p.10 #1 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
Looks like I'm going to skip R5 and wait for R6. I did the same going from R2 to R4. For me to justify the move I need something that is so much better that I can not live without it. So I looked at R5 specs:
61MP Full-Frame Exmor R BSI CMOS Sensor.
I already have it in R4
BIONZ XR & AI Processing Unit (up to 8x greater processing performance compared to previous generations).
Nice, but I have no problems with R4 speed.
AI-Based Real-Time Tracking AF System (60% more accurate for humans and 40% more accurate for birds/animals).
I don't trust AI claims on anything. Especially when they tell me percentage better.
Insect/Car/Train recognition also available.
I can tell the difference between insect and a train without AI help.
8K 24p, 4K 60p, FHD 120p 10-Bit Video.
4K 16-Bit Raw Output; S-Log3/S-Cinetone
I don't do much video and HD and 4K on R4 are just fine for me.
9.44m-Dot EVF with 120 fps Refresh Rate (OLED).
I have no problem with EVF on R4
693 phase-detection covering 79% of the full frame area.
I don't really have a problem with 78% coverage
3.2" 4-Axis Multi-Angle Touchscreen LCD (2.1m-dot).
Don't see any advantage to the way I shoot.
In-camera Focus Bracketing (up to 299 frames).
I use RMT-P1BT remote as described in this post https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1635996
and it works great for 20-30 frames (my computer would take hours to process 299 120MB frames)
Also I have R2 and playmemories after market app for focus stacking works just fine on it.
8-Stop 5-Axis Image Stabilization!!
I do not need it, but even if I did I would not believe this claim enough to buy this camera.
So for these reasons I don't see myself buying this new shiny toy.
p.10 #2 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
Fboss wrote:
The other features don't make up for the slow readout and rolling shutter when using electronic shutter. EFCS is still going to be an issue with the bokeh, at fast shutter speeds.
If I understand it correctly the A7RV does not have a full mechanical shutter anymore, i.e. the only way to avoid these bokeh issues at fast shutter speeds is using the silent shutter with its slow readout.
Is it like this? There is the choice between bokeh defects and rolling shutter distortions?
Olaf G wrote:
If I understand it correctly the A7RV does not have a full mechanical shutter anymore, i.e. the only way to avoid these bokeh issues at fast shutter speeds is using the silent shutter with its slow readout.
Is it like this? There is the choice between bokeh defects and rolling shutter distortions?
p.10 #7 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
"after accounting for inflation, the a7rv is actually cheaper than the a7riv was in 2019."
after you do sony pr, you would make a great russian troll. Go Ukraine - and please if no one buys this camera in the first few weeks, sony will magically drop the price - and still make a profit. $2995 tops. But I am staying with the A7R4
p.10 #8 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
I am happy, Sony delivered everything I wanted (needed)
big A1 viewfinder (like A1, A7S3)
lossless compressed raw option (like A74)
fully articulated screen
ultrasonic sensor cleaning (like A1, A7S4 re-introduced - the ibis sensor cleaning did never work as ultrasonic was kicked by Sony when they introduced IBIS)
bonus:
enough video power for my usage
better IBIS is nice too (curious how it works with my GM II 70200 lens)
p.10 #9 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
novalaker wrote:
I'm a current M43 shooter and looking to upgrade from my G9. Lately I've been looking at used prices of A7RIV and wondering if they will drop further. I can even get a new one for $2600 as an educator. But I'm wondering if the image quality improvements will outweigh the usability of something like the OM-1, with HHHR and Live ND (plus better weather sealing), which is also a better wildlife/sports camera. I do really like the Sony ecosystem however and I think investing in it would be a good long-term decision, while I'm less sure about the future of OM. ...Show more →
I’m an ex-m43 guy shooting Sony today (came from the G9 in February, but I’d owned the E-M1 and E-M1.2 previously. Never should have sold my E-M1.2)
In terms of IQ it’s no contest, an A7RIV in crop mode is distinctly better than a G9 and somewhat better than an E-M1 or OM-1 in terms of DR, and resolution. In full frame mode it’s not even in shouting distance. You have to use the HDR multishot features to get really usable landscape files on m43, and I did so extensively, however I can do the same on the A7RIV and do even better (I got in the habit of shooting 3 frame/1 stop bracket sets for everything while shooting m43 and still do that on the A7RIV)
In terms of software, both systems are the land of odd gotchas. Sony locks out much of the UI when writing and the files are big enough that this is an issue in regular use. Both systems have a lot of odd and unpredictable interactions between settings. Sony menus are easier to understand (no ‘1 fish/3 fish’ issues unlike OMDS which retains Oly’s addictions to obscure iconography over clear titles). Oly does silly thinks like linking the no blackout EVF feature to only the fastest frame rates, you can’t get no blackout at 10fps.
The computational bits on the OM-1 are best in the market. HHHR is mostly a gimmick though, and regardless of the marketing numbers an OM-1 using multishot gives files on par with an A7IV in terms of resolution, not an A7RIV. LiveND is killer and it’s sad that Sony abandoned that feature (yes, they had it first with the Smooth Reflections App in the A7 and A7 II series). Oly IBIS is also simply better than any of the Sony bodies before the last few (A1 and later start to compete).
Oly Pro glass is also killer, and I really miss the 12-40 Pro, it’s simply the best normal zoom I’ve used. Not just for the small size and high IQ, but the exceptional close focus performance is something I really miss, I’ve yet to encounter a FF normal zoom that can focus as close in normal use (0.2m btw). The flip side is that the selection of glass in Sony land is far larger than even the large m43 system, and while gaps remain on m43 (try and find an AF UWA prime….) FE is better rounded as well.
The biggest miss in Sony is the lack of good compact carry options. APS-C is a dogs breakfast and the A7c is a real mixed bag ergonomically. The OM-5 gives a lot of good options even if it’s an underwhelming body (it’s what the E-M5.3 should have been a couple years ago, today they should have included a less crappy EVF, USB-C PD and a few other minor items).
I’m a landscape guy, so wildlife capabilities are really outside my wheelhouse and I won’t comment on them.
p.10 #10 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
tsdevine wrote:
I would have been surprised as well if they had ditched full mechanical.
Waiting for that day May happen when the global chip shortage eases after a few years - I hope.
A7r5 looks like a sensible upgrade, but the camera to have in Sony line-up is A1. Maybe Sony will give A1 a small mid cycle upgrade with improved IBIS and LCD? We will see. I am not upgrading to a new camera right now. A7r5 is not enough and A1 is too expensive.
p.10 #11 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
This ticks quite a few boxes for me, but I can understand everyone has their own priorities and this may not tick boxes for everyone.
No camera is going to make every person 100% happy. It's just not possible.
tuomkok wrote:
Waiting for that day May happen when the global chip shortage eases after a few years - I hope.
A7r5 looks like a sensible upgrade, but the camera to have in Sony line-up is A1. Maybe Sony will give A1 a small mid cycle upgrade with improved IBIS and LCD? We will see. I am not upgrading to a new camera right now. A7r5 is not enough and A1 is too expensive.
p.10 #12 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
mawz wrote:
I’m an ex-m43 guy shooting Sony today (came from the G9 in February, but I’d owned the E-M1 and E-M1.2 previously. Never should have sold my E-M1.2)
In terms of IQ it’s no contest, an A7RIV in crop mode is distinctly better than a G9 and somewhat better than an E-M1 or OM-1 in terms of DR, and resolution. In full frame mode it’s not even in shouting distance. You have to use the HDR multishot features to get really usable landscape files on m43, and I did so extensively, however I can do the same on the A7RIV and do even better (I got in the habit of shooting 3 frame/1 stop bracket sets for everything while shooting m43 and still do that on the A7RIV)
In terms of software, both systems are the land of odd gotchas. Sony locks out much of the UI when writing and the files are big enough that this is an issue in regular use. Both systems have a lot of odd and unpredictable interactions between settings. Sony menus are easier to understand (no ‘1 fish/3 fish’ issues unlike OMDS which retains Oly’s addictions to obscure iconography over clear titles). Oly does silly thinks like linking the no blackout EVF feature to only the fastest frame rates, you can’t get no blackout at 10fps.
The computational bits on the OM-1 are best in the market. HHHR is mostly a gimmick though, and regardless of the marketing numbers an OM-1 using multishot gives files on par with an A7IV in terms of resolution, not an A7RIV. LiveND is killer and it’s sad that Sony abandoned that feature (yes, they had it first with the Smooth Reflections App in the A7 and A7 II series). Oly IBIS is also simply better than any of the Sony bodies before the last few (A1 and later start to compete).
Oly Pro glass is also killer, and I really miss the 12-40 Pro, it’s simply the best normal zoom I’ve used. Not just for the small size and high IQ, but the exceptional close focus performance is something I really miss, I’ve yet to encounter a FF normal zoom that can focus as close in normal use (0.2m btw). The flip side is that the selection of glass in Sony land is far larger than even the large m43 system, and while gaps remain on m43 (try and find an AF UWA prime….) FE is better rounded as well.
The biggest miss in Sony is the lack of good compact carry options. APS-C is a dogs breakfast and the A7c is a real mixed bag ergonomically. The OM-5 gives a lot of good options even if it’s an underwhelming body (it’s what the E-M5.3 should have been a couple years ago, today they should have included a less crappy EVF, USB-C PD and a few other minor items).
I’m a landscape guy, so wildlife capabilities are really outside my wheelhouse and I won’t comment on them....Show more →
I do a mix of landscape and wildlife, but my G9 and PL 100-400 suffice for wildlife (though AF could be better). What I'm considering doing is selling some of my other M43 lenses and then keeping the G9 for wildlife and investing in another system for landscape and pretty much everything else. I've always wanted to avoid being a two-system shooter but shooting wildlife on a FF system means less reach and bigger, much more expensive lenses. The Fuji X-H2 is a compelling compromise, but I think the A7RIV would still be a pretty big step up in image quality.
p.10 #14 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
tuomkok wrote:
Waiting for that day May happen when the global chip shortage eases after a few years - I hope.
A7r5 looks like a sensible upgrade, but the camera to have in Sony line-up is A1. Maybe Sony will give A1 a small mid cycle upgrade with improved IBIS and LCD? We will see. I am not upgrading to a new camera right now. A7r5 is not enough and A1 is too expensive.
I'm kind of in the same boat. Have an a7R3 and just can't pull the trigger on an A1 or an R5. I mostly do live aerial/burlesque photography so my primary concern is low-light DR and AF accuracy (think a person quickly spinning on an axis and the AF nailing their face). The nice thing about the A1 for me is that it deals with the nasty LED lighting I see at a lot of venues that makes me need mechanical shutter on my R3. But the R5 AI AF might deal with my spinning subjects better, hard to say. Plus neither of them even match the DR of the R3, so are either of them going to really improve my photos? If I knew that one or the other was going to nail focus significantly more often I'd say yes, but without actually trying it I can't say for certain.
I imagine the next A1 will probably be the current A1 sensor with the AI autofocus, improve IBIS, and new screen/viewfinder. That is probably the camera that would be my upgrade path, even without improved DR.
Question is how long is the wait for then next A1 going to be.
Wish I could borrow an R5 for a day and actually see how good the AF is.
p.10 #15 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
rdcny wrote:
"after accounting for inflation, the a7rv is actually cheaper than the a7riv was in 2019."
after you do sony pr, you would make a great russian troll. Go Ukraine - and please if no one buys this camera in the first few weeks, sony will magically drop the price - and still make a profit. $2995 tops. But I am staying with the A7R4
Say what? That's 100% factually correct here in the US, and given how much inflation has impacted things like chips, it's actually pretty remarkable.
p.10 #16 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
arbitrage wrote:
I think Galer's final slide sums it up well if comparing A7RV vs A1...
Yes, BUT…it would be great if Sony pushed the bulb feature and the focus bracketing to the a1 via firmware. They do advertise it as the one camera that can do it all. I don’t want to “downgrade” to an R5 but would really like those two features.
Plus, judging from posts on this thread, Sony would likely sell a few more a1 bodies over the R5, which for them would be both a line extension and more $ for no new outlay. Win-win.
p.10 #18 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
samosh wrote:
Looks like I'm going to skip R5 and wait for R6. I did the same going from R2 to R4. For me to justify the move I need something that is so much better that I can not live without it. So I looked at R5 specs:
61MP Full-Frame Exmor R BSI CMOS Sensor.
I already have it in R4
BIONZ XR & AI Processing Unit (up to 8x greater processing performance compared to previous generations).
Nice, but I have no problems with R4 speed.
AI-Based Real-Time Tracking AF System (60% more accurate for humans and 40% more accurate for birds/animals).
I don't trust AI claims on anything. Especially when they tell me percentage better.
Insect/Car/Train recognition also available.
I can tell the difference between insect and a train without AI help.
8K 24p, 4K 60p, FHD 120p 10-Bit Video.
4K 16-Bit Raw Output; S-Log3/S-Cinetone
I don't do much video and HD and 4K on R4 are just fine for me.
9.44m-Dot EVF with 120 fps Refresh Rate (OLED).
I have no problem with EVF on R4
693 phase-detection covering 79% of the full frame area.
I don't really have a problem with 78% coverage
3.2" 4-Axis Multi-Angle Touchscreen LCD (2.1m-dot).
Don't see any advantage to the way I shoot.
In-camera Focus Bracketing (up to 299 frames).
I use RMT-P1BT remote as described in this post https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1635996
and it works great for 20-30 frames (my computer would take hours to process 299 120MB frames)
Also I have R2 and playmemories after market app for focus stacking works just fine on it.
8-Stop 5-Axis Image Stabilization!!
I do not need it, but even if I did I would not believe this claim enough to buy this camera.
So for these reasons I don't see myself buying this new shiny toy.
p.10 #19 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
jhapeman wrote:
Say what? That's 100% factually correct here in the US, and given how much inflation has impacted things like chips, it's actually pretty remarkable.
It’s hard to list a single thing that is not more expensive today compared to 2019. Why would one even think cameras of all things break this pattern.
p.10 #20 · Official: Sony A7R V announced (pre-orders now available)
arbitrage wrote:
I think Galer's final slide sums it up well if comparing A7RV vs A1...
IMHO, the shooting experience can sometimes trump specifications. With the earlier Leica digital cameras, folks (including myself) would give-up things like a bit of dynamic range and programability just to have that amazing tactile shooter experience, along with shooting simplicity, and lens rendering characteristics that do not show-up on the specification sheets.
I shoot a lot of portraits and it would be great to have the new flip screen on the V for shooting low portrait orientations, which I shoot a lot of. 8-stop's of IBIS and AI assisted focus would also be really welcomed, as well.
I have considered giving one of my two A1's up for a V; however, I have come to love silent-shutter for all modes (even with strobes), the almost no rolling-shutter and do not want to give them up. I guess I will be waiting for the A1 II, although I am quite happy with what I have, today.
The main feature I long for is a global-shutter for expanded strobe synch speeds, but I'll probably have noticeably more grey hair before I get that.
...
May happen when the global chip shortage eases after a few years - I hope.