p.43 #1 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Always fun to check in and see the usual suspects keeping a high post to photo ratio
Nov 25, 2016 at 09:04 PM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: On
p.43 #2 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
greenaa wrote:
You do realise that an H series lens with adapter will be SIGNIFICANTLY longer than an XCD lens? What's the point of purposely creating an SL style weight and size mismatch?
ACG
Well the adapter for HC lenses will have to be 40mm or a little more, so yes it will add quite a bit of length to the HC lenses. This doesn't bother me too much. I am not looking for a tiny package as this is quite a bit bigger sensor. I will be happy with a kit about the size and weight of a DSLR, but that has the sensor with better DR, color depth, and leaf shutter lenses. As a package I will be happy with that. I will keep my Sony A7rII and Leica M lens kit when I want a small (kit and that is a very small kit) for some types of shooting, but I will be happy to have the mini MF system for other types of shooting. I think even if you go with the native lenses, this Hassy system won't compete with a small A7r II and Leica M kit. For example the X1D and the XCD 90 f/3.2 would perform a lot like the A7rII and a Leica M 75 f/2.4. The Hassy kit would weigh 1344g and the lens has a 77mm diameter and is 100mm long. The A7rII kit would weigh about 1000g and the lens would have a 55mm diameter and would be 70mm long with the adapter. That is a huge difference in size, so I don't think the Hassy kit either with native lenses or adapted lenses can really compete for size.
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p.43 #3 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
davewolfs wrote:
Always fun to check in and see the usual suspects keeping a high post to photo ratio
Well I think only one person on the forum has the camera at this point, so it isn't surprising that everyone else hasn't posted pictures. When I get mine, I promise to help reverse the ratio.
p.43 #4 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
I have shot extensively with the X1D and the body + 45mm without the lens hood feels dangerously close to in size to the Leica M240 with grip and a somewhat larger lens. The infinitely better grip on the X1D and great weight balance produces even less hand fatigue.
ACG
Steve Spencer wrote:
Well the adapter for HC lenses will have to be 40mm or a little more, so yes it will add quite a bit of length to the HC lenses. This doesn't bother me too much. I am not looking for a tiny package as this is quite a bit bigger sensor. I will be happy with a kit about the size and weight of a DSLR, but that has the sensor with better DR, color depth, and leaf shutter lenses. As a package I will be happy with that. I will keep my Sony A7rII and Leica M lens kit when I want a small (kit and that is a very small kit) for some types of shooting, but I will be happy to have the mini MF system for other types of shooting. I think even if you go with the native lenses, this Hassy system won't compete with a small A7r II and Leica M kit. For example the X1D and the XCD 90 f/3.2 would perform a lot like the A7rII and a Leica M 75 f/2.4. The Hassy kit would weigh 1344g and the lens has a 77mm diameter and is 100mm long. The A7rII kit would weigh about 1000g and the lens would have a 55mm diameter and would be 70mm long with the adapter. That is a huge difference in size, so I don't think the Hassy kit either with native lenses or adapted lenses can really compete for size....Show more →
Nov 26, 2016 at 12:21 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: On
p.43 #5 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
greenaa wrote:
I have shot extensively with the X1D and the body + 45mm without the lens hood feels dangerously close to in size to the Leica M240 with grip and a somewhat larger lens. The infinitely better grip on the X1D and great weight balance produces even less hand fatigue.
ACG
Well I hope to get mine soon (I don't think anyone on this side of the Atlantic has one yet) and I hope it seems that small, but as I said for me that isn't a priority for this camera. That is part of the reason I am getting mostly HC lenses, but if size is a primary concern for others I can see why they may want more native lenses. If I were making a comparison of the 45mm lens to a FF 35mm lens, however, I would note that the XCD 45 is about the equivalent of a 35mm f/2.8 lens. So on a M240, you are talking a lens that would function much like the Leica M 35 f/2.4, which is absolutely tiny. It is just 52mm in diameter and just 34mm long. In comparison the XCD 45 has a 77mm diameter and is 75mm long, so with a similarly performing lens I think the M240 (or the A7rII) would still be enough smaller to make a big difference to me. Of course others might feel differently.
p.43 #6 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Lee Saxon wrote:
I mean, of course you're right. Anything can fail over time. It's not the build quality of M-lenses or even the continued existence of the M-mount I was referring to. I also until recently used a C/Y 50/1.7 which shares neither of those benefits. And my beloved Leica R's have only the former.
My thing is about reliance on electronic protocols and firmware updates. Fuji has to update its existing lenses for every new body; how long do you think they'll keep that up? A purely mechanical lens is much more likely to be able to be kept functional, particularly after its native mount retires or sees its protocols changed.
You may be right about the thermal expansion aspect, I'd never heard that.
PS - Sorry to those of you who have heard me say that 50 times (it's kind of a personal pet issue)....Show more →
That is a valid concern. A concern which nobody can answer at this point. But let's just say I have faith in Hasselblad to make this new XCD mount a commercial success hence keeping the mount and lenses alive for decades
Steve Spencer wrote:
Well I hope to get mine soon (I don't think anyone on this side of the Atlantic has one yet) and I hope it seems that small, but as I said for me that isn't a priority for this camera. That is part of the reason I am getting mostly HC lenses, but if size is a primary concern for others I can see why they may want more native lenses. If I were making a comparison of the 45mm lens to a FF 35mm lens, however, I would note that the XCD 45 is about the equivalent of a 35mm f/2.8 lens. So on a M240, you are talking a lens that would function much like the Leica M 35 f/2.4, which is absolutely tiny. It is just 52mm in diameter and just 34mm long. In comparison the XCD 45 has a 77mm diameter and is 75mm long, so with a similarly performing lens I think the M240 (or the A7rII) would still be enough smaller to make a big difference to me. Of course others might feel differently....Show more →
We all know Leica is the king of miniaturizing lenses when it comes to M lenses. It helps to design a small lens when autofocus motor is not required in the design. And M lenses tend to have not so impressive minimum focus distance. Leica SL has showed us so much for small lenses as the sizes so far have been massive. So I am just wondering how small these Hasselblad XCD lenses could be if Leica designed them without autofocus.
p.43 #7 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Sweet. It looks to be a killer camera.
Steve Spencer wrote:
Well I think only one person on the forum has the camera at this point, so it isn't surprising that everyone else hasn't posted pictures. When I get mine, I promise to help reverse the ratio.
p.43 #9 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
At this point Hasselblad and Fuji may hit the market at the same time. I wonder if this extra time is tuning firmware, waiting for sensor supply, or having production/testing problems. One is good, one is neutral, one is bad.
p.43 #10 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
wayne seltzer wrote:
Delayed again according to Lloyd Chambers.
This is bad news indeed. I had hoped to get the camera before I leave for a trip on December 15, but right now it's looking pretty unlikely. I pre-ordered on the first day as well, the 6-month wait is getting dangerously close to my "time to cancel" limit.
p.43 #11 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Tmuussoni wrote:
We all know Leica is the king of miniaturizing lenses when it comes to M lenses. It helps to design a small lens when autofocus motor is not required in the design. And M lenses tend to have not so impressive minimum focus distance. Leica SL has showed us so much for small lenses as the sizes so far have been massive. So I am just wondering how small these Hasselblad XCD lenses could be if Leica designed them without autofocus.
The shutter assembly would still put them on the large side and would still require electronic control (unless you want to take on the additional bulk of manual controls and a cocking mechanism). And just replacing FBW with MF wouldn't save you much bulk. It also might necessitate a simplified design, impacting potential quality and/or usability. Keeping things small and light is a good goal, but it shouldn't be the only goal.
p.43 #12 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
FWIW, from Mirrorless Rumors...
"The early Hasselblad X1D preorders are now shipping out (slowly) at BHphoto. In Europe they will ship out in 10 days at Calumet.de and at WexUK. I still haven’t found any official full review to share. I would love to see an image quality comparison between the best FF cameras and the X1D to see if there is really a major difference."
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p.43 #13 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
blue265 wrote:
FWIW, from Mirrorless Rumors...
"The early Hasselblad X1D preorders are now shipping out (slowly) at BHphoto. In Europe they will ship out in 10 days at Calumet.de and at WexUK. I still haven’t found any official full review to share. I would love to see an image quality comparison between the best FF cameras and the X1D to see if there is really a major difference."
Also in the FWIW category. B & H contacted me last week asking if I was still interested in the camera. That made me hopeful I might get mine soon, but then I saw the delay on Lloyd Chamber's site so I am not at all sure I will get mine soon. I am expecting it in January, but that is just a guess.
p.43 #14 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
I know people who have had them for months as I've already mentioned.. But just a few days ago I tested one with the latest firmware and I still think it would be a mistake for Hassy to release the camera into the wild. It's at least 3 months and quite a few new hire genius software engineers away from being ready.
And that's not even talking about the video feature which totally cocks up the camera..
I think Hassy would piss a lot of people off with the camera in it's current state.
Dec 05, 2016 at 02:00 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: On
p.43 #15 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
I suspect I am missing something, but I think you may be able to use lenses with a mechanical shutter in the following way: 1) mount the lens with the mechanical shutter on the camera (I am pretty sure this is possible; 2) cock the mechanical shutter; 3) turn on bulb mode on the camera; 4) release the mechanical shutter; 5 turn off bulb mode on the camera. I think this may allow a good exposure with the mechanical shutter, but again I may be missing something.
You might wonder why I might be interested in such a setup. I think it might make an interesting macro rig. The Hassy HC 120 f/4 macro is quite a beast and I might prefer--at least some of time--using a bellows setup (like the combo actus) and a quality enlarging lens like the Schneider APO-Componon 150 f/4 or 90 f/4.5.
p.43 #16 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
I mean that's just a non-automated version of how any digital camera without an electronic shutter works, so I can't imagine there'd be any technical reason it wouldn't work. Kind of a pain though.
p.43 #17 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Lee Saxon wrote:
I mean that's just a non-automated version of how any digital camera without an electronic shutter works, so I can't imagine there'd be any technical reason it wouldn't work. Kind of a pain though.
Hi Lee,
Maybe many of todays photographers may find this a pain or inconvient, but for those of us that used Large Format cameras and Medium Format versions of these camera, they offered meterless auto nothing and we had to cock shutters and adjust the apertures by hand. But also, if this will be possible, it may still be possible (providing Hasselblad agrees to it) that the camera may be able to be mounted onto a Cambo Actus or Cambo Actus DB2 which would open up a large number of lenses not only Enlarger lenses, but also Large Format Film and Digital Large and Medium format lenses that could be used with the bellows of the camera as well as extension tubes. This would expand dramatically the capabilities of the camera for close-up, architecture, landscape, and studio work.
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p.43 #18 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
naturephoto1 wrote:
Hi Lee,
Maybe many of todays photographers may find this a pain or inconvient, but for those of us that used Large Format cameras and Medium Format versions of these camera, they offered meterless auto nothing and we had to cock shutters and adjust the apertures by hand. But also, if this will be possible, it may still be possible (providing Hasselblad will agrees to it) that the camera may be able to be mounted onto a Cambo Actus or Cambo Actus DB2 which would open up a large number of lenses not only Enlarger lenses, but also Large Format Film and Digital Large and Medium format lenses that could be used with the bellows of the camera as well as extension tubes. This would expand dramatically the capabilities of the camera for close-up, architecture, landscape, and studio work.
Now the drawback of this set up is a huge number of adapters and a quite long registration distance before you start, but it would work with a lens like the Schneider APO-Componon 150 f/4 (or your Rodentstock APO Rodagon 105 f/4), even at infinity. Shorter focal lengths like 75/80/90 would work but primarily for close focus. I suspect, however, that Cambo could just make a Hasselblad H camera mount (instead of the digital back mount) to attach to the bellows and then they could use the adapter the Hasselblad makes to make their system work. I think they could do that without Hasselblad providing support. What they may need Hasselblad's support for is a camera mount adapter to attach the bellows directly the X1D. That Hasselblad may not provide.
Dec 06, 2016 at 08:55 PM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: On
p.43 #19 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Lee Saxon wrote:
I mean that's just a non-automated version of how any digital camera without an electronic shutter works, so I can't imagine there'd be any technical reason it wouldn't work. Kind of a pain though.
Yes, Lee, kind of a pain, but it would allow you to adapt a number of lenses to the Hassy X1D. People are thinking only the H lenses are possible. If some large format lenses are possible, then for a few folks like me that is good news.
p.43 #20 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Steve Spencer wrote:
Yes, Lee, kind of a pain, but it would allow you to adapt a number of lenses to the Hassy X1D. People are thinking only the H lenses are possible. If some large format lenses are possible, then for a few folks like me that is good news.
Hi Steve,
After giving more thought to this, even if we could get a shuttered lens to fire and set the f stop and shutter speed, I am not sure how we woul be able to get the camera to record the image unless Hasselblad somehow set the camera to do this. There would be no problem with a camera with a focal plane in that I would think that either the camera shutter or the lens shutter would set the time. But a camera lacking a shutter and recording only the shutter adjustment from the lens with a digital camera that only works with its own leaf shutter lenses this may be a problem. This is and would not be the case with a film based camera.
