p.22 #1 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Traditionally, leaf shutter lenses are used by those who need high sync speeds for outdoor use with flash/ strobe (some fashion, catalog, wedding) and maybe some sports stuff. It's certainly not essential for all professionals and many professionals even in these niches shoot without using leaf shutter lenses. Today's leaf shutters are mighty impressive though given the top speeds compared to the 1/500sec. we were once limited to (not compared to focal plane shutters but still). The biggest issue with Hasselblad and leaf shutter lenses was once being limited to this top speed of 1/500sec. It is interesting to note though that the very first Hasselblads (as the basic modular system was conceived by Victor Hasselblad) was designed around the focal plane shutter (1600F, 1000F). Later of course, Hasselblad would offer focal plane options as well (2000FC, 205, 203, 201, etc.).
The open/ closed system issue has specific significance for Hasselblad in particular given the outcry there was when they artificially prevented other digital backs from working with the H3D. The late Michael Reichmann had a lot to say about it back then. Maybe they think about a decade is enough time for folks to have forgotten about it...
If we remember back to the film days, Hasselblad had both thec C/CM and the F system of cameras. The F system with the Focal Plane shutter allowed the usage of both the F lenses (which lacked the leaf shutters) as well as the C/CM lenses which had the leaf shutters. So, with the new camera. they are also leaving out the possiblility of using the F lenses as did the C and CM cameras though in the case of the new camera it may be possible to have an adapter that will come by some maker that will allow the C/CM lenses to be used on this camera.
p.22 #2 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
naturephoto1 wrote:
Hi Fred and Tariq,
If we remember back to the film days, Hasselblad had both thec C/CM and the F system of cameras. The F system with the Focal Plane shutter allowed the usage of both the F lenses (which lacked the leaf shutters) as well as the C/CM lenses which had the leaf shutters. So, with the new camera. they are also leaving out the possiblility of using the F lenses as did the C and CM cameras though in the case of the new camera it may be possible to have an adapter that will come by some maker that will allow the C/CM lenses to be used on this camera.
p.22 #3 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
naturephoto1 wrote:
Hi Fred and Tariq,
If we remember back to the film days, Hasselblad had both thec C/CM and the F system of cameras. The F system with the Focal Plane shutter allowed the usage of both the F lenses (which lacked the leaf shutters) as well as the C/CM lenses which had the leaf shutters. So, with the new camera. they are also leaving out the possiblility of using the F lenses as did the C and CM cameras though in the case of the new camera it may be possible to have an adapter that will come by some maker that will allow the C/CM lenses to be used on this camera.
p.22 #4 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Maybe with this new camera Mamiya may consider a camera that could finally utilize the excellent Mamiya 7 lenses. We will have to wait to see if Mamiya and Leaf decide to take up the challenge.
p.22 #5 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Hasselblad made a choice to keep the system small and light by not having a focal plane shutter. This isn't a mass market camera so I'm pretty sure they're just trying to maximize their profits. They are a very small company. There will be other competitors. Fuji might be the one to shake up the market with their own mirrorless MF. They have the know how to do it.
Pentax is another, but I don't have a lot of faith in them. They haven't shown a lot of imagination. Instead of a mirrorless MF, they introduced the 645D. Instead of mirrorless FF, they introduce the K1. They seem to be throwing their me-too hat into the last generation's rings. Instead of some innovative mirrorless again, they announced they plan to support the tiny 100mp MF camera market. They might actually be more asleep at the wheel than Canon and Nikon.
P1 and all their subsidiaries are also small companies. I'm going to wait for Fuji and Sony before jumping in. At these price points, the money lost on switching will be very high in the event that Fuji and Sony blows our mind with their MF cameras.
p.22 #6 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Phase One owns Mamiya and Leaf So keep that in mind . Phase one, leaf and Mamiya are now 3 different product lines but under the Phase One corporate blanket. They own all rights to both Leaf and Mamiya. So it is very possible they could do exactly the same thing and I'm actually surprised Hassy beat them to the punch . This need like the X1D is no secret. MF shooters have been asking for this for a long time. Problem today is that high end niche market is fading both in users and needs. With the success of Sony Mirrorless the writing obviously was on the wall as many switched over. You can argue that till the cows come who cares the point is they are growing innovating and even if your half asleep Sony got noticed . Hassy saw this as a market they could tap , get users back into the line and have them as customers for a long time. One reason is it is closed once you capture the users heart they have to buy your gear. That's the business model
p.22 #7 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Possibly someone will decode the lens communications and make an adapter with a mechanical solenoid to trigger copal shutters, and possibly other MF manual lenses with internal shutters.
As it is, I won't be interested in it even at a used price of $2000 due to the focus by wire lenses, lack of focus aids, and the inability to adapt lenses.
Like Fred, I would want an UW lens in the 15-21mm FF equivalent range.
Sorry H, you came close to capturing my heart, but dropped the ball at the last moment.
p.22 #8 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
sflxn wrote:
Pentax is another, but I don't have a lot of faith in them. They haven't shown a lot of imagination. Instead of a mirrorless MF, they introduced the 645D. Instead of mirrorless FF, they introduce the K1. They seem to be throwing their me-too hat into the last generation's rings. Instead of some innovative mirrorless again, they announced they plan to support the tiny 100mp MF camera market. They might actually be more asleep at the wheel than Canon and Nikon.
Not to discredit the other companies at all, but I think you are being a bit harsh on Pentax. Aside from not coming out with a mirrorless medium format camera before any other manufacturers — ahem — they have pushed the envelope of the MF world in a number of interesting ways:
Price: At a time when other MF options cost anywhere from 2x to (way) more than 6x the cost, they introduced a fine system with a body that was under $10k. (You can currently get it for a lot less than that.)
Human Interface: Unlike the other MF manufacturers, who mostly stuck with the traditional MF interfaces, Pentax leveraged the familiar user interface of DSLRs (and, by extension, recent mirrorless cameras) to produce a camera that is much more "familiar" and friendly to photographers.
ISO: The 645z operates at very high ISOs (totally unlike prior MF systems) with outstanding image quality.
Lenses: These cameras work with both modern MF-specific lenses and with many older lenses.
I think that the idea of a mirrorless MF body certainly "has legs," but I think it is a bit premature to write off Pentax.
p.22 #9 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
sflxn wrote:
Hasselblad made a choice to keep the system small and light by not having a focal plane shutter. This isn't a mass market camera so I'm pretty sure they're just trying to maximize their profits. They are a very small company. There will be other competitors. Fuji might be the one to shake up the market with their own mirrorless MF. They have the know how to do it.
Pentax is another, but I don't have a lot of faith in them. They haven't shown a lot of imagination. Instead of a mirrorless MF, they introduced the 645D. Instead of mirrorless FF, they introduce the K1. They seem to be throwing their me-too hat into the last generation's rings. Instead of some innovative mirrorless again, they announced they plan to support the tiny 100mp MF camera market. They might actually be more asleep at the wheel than Canon and Nikon. ...Show more →
I think that's a bit unfair about Pentax. First of all consider that the company has been sold a few times over the last decade or so... and they're not big like Canon or even Nikon, so resources will be somewhat limited in comparison. When the 645D was released, mirrorless was in its infancy and it used a CCD sensor for which a mirrorless design won't work (power demands, sensor characteristics). I'd guess that specific CCD sensor was available at the right price. But superseding all that, I think is Pentax's philosophy of catering to their ever so patient, loyal followers. Maybe that wasn't as much the case during their era of APS-C cameras, but more recently with the 645 and K1, it seems as much about giving longtime supporters very capable cameras compatible with their existing equipment archives, as it is about making products with broader appeal to attract those new to Pentax. I think in time they will be more innovative in respect to mirrorless and broader enthusiast photographer expectations. But first they have to establish a renewed base of customers and make some money. In a way it's similar to Leica's situation last decade. After struggling with digital and apparently nearly going under, they launched the M9 squarely at their existing base of M users, many of whom are very conservative when it comes to bells & whistles type features (like live view, video, EVFs, etc). It was a huge success that laid a financial foundation for Leica to then attempt to become more relevant to a broader range of photographers (for which they're often derided). It wouldn't have happened if they released a camera like the SL out of the blue.
I guess Hasselblad is in a similar position. Shrinking dedicated customer base, further possibly alienated by their Lunar expedition... The X1D is a return to the roots of a sort that at least gives those invested in the H system some decent options and a sense of recommitment to them by Hasselblad. That said, for someone like me outside the Hasselblad ecosystem, of course I see it differently and likely would cherry pick the body to use with used third party lenses, had they made it capable of doing so.
p.22 #10 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
The more I look at the X1D, more I appreciate its elegant engineering design. Cost wise it is almost palatable... almost !
I know when the Leica M9/Mono and M240 were introduced in Australia, the bodies alone were 9000 AUD. This did not deter buyers as it was the first small FF when the M9 was introduced and many like myself loved the M range of lenses and continued the Mono and M240. What killed the interest for many was the lack of local service agents being able to calibrate the M240 and lenses. This meant often your gear, 12K was sent away for several months! The other fact was with the introduction of the M240 the electronic interface was already several years dated. Leica would have been much better having a third party design the body ensuring the design was ahead of its time ensuring a much longer time before obsolescence.
Early days for the X1D and I really do hope the electronics and functionality are truly up to date.
The X1D will not replace our normal FF cameras for fast day to day photography. I am really looking forward to see what the X1D and new lenses can produce image wise
p.22 #11 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Yes, I briefly owned the 2000FC/W back then as well as the amazing Zeiss 110/F2. Those cameras were not terribly known for reliability unfortunately.
I suspect/ doubt we will see compatibility with the mechanical shutter C/CM lenses...but I would love Hasselblad to prove me wrong.
They do make an CF-to-H adapter now that even has a mechanism to cock and release the shutter, so it could be relatively simple for them to allow it. I'm not convinced there will be a massive outcry among users if they don't allow it, though. I guessing most of that user group who would be serious about finding a digital platform for those lenses is probably content with their CFV-50c's on their 500-series bodies.
p.22 #12 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
freaklikeme wrote:
They do make an CF-to-H adapter now that even has a mechanism to cock and release the shutter, so it could be relatively simple for them to allow it. I'm not convinced there will be a massive outcry among users if they don't allow it, though. I guessing most of that user group who would be serious about finding a digital platform for those lenses is probably content with their CFV-50c's on their 500-series bodies.
That's cool. I wasn't aware of that $1600! adapter. I suspect at that price, Hasselblad might even offer one for the X1D as it's not so far off the cost of a lens.
Btw, did anyone notice an actual/ traditional PC Sync socket on this body? I didn't notice where it has one.
p.22 #13 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Tariq Gibran wrote:
That's cool. I wasn't aware of that $1600! adapter. I suspect at that price, Hasselblad might even offer one for the X1D as it's not so far off the cost of a lens.
Btw, did anyone notice an actual/ traditional PC Sync socket on this body? I didn't notice where it has one.
Hi Tariq,
I am not sure if the camera has a PC Sync socket. Looking at the specs on B&H Photo, they list the external flash connection as hot shoe. There is no PC Sync socket mentioned.
p.22 #14 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Tariq Gibran wrote:
For a general user/ enthusiast (non professional or specialist), I think the two lenses are a decent/ so-so start. The lack of a Macro and a wider lens though is going to be an issue for many serious users. The 3 pound H system 120 Macro is a great lens but it would be a nightmare to use on this body for instance. That's going to be the same situation with many of the H system lenses. The longer 90 lens introduced though should have been at least equivalent to an 85-90mm (FF35) imo. 70mm equivalent always seems just too short in my experience.
My feeling is that this camera will not see much professional use. It will be the digital equivalent of a Mamiya 7 and will be mostly used for landscapes and street.
p.22 #15 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
naturephoto1 wrote:
Hi Tariq,
I am not sure if the camera has a PC Sync socket. Looking at the specs on B&H Photo, they list the external flash connection as hot shoe. There is no PC Sync socket mentioned.
Rich
If the hot shoe is Nikon compatible, you can get X sync from there. Nikon even sells a PC sync socket adapter, AS-15, if memory serves, that you put in the hot shoe. There are probably others available as well.
p.22 #16 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
bjornthun wrote:
If the hot shoe is Nikon compatible, you can get X sync from there. Nikon even sells a PC sync terminal adapter, AS-15, if memory serves, that you put in the hot shoe.
I appreciate that, but the camera alone does not appear to offer one.
p.22 #17 · Official: Hasselblad X1D-50c Medium Format Mirrorless
Rich I don't see one as well. I really have no need anymore as I am completely wireless with all my Godox strobes. Both AD 360 II and my Godox Sonys which I would have to add a Nikon transmitter 50 dollars and i would have to add a Nikon portable but I could fully use my 3 AD 360II strobes. So I would have to add about 170 to my costs .
