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Archive 2013 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you
  
 
PetKal
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


I think it has been almost a year now that some of you have owned and used 5DMkIII and 1DX.
I guess that is enough time for us to make up our minds about the benefits those new camera bodies have offered to our practice of photography.
How would you summarize the major gains, expressed as results, you have made by shooting with those cameras, compared to the previous models you had owned ?

In my case the key benefit of 1DX has been its excellent high ISO noise performance.
On one hand, low noise means significantly better IQ of my high ISO files. Moreover, I have been going out taking pictures with 1DX in much lower light levels than ever before.

Secondly, I am able to set my shutter speed and DoF more appropriately for the scene/target being photographed, without being under constant pressure to keep ISO under 800, and/or shoot with precarious and marginal exposure settings. The net effect here has been an improvement in capture quality as well as the keeper rate.

As far as autofocus capability is concerned (see the Note below), 1DX does represent a fair but not earthshattering improvement over my old 1DsMkII and 1DMkIIN. I think Canon should improve the speed of initial focus pickup, etc. I believe they also need to rethink their entire approach to AF system fine tuning by the user......those new 6 standard cases of Servo AF tracking are largely one muddled mess in my view.

Lastly, while 12 FPS can be helpful on occasion, that has not been a pivotal improvement for me. I'd be perfectly happy with the maximum rate of 8 FPS if they choose to increase the file size to, say, 30 MP. With high resolution lenses at our disposal, the 18 MP files sometimes look too "thin"....I guess, our expectations in that regard are on the rise too.
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Note: I am somewhat "harsh" when it comes to Servo AF performance. For several years I have been testing AF response of camera/lens combos on the same type of target and its motion: largely towards the camera, with the rate of focusing distance change typically 40-60 km/hr. It is important to note that such focusing speed is not the same as the target speed, and action photographers often mix up those two. For example, you can have a very fast falcon doing a flyby at 100 km/hr whereby the focusing distance change is minor, therefore the AF task would not be as challenging, although there would be difficulties of some other type, such as speed of the operator's response.
In other words, if you are trying to track a fast moving target, you have to look at that component of its speed vector which is coaxial with the lens, and which represents the focusing distance rate of change (i.e., focusing speed). The target speed vector component which is perpendicular to the lens axis does not represent (in an approximation) a change in focusing speed, since the focusing distance (in approximation) doesn't change. ( NB.:No focusing distance change means that focusing speed is zero after the initial AF lock had been achieved. )

Edited on Feb 18, 2013 at 12:31 PM · View previous versions



Feb 18, 2013 at 11:30 AM
CanonPhotog
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


With the 5DIII, the new focus system has tripled my keeper rate. And, like you, I'm no longer afraid to push the ISO limit a bit more. I really can't think of much that I *don't* like about the 5DIII.


Feb 18, 2013 at 11:36 AM
timbop
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


Because I can trust the offcenter points now, when shooting "action" I don't have to compose wider than I want and crop in order to get the framing I intended. That has the effect of putting more pixels in the image, improving high ISO image quality from higher resulting pixel density.

More importantly, I shoot my 5d3 in situations where I used to reach for the 7d- again netting better image quality



Feb 18, 2013 at 01:58 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


My 1DX gives me much improved high ISO performance, and provides a high fps FF body to use alongside my 1DIV. I think its AF tracks moving subjects against a cluttered background better than my previous 1D-series bodies. I also like the new configuration options; I'm using IS on the M-Fn 2 button and AF mode on the DOF button - with the lens set for IS-off and the camera in AF Servo mode, I can track moving things, and then simply push in those two buttons to have the IS turn on and switch to One Shot AF mode. Takes a bit of practice, because you have to keep them pushed in, but I'm getting the hang of it.


Feb 18, 2013 at 02:01 PM
Paul Mo
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


From a 5DC to my 5D3.

Positives
A) High ISOs for low light.
B) Video when I need it.
C) Good menu layout.
D) Silent shutter.
E) Reasonable burst rate.
F) 'Rainy day' potential that I can tap into when I have the time - multiple exp., et al.
G) Crisp, high res. images.

Negatives
H) Disappointment in an initial steep price, and consequent drop (early adopter).
I) Reverts to SD card when the CF card is removed.
J) Awful green-brown shadow noise.



Feb 18, 2013 at 02:12 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


Paul Mo wrote:
...I) Reverts to SD card when the CF card is removed.


My 1DIV and 1DX do this (second CF card for the 1DX) only when I remove a card and then close the card door before replacing the card, while the power is on. They don't switch cards if you turn them off before removing a card, or don't close the card door until the after the card is replaced. I figure your 5DIII might behave the same way...



Feb 18, 2013 at 02:19 PM
dhphoto
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


jcolwell wrote:
I figure your 5DIII might behave the same way...


It does, if you don't close the door it doesn't change to the other card.

The 5D3 has made quite a big difference in the way I approach some assignments.

I can use far more ambient light and worry less about using flash as the high ISO perfrmance is so good. I'm quite happy to shoot RAW at 1600 ISO and remove the noise in LR4. Even a bit higher if need be.

Also the inbuilt two-way level and dual card slots are just marvellous at the top of a ladder or tripod or hanging from gantries the way I have to, the body is so much smaller and more convenient than my 1Ds3 for this. Being able to see the level and all the settings from a distance away on the excellent LCD is just great.

In my line of work it has made really quite a big difference to the results.



Feb 18, 2013 at 02:27 PM
ggreene
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


1D4 to 1DX:

High ISO performance without a doubt is the main improvement with my 1DX. Along with that comes better initial AF lock in low light. It's allowed me to get a bit more DOF and/or shutter speed for indoor sports and night games.

I'd have to say that the increased FOV because of the FF sensor is a nice improvement as well. It makes my 70-200 a lot more usable at games when you are close to the action. Two CF card slots are nice for mirroring as well.

The one issue I have with it is that if you don't have or don't want to lug around super teles its pixel density is a real loss in decent light. You need to zoom with your feet a lot more. I'm hoping the 7D2 helps out in this regard.



Feb 18, 2013 at 02:39 PM
schlotz
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


1D-X has provided a significantly improvement in the ability to capture action sports with higher SS on low lit high school soccer fields. It's AF tuning has helped in keeping it on target with less distractions. While I still use the Mk IV with a 70-200 as my second body, the 1D-X has allowed a higher keeper rate under extreme conditions with the added advantage of less noise.

Matt



Feb 18, 2013 at 02:45 PM
Will Patterson
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


Having shot with every DSLR Canon has made from the D30 up to 1D Mark III, my 1D X feels/acts like Canon literally went back to the drawing board because it handles/acts/performs like no other camera of theirs. It's lightning fast in everything it does. The biggest single improvement to me is the autofocus system, it just never misses.

Secondly to me, would be the high ISO performance (and with that, the clarity of the photos in the low to mid-range ISO's). I don't remember getting as many compliments on my photos as I have with this camera, if that's any sign. The camera really gets the job done and has stepped up my game.



Feb 18, 2013 at 03:00 PM
 

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gel685
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


My 5D3 is replacing my 5D and 1D2n. I used the 5D for subjects that don't move and the 1D2n for subjects that move. My biggest gain is making my bag lighter by going down to one body. I only had the 1D2N for about a year, but I find that the 5D3 has increased my keeper rate significantly for moving subjects. (mostly kid's sports, occasionally birds) I was expecting better high ISO performance compared to the 5D, so now I appreciate the 5D more. But I can now shoot in lighting conditions that I wouldn't even bother in with my old cameras. ISO 8000 is useable. My old cameras couldn't go there.--Eric.


Feb 18, 2013 at 03:41 PM
photoelle
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


1D Mark IV to 5D Mark III:

Vast improvement in high ISO images. I can shoot sellable action images in most any lighting conditions now.
Better colour quality in images.
Lighter weight is a big bonus for me.
Fast & accurate AF both for acquiring the subject, and tracking it successfully. Higher keeper rate. All my lenses perform better.
Easy to choose different AF points, which seem to be accurate all across the viewfinder.
Extra benefits with the 600EX RT flash system.

The one drawback is that the focus point does not light up in AI servo.



Feb 18, 2013 at 03:44 PM
PhilDrinkwater
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


With the 5d2 to the 5d3:

I've massively improved my in focus shots in low light or while a couple is moving.
I've moved away from central focus shots quite so much, since I can use outer points.
I've been using auto ISO a lot more, which has improved my ability to take a shot quickly.
I've got an extra stop of usable ISO and exceptional focusing in low light which has allowed me to take natural light shots on the dance floor.
I've got a better starting point for auto WB which has reduced my post production time and therefore improved my profitability.
I've switched from 8Gb to 64Gb cards due to the dual card slots and backup which means I don't have to worry about changing cards all day.
I've been able to take more shots without people noticing due to the silent shutter.
I've been able to confirm focus much quicker due to the "one click zoom 100%" function which has improved my productivity on the day.
I'm able to more accurately judge exposure on the screen which has reduced my post production time.

The biggest negative compared with the 5d2 is the focus points not being visible when I'd want them to be both in good and poor lighting. The biggest disappointment was the auto ISO system, which still was very limited and didn't work in well Manual.

I honestly believe the 5d3 is a much more significant upgrade than many give it credit for. The only reasons not to get it are the identical resolution to the 5d2 (although that's a benefit for me) and the similar dynamic range at low ISO. If they're your needs, it wasn't a good upgrade. For everything else it was amazing ... and with a few tweaks could have been exceptional.

I wrote a review actually http://www.phildweddingphotography.co.uk/2012/05/canon-5diii-for-weddings/



Feb 18, 2013 at 03:52 PM
MDJAK
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


Peter, you, my long time friend, are a true gem when it comes to these forums and your extremely interesting and well thought out posts. (What a loss to POTN. But that's another story completely.)

As you stated, and I completely agree, the initial AF attainment needs to be improved. I do more shooting of my two Labs more than anything else lately. My chocolate lab was running at me yesterday. I had the new 24-70 II on my 1Dx. It failed to attain focus on him and gave me a blurred mess. Now it may very well be because of lack of contrast.

As to the cases, again you hit the nail on the head. One "case" with just the ability to change the different choices would have been fine. I do need to increase the tracking speed on mine to see if that helps.

All that said, I find the 1Dx and 5D3 to be far superior to the 1D3 and IV, and the 5D2 respectively. I would never trust the 5D2 on anything but the center point. My 1DIV was hit and miss. The 1Dx for regular, run of the mill shots, people walking, candids on the street, returns perfect focus every time. Truly amazing. I love them both.

mark



Feb 18, 2013 at 04:04 PM
ben egbert
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


dhphoto wrote:
It does, if you don't close the door it doesn't change to the other card.

The 5D3 has made quite a big difference in the way I approach some assignments.

I can use far more ambient light and worry less about using flash as the high ISO perfrmance is so good. I'm quite happy to shoot RAW at 1600 ISO and remove the noise in LR4. Even a bit higher if need be.

Also the inbuilt two-way level and dual card slots are just marvellous at the top of a ladder or tripod or hanging from gantries the way I have to, the
...Show more


Thanks for the tip on closing the door, I am getting tired of running upstairs to get the other card when I try to upload the wrong one because the camera switched them. I got used to the 1DSm3 over 5 years.

Tried it, and it works as advertised. Now all I need to do is remember it.




Edited on Feb 18, 2013 at 08:56 PM · View previous versions



Feb 18, 2013 at 04:12 PM
ben egbert
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


I have only had mine 2 weeks and can't catch a weather/light break. But last night I took a shot of the Wasatch front range from my front yard just for practice and the image had a special look that I have not seen with my 1DS-mk3. Maybe it was just the light, or maybe something else.

I wonder if perhaps the edges and corners are cleaner because of something to do with the sensor?

I did try highlight tone priority just to see if I might want to do this for landscapes. My normal processing produced sky noise at ISO200. So I guess not. I used to run NR on my 1DS-mk3 at ISO100 until I changed my work flow.

I could mask of course or run NR as before, but I will only bump iso when it is required for the shot. I think most people have a lot more noise tolerance than I do.

I am really jazzed with the AF and especially live view. I expect to get a lot more keepers than before, especially with my TSE lens which was hit or miss on the 1DS3.




Feb 18, 2013 at 04:22 PM
retrofocus
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


PhilDrinkwater wrote:
With the 5d2 to the 5d3:

The only reasons not to get it are the identical resolution to the 5d2 (although that's a benefit for me) and the similar dynamic range at low ISO. If they're your needs, it wasn't a good upgrade.


+1. Exactly. I would only upgrade to a new camera body if the sensor itself improves. Next thing of importance for my style of shooting is the 100% viewfinder, for me the biggest improvement from the 5D II to a potential 5D III. The rest of the improvements are nice to haves like AF, but no must for me at all. So I keep on shooting with my 5D IIs for now.



Feb 18, 2013 at 04:30 PM
goosemang
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


i'm... let's see... 10 months into my 5d3, coming from a 7d. here's what i know:

- noise performance is light years better. 6400 no sweat. i don't even touch noise reduction until i start shooting at 3200, and even then sometimes i don't touch it. the noise is tight and grainy and doesn't bother me much, especially if i'm doing a b&w conversion.

- raw files are much better to work with/more forgiving

- servo AF is ridiculous, even compared to 7d, and i'm tracking people at f/1.4-f/2 in crap light and nailing focus. with crappy AF lenses like the 50 1.4!

downsides?

- i'm not looking to push shadows 5 stops, but it'd be nice if i could push them a bit more without things looking crappy. ETTR, you know? pretty much takes care of that 90% of the time.

- another downside is that they dropped the price $500 in a year but hey, you gotta pay to play.

- the non-illuminated AF point thing isn't a huge issue for me, but it IS an issue and it's too bad it's not better implemented. i know this really stinks for some of y'all.

i've said it before but once you get your head around this camera, customize it to your liking, it just works. it was worth the money. hopefully it'll be the last dslr i ever buy, because i figure these big honking things will be obsolete in five years.



Feb 18, 2013 at 04:37 PM
Breitling65
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


I think we said lot about this topic and I like 5D3 lot. But no meter what we will say - there is large group of Canon forum members who will trash both for number of mpx Nikon/Sony sensor currently provides. Many don't even know why they need them or how to deal with such resolution, but they like to have it. I think Canon should do it to make them happy


Feb 18, 2013 at 05:03 PM
ggreene
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · 5DMkIII/1DX: major gains to you


PhilDrinkwater wrote:
I've switched from 8Gb to 64Gb cards due to the dual card slots and backup which means I don't have to worry about changing cards all day.


I agree, now that I have switched to two 64GB cards it's so much nicer to shoot long events where I'm not managing how many shots are left on the cards. I haven't noticed any buffer issues either when mirroring (at least not on the 1DX with Lexar 1000x). I do wish that it could delete images from both cards when doing on the fly culling.

Breitling65 wrote:
I think we said lot about this topic and I like 5D3 lot. But no meter what we will say - there is large group of Canon forum members who will trash both for number of mpx Nikon/Sony sensor currently provides. Many don't even know why they need them or how to deal with such resolution, but they like to have it. I think Canon should do it to make them happy


If they would branch out and stop being such Canon Fanboys they would already have a D800E with a 14-24 zoom and getting the MP/DR they so desire.



Feb 18, 2013 at 05:18 PM
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