p.10 #1 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Thanks, Juha!
Mar 03, 2018 at 07:46 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.10 #2 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Phillip Reeve wrote:
That's the point I was trying to make: We don't have good evidence that these lenses were in fact developed "directly by Zeiss". As you I think they likely are but I wouldn't treat that as a fact.
Well, we do have good evidence the Loxia 35 and 50 were developed by Zeiss. They were pretty clearly derived directly from the very similar ZM lenses, which in turn show pretty clear lineage to the Contax G lenses. I also think the other three lenses show fairly clear evidence of Zeiss fingerprints. The Loxia 85 bears a strong resemblance to the ZM 85 f/2 and the Loxia 21 and now 25 bear at least some resemblance to the Zeiss ZM 21 f/2.8 and the Zeiss C/Y 21 f/2.8.
p.10 #3 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Juha Kannisto wrote:
I went to CP+ today and managed to use the demo version of this lens for some minutes at Cosina area. I shot some random stuff at their lens test area where they had some plants and garden tools and a mailbox. No real Macro shots and I kept the aperture at f2.5 and ISO640 to keep the shutter speed at reasonable level.
I think the IQ will be very similar to that of CV 65/2 as could be expected. It looks very sharp as expected and I like the bokeh based on initial sampling. Handling felt similar to 65/2 as well. In the end I compared the 2 lenses for weight (my CV 65/2 in one hand and demo 110/2.5 in the other) and asked Cosina people about the weight as well. They did say that 110/2.5 is heavier (without mentioning specific weight) and I could feel quite much difference in weights, so I think 110/2.5 will actually be at least 800g or so.
The lens name for the demo lens seems to be misspelled in EXIF as APO-LANTHER, but this time they don't seem to have a special CP+ designation in EXIF data like last year....Show more →
Thx for the samples. Not in love with the cat eyes shape of bokeh highlights wide open but no surprise given it only has a 58mm filter thread.
p.10 #4 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Thus, they are just rehashing the old stuff and charging a premium for the blue tags....
Steve Spencer wrote:
Well, we do have good evidence the Loxia 35 and 50 were developed by Zeiss. They were pretty clearly derived directly from the very similar ZM lenses, which in turn show pretty clear lineage to the Contax G lenses. I also think the other three lenses show fairly clear evidence of Zeiss fingerprints. The Loxia 85 bears a strong resemblance to the ZM 85 f/2 and the Loxia 21 and now 25 bear at least some resemblance to the Zeiss ZM 21 f/2.8 and the Zeiss C/Y 21 f/2.8.
Mar 03, 2018 at 08:08 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.10 #5 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
realVivek wrote:
Thus, they are just rehashing the old stuff and charging a premium for the blue tags....
In a way yes, at least with the Loxia 35 and 50. Those lenses appear to be just the ZM lenses tweaked for the cover glass on the Sony sensor. The Loxia 21 and now 25 are clearly new designs that take advantage of the shorter flange focal distance of the Sony cameras, but in my view they show the Zeiss heritage with similarities to both the ZM 21 f/2.8 and C/Y (and therefore Milvus) 21 f/2.8. The Loxia 85 f/2.4 is somewhere in between. It has a similarity to the ZM 85 f/2, but is different enough I would definitely call it a new design, but less of a change than the 21.
p.10 #6 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
This is Cosina's new lens presentation/spec sheet for CP+ in English. I have only seen the Japanese version in their web site, and they didn't have any handouts of the English version, so I took a few photos of it (with my 65/2 after testing 110/2.5).
p.10 #7 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
It is my understanding that the ZM85/2 is a failure due to focus shifts when changing the aperture. The brilliant people made this for a blind RF camera.
The FE 85/2.4 is not that bad. Steve Spencer wrote:
In a way yes, at least with the Loxia 35 and 50. Those lenses appear to be just the ZM lenses tweaked for the cover glass on the Sony sensor. The Loxia 21 and now 25 are clearly new designs that take advantage of the shorter flange focal distance of the Sony cameras, but in my view they show the Zeiss heritage with similarities to both the ZM 21 f/2.8 and C/Y (and therefore Milvus) 21 f/2.8. The Loxia 85 f/2.4 is somewhere in between. It has a similarity to the ZM 85 f/2, but is different enough I would definitely call it a new design, but less of a change than the 21....Show more →
p.10 #8 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Does anyone else feel that Zeiss has been playing it a bit too safe?
There are quite a few lenses that they have produced which I think would do well in a native mount. You have to wonder if this is by choice or if they have agreements in place with Sony that prevent them from competing.
p.10 #9 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
realVivek wrote:
Thus, they are just rehashing the old stuff and charging a premium for the blue tags....
I don't think physics has changes recently. They do have electrical connectivity.
I have the two 35 ZM lenses and the Loxia version is better in the periphery. It still requires stopping down and they are all Biogons. Other than size, the 21mm Loxia is superior to my ZM. So the rehash does bring incremental improvement. For the 35mm it can be argued that a more modern design should have been used. When I purchased the 35mm ZMs, I understood that specifications, down to the coatings, were Zeiss. The process was somewhat like how the US Air Force builds a new plane.
Mar 03, 2018 at 08:31 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.10 #10 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
realVivek wrote:
It is my understanding that the ZM85/2 is a failure due to focus shifts when changing the aperture. The brilliant people made this for a blind RF camera.
The FE 85/2.4 is not that bad.
Well not everyone thinks the ZM 85 f/2 was a failure, but Zeiss did decide to discontinue it. Focus shift is a lot bigger issue on rangefinder cameras that mirrorless cameras, but I haven't noticed it on my Loxia 85 f/2.4.
p.10 #11 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
The fact that the info sheets on the 110, 21, and 50 say that there are demo, exhibit, and demo availability respectively probably hint that the 110 will be the first to be released between the 110 and 21. I was hoping it would be the other way around.
That 21/3.5 could be my new hiking 21mm if it's great.
Nothing wrong with my 21 Lox, except that I rarely use it at f/2.8 and it's not that small or light and I ain't getting any younger . . .
p.10 #12 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Since CV didn't reproduce the 125/2.5 in a native E mount, I wonder what their next longer lens will be for E mount.
Currently in E mount they have:
10/5.6
12/5.6
15/4.5
21/3.5
40/1.2
65/2 APO
110/2.5 APO
so something in the 180mm range would be great to have, even if it was just a re-packaged 180/4 APO, though it could use a slight sharpness tweak at infinity.
I wonder if their relationship with Zeiss is affecting the focal lengths they can put out and the 125/2.5 was too close to an E mount 135/2 which should be coming out sometime soon I would suspect. That and a Sony 135/1.8 and 135/1.8 Sigma - lots of competition in the 135mm range soon.
p.10 #13 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
+ 10/5.6 + 12/5.6 (one of my favorites)
and for any speculation: I first want to see how the 21 and 110 performs before I think of others. Of course it's nice to have options. But at least my 40 has a lot of asymetrical vignetting and colorshifts to the corners. nothing I can fix but it reminds me that it is a character lens which is not nearly as perfect as the loxia 21. Therefore I'm really sceptical here if the 21/3.5 can conquer in terms of a landscape lens. Then on the other hand the 65 performs great but I don't get in touch with it (and I don't know why). So the 110 need to proof it's quality and also character first. Beside I already have a great macro (Sonys 90/2.8 G) in my stable.
p.10 #14 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
jhinkey wrote:
Since CV didn't reproduce the 125/2.5 in a native E mount, I wonder what their next longer lens will be for E mount.
Currently in E mount they have:
15/4.5
21/3.5
40/1.2
65/2 APO
110/2.5 APO
so something in the 180mm range would be great to have, even if it was just a re-packaged 180/4 APO, though it could use a slight sharpness tweak at infinity.
I wonder if their relationship with Zeiss is affecting the focal lengths they can put out and the 125/2.5 was too close to an E mount 135/2 which should be coming out sometime soon I would suspect. That and a Sony 135/1.8 and 135/1.8 Sigma - lots of competition in the 135mm range soon. ...Show more →
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sebbe wrote:
+ 10/5.6 + 12/5.6 (one of my favorites)
and for any speculation: I first want to see how the 21 and 110 performs before I think of others. Of course it's nice to have options. But at least my 40 has a lot of asymetrical vignetting and colorshifts to the corners. nothing I can fix but it reminds me that it is a character lens which is not nearly as perfect as the loxia 21. Therefore I'm really sceptical here if the 21/3.5 can conquer in terms of a landscape lens. Then on the other hand the 65 performs great but I don't get in touch with it (and I don't know why). So the 110 need to proof it's quality and also character first. Beside I already have a great macro (Sonys 90/2.8 G) in my stable....Show more →
I guess that a 28mm and a 180mm could fit in nicely as the next Voigtländer FE lenses, in 2019 maybe.
p.10 #16 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Surely CV knows that many would like a remake of the 180/4. This was also true of the 125/2.5, and they're delivering a slightly different version. I've thought for some time that a new 180 will be coming (one reason why I sold my old one sooner rather than later: the value will drop like a rock if a new one comes out); we could indeed get another 180, or perhaps they'll give us something different. Maybe a 165-170 or other oddity, or maybe even a 200. Has CV ever made anything longer than 180? Offhand I don't know of any.
p.10 #17 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
I am surprised that nobody asks the question: how is it that CV "suddenly" turns out one world-class design after the other? That used not to be the case, so what happened?
p.10 #19 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
I a not a fan of MF only lenses having sold off my four Loxias and Voigt CV15 because while I use MF a lot there are too many times I need AF
For Macro I am almost always using MF so if the quality is on par or hopefully even better than my 90 macro I will get it. The idea of 165mm macro in crop mode on the a7rIII or a6500 is also very appealing.
p.10 #20 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
philber wrote:
I am surprised that nobody asks the question: how is it that CV "suddenly" turns out one world-class design after the other? That used not to be the case, so what happened?
They had some nice designs in the past, such as the 125 apo macro.
It seems that lens design is easier nowadays with better software, as we saw some very good designs like the Venus 15/2 from previously unknown companies.
Even Sigma who used to focus on entry-level lenses now has world-class ART lenses.
And as you said, maybe some other things happened. Maybe they decided to put more money on R&D or maybe they hired a genius.
