p.41 #1 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
FrankA373 wrote:
I read on another site that a photographer set his Z8 to have a button trigger both AF-ON plus Wide small. I have been searching the manual for hours and can’t find that. Can someone help with this please plus explain how it works? Thanks.
Easy peasy. Menu > Custom Settings > F (Controls) > Custom controls (shooting) > AF-ON > AF-area mode + AF-ON
Hit right on the D pad at this point (not obvious at all), then pick Wide-area AF (S)
p.41 #4 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
I guess it is, at some point, about getting old but I am failing to see the case for criticizing autofocus on this camera. Same, frankly, as on the Z6II/7II cameras.
If I was teaching a seminar and someone set up to shoot those birds against that uber-busy background I would start by telling them that they are setup at the wrong place. And then that they are attempting to get the camera to alibi their composition mistakes with AI. I would tell them that if I wanted to get those birds in focus I would take control of at least the initial focus myself and make sure it was as close as I could get it before I sent the camera to do its part.
As old fashioned an idea as it is, I guess I want a camera that first does what I tell it to do and I accept that my "instructions" to it should be the correct ones. I want a camera that gets out of the way and lets me take pictures. Not one that expects me to work for it. I like great features and am happy to try new things. It is, however, my first-best bet to put my limited expertise and experience to work to create the artistic expression that I am intending to capture. For me (YMMV) the idea of spraying out 3000 pictures in three hours and then looking for nuggets is not fun and goes against the way I was taught to shoot. Of course it was literally impossible 'back in the day'. Maybe that is how it is done today. The, and I digress, workflow issues this causes borders on the absurd.
It is shear gear-headedness that attempts to put the camera on the bleeding edge of technology and then grades it against other cameras operating on that same bleeding edge. And monumental hubris to expect the rest of us to believe or care about this trip down the rabbit hole.
I have said before (and been roundly criticized for it) rather than taking a new camera and trying to break its capabilities, one would be far better off trying to perfect ones skill and ability to stay well inside the envelope. The Z8 is a better camera than I am a photographer. And it is that, 50 years of experience and all, that should be my first and foremost concern.
Back in the early 70s, living in Germany, I was fortunate to be (sort of) apprenticed to an old man who had shot for Leica since the late 20's. When I told him I was going to buy an SLR he told me I had to buy a Petri V6. I complained that it did not have a meter in it and he said, "precisely". Within a couple of years I had a Nikormat EL and later an F2 with his blessing but starting out he wanted me to learn to shoot "by eye". And, when using a handheld meter, to look at it as a compositional tool not simply as the means to a correct exposure. I am rambling a bit but I think those lessons are still arrows in my quiver.
I can spray and pray with the best of them but that is all it is. And I can whine when only half of them are in focus. And now, if I want to, I can do it at 120 frames per second. Oh boy.....
p.41 #5 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
At this point it’s pretty well known that if you can’t get any shot with a Z8 or a Z9, you need to hang up your boots. Is it slightly harder to get the most edge case shots? Yes. Does anybody really care outside of a few niche online forum posters? Unequivocally not.
p.41 #6 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
Well said!
RickPJ wrote:
I guess it is, at some point, about getting old but I am failing to see the case for criticizing autofocus on this camera. Same, frankly, as on the Z6II/7II cameras.
If I was teaching a seminar and someone set up to shoot those birds against that uber-busy background I would start by telling them that they are setup at the wrong place. And then that they are attempting to get the camera to alibi their composition mistakes with AI. I would tell them that if I wanted to get those birds in focus I would take control of at least the initial focus myself and make sure it was as close as I could get it before I sent the camera to do its part.
As old fashioned an idea as it is, I guess I want a camera that first does what I tell it to do and I accept that my "instructions" to it should be the correct ones. I want a camera that gets out of the way and lets me take pictures. Not one that expects me to work for it. I like great features and am happy to try new things. It is, however, my first-best bet to put my limited expertise and experience to work to create the artistic expression that I am intending to capture. For me (YMMV) the idea of spraying out 3000 pictures in three hours and then looking for nuggets is not fun and goes against the way I was taught to shoot. Of course it was literally impossible 'back in the day'. Maybe that is how it is done today. The, and I digress, workflow issues this causes borders on the absurd.
It is shear gear-headedness that attempts to put the camera on the bleeding edge of technology and then grades it against other cameras operating on that same bleeding edge. And monumental hubris to expect the rest of us to believe or care about this trip down the rabbit hole.
I have said before (and been roundly criticized for it) rather than taking a new camera and trying to break its capabilities, one would be far better off trying to perfect ones skill and ability to stay well inside the envelope. The Z8 is a better camera than I am a photographer. And it is that, 50 years of experience and all, that should be my first and foremost concern.
Back in the early 70s, living in Germany, I was fortunate to be (sort of) apprenticed to an old man who had shot for Leica since the late 20's. When I told him I was going to buy an SLR he told me I had to buy a Petri V6. I complained that it did not have a meter in it and he said, "precisely". Within a couple of years I had a Nikormat EL and later an F2 with his blessing but starting out he wanted me to learn to shoot "by eye". And, when using a handheld meter, to look at it as a compositional tool not simply as the means to a correct exposure. I am rambling a bit but I think those lessons are still arrows in my quiver.
I can spray and pray with the best of them but that is all it is. And I can whine when only half of them are in focus. And now, if I want to, I can do it at 120 frames per second. Oh boy........Show more →
Jun 04, 2023 at 03:15 AM
duncang Offline • • • [X]
p.41 #7 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
RickPJ wrote:
I guess it is, at some point, about getting old but I am failing to see the case for criticizing autofocus on this camera. Same, frankly, as on the Z6II/7II cameras.
If I was teaching a seminar and someone set up to shoot those birds against that uber-busy background I would start by telling them that they are setup at the wrong place. And then that they are attempting to get the camera to alibi their composition mistakes with AI. I would tell them that if I wanted to get those birds in focus I would take control of at least the initial focus myself and make sure it was as close as I could get it before I sent the camera to do its part.
As old fashioned an idea as it is, I guess I want a camera that first does what I tell it to do and I accept that my "instructions" to it should be the correct ones. ....Show more →
if you have ever tried to capture lanner falcons, or tawny or martial eagles hunting you would know that they come in fast and low with cover behind them and you have next to no ability to 'setup' and eliminate uber-busy backgrounds.
No way I am travelling half way around the world only to miss a raptor strike because I was unable to acquire focus against an uber-busy background if I don't have to. I am not a professional so can't spend 6 months trying - I have only a few fleeting moments and want to maximise my chances.
p.41 #8 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
The following is a Steve Perry quote from his interview on a YT Vahagraphy Nikon 800 vid. Please just google it because I did not want to post the big YT screen image.
The Steve Perry quote I am referring to begins at 33:44:
“I’m not trying to pick on Sony but I want to a little bit....
I don’t see a 300 f4 in Sony. I don’t see any PF lenses. I don’t see a 300 2.8. I don’t see anything in the 200-400 or 180-400 range. You know those are all pretty critical. There’s no 500 f4.
So there’s lot of stuff missing in that line-up. And Nikon is really doing well I think in the lens department. Not only that, you can use their F-mount lenses, which are great. That 500PF adapts fantastically to the Z9 by the way. The 400 2.8 with a teleconverter... you know, that’s great.!
I have been saying this for years. As soon as I saw those longer lenses with teleconverters, I said “I sure wish they would do that with the primes.” And they did it with the 400 2.8 and there’s a rumor they might do it with the 600.”
p.41 #9 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
The above quote was made before Nikon did it yet again, by producing the 600 Z with a built in TC!
I'm tired of reading niggling’s about Sony vs Nikon AF. That is not where it is at. That is all improvable and correctable through firmware.
Not so with the glass. Glass requires a huge commitment toward change. Nikon has demonstrated that commitment and will continue to do so. Look for more surprises.
I am not about gear. I am about nature (Itsaboutnature.net).
Although I *am* glad I went with Nikon back in 1984. Of course, if you were around back then, you know that that choice was easy.
p.41 #10 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
I am not a professional so can't spend 6 months trying
if only that were true. i wish i had 6 months to work on a few of my images. and they don't necessarily move at high speed. no, i don't do birds. like many things its an acquired taste. and here there are those who are well dedicated to that particular genre and i don't like transporting big lenses around too. i don't quite have that level of patience. i am contracted to do PPT (People, Places, and Things).
there really isn't that much to being a professional. primarily it's knowledge, understanding and patience. also, you drop the ego
p.41 #11 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
bs kite wrote:
The following is a Steve Perry quote from his interview on a YT Vahagraphy Nikon 800 vid. Please just google it because I did not want to post the big YT screen image.
The Steve Perry quote I am referring to begins at 33:44:
“I’m not trying to pick on Sony but I want to a little bit....
I don’t see a 300 f4 in Sony. I don’t see any PF lenses. I don’t see a 300 2.8. I don’t see anything in the 200-400 or 180-400 range. You know those are all pretty critical. There’s no 500 f4.
So there’s lot of stuff missing in that line-up. And Nikon is really doing well I think in the lens department. Not only that, you can use their F-mount lenses, which are great. That 500PF adapts fantastically to the Z9 by the way. The 400 2.8 with a teleconverter... you know, that’s great.!
I have been saying this for years. As soon as I saw those longer lenses with teleconverters, I said “I sure wish they would do that with the primes.” And they did it with the 400 2.8 and there’s a rumor they might do it with the 600.”
End of Steve Perry’s quote
As a Sony shooter, A7IV and Sony 100-400 what Steve said is so true. Everyone talks in Sony land about the 200-600 and Nikon doesn't have this lens yet. Well...ok...but we don't have a 400 f4.5 or any of the lenses mentioned above. And knowing Sony if they did come out with lenses like this? They would not be cheap. $3K for that Nikon 400 f4.5? I dare Sony to match that in every way. Same goes with the Z8 and the rumored Sony A9III.
I chose the 100-400 over the 200-600 because of the weight issue. I'm happy with what I have lens wise. If I were to switch back to Nikon? No doubt I would have their version of the 100-400. And quite possibly that 400 f4.5.
p.41 #12 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
Thanks for not responding with more arguing .
BTW, I agree with everything you said.
I honestly want to see more for Sony shooters in glass. And I did not think to mention the cut in the cost of a few of those long Nikon lenses. But even if a glass piece is expensive, we all know that it is worth it.
I guess the Sony 200-600 is an exception. It is reasonably priced. That happens to be the lens I am waiting to see from Nikon. Nikon has its hands full to meet that Sony lens in quality, specs and price.
Yes, even if money were not a factor..... weight is always the limiting factor with the long glass. Example: If I had unlimited funds, I would still be cautious about having the 600 TC for myself, just because of the weight. I like to handhold. And that relates to another thing that is becoming more exciting.... the advancements in image stabilization.
And you mentioned that 400 4.5. Everyone loves it. If I did not have the 500pf already, I would be looking at that one first.
So if you are reading this Sony corporation, get on with more innovative glass for all your loyal Sony shooters !
p.41 #13 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
bs kite wrote:
So if you are reading this Sony corporation, get on with more innovative glass for all your loyal Sony shooters !
Well the reason for this disparity in concentration in lens lines is simple, and not likely to change anytime soon. It is simply money. Sony has been concentrating on building products for content creators. Uses in blogging, vlogging, and business related collaboration. Generalist photography in small, lightweight systems, with high performance in targeted areas. There is simply a lot of money, volume of sales, and market share numbers in this approach. Sony wants to get these huge market segments invested in the Sony E-Mount system going forward. Sony is laser focused on becoming number 1 in the camera industry. If you have read the details that is now coming out from ex Sony executives of the many year operation/deception Sony ran using the mirrorless camera model as the foil, you would be shocked, and probably angered a bit. Like it or hate it, the deceptive withholding of developed technology until the Sony ecosystem was better developed, combined with the intentional framing of non existent limitations in mirrorless in order to keep the competition asleep, was pure genius. It is an amazing business strategy story that should be taught to every student of business.
The number of birders in the World is tiny. I don't think Sony cares much about them in reality. The A1 being possibly the best birding camera body in the World is probably just a side effect of other areas where Sony is concentrating. Sony does offer enough lenses for this kind of shooting to make people successful. Enough for large companies and organizations to choose the Sony ecosystem. Plus, there was until recently almost no meaningful competition in mirrorless. The lenses Nikon has been making didn't overcome the lack of competitive camera bodies.
Nikon now has two versions of what is basically the same camera. Same internals, same performance, same use cases, pick your form factor. Nikon's other camera body offerings seriously lag the competition. In camera bodies Nikon is the low cost leader. This I believe is designed to drive sales of these expensive lenses. Not a huge number of lens sales, but they are highly profitable. This is huge for Nikon, but wouldn't move Sony's numbers a noticeable amount so they are probably not going to respond in a meaningful way.
I agree with Robert, and Steve Perry regarding lenses. If you are a birder/nature photographer of a certain type (not requiring the best acquisition of small, fast, subjects far away), Nikon is your best choice at this time. Your needs may be likely to get more attention going forward as well. Non birders like me are likely better served elsewhere at this time.
p.41 #17 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
Any suggestions?
Reference the little focus box: I cannot see the red from the green. It is a type of Daltonism, a red-green genetic color deficiency. Heck I even have difficulty seeing the box at all in the D850's LCD. I see the black box fine in the optical viewfinder.
I am told I will be sent a copy of the Z8 soon.
It would be wonderful if I could substitute another color in there for the short term, even white.
In upcoming firmware, the long-term solution will be to include options to change the color of that box to any of the 4 bold peak focusing options... red, blue, white yellow
I figure I will get by for now just by relying on the camera to lock on, even if I cannot see that it locked.
I have difficulty seeing it only when the red or green box is against foliage... which is most often...
p.41 #18 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
bs kite wrote:
Any suggestions?
Reference the little focus box: I cannot see the red from the green. It is a type of Daltonism, a red-green genetic color deficiency. Heck I even have difficulty seeing the box at all in the D850's LCD. I see the black box fine in the optical viewfinder.
I am told I will be sent a copy of the Z8 soon.
It would be wonderful if I could substitute another color in there for the short term, even white.
In upcoming firmware, the long-term solution will be to include options to change the color of that box to any of the 4 bold peak focusing options... red, blue, white yellow
I figure I will get by for now just by relying on the camera to lock on, even if I cannot see that it locked.
I have difficulty seeing it only when the red or green box is against foliage... which is most often...
As long as you can see the AF square/rectangle, shoot in AF-C and don't worry about it. I turned off the red/green change pretty fast, I just trust that the camera is focusing on what I'm pointing at. I shoot "release" mode so a color changing confirmation means nothing to me.
If the issue is seeing red against green, no easy solution here, the only mode that allows for a color change is 3D tracking to white instead of red.
p.41 #19 · Nikon unveils the highly anticipated Z8 camera!
RoamingScott wrote:
As long as you can see the AF square/rectangle, shoot in AF-C and don't worry about it. I turned off the red/green change pretty fast, I just trust that the camera is focusing on what I'm pointing at. I shoot "release" mode so a color changing confirmation means nothing to me.
If the issue is seeing red against green, no easy solution here, the only mode that allows for a color change is 3D tracking to white instead of red.
Sounds great! That's what I was hoping. It will work fine.
I'll be shooting AF-C and Release too, same as I have set in the D850
.
