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Archive 2020 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6

  
 
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p.5 #1 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Fred Miranda wrote:
It looks like you don't need a lens equipped with IS to get the 8-stop compensation. It really depends on the lens used:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1653784/2#15277679

I agree that 8-stop IBIS is a very compelling feature. My A7R IV has only 16% more resolution (linear) and offers 5.5 stops of IBIS. The new Canon bodies offers almost 3 extra stops of compensation. How did they do that?

If you shoot video, the new Canon R5 pretty much embarrassed current Sony bodies. But we have to wait for the new A7S III as it could match Canon's specs (except for 8K). So far we
...Show more

I think that with all of the improvements in this camera it shows that they are out of the woods in the sensor technology area. It's been a long time too.



Jul 09, 2020 at 08:00 PM
tzhang4284
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p.5 #2 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6




6:10 - seems like they might've solved the EVF blackout problem or at least live view blackout...

Maybe it can replace the A9 +A7R combo...



Jul 09, 2020 at 08:17 PM
offtraildog
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p.5 #3 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


There is nothing compelling for me to switch from my R3. I don't shoot video, am comfortable with the R3 ergonomics/access to functions and with the R3, the IQ meets my needs. The R3 is a lighter weight body and there is a plethora of fantastic lens options.


Jul 09, 2020 at 08:21 PM
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p.5 #4 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Potential over heating issues?:




Jul 09, 2020 at 08:23 PM
shadow9d9
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p.5 #5 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Fred Miranda wrote:
It looks like you don't need a lens equipped with IS to get the 8-stop compensation. It really depends on the lens used:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1653784/2#15277679

I agree that 8-stop IBIS is a very compelling feature. My A7R IV has only 16% more resolution (linear) and offers 5.5 stops of IBIS. The new Canon bodies offers almost 3 extra stops of compensation. How did they do that?

If you shoot video, the new Canon R5 pretty much embarrassed current Sony bodies. But we have to wait for the new A7S III as it could match Canon's specs (except for 8K). So far we
...Show more

Ibis stops advertised never equal real stops in reality, from m43 through gfx. They are half of what is advertised at best.

And I find it weird that you think Canon releasing a camera 1 year after the a7riv and 3 years after the a9 means that sony has to "chase" canon. So all the years of being categorically ahead get reset to zero? They don't need to chase anything. They will continue their regular product cycle and surpass Canon again. This is only significant because Canon has been out of the game completely for so long. Is it a good thing to release crap and then something light years better or to continue to release quality improvements without the duds?

Keep in mind that I am not refering to video, as I will never use that. 10% more of the frame has tracking. There is bird eye autofocus and better ibis. There is also cfexpress. But the rolling shutter will be worse, the camera is bulkier, heavier, and well more expensive than the r4. There are very little in terms of lens options, on a closed system with nearly no third party support.

If people want camcorders, for now Panasonic and Canon are the place to go. For those that want stills, there really is nowhere besides Sony.

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Jul 09, 2020 at 08:26 PM
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p.5 #6 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


What is interesting is if IBIS is that good why are they not promoting it more on their website. They don't even mention 8 stops. They just say "EOS R5’s IBIS will work in combination with Optical Image Stabilization found in many Canon RF and EF lenses." Seems odd they wouldn't be touting that.

https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/explore/product-showcases/cameras-and-lenses/eos-r5



Jul 09, 2020 at 08:27 PM
dakel
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p.5 #7 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Looks like the battery life is pretty ordinary. See screenshot from dpreview youtube video







Jul 09, 2020 at 08:31 PM
jamato8
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p.5 #8 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


I still have all my Canon glass, well also the bodies. lol May look seriously into the R5 but would keep shooting my A7RIII. I actually prefer the body style of the Sony, more industrial looking and to be honest, it has taken a real beating, both the A7RII and the III.


Jul 09, 2020 at 08:37 PM
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p.5 #9 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


patotts wrote:
I think many of us eagerly awaited the release of the Canon R5 (some perhaps even the R6) and I am curious what are your initial reactions to the specs/details?

The jury is still out on performance and IQ but, as a Sony user, what do you like or dislike with the new Canon release? Anyone thinking of giving it a try?


I would never go back as I love my Sony system, but for video work the new Canon sounds great. It offers 422 Canon Raw in the camera. 8K is irrelevant to me though. They also mention a HDR video mode which sounds very interesting. I look forward to learning more about it in that regard and see how it compares with the new Sony A7S3. At one time Canon set the bar with video in their still cameras, maybe they are doing it again?




Jul 09, 2020 at 08:44 PM
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p.5 #10 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


It's going to be interesting how Sony responds with A7SIII given how early the general spec of R5 came out, which is exciting because Sony has led the market for so long that even with A9II, they went with a simple update rather than a complete new product.

With the rumors that A7SIII is employing a new type of cooling system, it's going to be hard to imagine what Sony is up to. I originally thought Sony would make a very good 4k MLC out of A7SIII... but with the R5 spec, and the fact that Sony didn't bother to come up with anything new for so long (they forgo to update A7S with the A7III/A9/A7RIII body type) and they have become extremely good at keep things under wrap with their upcoming products.

The recent leak, or more like an semi-official announcement came from an interview to their product VP. The S is shifting from "S"ensitivity to "S"upreme. Something tells me Sony is saving the best for last, now that they finally have a worthy competitor. There was no need for Sony to give out all the glory of A7SIII in a VP interview. And it wouldn't be very "Supreme" if it can't even compete with R5.



Jul 09, 2020 at 08:47 PM
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p.5 #11 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


By chasing, I mean it’s been a long time since Canon challenges Sony in features and specs. Video’s specs are the most exciting, but they also improved IBIS and fused a high MP body to a high FPS body. Basically a high resolution sports camera that shoots pro video.

shadow9d9 wrote:
Ibis stops advertised never equal real stops in reality, from m43 through gfx. They are half of what is advertised at best.

And I find it weird that you think Canon releasing a camera 1 year after the a7riv and 3 years after the a9 means that sony has to "chase" canon. So all the years of being categorically ahead get reset to zero? They don't need to chase anything. They will continue their regular product cycle and surpass Canon again. This is only significant because Canon has been out of the game completely for so long. Is it a good
...Show more



Jul 09, 2020 at 08:49 PM
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p.5 #12 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


I think most photographer welcome high end competition and innovation in photography so I assume we all feel really good about this release. On the still photo side, there is nothing there in the Canon R5 release that would justify switching system, unless is a personal preference for Canon's color science or handling/UI.

I bought an R on the December sale and used it alongside my Sony system, mainly to try out the RF 50/1.2 so I have some experience with the R system for a number of months (sold it for more than I paid, I cannot really complain).

A couple of sobering observations regarding Canon R-strategy:

- The bodies are rather big and thick for being mirrorless. Some prefer this, others don't. Everytime I picked up my A7R3 after having used the Canon R I was pleasantly surprised how compact the Sony is. Combine the Canon the bodies with Canon's very beefy RF glass, the size and weight advantage of mirrorless is almost all gone for Canon users.

- Closed lens mount: The RF lenses that Canon have released so far are almost exclusively top-shelf glass, but they are big, heavy and expensive. And far from a complete line-up. The fact that it is a closed lens-mount is a major flaw in my book. Sigma, Tamron, Voigtlander, etc all make very compelling glass at this point, and Canon is limiting choice and competition.

- Canon is definitely charging a premium for being first out with 8K video, as well as for their RF glass. Owning a couple of R5 bodies and a good set of lenses is certainly an expensive proposition.

On the upside or TBD:

- Image quality: I fully expect color science, noise levels, dynamic range, etc to be competitive, on par with competition.

- AF speed and accuracy: more testing needs to be done with production bodies but from what I can tell, both speed and accuracy seem very impressive

- Operations: as much as many of us complain on Sony's menu system, the fact it once you have dialed in the menus, shortcuts, saved settings, and custom buttons - the operation of my Sonys are very efficient. I still hate the fact that Canon's on/off button is on the "wrong" side of the camera vs Sony and Nikon. I would need to get used to Canon's UI, school wheels and joysticks again, but I think that is no biggie. It is a tool like any other camera and most of us can adjust quickly.


As Fred points out - the Canon is a very compelling do-it-all camera, even if you have to pay a $500 premium for that (right now at least). I think that are still a lot of Canon faithful out there and this body will do very well among well-healed enthusiasts and pros (having said that, many photographers are struggling at this point and will continue to do so for the reminder of the year as bookings for events, wedding, sports, etc are way down).






Jul 09, 2020 at 08:50 PM
shadow9d9
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p.5 #13 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Fred Miranda wrote:
By chasing, I mean it’s been a long time since Canon challenges Sony in features and specs. Video’s specs are the most exciting, but they also improved IBIS and fused a high MP body to a high FPS body. Basically a high resolution sports camera that shoots pro video.



Indeed.



Jul 09, 2020 at 09:12 PM
Justin Stone
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p.5 #14 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Canon cripple hammer!

benjimouse wrote:
Potential over heating issues?:





Jul 09, 2020 at 09:15 PM
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p.5 #15 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Fred Miranda wrote:
It looks like you don't need a lens equipped with IS to get the 8-stop compensation. It really depends on the lens used:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1653784/2#15277679

I agree that 8-stop IBIS is a very compelling feature. My A7R IV has only 16% more resolution (linear) and offers 5.5 stops of IBIS. The new Canon bodies offers almost 3 extra stops of compensation. How did they do that?

If you shoot video, the new Canon R5 pretty much embarrassed current Sony bodies. But we have to wait for the new A7S III as it could match Canon's specs (except for 8K). So far we
...Show more

Thank you for the link and the good information on the lenses and IS.

Being able to hand-hold a 50/1.2 or 85/1.2 for a three or four second exposure is a very compelling proposition for me--it really fits the way I like to photograph people and situations (e.g., family, travel, street, cityscapes, night scenes, some types of landscapes). Think wandering around Venice at night. Or dusk. Or available light generally.

In my personal case, the video doesn't matter so much since I would only use it for shooting my new grandchild. But the IS has always been a key issue for me because of my shooting style and the images I like to make.

The autofocus capability of the R5 is also very appealing for my style of shooting.

Canon originally unseated Nikon from its preeminence back in 1987 with the EF mount and a really superior autofocus system. Their new IS and autofocus may this time round help them to challenge Sony. The model designation "5" is also a significant one for Canon--it suggests that this is a very serious and innovative model in their view, but it also indicates that there is more to come in the not too distant future--an R1.

But Sony is no slouch in developing technology into an accessible high-functioning camera. Let's see what their next round brings. Quad-Bayer, anyone?



Jul 09, 2020 at 09:30 PM
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p.5 #16 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Forget the cameras. I'm more jealous of the collapsable super-teles. If they were f/8 instead of f/11, I'd have order an R5.


Jul 09, 2020 at 09:38 PM
shadow9d9
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p.5 #17 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


chiron wrote:
Thank you for the link and the good information on the lenses and IS.

Being able to hand-hold a 50/1.2 or 85/1.2 for a three or four second exposure is a very compelling proposition for me--it really fits the way I like to photograph people and situations (e.g., family, travel, street, cityscapes, night scenes, some types of landscapes). Think wandering around Venice at night. Or dusk. Or available light generally.

In my personal case, the video doesn't matter so much since I would only use it for shooting my new grandchild. But the IS has always been a key issue for me
...Show more

No one is holding for 3 or 4 seconds. Even with a 6.5 stop IBIS with a G9 and Panasonic lens, at 60 mm, it didn't work reliably under 1/8 second. They are reporting unicorn successes as common. If it fails seven out of eight times, is not reliable. I'm in my thirties with excellent coordination.



Jul 09, 2020 at 09:42 PM
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p.5 #18 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Eh, I was able to fairly regularly get half second exposures on my Olympus bodies, and one second wasn't unusual with wide angles.


Jul 09, 2020 at 09:49 PM
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p.5 #19 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


Fred Miranda wrote:
By chasing, I mean it’s been a long time since Canon challenges Sony in features and specs. Video’s specs are the most exciting, but they also improved IBIS and fused a high MP body to a high FPS body. Basically a high resolution sports camera that shoots pro video.



How is 10FPS a sports camera? The 20FPS electronic shutter will be pretty useless for sports due to slow readout.




Jul 09, 2020 at 09:53 PM
Jman13
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p.5 #20 · Sony-shooters thoughts on the Canon R5/R6


I love how somehow in the past 10 years 10fps just became far too slow.

The 1D series from Canon was THE sports camera for years and years, and topped out at 10fps and was 8fps for many iterations. Many Olympics and major sporting events were shot with those cameras, with award winning photos created. Is 20fps a nice advantage? Sure. But 10fps is plenty to shoot sports with.

lightskyland wrote:
How is 10FPS a sports camera? The 20FPS electronic shutter will be pretty useless for sports due to slow readout.





Jul 09, 2020 at 09:58 PM
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