
I went to SW US last week, mainly Zion and Page Arizona bringing my kids for some outdoor activity and catching some fall color myself
This time, I only bring D810 14-24-70G and RX1
As discussed before, I find for my national park family trip like this I need zoom for time saving. Changing lens back and forth in field is a hassle. So no new images for here, I will slowly upload to RX1 and D810 thread once I go through them. A7 is long gone as this round just didn't suit my need: slow MF, no enough good AF lens, user experience etc....
M9 with M glass is still lovely experience I can't abandon though
Two images to share 28cron:
Edward, Gary, Ron, Joakim, great images as always.
and welcome to all the new posters
Since we are discussing system quite often here, I want chime in.
I went to SW US last week, mainly Zion and Page Arizona bringing my kids for some outdoor activity and catching some fall color myself
This time, I only bring D810 14-24-70G and RX1
As discussed before, I find for my national park family trip like this I need zoom for time saving. Changing lens back and forth in field is a hassle. So no new images for here, I will slowly upload to RX1 and D810 thread once I go through them. A7 is long gone as this round just didn't suit my need: slow MF, no enough good AF lens, user experience etc....M9 with M glass is still lovely experience I can't abandon though
Two images to share 28cron:
Nov 17, 2014 at 11:56 AM
p.1030 #18Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
Ok, so popflash has benn very nice with the whole thing, the camera is going back and I placed the order for another one. Popflash said if I wish they can charge the battery and few shots to check everything before shipping out, and I agreed to it. They even will cover the shipping for the one going back. I am sold on the popflash service and that makes the whole experience not bad at all but just a learning experience. Thank you all for the support and guidance over last few post some of which were like panic calls. Appreciate each one of you guys here. As Ron said living far from major city can get tough in these situations but this forum does make up for that drawback quite a bit. Thanks again to all of you.
Nov 17, 2014 at 11:58 AM
p.1030 #19Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
jfreak wrote:
Ok, so popflash has benn very nice with the whole thing, the camera is going back and I placed the order for another one. Popflash said if I wish they can charge the battery and few shots to check everything before shipping out, and I agreed to it. They even will cover the shipping for the one going back. I am sold on the popflash service and that makes the whole experience not bad at all but just a learning experience. Thank you all for the support and guidance over last few post some of which were like panic calls....Show more →
Glad to know that Popflash was willing and able to help you. I have only had 1 small transaction with Popflash but was happy with the transaction and service.
Rich
Ok, so popflash has benn very nice with the whole thing, the camera is going back and I placed the order for another one. Popflash said if I wish they can charge the battery and few shots to check everything before shipping out, and I agreed to it. They even will cover the shipping for the one going back. I am sold on the popflash service and that makes the whole experience not bad at all but just a learning experience. Thank you all for the support and guidance over last few post some of which were like panic calls....Show more →
Glad to know that Popflash was willing and able to help you. I have only had 1 small transaction with Popflash but was happy with the transaction and service.
Rich
Nov 17, 2014 at 12:02 PM
p.1030 #20Leica M/X/T/S/Q/CL/SL Picture Thread
@jfreak so glad to hear about Pflash. When u get a good one now u will luv it more
@michael beautiful 3D from the beach mit das wundercron I hope you will post up some links in here to your Nikon shots when they are up, as I seldom stray from Alt, but would love to see them
@michael beautiful 3D from the beach mit das wundercron
I hope you will post up some links in here to your Nikon shots when they are up, as I seldom stray from Alt, but would love to see them Nov 17, 2014 at 02:35 PM