Listen, camera forums are for discussion. Some discussions you may enjoy and some may not be your thing and that's ok. But we can't keep kissing canons rearend, we can discuss other brands. We can piss and moan about everything and anything..... That's the point. Find a way to enjoy yourself, seriously. Don't take this stuff so personally.
popinvasion wrote:
Childish is complaining in every thread that doesn't praise canon. Listen Canon is great, but every discussion can't be praise.
I never even mentioned Canon. Threads like this are pointless and inflammatory. Perhaps that's how you get off. I find it rather dull, there's been a lot of dullness and repetition round here lately, from people trying to force their opinions, which is a shame.
BTW I have just as much right to post what I want as you do, even if you don't like it.
dhphoto wrote:
I never even mentioned Canon. Threads like this are pointless and inflammatory. Perhaps that's how you get off. I find it rather dull, there been a lot of dullness and repetition round here lately, from people trying to force their opinions, which is a shame.
You read, respond, participate in a thread that you find dull? That's on you. As for inflammatory, the question posed was what do you like and dislike about a camera brand, on a camera discussion forum of all places. If that is inflammatory then you need a major reality check. What's inflammatory is how you turn every thread into a pissing match while rarely ever adding anything of substance. There have been some very thoughtful and enjoyable replies. You are disrupting what most people call a discussion. Kindly find something to do more suited to your taste, something not so dull.
dhphoto wrote:
Good idea, plus another one for the hide me list
Hide me lists are for 11 year olds. The subject of this thread is what do you like or not like about Nikon. Please contribute. If you have nothing to add but attacks, leave the thread and send me a pm. I can handle whatever gripe you may have. Pm me. We can hammer it out.
popinvasion wrote:
But all I hear from Canon users is the desire for better DR. I too like better DR, but there has to be other reasons of camera envy than just DR.
Do you talk to other photographers outside of forums? I just don't hear anything about low ISO DR when I actually talk to other photographers. The level of bitching on the forums seems out of whack with the real world.
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StillFingerz wrote:
Dislikes
- their body ergonomics SLR/DSLR and menus for DSLRs absolutely 'SUCK' and they have since 1978
- the shutter button positioning is silly and awkward
Yep, two of my biggest ones. Just before Canon came out with the 1D4 I was looking to switch to Nikon because of the whole 1D3 fiasco. I had a chance to try the D700/D3 bodies and they just didn't fit very well in your hand and the shutter button is a weird position. It never lines up in a comfortable way for your finger. Fortunately, Canon released the 1D4 and then the 1DX which I haven't seen anything out there that can match them. For me at least.
dhphoto wrote:
I never even mentioned Canon. Threads like this are pointless and inflammatory. Perhaps that's how you get off. I find it rather dull, there's been a lot of dullness and repetition round here lately, from people trying to force their opinions, which is a shame.
BTW I have just as much right to post what I want as you do, even if you don't like it.
Up until now, this thread was civil. Let's keep it this way. I think it's great to hear the strengths and weaknesses of both systems from people who have shot with both.
The thing I like about Nikon is their older film lenses (AI & AIS) can be used on their DSLRs. I wish I could use my old FD lenses on my 6D. The thing I do not like about Nikon is the negative comments I've heard over the years about their service department. I've used Canon's service dept. in NJ about 7 times and have been very satisfied.
Pros: The build quality and ergonomics suit me far better than Canon. Nikons tend to feel denser, more aggressively streamlined, and with a nicer finish. Not a big deal, but it matters when you're shooting for hours on end.
Then we have DR, megapixels, and all that jazz.
Cons: Lenses tend to come out later for Nikon than Canon, there aren't any modern lenses faster than f1.4, and usually Canon has an FPS advantage. Plus there's usually better third-party support for Canon.
I've found Nikon works best for what I shoot, though if I exclusively shot sports it might be another story. The D810 + 400mm f2.8e looks like a good sports combo though...
Things I like about Nikon (through experience or reputation):
1) Very pleasing imaging with slightly heightened color/contrast.
2) Higher MP (Sony)
3) Wide DR (Sony, or other vendor)
4) Some lenses are really great (as Jerry noted the 18-200, 14-24/2.8, 60 Macro D, 180/2.8 ED, etc.), but not as many unique/stellar lenses as Canon.
What I don't like about Nikon (from experience, up to D7000 model):
1) "Sloppy" center AF point -- not precise (probably applies to all selected AF points)
2) Flange distance makes use of Alt lenses extremely limited
3) Nomenclature and manual are terrible for locating specific information/references
4) Controls are liable to be easily jostled out of position, including changing exposure settings
4a) So-so ergonomics -- some models great (full size pro models good, smaller models cramped)
4b) Prefer Canon's rear wheel and set button to the Nikon rear wheel
5) "Turns backwards" for focusing, lens mounting
6) Programming affects exposure metering in high contrast scenes (some go 2 stops over-exposure on outdoor scenes)
6a) Prefer the Canon Evaluative algorithm to the Nikon Matrix metering -- Canon has more accurate exposures for my style
7) Slower, more expensive repairs
8 ) PC-E lenses are disappointing
9) Canon has more realistic color/contrast -- especially good for people pictures
I currently keep a D300 (and a few old Nikon film bodies) and a half dozen lenses. Mostly used to remind myself why I prefer the Canon System over the less (for me) fully realized Nikon version.
I don't rule out buying a newer Nikon body someday to update to FF with the better sensor, still keeping my full Canon set-up though!
popinvasion wrote:
Hide me lists are for 11 year olds. The subject of this thread is what do you like or not like about Nikon. Please contribute. If you have nothing to add but attacks, leave the thread and send me a pm. I can handle whatever gripe you may have. Pm me. We can hammer it out.
"Hide me" lists are for people who prefer to choose who they converse with.
What I like about Nikon is that it is an excellent brand, with a long history of producing excellent gear. It is part of the photography ecosystem that encourages competition and improvement in all brands. Though I don't shoot Nikon (and never have), I have friends and colleagues who do, and they produce beautiful work.
We can see a clear example of how having multiple brands competing is good for consumers when we look at sensor developments over the past decade or so. When Canon began to produce excellent full frame sensor cameras, first in the expense 1-series versions and then in the ground-breaking 5-series bodies, Nikon did not have anything similar for quite a while. There was a some hand-wringing among Nikon shooters, and there was — as is always the case — some degree of brand switching. This most certainly encouraged Nikon to make the great strides they have recently made with full frame sensor cameras, such that they currently not only equal Canon in this regard but have surpassed Canon. (No, I'm not switching — that's not a topic for this thread.) And you can bet that this has been a wake up call to Canon and that Canon will, in a time frame that is too long for some but not that long in the grand scheme of things, answer and more these developments.
Competition is a good thing.
Nikon and Canon both make excellent cameras, lenses, and related equipment. Great photographers currently use both systems to produce stunning photographs, and if you see their work hung side by side in galleries (and I often do) you will be completely unable to determine which camera brand was used.
We are at a wonderful time in the development of photography technology, with powerful systems in a range of formats and coming from a diversity of manufacturers.
I know and have known many photographers. I frequently shoot side by side with folks using a range of systems — different brands and different formats ranging from MF film and digital, though multiple FF digital systems, to cropped sensor and 4/3 models. When we discuss how it was that we arrived at a particular brand, it turns out that the decision was rarely a logical or calculated one. A friend or family member owned a brand, so we got the same thing. There was a sale on one or the other. A relative gave us one. Our school program happened to be equipped with one or the other. At the particular time we purchased our first system, we were attracted to some particular area in which one brand seemed to be ahead.
This year Nikon is a bit ahead in sensor technology, since they are closer to the start of their use of a newer generation of sensors. Unless something surprising and almost unprecedented happens, Canon (and probably others) will equal or surpass this current level of sensor when they arrive at their next generation. Canon produces a wide range of excellent lenses, though if Nikon has what you need theirs are also excellent.
Of all the questions you'll need to answer in your photographic career, "Nikon or Canon?" is perhaps just about the very least important.
Is that on topic enough for some of you? I still say that a question that is specifically about Nikon (as "What do you like/dislike about Nikon?" surely is) belongs in a Nikon forum. People looking to find out about Nikon most logically look there.
Likes:
Aside from the oft-stated desire for better DR with Canon sensors (a desire I share), I like that Nikon is being a bit adventurous with their product releases. Nikon has become an edgier manufacturer lately. Releasing a 36MP camera in 2012 was definitely cutting edge for a 35mm sensor. And I like that they've stepped things up a notch with the D810 improving high ISO performance and supporting native ISO 64.
Dislikes:
In 2012 I bought a D800 and mostly loved it, but did hate a few things. The D800's LiveView was dreadful - especially in low light scenarios where it became utterly useless for setting critical focus.
One major reason I sold my D800 and stuck with Canon is I really like my TS-E 17 and 24 II lenses. Nikon doesn't compete there. And sadly that's what makes these decisions so frustrating. If Nikon would simply produce an excellent PC 17mm as well as a PC 24mm (as good or better than the Canon model), then it would be an easier decision for me.
Other Considerations:
Thankfully, Sony stepped up and gave me the answer I was looking for: A 36MP sensor with excellent DR that allows me to use all my Canon-mount lenses - including my beloved TS-E lenses. Now I have the best of both worlds: I love my 5D III for a lot of applications, and when I want the extra resolution or DR, or just want to enjoy the pleasures of walk-around shooting with manual-focus lenses, I love my a7R.
The main asset that Nikon has over Canon is the Sony sensor. But, by adding a Sony a7 series camera as an accessory to my Canon kit, I can enjoy that Sony Exmor advantage while also enjoying one of the best things about Canon: wonderful lenses (using manual-focus).
gdanmitchell wrote:
Of all the questions you'll need to answer in your photographic career, "Nikon or Canon?" is perhaps just about the very least important.
Is that on topic enough for some of you? I still say that a question that is specifically about Nikon (as "What do you like/dislike about Nikon?" surely is) belongs in a Nikon forum. People looking to find out about Nikon most logically look there.
Dan
That was basically the gist of my first post in this thread. It's hard to buy a poor camera now. Apparently that's not an acceptable view and being satisfied with your Canon gear makes people irritated. A bit pathetic really.
Plus Fred gave us the Hide-me button and I expect he didn't think it was for 11 year olds.
Sometimes certain people really drag this place down. I won't list them as they are largely self-evident, well known and thankfully hidden
Was a canon shooter all my life until I went sony with the A7r a year back (almost) however we have two D800e's in the studio that are used for repro, product and macro work. Bought when the camera was released and heavily used on a daily basis.
Dislikes:
Really uncomfortable grip for bigger male hands. I've read the D750 is worse and the D810 is better but have no more information.
They killed the great thumb rest of the D700, it's almost non existent on the D800 and you thumb slips off really easily.
Mounting with the dot at the centre top makes the most sense, the Nikon system requires you to have the lens mount tilted towards you to mount so you can see what you're doing. Big complaint on our Mamiya medium format as well (though their more modern lenses have a 2nd blue dot to use when mounting so you can align with the top).
LV (apparently fixed?)
Not a fan of the cable release mounting system, again instead of just plugging in you have to tilt to find the correct orientation on a circle. Even when I'm facing the camera it's a pain. When it's mounted on a repro stand it's a royal pain in the neck.
The menu system on the canon is just a joy to use compared to everything else I've seen, ditto the properly working 'my menu'.
Tethering software not included with the camera (though we use Capture One which does support tethering with LV).
No silent mode to compare to the 5D3.
They don't seem to have managed to make a reliable workhorse flash since the SB-800 according to my wedding shooter friends who are nikonites.
These are just niggles though. Practically everything else is better with the current line at least. Heck even just the design of the CF button on the D800 is a sheer pleasure to use (it's massive). I love the in viewfinder spirit level too, a real boon to our work. IQ is of course not even comparable, worlds apart for our work.
popinvasion wrote:
The lenses are unmatched. Canon lacks in sensor tech but damn they killed it on the lens front.
Right. I'm just biding my time until Canon improves the DR. It's like waiting for an earthquake: The longer it takes, the more likely that something big is going to happen.
Nikon on the other hand may never catch up with Canon's lenses.
Dan -- Well said about the benefit to us all having rival manufacturers competing for our dollars.
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My choice to follow Canon (for the most part), really began back in the Film Era.
I believe I was shooting a Canon T90 camera and the 35 TS lens (along with the 20-35L and 35-105) as a supplement to my 4x5 architecture work. The problem with the Canon set-up was the 35mm was just too long to take in skyscrapers in LA, or produce any real "drama".
Nikon had the industry leading 28mm PC lens at that time, so I purchased an FE2 body and that lens to fill that gap in the Canon line-up. The FE2 was great, but the 28mm suffered from severe pin-cushion distortion! I know, "What?", right? You'd think Nikon would make a flat field shift lens! Nope. Pretty rotten in the corners too. I used that set-up for several years, until I switched to Canon EOS after they came out with the 24TSE lens (I think I waited until '93, protesting Canon's obsolescence of my FD system! ) -- people malign that lens now, but if you had gone through the earlier 35TS and Nikon 28PC, you'd have an abiding loyalty to the company that came out with that electronic TSE lens! I never again took Nikon seriously with regard to my needs and interests, despite repeatedly checking in and trying out Nikon's later offerings. I still like the original 24TSE, but Canon really hit the ball out of the park with the newer 24TSE II, which is one of my very favorite lenses, ever, in any format.
No brand is perfect, but some are certainly more responsive to the specific needs of specific photographers. I like to think I can pretty well pick up any decent camera and get good images, and like to retain that fluidity. But certain brands or models will of course be better suited than others when all is said and done.
Shot Canon for 10 years and switched to Nikon a few years ago. I really cannot complain too much about either system.
CANON:
Likes: CPS, 200 f/1.8
Dislikes: price
NIKON:
Likes: flash system, spot metering works with all focus points (D700 and up), price, DR, 36mp
Dislikes: focus breathing - 70-200, service repairs
ggreene wrote:
Do you talk to other photographers outside of forums? I just don't hear anything about low ISO DR when I actually talk to other photographers. The level of bitching on the forums seems out of whack with the real world.
What I don't like about nikon, is that people seem to continuously think that the canon forum is a great place to post a topic dedicated to nikon gear.
