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Archive 2019Leica SL 2 announced
p.4 #1Leica SL 2 announced
rscheffler wrote:
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
Nov 10, 2019 at 10:37 PM
p.4 #2Leica SL 2 announced
flash wrote:
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
Hi, Gordan, I decided preorder it as well, though not sure when I can get my hand on one. This is one of few times I feel Leica was more reasonable on asking price. In recent Leica interview, Stefan Daniel of Leica claimed this is strategic price to attract more customers from nonLeica people, I actually kind of agree.
There is never a time you can build a Leica SL system this cheap. I don't like Leica zoom size before but I like sigma 45mm, I like 70-200f4 Panaleica, and I think I might like sigma 14-24 and Pana16-35. Given I have M and S glass, the out of pocket is not outrageous to have a nice L setup. and I don't need fancy AF.
rscheffler wrote
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
Hi, Gordan, I decided preorder it as well, though not sure when I can get my hand on one. This is one of few times I feel Leica was more reasonable on asking price. In recent Leica interview, Stefan Daniel of Leica claimed this is strategic price to attract more customers from nonLeica people, I actually kind of agree.
There is never a time you can build a Leica SL system this cheap. I don't like Leica zoom size before but I like sigma 45mm, I like 70-200f4 Panaleica, and I think I might like sigma 14-24 and Pana16-35. Given I have M and S glass, the out of pocket is not outrageous to have a nice L setup. and I don't need fancy AF.
Nov 11, 2019 at 12:49 AM
p.4 #3Leica SL 2 announced
The back buttons thing drives me nuts... Stefan says in the interview (not his exact words but in essence) that there are cameras with 27 or more buttons and that they went with a simple approach. But frankly that's a crock, think about it like this... Before there were 4 buttons on the back each had a short and long press function, very quick one handed operation and intuitive if you used your camera enough to remember what's what. This SL2 has 3 buttons (on the back) but one of those three buttons opens up a on screen menu that has guess what a bunch of buttons.. So how is that any better than a Sony A whatever?
I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!
I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!
Nov 11, 2019 at 01:58 AM
p.4 #4Leica SL 2 announced
adamdewilde wrote:
The back buttons thing drives me nuts... Stefan says in the interview (not his exact words but in essence) that there are cameras with 27 or more buttons and that they went with a simple approach. But frankly that's a crock, think about it like this... Before there were 4 buttons on the back each had a short and long press function, very quick one handed operation and intuitive if you used your camera enough to remember what's what. This SL2 has 3 buttons (on the back) but one of those three buttons opens up a on screen menu that...Show more →
I personally think the screen menu is a great solution for both tripod (stills) and gimbal (video) work. There's need to fiddle with dials on the top plate (ie Fuji) as everything is in the back.
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.
The back buttons thing drives me nuts... Stefan says in the interview (not his exact words but in essence) that there are cameras with 27 or more buttons and that they went with a simple approach. But frankly that's a crock, think about it like this... Before there were 4 buttons on the back each had a short and long press function, very quick one handed operation and intuitive if you used your camera enough to remember what's what. This SL2 has 3 buttons (on the back) but one of those three buttons opens up a on screen menu that...Show more →
I personally think the screen menu is a great solution for both tripod (stills) and gimbal (video) work. There's need to fiddle with dials on the top plate (ie Fuji) as everything is in the back.
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.
Nov 11, 2019 at 02:56 AM
p.4 #5Leica SL 2 announced
Zony_user wrote:
I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!I personally think the screen menu is a great solution for both tripod (stills) and gimbal (video) work. There's need to fiddle with dials on the top plate (ie Fuji) as everything is in the back.
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.
I don't have to reserve judgement I've used pretty much everything out there.. The Sigma FP is pretty reliant on the back screen quick menu too but I don't really bother with most settings since the sigma in my mind will be used in a different way. Also the X1D has the same type of menu screen thing.. The SL I do expect to use in a way that would have me accessing certain features on the fly and thus I will have to interact with the menu rather than having the brilliant 4 button system.
With that said, it's only my opinion and I'm sure that others will find the screen to be useful/favourable. It's just that I don't and I find that it's less simple now with "more buttons" event though they tout that it's less buttons.
adamdewilde wrote
The back buttons thing drives me nuts... Stefan says in the interview (not his exact words but in essence) that there are cameras with 27 or more buttons and that they went with a simple approach. But frankly that's a crock, think about it like this... Before there were 4 buttons on the back each had a short and long press function, very quick one handed operation and intuitive if you used your camera enough to remember what's what. This SL2 has 3 buttons (on the back) but one of those three buttons opens up a on screen menu that has guess what a bunch of buttons.. So how is that any better than a Sony A whatever?I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.
I don't have to reserve judgement I've used pretty much everything out there.. The Sigma FP is pretty reliant on the back screen quick menu too but I don't really bother with most settings since the sigma in my mind will be used in a different way. Also the X1D has the same type of menu screen thing.. The SL I do expect to use in a way that would have me accessing certain features on the fly and thus I will have to interact with the menu rather than having the brilliant 4 button system.
With that said, it's only my opinion and I'm sure that others will find the screen to be useful/favourable. It's just that I don't and I find that it's less simple now with "more buttons" event though they tout that it's less buttons.
Nov 11, 2019 at 03:32 AM
p.4 #6Leica SL 2 announced
adamdewilde wrote:
I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!I personally think the screen menu is a great solution for both tripod (stills) and gimbal (video) work. There's need to fiddle with dials on the top plate (ie Fuji) as everything is in the back.
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.I don't have to reserve judgement I've used pretty much everything out there.. The Sigma FP is pretty reliant on the back screen quick menu too but I don't really bother with most settings since the sigma in my mind will be used in a different way. Also the X1D has the same type of menu screen thing.. The SL I do expect to use in a way that would have me accessing certain features on the fly and thus I will have to interact with the menu rather than having the brilliant 4 button system.
With that said, it's only...Show more →
I agree. More annoying because they already had it right the first time. Sure it's an OK system and better than many on the market but it's still a step backward from the SL. But that's the only major gripe I have. Removal of GPS doesn't worry me as much as I thought.
Gordon
Zony_user wrote
adamdewilde wrote
The back buttons thing drives me nuts... Stefan says in the interview (not his exact words but in essence) that there are cameras with 27 or more buttons and that they went with a simple approach. But frankly that's a crock, think about it like this... Before there were 4 buttons on the back each had a short and long press function, very quick one handed operation and intuitive if you used your camera enough to remember what's what. This SL2 has 3 buttons (on the back) but one of those three buttons opens up a on screen menu that has guess what a bunch of buttons.. So how is that any better than a Sony A whatever?I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.
With that said, it's only...Show more →
I agree. More annoying because they already had it right the first time. Sure it's an OK system and better than many on the market but it's still a step backward from the SL. But that's the only major gripe I have. Removal of GPS doesn't worry me as much as I thought.
Gordon
Nov 11, 2019 at 07:13 AM
p.4 #7Leica SL 2 announced
flash wrote:
I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!I personally think the screen menu is a great solution for both tripod (stills) and gimbal (video) work. There's need to fiddle with dials on the top plate (ie Fuji) as everything is in the back.
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.I don't have to reserve judgement I've used pretty much everything out there.. The Sigma FP is pretty reliant on the back screen quick menu too but I don't really bother with most settings since the sigma in my mind will be used in a different way. Also the X1D has the same type of menu screen thing.. The SL I do expect to use in a way that would have me accessing certain features on the fly and thus I will have to interact with the menu rather than having the brilliant 4 button system.
With that said, it's only my opinion and I'm sure that others will find the screen to be useful/favourable. It's just that I don't and I find that it's less simple now with "more buttons" event though they tout that it's less buttons.I agree. More annoying because they already had it right the first time. Sure it's an OK system and better than many on the market but it's still a step backward from the SL. But that's the only major gripe I have. Removal of GPS doesn't worry me as much as I thought.
Gordon
Yes, I actually don't think I've used GPS once. And I didn't think they removed it, I thought they just got rid of the hump? I now see that it says GPS via the photos app... Hmmm what cheap fix (still I've no interest in GPS so no worries for me).
I'm still not getting one anytime soon. Gonna sit this one out for a while enjoy the FP.
adamdewilde wrote
Zony_user wrote
adamdewilde wrote
The back buttons thing drives me nuts... Stefan says in the interview (not his exact words but in essence) that there are cameras with 27 or more buttons and that they went with a simple approach. But frankly that's a crock, think about it like this... Before there were 4 buttons on the back each had a short and long press function, very quick one handed operation and intuitive if you used your camera enough to remember what's what. This SL2 has 3 buttons (on the back) but one of those three buttons opens up a on screen menu that has guess what a bunch of buttons.. So how is that any better than a Sony A whatever?I think they did this because a lot of people who were casual SL shooters (took the camera out once a month or so) would forget how they mapped the camera. So to them it was troublesome (and they're the ones who shout the loudest over on L-forum). Or the pressure from the reviewers who have the camera all of a day and then talk about how stupid it is that the buttons aren't labeled.. Sure if you're reviewing the camera for an hour it's annoying. If you are a casual shooter you might forgot. But in actual daily use it's genius and the fastest camera layout I've used (save for an M which technically doesn't count as it doesn't have enough features to warranty buttons).
Anyway rant over!
I'm reserving judgement on the omission of the 4 buttons until I actually handle one. I think it largely depends on how accessible the front 2 buttons are.
With that said, it's only my opinion and I'm sure that others will find the screen to be useful/favourable. It's just that I don't and I find that it's less simple now with "more buttons" event though they tout that it's less buttons.
Gordon
Yes, I actually don't think I've used GPS once. And I didn't think they removed it, I thought they just got rid of the hump? I now see that it says GPS via the photos app... Hmmm what cheap fix (still I've no interest in GPS so no worries for me).
I'm still not getting one anytime soon. Gonna sit this one out for a while enjoy the FP.
Nov 11, 2019 at 10:10 AM
p.4 #8Leica SL 2 announced
flash wrote:
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
Got mine! spend half hour setup the camera, no need for trying to understand anything in menu. Great support for M and S glasses. Miles better than confusing S1 in menu setup.
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all others, though I do find 60fps give "slightly" better sharpness and clarity. I have many minor thought about its menu option improvement and hopefully get resolved in the future update but nothing major.
At least, this is first time, Leica offer state of Art in IQ department, I am waiting for high resolution mode and hopeful it remove 1s limitation of Panasonic. I personally think it make sense to stay 24M on M but leave best FF IQ to SL.
Overall, a very impressive Leica though I have to say M10 give me the same feeling compare to M240 and M9.
How I feel, it is just like compare driving a Audi/BWM and toyota/honda compare to otherwise awesome S1 and Z7 or Ax, If you know what I mean. Leica nail it this time, more than ever even Panasonic did most of hard work.
rscheffler wrote
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
Got mine! spend half hour setup the camera, no need for trying to understand anything in menu. Great support for M and S glasses. Miles better than confusing S1 in menu setup.
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all others, though I do find 60fps give "slightly" better sharpness and clarity. I have many minor thought about its menu option improvement and hopefully get resolved in the future update but nothing major.
At least, this is first time, Leica offer state of Art in IQ department, I am waiting for high resolution mode and hopeful it remove 1s limitation of Panasonic. I personally think it make sense to stay 24M on M but leave best FF IQ to SL.
Overall, a very impressive Leica though I have to say M10 give me the same feeling compare to M240 and M9.
How I feel, it is just like compare driving a Audi/BWM and toyota/honda compare to otherwise awesome S1 and Z7 or Ax, If you know what I mean. Leica nail it this time, more than ever even Panasonic did most of hard work.
Dec 06, 2019 at 01:17 PM
p.4 #9Leica SL 2 announced
zhangyue wrote:
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
GordonGot mine! spend half hour setup the camera, no need for trying to understand anything in menu. Great support for M and S glasses. Miles better than confusing S1 in menu setup.
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all...Show more →
Congratulation, Michael! After you have some time using it, I would like to know your take on the real world use of the EVF between SL2 and Z7.
I agree with you that M body should stay with 24M with the current rangefinder focusing system. I can see that with higher MP sensor, M system will struggle with focus accuracy. But SL/2 focus system is very accurate and the Leica SL lenses are the best state-of-the-art. You can really enjoy using Leica lenses at higher MP. Now you just need to get your Summicron-SL 35mm APO lens!
flash wrote
rscheffler wrote
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all...Show more →
Congratulation, Michael! After you have some time using it, I would like to know your take on the real world use of the EVF between SL2 and Z7.
I agree with you that M body should stay with 24M with the current rangefinder focusing system. I can see that with higher MP sensor, M system will struggle with focus accuracy. But SL/2 focus system is very accurate and the Leica SL lenses are the best state-of-the-art. You can really enjoy using Leica lenses at higher MP. Now you just need to get your Summicron-SL 35mm APO lens!
Dec 06, 2019 at 02:10 PM
p.4 #10Leica SL 2 announced
zhangyue wrote:
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
GordonGot mine! spend half hour setup the camera, no need for trying to understand anything in menu. Great support for M and S glasses. Miles better than confusing S1 in menu setup.
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all...Show more →
Congrats Michael. Enjoy your camera.
I got back into Sydney and a few days later got the call to pick mine up. I've had it a couple of weeks now.
I've changed my mind on the menus. I prefer the SL2. I still don't like the button layout and I like it less now than when I played with a demo one. They're small, difficult to find with my fingers and almost exclusively placed just out of easy reach. A real downgrade. I have come to appreciate how well laid out the S1R is and how perfect the button feel/size/travel is on that camera.
The new EVF doesn't wow me after the SL and S1R. It's great but the SL was a huge leap forward. This is an evolution. The joystick is still BY FAR the best on any camera. I'm learning to like the quick menu. I wish it was customisable. Shutter sound is just lovely. Really glad to have the option of no LENR and availability of 30 minute exposures before bulb. Mostly I need up to about 120 seconds so it'll be perfect not having to resort to bulb.
As expected, continuous AF is poor/average. Not something I really ever use and about the same as the S1R. Face detect is also crap compared to pretty much everything else. Would like to see that improved with firmware. Also looking forward to high res shot. Grip is improved but S1R is better. SL2 *feels* lighter than it is, to me.
The build is superb and the finish is perfect. It does have that mojo of a camera you want to use. I don't think it's a better camera than the S1R but I have a bit of an emotional spot for it. So, for me, I'm pleased with it.
I also managed to find a store with a 50 Summicron SL in stock.
Gordon
flash wrote
rscheffler wrote
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all...Show more →
Congrats Michael. Enjoy your camera.
I got back into Sydney and a few days later got the call to pick mine up. I've had it a couple of weeks now.
I've changed my mind on the menus. I prefer the SL2. I still don't like the button layout and I like it less now than when I played with a demo one. They're small, difficult to find with my fingers and almost exclusively placed just out of easy reach. A real downgrade. I have come to appreciate how well laid out the S1R is and how perfect the button feel/size/travel is on that camera.
The new EVF doesn't wow me after the SL and S1R. It's great but the SL was a huge leap forward. This is an evolution. The joystick is still BY FAR the best on any camera. I'm learning to like the quick menu. I wish it was customisable. Shutter sound is just lovely. Really glad to have the option of no LENR and availability of 30 minute exposures before bulb. Mostly I need up to about 120 seconds so it'll be perfect not having to resort to bulb.
As expected, continuous AF is poor/average. Not something I really ever use and about the same as the S1R. Face detect is also crap compared to pretty much everything else. Would like to see that improved with firmware. Also looking forward to high res shot. Grip is improved but S1R is better. SL2 *feels* lighter than it is, to me.
The build is superb and the finish is perfect. It does have that mojo of a camera you want to use. I don't think it's a better camera than the S1R but I have a bit of an emotional spot for it. So, for me, I'm pleased with it.
I also managed to find a store with a 50 Summicron SL in stock.
Gordon
Dec 06, 2019 at 04:29 PM
p.4 #11Leica SL 2 announced
Agree with most of what you say. SL2 is more sexy but S1/R is more functional.
However, for me I still feel Z is best over all camera if you consider multiple factor include size and price but SL2 just took the crown from S1 for most sexy camera with X factor.
As for EVF, I think I need more time to evaluate before conclusion, I am not sure it is better in today’s daylight shooting. I will be careful to comment before spending more time.
Yes, I wish first pg of screen menu can be reprogrammed. I wish format ratio can be mapped to button. I also agree the button is not that easy to reach. The front two was OK but it is just looks funny to me.
But 30mins without bulb is so nice. And bracket is design by human than computer like Panasonic did so that you can select how many stop to bracket. I seriously hope SL2 high res mode can be more than 1s.
I think for Leica users like me need support for M and S glasses, it is overall justified it’s prime.
flash wrote:
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
GordonGot mine! spend half hour setup the camera, no need for trying to understand anything in menu. Great support for M and S glasses. Miles better than confusing S1 in menu setup.
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all others, though I do find 60fps give "slightly" better sharpness and clarity. I have many minor thought about its menu option improvement and hopefully get resolved in the future update but nothing major.
At least, this is first time, Leica offer state of Art in IQ department, I am waiting for high resolution mode and hopeful it remove 1s limitation of Panasonic. I personally think it make sense to stay 24M on M but leave best FF IQ to SL.
Overall, a very impressive Leica though I have to say M10 give me the same feeling compare to M240 and M9.
How I feel, it is just like compare driving a Audi/BWM and toyota/honda compare to otherwise awesome S1 and Z7 or Ax, If you know what I mean. Leica nail it this time, more than ever even Panasonic did most of hard work.Congrats Michael. Enjoy your camera.
I got back into Sydney and a few days later got the call to pick mine up. I've had it a couple of weeks now.
I've changed my mind on the menus. I prefer the SL2. I still don't like the button layout and I like it less now than when I played with a demo one. They're small, difficult to find with my fingers and almost exclusively placed just out of easy reach. A real downgrade. I have come to appreciate how well laid out the S1R is and how perfect the button feel/size/travel is on...Show more →
However, for me I still feel Z is best over all camera if you consider multiple factor include size and price but SL2 just took the crown from S1 for most sexy camera with X factor.
As for EVF, I think I need more time to evaluate before conclusion, I am not sure it is better in today’s daylight shooting. I will be careful to comment before spending more time.
Yes, I wish first pg of screen menu can be reprogrammed. I wish format ratio can be mapped to button. I also agree the button is not that easy to reach. The front two was OK but it is just looks funny to me.
But 30mins without bulb is so nice. And bracket is design by human than computer like Panasonic did so that you can select how many stop to bracket. I seriously hope SL2 high res mode can be more than 1s.
I think for Leica users like me need support for M and S glasses, it is overall justified it’s prime.
flash wrote:
zhangyue wrote
flash wrote
rscheffler wrote
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all others, though I do find 60fps give "slightly" better sharpness and clarity. I have many minor thought about its menu option improvement and hopefully get resolved in the future update but nothing major.
At least, this is first time, Leica offer state of Art in IQ department, I am waiting for high resolution mode and hopeful it remove 1s limitation of Panasonic. I personally think it make sense to stay 24M on M but leave best FF IQ to SL.
Overall, a very impressive Leica though I have to say M10 give me the same feeling compare to M240 and M9.
How I feel, it is just like compare driving a Audi/BWM and toyota/honda compare to otherwise awesome S1 and Z7 or Ax, If you know what I mean. Leica nail it this time, more than ever even Panasonic did most of hard work.
I got back into Sydney and a few days later got the call to pick mine up. I've had it a couple of weeks now.
I've changed my mind on the menus. I prefer the SL2. I still don't like the button layout and I like it less now than when I played with a demo one. They're small, difficult to find with my fingers and almost exclusively placed just out of easy reach. A real downgrade. I have come to appreciate how well laid out the S1R is and how perfect the button feel/size/travel is on...Show more →
Dec 06, 2019 at 05:19 PM
p.4 #12Leica SL 2 announced
No SL summicron for me, especially new US price 
I will update with you about how I feel it once I spend more time with it.
ocean2059 wrote:
Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).He is...😃
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
GordonGot mine! spend half hour setup the camera, no need for trying to understand anything in menu. Great support for M and S glasses. Miles better than confusing S1 in menu setup.
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all others, though I do find 60fps give "slightly" better sharpness and clarity. I have many minor thought about its menu option improvement and hopefully get resolved in the future update but nothing major.
At least, this is first time, Leica offer state of Art in IQ department, I am waiting for high resolution mode and hopeful it remove 1s limitation of Panasonic. I personally think it make sense to stay 24M on M but leave best FF IQ to SL.
Overall, a very impressive Leica though I have to say M10 give me the same feeling compare to M240 and M9.
How I feel, it is just like compare driving a Audi/BWM and toyota/honda compare to otherwise awesome S1 and Z7 or Ax, If you know what I mean. Leica nail it this time, more than ever even Panasonic did most of hard work.Congratulation, Michael! After you have some time using it, I would like to know your take on the real world use of the EVF between SL2 and Z7.
I agree with you that M body should stay with 24M with the current rangefinder focusing system. I can see that with higher MP sensor, M system will struggle with focus accuracy. But SL/2 focus system is very accurate and the Leica SL lenses are the best state-of-the-art. You can really enjoy using Leica lenses at higher MP. Now you just need to get your Summicron-SL 35mm APO lens!
I will update with you about how I feel it once I spend more time with it.
ocean2059 wrote:
zhangyue wrote
flash wrote
rscheffler wrote
SL vs. SL2 comparison specs listed at Red Dot Forum.Gordon will be happy: LENR can be disabled (apparently).
Have had a play with one.
Don't like:
Change to rear buttons.
New menu layout.
Play button is on the left and you can't assign playback to optional buttons.
Do like:
User settable lenr.
Lighter than S1R.
Prefer VF layout to S1R.
Same fab joystick.
Doing some sharpness comparisons but nothing to report yet. Cover glass is confirmed as thinner than S1R and SL with new microlenses for M lens users. Has M lens profiles. Handles well but I preferred SL.
I have two S1Rs so I don't need this. Have ordered one based on playing with this one. Can't say it's better though.
Gordon
It didn't offer the same real marked button as Panasonic and I don't really like 6 unmarked button, no way I can remember that unless this is my only camera used for next few months, years. This is the same complain I had with Sony's c1/2/3/4. However, the body is so much cleaner and joyful to hold and use.
EVF is somehow just nicer IMHO compare to all others, though I do find 60fps give "slightly" better sharpness and clarity. I have many minor thought about its menu option improvement and hopefully get resolved in the future update but nothing major.
At least, this is first time, Leica offer state of Art in IQ department, I am waiting for high resolution mode and hopeful it remove 1s limitation of Panasonic. I personally think it make sense to stay 24M on M but leave best FF IQ to SL.
Overall, a very impressive Leica though I have to say M10 give me the same feeling compare to M240 and M9.
How I feel, it is just like compare driving a Audi/BWM and toyota/honda compare to otherwise awesome S1 and Z7 or Ax, If you know what I mean. Leica nail it this time, more than ever even Panasonic did most of hard work.
I agree with you that M body should stay with 24M with the current rangefinder focusing system. I can see that with higher MP sensor, M system will struggle with focus accuracy. But SL/2 focus system is very accurate and the Leica SL lenses are the best state-of-the-art. You can really enjoy using Leica lenses at higher MP. Now you just need to get your Summicron-SL 35mm APO lens!
Dec 06, 2019 at 05:23 PM
p.4 #13Leica SL 2 announced
Congrats Michael! Time for an M lens wide angle shootout - M10 vs. SL2 edge smearing
Dec 06, 2019 at 08:35 PM
p.4 #14Leica SL 2 announced
GiuseppeL wrote:
This video appears to present the S1/SL, Panasonic/Leica relationship as a certainty?The presenter also writes as fact in the comments to his video that Leica is phasing out M lenses and in another comment moving out of M lenses.
Dr Kaufmann said in a recent interview/video: "Leica M will be around ten years from now. No IBIS no AF, but its small and uses every lens since 1954. "It's an iconic product for people who know how to shoot pictures."Leica are unlikely to stop producing the M, cameras and/or lenses. I heard rumors that a new monochrome (derived from M10) is in the making and also a M11. The Monochrome maybe with 41 MP (derived from the S3 sensor). and the M11 maybe even with 47 MP. But it's only rumors.
But what I wonder is if the sensor in the SL2 is really the same as in the S1R and Q2. The resolution is the same, but SL2 gets 20 fps out of it, while the others only offer 9 and 10 fps. So it is probably a close...Show more →
I like the fanboy enthusiasm!!
I too am waiting for the M10-Monocrhom. I'd prefer spending money on that TBH since I'm quite happy thus far with the Sigma FP.
LBJ2 wrote
LBJ2 wrote
This video appears to present the S1/SL, Panasonic/Leica relationship as a certainty?
Dr Kaufmann said in a recent interview/video: "Leica M will be around ten years from now. No IBIS no AF, but its small and uses every lens since 1954. "It's an iconic product for people who know how to shoot pictures."
But what I wonder is if the sensor in the SL2 is really the same as in the S1R and Q2. The resolution is the same, but SL2 gets 20 fps out of it, while the others only offer 9 and 10 fps. So it is probably a close...Show more →
I like the fanboy enthusiasm!!
I too am waiting for the M10-Monocrhom. I'd prefer spending money on that TBH since I'm quite happy thus far with the Sigma FP.
Dec 06, 2019 at 09:53 PM
p.4 #15Leica SL 2 announced
rscheffler wrote:
Congrats Michael! Time for an M lens wide angle shootout - M10 vs. SL2 edge smearing
Ron, I tested it with 21SEM and 28Cron and 50APO. I think the performance is very good, as good as I can expect for non-native platform. It is definitely better than Z and S1 I have to say. I can't do apple to apple comparison given SL2 is 47M and M10 is 24M at pixel level.(So was S1's 24M) I feel for 21 and 28, pixel level performance, SL2 is roughly one stop behind m10, consider the high density, this is not bad at all. The key is much less astigmatism behavior and FC compare to what you will see from thick sensor stack. 28mm Cron also show less focus shift compare to S1, there is still some but close to M10 performance here. Sony is the worst offender, S1 and Z are about the same but not free of them. (Z might be slightly better if I try hard to distinguish them, but it is also 45M and I have OEM adapter for L mount might give slightly better performance on S1, it hard to get perfect adapter for Z). I can post crop later, but you just have to trust my assessment.
Given there are so many variables to play here, I still strongly suggest anyone to do test themselves to determine if it is good enough. For me? more than enough
I think this will be a perfect platform for my personal use for next few years. A very nice bridge product to connect all Leica product. I roughly took a look of the files, I like what I see, even slightly prefer to S1. (which I think it is good for portrait) I don't have S1R, don't know how they compare and obviously I haven't shoot SL2 much, but under night artificial light, the file seems robust for skin tone, even with different white balance temperature, the skin tone still looks pleasing and true to life. A very good sign based on my experience. Even I do slightly prefer Z7's landscape file to S1. I don't know how Z7 and SL2 compare. My Z7 went to Nikon to fix its skin and EVF cover problem.
There is still something I don't like about it, such as focus peaking have to be used with display option that show histogram and all other craps. You can't just turn it on or off.
I stand behind my original comment that I like SL2's EVF better than others. The difference between it and S1 is really small and I might just like the JPG feed of SL2 engine. Somehow, I still feel Z7's EVF give me more analog feel, less impressive than both SL2 and S1 but more OVF like, I don't know it is from sharper optics of EVF or Nikon has some special trick in signal processing but SL2's EVF feel more brighter. and peaking implementation is just better than Nikon. I think it is inherent from Panasonic.
This is almost a perfect camera for my use. The control is very similar between SL, S and M. That is also the reason I adapt myself quickly with S1 because it share so many features with S such as focus WO for AF glasses.
The more I use it the more I like it. Recommended for Leica users.
Congrats Michael! Time for an M lens wide angle shootout - M10 vs. SL2 edge smearing
Ron, I tested it with 21SEM and 28Cron and 50APO. I think the performance is very good, as good as I can expect for non-native platform. It is definitely better than Z and S1 I have to say. I can't do apple to apple comparison given SL2 is 47M and M10 is 24M at pixel level.(So was S1's 24M) I feel for 21 and 28, pixel level performance, SL2 is roughly one stop behind m10, consider the high density, this is not bad at all. The key is much less astigmatism behavior and FC compare to what you will see from thick sensor stack. 28mm Cron also show less focus shift compare to S1, there is still some but close to M10 performance here. Sony is the worst offender, S1 and Z are about the same but not free of them. (Z might be slightly better if I try hard to distinguish them, but it is also 45M and I have OEM adapter for L mount might give slightly better performance on S1, it hard to get perfect adapter for Z). I can post crop later, but you just have to trust my assessment.
Given there are so many variables to play here, I still strongly suggest anyone to do test themselves to determine if it is good enough. For me? more than enough
I think this will be a perfect platform for my personal use for next few years. A very nice bridge product to connect all Leica product. I roughly took a look of the files, I like what I see, even slightly prefer to S1. (which I think it is good for portrait) I don't have S1R, don't know how they compare and obviously I haven't shoot SL2 much, but under night artificial light, the file seems robust for skin tone, even with different white balance temperature, the skin tone still looks pleasing and true to life. A very good sign based on my experience. Even I do slightly prefer Z7's landscape file to S1. I don't know how Z7 and SL2 compare. My Z7 went to Nikon to fix its skin and EVF cover problem.
There is still something I don't like about it, such as focus peaking have to be used with display option that show histogram and all other craps. You can't just turn it on or off.
I stand behind my original comment that I like SL2's EVF better than others. The difference between it and S1 is really small and I might just like the JPG feed of SL2 engine. Somehow, I still feel Z7's EVF give me more analog feel, less impressive than both SL2 and S1 but more OVF like, I don't know it is from sharper optics of EVF or Nikon has some special trick in signal processing but SL2's EVF feel more brighter. and peaking implementation is just better than Nikon. I think it is inherent from Panasonic.
This is almost a perfect camera for my use. The control is very similar between SL, S and M. That is also the reason I adapt myself quickly with S1 because it share so many features with S such as focus WO for AF glasses.
The more I use it the more I like it. Recommended for Leica users.
Dec 07, 2019 at 01:12 AM
p.4 #16Leica SL 2 announced
Thanks Michael. I'll take your word for it - not sure crops are necessary. Way back when I compared the a7R against the M9 or M240, I downscaled the Sony to match the Leica's pixel dimensions. Doing so with the SL2's files will narrow the difference, if as you say, it's already the best mirrorless with M lenses other than an M camera.
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or less a marketing feature, which raised the question whether Leica was doing the same with the SL2. The specs gave hope that this time M lens performance was better optimized. Your preliminary results support this, which is reassuring.
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or less a marketing feature, which raised the question whether Leica was doing the same with the SL2. The specs gave hope that this time M lens performance was better optimized. Your preliminary results support this, which is reassuring.
Dec 07, 2019 at 06:25 PM
p.4 #17Leica SL 2 announced
Ron, yes, SL2 definitely behave almost like native camera by inspect those files, I am experienced enough to know what to look for or where is not right, SL2 is impressive in that regards.
For M lens users, it especially handy and a almost perfect pair for M. For example, that back wheel automatically become zoom function (one turn give perfect magnification, turn twice is about 100%, a little too much for most application. ) because you don’t need aperture control. And joystick can be used to instant zoom 100% during shooting. It is just a very smooth experience. Peaking will work under wide range of condition if you know how to use it with more experience. M glass focus throw is always nice IMHO, I don’t like long throw of certain Zeiss ZF before.
However, for other manual lens support, it is not that smooth ride to me. With dumb adapter, You can select option from R or M list, which is quite extensive. However, EXIF won’t document the lens info even you manually select it. And back wheel don’t have this zoom function any more. You can only use joystick to zoom direct to 100%, quite cumbersome.
Then with S glass, I lost zoom function if I want keep back button focus function. Just like S camera, SL only let you do back button focus in M mode, so if I use S glass, back wheel control aperture, front wheel control EC( you can’t change it), joystick as AFon, I have to map another button for zoom if I want Which is not a ideal choice for me. I might need save a special user profile for S glass use, or just don’t use magnification at all given I prefer keeping thing simple.
Compare to Panasonic, Leica limited your choice of program button. Good thing is you get way simpler menu and choice, bad thing is you might find yourself stuck somewhere that you can’t personalize your camera as you want.
For both Panasonic S1 and SL, I never use any fancy AF features. That is why they both meet my requirement perfectly. For M and S glass support, I won’t expect anything even come close to what SL2 offer me. However, if I want pick a system for pro work or do a event shooting, using Nikon Z and either prime or zoom with eye AF, either EVF or flip LCD shooting seems just make more sense. ( I would assume Sony Or Canon will be the same. )
as you can see, just like Panasonic, SL will only please certain group of photographers IMHO which i am happen to be one of them. The shooting experience is very good and similar to drive a luxury German car, a comparison I keep being it up, not always reliable or functional but feels great and fan.
rscheffler wrote:
Thanks Michael. I'll take your word for it - not sure crops are necessary. Way back when I compared the a7R against the M9 or M240, I downscaled the Sony to match the Leica's pixel dimensions. Doing so with the SL2's files will narrow the difference, if as you say, it's already the best mirrorless with M lenses other than an M camera.
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or...Show more →
For M lens users, it especially handy and a almost perfect pair for M. For example, that back wheel automatically become zoom function (one turn give perfect magnification, turn twice is about 100%, a little too much for most application. ) because you don’t need aperture control. And joystick can be used to instant zoom 100% during shooting. It is just a very smooth experience. Peaking will work under wide range of condition if you know how to use it with more experience. M glass focus throw is always nice IMHO, I don’t like long throw of certain Zeiss ZF before.
However, for other manual lens support, it is not that smooth ride to me. With dumb adapter, You can select option from R or M list, which is quite extensive. However, EXIF won’t document the lens info even you manually select it. And back wheel don’t have this zoom function any more. You can only use joystick to zoom direct to 100%, quite cumbersome.
Then with S glass, I lost zoom function if I want keep back button focus function. Just like S camera, SL only let you do back button focus in M mode, so if I use S glass, back wheel control aperture, front wheel control EC( you can’t change it), joystick as AFon, I have to map another button for zoom if I want Which is not a ideal choice for me. I might need save a special user profile for S glass use, or just don’t use magnification at all given I prefer keeping thing simple.
Compare to Panasonic, Leica limited your choice of program button. Good thing is you get way simpler menu and choice, bad thing is you might find yourself stuck somewhere that you can’t personalize your camera as you want.
For both Panasonic S1 and SL, I never use any fancy AF features. That is why they both meet my requirement perfectly. For M and S glass support, I won’t expect anything even come close to what SL2 offer me. However, if I want pick a system for pro work or do a event shooting, using Nikon Z and either prime or zoom with eye AF, either EVF or flip LCD shooting seems just make more sense. ( I would assume Sony Or Canon will be the same. )
as you can see, just like Panasonic, SL will only please certain group of photographers IMHO which i am happen to be one of them. The shooting experience is very good and similar to drive a luxury German car, a comparison I keep being it up, not always reliable or functional but feels great and fan.
rscheffler wrote:
Thanks Michael. I'll take your word for it - not sure crops are necessary. Way back when I compared the a7R against the M9 or M240, I downscaled the Sony to match the Leica's pixel dimensions. Doing so with the SL2's files will narrow the difference, if as you say, it's already the best mirrorless with M lenses other than an M camera.
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or...Show more →
Dec 08, 2019 at 01:09 AM
p.4 #18Leica SL 2 announced
rscheffler wrote:
Thanks Michael. I'll take your word for it - not sure crops are necessary. Way back when I compared the a7R against the M9 or M240, I downscaled the Sony to match the Leica's pixel dimensions. Doing so with the SL2's files will narrow the difference, if as you say, it's already the best mirrorless with M lenses other than an M camera.
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or...Show more →
GiuseppeL wrote:
Yes, both cameras (SL and SL2) officially support 170 older Leica lenses. And the performance of the M lenses is excellent on the SL and SL2. I cannot see why you have doubts about that. (Your disappointment looks completely unfounded to me.)
What I stated above was based on first-hand experience testing the SL a few years ago with a number of my M lenses, side by side with my M240. SL images with certain lenses, such as the 21 SEM and 28 Cron v1, showed edge smearing not present in M240 images with these lenses. While the SL was generally better than any of the Sony FF mirrorless I tried with M lenses, it was somewhat of a disappointment for me that it was noticeably not as good as the M with some lenses. Of course, there were many other M lenses with which the SL performed well, but it wasn't as consistently good across the board as a native M camera.
Thanks Michael. I'll take your word for it - not sure crops are necessary. Way back when I compared the a7R against the M9 or M240, I downscaled the Sony to match the Leica's pixel dimensions. Doing so with the SL2's files will narrow the difference, if as you say, it's already the best mirrorless with M lenses other than an M camera.
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or...Show more →
GiuseppeL wrote:
Yes, both cameras (SL and SL2) officially support 170 older Leica lenses. And the performance of the M lenses is excellent on the SL and SL2. I cannot see why you have doubts about that. (Your disappointment looks completely unfounded to me.)
What I stated above was based on first-hand experience testing the SL a few years ago with a number of my M lenses, side by side with my M240. SL images with certain lenses, such as the 21 SEM and 28 Cron v1, showed edge smearing not present in M240 images with these lenses. While the SL was generally better than any of the Sony FF mirrorless I tried with M lenses, it was somewhat of a disappointment for me that it was noticeably not as good as the M with some lenses. Of course, there were many other M lenses with which the SL performed well, but it wasn't as consistently good across the board as a native M camera.
Dec 08, 2019 at 10:09 PM
p.4 #19Leica SL 2 announced
rscheffler wrote:
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or less a marketing feature, which raised the question whether Leica was doing the same with the SL2. The specs gave hope that this time M lens performance was better optimized. Your preliminary results support this, which is reassuring.What I stated above was based on first-hand experience testing the SL a few years ago with a number of my M lenses, side by side with my M240. SL images with certain lenses, such as the 21 SEM and 28 Cron v1, showed edge smearing not present in M240 images with these lenses. While the SL was generally better than any of the Sony FF mirrorless I tried with M lenses, it was somewhat of a disappointment for me that it was noticeably not as good as the M with some lenses. Of course, there were many other M...Show more →
This is true.
rscheffler wrote
Thanks Michael. I'll take your word for it - not sure crops are necessary. Way back when I compared the a7R against the M9 or M240, I downscaled the Sony to match the Leica's pixel dimensions. Doing so with the SL2's files will narrow the difference, if as you say, it's already the best mirrorless with M lenses other than an M camera.Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or less a marketing feature, which raised the question whether Leica was doing the same with the SL2. The specs gave hope that this time M lens performance was better optimized. Your preliminary results support this, which is reassuring.
GiuseppeL wrote
Yes, both cameras (SL and SL2) officially support 170 older Leica lenses. And the performance of the M lenses is excellent on the SL and SL2. I cannot see why you have doubts about that. (Your disappointment looks completely unfounded to me.)This is true.
Dec 09, 2019 at 06:49 AM
p.4 #20Leica SL 2 announced
Adam, did you get one for trying? I actually like SL this time. I don’t know how it compare to S1R but color is nice.
adamdewilde wrote:
Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or less a marketing feature, which raised the question whether Leica was doing the same with the SL2. The specs gave hope that this time M lens performance was better optimized. Your preliminary results support this, which is reassuring.What I stated above was based on first-hand experience testing the SL a few years ago with a number of my M lenses, side by side with my M240. SL images with certain lenses, such as the 21 SEM and 28 Cron v1, showed edge smearing not present in M240 images with these lenses. While the SL was generally better than any of the Sony FF mirrorless I tried with M lenses, it was somewhat of a disappointment for me that it was noticeably not as good as the M with some lenses. Of course, there were many other M lenses with which the SL performed well, but it wasn't as consistently good across the board as a native M camera.This is true.
adamdewilde wrote:
rscheffler wrote
rscheffler wrote
Thanks Michael. I'll take your word for it - not sure crops are necessary. Way back when I compared the a7R against the M9 or M240, I downscaled the Sony to match the Leica's pixel dimensions. Doing so with the SL2's files will narrow the difference, if as you say, it's already the best mirrorless with M lenses other than an M camera.Back when the SL was released, IIRC, Leica marketed it as M lens compatible. I suppose it literally was, if not technically ideal. I think the disappointment for some of us was that the compatibility was more or less a marketing feature, which raised the question whether Leica was doing the same with the SL2. The specs gave hope that this time M lens performance was better optimized. Your preliminary results support this, which is reassuring.
GiuseppeL wrote
Yes, both cameras (SL and SL2) officially support 170 older Leica lenses. And the performance of the M lenses is excellent on the SL and SL2. I cannot see why you have doubts about that. (Your disappointment looks completely unfounded to me.)Dec 09, 2019 at 10:30 AM