p.11 #2 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
From the images I have seen, LoCA was a bit high for its price tag.
Steve Spencer wrote:
Well not everyone thinks the ZM 85 f/2 was a failure, but Zeiss did decide to discontinue it. Focus shift is a lot bigger issue on rangefinder cameras that mirrorless cameras, but I haven't noticed it on my Loxia 85 f/2.4.
p.11 #3 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
philber wrote:
That would be discounting CV's affinity for unusual focal lengths.. 40, 65, 110.... how about a 220 or a 240mm?
Maybe a Batis 200/2.8 or Lox 180/4 is coming out and a direct conversion of a 180/4 APO to E mount is too close to that. That's the only reason I can think of for the "odd" 40mm, 65mm, 110mm, etc. focal lengths
p.11 #4 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
I think the reduction from 125 to 110 could have came from the shorter flange distance. In keeping with the old formula the lens would have been the size of the 125 with an adapter. That would be too large for many.
p.11 #5 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Now if I could just get those sample pictures to download to my phone!
Mar 03, 2018 at 02:18 PM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.11 #6 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Fred Miranda wrote:
From the images I have seen, LoCA was a bit high for its price tag.
I don't disagree Fred, but Edward Kara made some very good use of this lens as we saw with quite a few samples on FM when he had it. I think it was very much in need of the APD glass that we see in the Loxia 85. Not everyone will agree with that either, but to me APD glass is a huge bonus that give many modern lenses that step forward in IQ.
p.11 #7 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Has Cosina posted the 110’s optical design somewhere?
pdmphoto wrote:
I think the reduction from 125 to 110 could have came from the shorter flange distance. In keeping with the old formula the lens would have been the size of the 125 with an adapter. That would be too large for many.
Mar 03, 2018 at 02:19 PM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.11 #8 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
philber wrote:
I am surprised that nobody asks the question: how is it that CV "suddenly" turns out one world-class design after the other? That used not to be the case, so what happened?
Phillipe, I think that is an interesting question. I do see at least a couple of excellent CV lenses from a few years back that suggest they can do very well. In addition to the CV 125 f/2.5 APO, there is also the CV 35 f/1.7. Both those lenses are excellent and at least moderately fast. They also have some very good slower lenses in the CV 90 f/3.5 APO and the 180 f/4 APO, although I have to say that my copy of the CV 90 f/3.5 APO was one of my most disappointing lenses. It had pretty annoying purple fringing that was pretty easy to provoke, which was not what I expect from a lens labelled as APO.
I do find the question you pose quite intriguing, however. Could Zeiss be helping Cosina more than in the past and in effect be creating an excellent series of lenses for the E mount that doesn't compete with their Milvus and Otus line or even their Loxia line because of the focal lengths and speeds chosen? If they are doing so, then they would presumably be doing so for a cut of the profits, and I am surprised these lenses don't come at a higher price. If this is the arrangement then I think it doesn't apply to all the Voigtlander lenses. The 12mm, 15mm, the 35 f/1.4, and probably the new 21mm all seem pretty closely derived from old M mount lenses mostly tweaked for the thicker cover glass of the Sony cameras. The 40 f/1.2, 65 f/2, and the new 110 f/2.5 seem to be the one's with a lot higher quality. Of these only the 65 f/2 seems totally new. The 40 f/1.2 seems to have at least some roots in the M mount 35 f/1.2, and the 100 f/2.5 clearly is based on the 125 f/2.5. So, I remain unconvinced that Cosina is getting all that much help from anyone and that includes Zeiss, and if they are that help was probably primarily for the 65 f/2 and maybe a bit with the 40 f/1.2.
p.11 #10 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Steve, I do agree that CV did turnout some really good lenses over the years, although, with the exception of the 125, no world-beater IMHO. And quite a few lenses that were substantially less appealing. Matters have changed recently, again IMHO. If FM is a reasonable sample of the high-end market, CV's penetration seems to have increased quite a bit. Interestingy, when I discussed this with a senior person at Zeiss, he was totally unresponsive, as though he didn't know/care. Which I very much doubt, personally. Hence my guess that there is something afoot which they don't care to talk about.
p.11 #11 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
How is that possible while they seem to be dependent on Tamron for their Batis line?
Steve Spencer wrote:
I do find the question you pose quite intriguing, however. Could Zeiss be helping Cosina more than in the past and in effect be creating an excellent series of lenses for the E mount that doesn't compete with their Milvus and Otus line or even their Loxia line because of the focal lengths and speeds chosen?
p.11 #12 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
The older version was 650g. If the new one is 800 grams, that might be too heavy for me. Those are the same reason I hesitate to get the 65 Apo. It does does have marginally better IQ than the Loxia 50, but the added weight and size are major downers.
Mar 03, 2018 at 02:55 PM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.11 #13 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
realVivek wrote:
How is that possible while they seem to be dependent on Tamron for their Batis line?
That is a pretty weird question. I'm not sure what the Batis line and cooperation with Tamron has anything to do with the Loxia line or any of Zeiss' manual focus (MF) lenses. If Zeiss got some or even a lot of help from Tamron on the Batis line, then I would guess that is because they have not traditionally made many AF lenses and had not done so for quite some time. In contrast, Zeiss has a lot of expertise in developing MF lenses and they could share some of that expertise with Cosina. Not sure if they did, but I can see the point that Phillipe is raising and it is an interesting one. If anything the suspected collaboration of Zeiss with Tamron may demonstrate that Zeiss is quite will to cooperate with other lenses makers with each entity providing expertise in what they do best. That could suggest that Zeiss may cooperate with Cosina in making Voigtlander lenses and provide help with what they do best which is excellent MF lenses.
p.11 #15 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
I am surprised that nobody asks the question: how is it that CV "suddenly" turns out one world-class design after the other? That used not to be the case, so what happened?
Everyone now seems to be turning out a lot of world-class glass in the last couple years. Nikon, Canon, Sigma, Sony, Zeiss, CV, Olympus etc.
My bet: better ray-tracing / optical design software, more glass options for reducing optical aberrations and better manufacturing practices.
p.11 #16 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
The 110mm is 800g? I'm still hoping for ~700g.
Aside from a member’s guess, we don’t know that’s the case yet.
pdmphoto wrote:
The older version was 650g. If the new one is 800 grams, that might be too heavy for me. Those are the same reason I hesitate to get the 65 Apo. It does does have marginally better IQ than the Loxia 50, but the added weight and size are major downers.
p.11 #17 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
lightskyland wrote:
Everyone now seems to be turning out a lot of world-class glass in the last couple years. Nikon, Canon, Sigma, Sony, Zeiss, CV, Olympus etc.
My bet: better ray-tracing / optical design software, more glass options for reducing optical aberrations and better manufacturing practices.
Probably more in the area of advanced manufacturing capabilities have brought complex optical designs, which have been achievable from the software perspective for a while, into the realm of affordability.
p.11 #18 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Both design software and manufacturing can improve over time. With the increases in resolution of some of these cameras, you almost have to up your game or you won't compete.
I have a tough time seeing Zeiss helping Cosina with lens design. Just a subjective opinion.
p.11 #20 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
philber wrote:
Steve, I do agree that CV did turnout some really good lenses over the years, although, with the exception of the 125, no world-beater IMHO.
Some lenses of Cosina's Voigtlaender line are economy offerings, but others are indeed world-beaters: the 35/1.2 Nokton Aspherical in M mount, and 50/3.5 Heliar for examples. The latter was proclaimed by Popular Photography in 2001 as the sharpest 50mm ever tested, and on my to-buy list. Images show awesome color control which is remarkable for five elements.
