p.48 #1 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
raminolta wrote:
And maybe it is not. I am stunned some people think managements of big companies know what they are doing and always make the right decisions based on actual marketing data out there while it has been noted time after time that these people are just human beings like the rest of us and they make mistakes, sometimes very big mistakes.
And what stuns me even more is some members here know more about Sony's market than Sony. They feel their little world rules and the rest of the world's needs and wants don't count. Tell me how you feel Asia influences Sony's decision making.
p.48 #3 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
MikeEvangelist wrote:
I updated the image to add reference lines. The thickness is quite different between the two.
The A7C really raises more questions than it answers. There's only more fragmentation and confusion; and certainly no revolution.
It really makes you wonder what the A7IV is going to be like. Will that have the updated menu system and a flippy screen?
p.48 #4 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Clearly there is a very big market there for chunkier (than even the A7r4) cameras !
chez wrote:
And what stuns me even more is some members here know more about Sony's market than Sony. They feel their little world rules and the rest of the world's needs and wants don't count. Tell me how you feel Asia influences Sony's decision making.
p.48 #5 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
zz wrote:
The A7C really raises more questions than it answers. There's only more fragmentation and confusion; and certainly no revolution.
It really makes you wonder what the A7IV is going to be like. Will that have the updated menu system and a flippy screen?
that's a given, no questions about, the a7 series is their flagship product, it's more important than the a9 or 7s by far, I bet they keep the pricing too, they know people are extremely price sensitive in that segment
p.48 #6 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
zz wrote:
The A7C really raises more questions than it answers. There's only more fragmentation and confusion; and certainly no revolution.
It really makes you wonder what the A7IV is going to be like. Will that have the updated menu system and a flippy screen?
It's called product diversification...you know because markets and consumers are diverse. Same reason automakers have several makes and models
A lot of you guys are not the target market. That's cool. They didn't make it for you. Move on and enjoy your existing camera.
p.48 #7 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Mystik wrote:
A lot of you here have been supporting the "vlogging" trend without realizing it.
Case in point...a7c is announced, and where do you immediately go to learn more? Sony website? Ads on TV? No...you watch videos from The Northrups, Mark Galer, Kai, etc etc etc. Then you repost them here for us to see. It wasn't an accident that they are releasing videos 2 minutes after the announcement lol.
Companies have realized that its cheaper and they get more penetration by giving influencers stuff for free (or give early access to stuff) than to purchase TV ad spots, or to pay for clicks on web ads. Influencers in turn get more views and clicks, and are able to better monetize their channels.
It's interesting to see when a bunch of the people on my IG start simultaneously posting about the same make-up line lol. You know what's up....Show more →
It's nothing new.
In the old days you did it by sending new products to magazines for review.
15-20 years ago that became review websites
Now it's youtubers/influencers
Nothing's changed beyond the fact that you can get into this market without any gatekeepers beyond finding people to watch your content. Magazines had a lot of gatekeepers (publishers, printers, distribution). Websites had a few (still had to pay for webhosting), Youtube/video has almost none, you need a phone, an idea and internet access to get started.
p.48 #9 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
mawz wrote:
It's nothing new.
In the old days you did it by sending new products to magazines for review.
15-20 years ago that became review websites
Now it's youtubers/influencers
Nothing's changed beyond the fact that you can get into this market without any gatekeepers beyond finding people to watch your content. Magazines had a lot of gatekeepers (publishers, printers, distribution). Websites had a few (still had to pay for webhosting), Youtube/video has almost none, you need a phone, an idea and internet access to get started.
yes its nothing new. But now content can be produced at a grassroots level, and distributed at a broad level via youtube, IG, etc. No need for production crews or media outlet to formally distribute through...just a person with a camera and a marketable personality. That's where the whole "vlogger" trend is rising.
p.48 #10 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
chez wrote:
Maybe because it is? Do you have other data indicating the size of the vlogging market?
Nope! Just my eyes. I'm back and forth between Boston and NY all the time (fairly decent size cities). I have never in my life seen someone "vlogging". But I have seen thousands of people taking pictures. Small sample size I know I'm sure you will tell me you see people vlogging all the time
p.48 #11 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Mystik wrote:
It's called product diversification...you know because markets and consumers are diverse. Same reason automakers have several makes and models
A lot of you guys are not the target market. That's cool. They didn't make it for you. Move on and enjoy your existing camera.
Not true! When a camera company puts out a camera the forums don't like, it's usually followed by dropping every other model the company sells and the company presses a giant button on a wifi satellite that disables all existing cameras and automatically charges all credit cards for the new model. If you don't accept and shoot with the new model, people dressed like Satan will come by your house and ridicule your ancestors.
p.48 #12 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
chez wrote:
And what stuns me even more is some members here know more about Sony's market than Sony. They feel their little world rules and the rest of the world's needs and wants don't count. Tell me how you feel Asia influences Sony's decision making.
I have noticed your derogatory and diminishing tone aimed at me. Obviously, you have run out of logic on the topic and resort to stupid insults. Whether this product will be successful or not is not within neither your or my range of vision nor, the Sony's marketing team can be certain about how the market will respond. There are many marketing factors at stake here which Sony cannot predict. If you really have difficulty understanding this, you are at fault not me. Anyway, I never claimed I rule the world and I never said the needs and wants of the rest of the world don't count. You obviously have difficulty comprehending my simple statements here. Maybe you need to go back to school and learn some basic logic.
p.48 #13 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
I'm someone who has wanted an A7 put into the body of a NEX-5R or A6000 for many years. An EVF *or* tilt screen was a high priority for me.
Seeing this camera released is bittersweet - in some ways, it's what I've been wanting for years but it's also so clearly made for a different market. I've no interest in vlogging or video. This body would have some advantages for me over the A7/A7R2. Even though it's not much smaller than my A7R2 and bigger than my A7 in some ways, it could fit in my pocket with a small lens, sideways.
I really don't like working with a screen like the A7C/GH5. There are times it'd be better than a fixed screen for sure, but it's really not ideal. That's a strike against it.
The controls seem unnecessarily constrained considering the size of the camera. No front dial, no two custom buttons on top.
I haven't checked out the situation with the EVF yet, but the original A7's EVF worked for me.
The price is a bit high, for me. But I'm cheap, never buy new at release. I might if it hit all the right notes, though.
I'm going to pass on this, stick with my X-E3. Over the last few months, I've built out a system with the 18, 23, 35, and 60. Maybe pick up a used body in 12-18 months and move on from the A7R2 then.
I haven't caught up with the thread yet, hoping I can find the time - but I'm a bit underwhelmed, but looking forward to what folks from FM think when they get them into their hands.
p.48 #14 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
nhsonyshooter wrote:
Nope! Just my eyes. I'm back and forth between Boston and NY all the time (fairly decent size cities). I have never in my life seen someone "vlogging". But I have seen thousands of people taking pictures. Small sample size I know I'm sure you will tell me you see people vlogging all the time
That's not surprising. Most vloggers do it from home. The majority of the market is for people doing all sorts of activities and sharing them, especially crafts, cooking or DIY (it's huge in these circles). It's big with tech/maker types as well and of course people commenting on all sorts of things.
The ones out in the city or country vlogging are a tiny minority and using action cams for a lot of their outdoor stuff anyways.
That said, most of these people are shooting solo with minimal kit. A camera like the A7c is ideal for Vlog usage, both at home and when out. None of the limitations of the A7c come up for this sort of usage, since you're not using the EVF and don't care about the mechanical shutter and can't write to the second card slot anyways.
p.48 #15 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Jman13 wrote:
This may be true...but I'd rather have them put a 2.8" screen and make it 2mm taller and put a 0.7x finder in than what they chose to do, but maybe that's just me. And frankly, from the looks of it, they could have kept the screen and simply increased the height 2mm to fit the a6600 finder in there - which would also allow for a few extra buttons or maybe a joystick, and would still be notably shorter than the A7III - it's barely an increase in height from what they have now.
Sure - some tradeoff had to be made one way or the other given the physical constraints - and whichever compromise is made, some group will be unhappy. There are already those in this thread who are saying that the height reduction compared to A7III is not substantial enough - so if Sony had increased the height to fit a larger EVF, people would complain even more. If instead they made the screen 16:9 like A6xxxx to make room, there will be others who will jump and say that this a toy camera for smartphone shooters or that such a small lcd on a $1800 FF camera is unacceptable. If they made the camera wider then again people will complain that the camera is not small enough. At the end, out of all possible compromises this is the particular compromise that Sony chose. I don't think there was any way to keep everyone happy here.
p.48 #16 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
nhsonyshooter wrote:
Nope! Just my eyes. I'm back and forth between Boston and NY all the time (fairly decent size cities). I have never in my life seen someone "vlogging". But I have seen thousands of people taking pictures. Small sample size I know I'm sure you will tell me you see people vlogging all the time
You kidding? You must not get out enough. You need to go on the Brooklyn Bridge, Times Sq, Brooklyn Bridge Park, Hudson River Park, Central Park....too many places. Also for food bloggers NYC is huge, that's where the size, IBIS and full frame sensor matters a lot.
p.48 #17 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
How much better the new real time tracking AF is on this camera compared to A7III? Coming from a DSLR world, I think A7III eye AF is like magic; I get so many more in focus shots of my toddler. I am mainly talking about stills photography.
p.48 #18 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
People also need to not be so binary in their thinking. Just because this is being marketed to vloggers, doesn't mean its made specifically for vloggers and vloggers only.
The reality is that yes the market for stills cameras is larger, but its saturated even within Sony's current product line, and its a declining market. So if the goal going forward is to find opportunities to grow, you need to market the product to new subsets of customers. Vloggers is a largely untapped market for Sony. But its a great camera for others too....Vloggers certainly don't care for 10fps lol. Some of us just want a smaller FF camera...a7 series have progressively gotten larger to improve ergonomics, but the expense of the original appeal of being compact.
I just find it odd that people who don't care for a compact camera seem so legitimately offended that this camera exists. I mean, I really don't care for video, but I understand why the a7sIII makes sense. It's sort of like someone who drives a Toyota Sequoia getting upset because the trunk in the Supra is too small
p.48 #19 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
raminolta wrote:
I have noticed your derogatory and diminishing tone aimed at me. Obviously, you have run out of logic on the topic and resort to stupid insults. Whether this product will be successful or not is not within neither your or my range of vision nor, the Sony's marketing team can be certain about how the market responds to it. There are many marketing factors at stake here which Sony cannot predict. If you really have difficulty understanding this, your 'little brain' has fallen short not my 'little world'. Anyway, I never claimed I rule the world and I never said the needs and wants of the rest of the world don't count. You obviously have difficulty comprehending my simple statements here. Maybe you need to go back to school and learn some basic logic.
p.48 #20 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
arduluth wrote:
..
I haven't checked out the situation with the EVF yet, but the original A7's EVF worked for me....
I was really digging this new Sony for using adapted lenses. But the EVF resolution is way behind the competition now, including much less than other Sony offerings. Even my Fuji XP3 has a higher rez evf, but is not a FF camera.
While it may not be a problem for others, these lower rez EVFs give me headaches and I find harder to focus.
I have no issue with this camera being 24mp. Fine for my usage.
zz wrote:
I'm sure you will tell me you see people vlogging all the time