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Archive 2010 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?

  
 
cineski
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p.4 #1 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


In terms of looking objectively (and probably just as subjectively ;-) at Canon's current naming system, a 3D that's FF makes perfect sense since the lower the number, the better the camera. As the 7D is a dumbed down and cheaper 1D4, the 3D would be a dumbed down and cheaper 1Ds4. Many would see the 5d2 as that camera, but Canon has the opportunity to keep that strong as the multi media camera while the introduction of a FF 3d, which would be identical to the the 7D but FF would truly be a big seller. This is from my own wants, and from those I know. Others may disagree, but this is my post and it's all speculative

Also, by the time I got to the end of my original post in this thread I agree, there is a place for the 60d as there's a $1000 gap between the T2i and 7D. Haven't really paid attention to this part of the lineup, and since I am now, Canon does need a $1250 60d here. The consumer section of the lineup benefits from closely incremental pricing. In the past, Canon has ignored to an extent the lineup of their more professional lineup (in terms of incremental pricing). I know so many photographers who want a 1 series but simply refuse to pay $7-8K times multiple bodies (namely wedding photographers). Those same photographers have many complaints about the 5 not being good enough, but you know what? Even pros have a limit to what they buy. They also have very selective wants for their cameras, more so than consumers. I simply won't shoot a crop camera. I have no need or want for that. Just as others who shoot wildlife or sports may have no need for FF. I simply want a FF camera that takes demanding pictures incredibly well (when I say demanding, I mean no brick walls). Better than the 5D or 5D2 but not as expensive as the 1Ds. MANY on here want the same thing, just pay attention. For myself and others like me, where that increment is the 1D4, well, just won't buy a crop camera, either, so that leaves us feeling a bit lost and wanting this clear gap to be filled. Canon seems to be listening since they introduced the 7D, and hopefully the FF series will get this exact same consideration.

Sorry, I kinda hijacked.

Dudewithoutape wrote:
Engine choices? Lets see, the Camry has three at the least; a 4 cylinder, a 6 cylinder, and a hybrid. There is space for a 60D.

Also, to everyone hoping for a 3D, I'm fairly certain there is a much higher probability we will see a 60D before a 3D. Unless the 3D replaces the XXD line, as in, it is not the FF the 3D hopefuls are praying for.




Feb 09, 2010 at 04:16 PM
jerrykur
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p.4 #2 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


omarlyn wrote:
Really?

Toyota: Corolla (economy), Camary (mid level), Avalon (luxury).
Nissan: Sentra (Economy), Altima (mid-level), Maxxum (luxury)
Honda : Civic (Econony), Accord (mid-level/luxury)
Ford: Focus (Economy), Fusion (Mid-level), Taurus (Full size/Luxury).



I see it a bit differently

Toyota: Corolla (economy), Camary (low mid), Avalon(mid) , Lexus ES350 (low luxury), Lexus LS470 (luxury)

You can do the same thing with the other Japanese brands, Nissan/Infiniti and Honda/Acura.




Feb 09, 2010 at 04:42 PM
David Baldwin
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p.4 #3 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Canon won't need to bring out a 60D provided they reduce the price of the 7D by 30%.

The price jump between the Rebels and the 7D is massive, there is a real marketing need to fill the gap with a 60D.



Feb 09, 2010 at 05:11 PM
Canongarcon
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p.4 #4 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


nads wrote:
This is absurd. The multiple engines (which ARE available), transmissions, and options like leather seats, navigation, and sunroofs are in no way similar to accesories like lenses or flashes. They are as integral to the original purchase as control wheels, viewfinders and burst rates because once the product is purchased the buyer cannot change these features.

A fully loaded, 2.4L corolla is to the 1.8L automatic corolla and the 1.8L manual corolla what the 50d is to the 500d and 1000d.

They may all say corolla on the back, however if they offer different features at different price points then
...Show more

Your comparison is rediculous. Doesn't matter what engine and transmission, the Corolla has. They all have the same build quality and same dimensions. Comparing the Rebel to a 50D is like comparing a Corolla to a Camry.



Feb 09, 2010 at 05:27 PM
n0b0
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p.4 #5 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


David Baldwin wrote:
Canon won't need to bring out a 60D provided they reduce the price of the 7D by 30%.

The price jump between the Rebels and the 7D is massive, there is a real marketing need to fill the gap with a 60D.


As I said earlier, 40D was announced at $1300, 50D at $1400 and 7D $1700, I don't think it's massive. The only thing massive here was the 50D price drop.

omarlyn wrote:
I'll do you one better...not only do I believe the market will support a 60D but there's no reason not to have a 'noo-b' entry level Rebel kit priced at $400-$500. There probably aren't many (if any) members here on FM that would be interested in an entry level Rebel but (IMO) I believe there's a market that's being missed in between the bridge P&S cameras and a bottom-entry level DSLR that costs less than the current Canon Rebel.

That's my two-cents,
Omar


Are you talking about the Rebel XS aka 1000D?



Feb 09, 2010 at 06:29 PM
jorkata
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p.4 #6 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


n0b0 wrote:
As I said earlier, 40D was announced at $1300, 50D at $1400 and 7D $1700, I don't think it's massive. The only thing massive here was the 50D price drop.


Agree 100%.
This time last year the 40D was selling for $900. Now the 50D is selling for this much.

So, buyers do not seem willing to pay more than $1K for an xxD body.
And in the sub-$1K category Canon has five Rebels already.
Can't see a 60D getting to added to the mix at this time.



Feb 09, 2010 at 07:26 PM
nads
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p.4 #7 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Canongarcon wrote:
Your comparison is rediculous. Doesn't matter what engine and transmission, the Corolla has. They all have the same build quality and same dimensions. Comparing the Rebel to a 50D is like comparing a Corolla to a Camry.


Clearly the use of an analogy is over your head.

You just like to argue around in circles don't you. I assume you are too stupid to remember the original point: There is room to market a xxD between the current xxxxD, xxxD and the 7D series body. Just as the Automotive industry does not sell 3 models of cars that fit the economy, midsize and luxury market segments that you so ignorantly described without any acknowledgement of the fact that, without exception, the top trim level of each of your examples is more expensive and offers more features than the base trim level of the next level vehicle that you listed.






Feb 09, 2010 at 07:42 PM
digitalbug30d
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p.4 #8 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


there still going to be a 60D,priced between the 50D and 7D
it very well end up with lower mp count something like 12
dual digic4s ect 920k screen,live view,video 1080p



Feb 09, 2010 at 08:20 PM
M Vers
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p.4 #9 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


digitalbug30d wrote:
it very well end up with lower mp count something like 12
dual digic4s ect 920k screen,live view,video 1080p


Doubtful, IMO. If a 60D does end up happening it will have an 18mp sensor (probably the same one used in the 550D) with the same AF system as the 50D plus all the features of the 550D. The largest difference between the 550D and a 60D will likely be ergonomics, build, and fps.



Feb 09, 2010 at 08:37 PM
Marcel VanEerd
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p.4 #10 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


NO: I think they'll continue to downsize the body, gearing it more and more toward a demanding consumer who want small-without-loss-of-features, but just like we saw with the earlier FD bodies, I wouldn't be surprised if more creative naming of bodies would start showing. (think FT(b), EF, AE1, A1, T-series, 1-series)


Feb 09, 2010 at 08:53 PM
Fat Dave
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p.4 #11 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Marcel VanEerd wrote:
NO: I think they'll continue to downsize the body, gearing it more and more toward a demanding consumer who want small-without-loss-of-features, but just like we saw with the earlier FD bodies, I wouldn't be surprised if more creative naming of bodies would start showing. (think FT(b), EF, AE1, A1, T-series, 1-series)


Why do you think they will downsize the body?

If you look at 30D -> 40D -> 50D, they certainly didn't downsize the body.

It's one of the key bullet points differentiating the xxD line from the entry-level line.



Feb 09, 2010 at 08:57 PM
Canongarcon
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p.4 #12 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


nads wrote:
Clearly the use of an analogy is over your head.

You just like to argue around in circles don't you. I assume you are too stupid to remember the original point: There is room to market a xxD between the current xxxxD, xxxD and the 7D series body. Just as the Automotive industry does not sell 3 models of cars that fit the economy, midsize and luxury market segments that you so ignorantly described without any acknowledgement of the fact that, without exception, the top trim level of each of your examples is more expensive and offers more features than the
...Show more

The 60D ain't a happening. Get over it.



Feb 09, 2010 at 09:29 PM
Canongarcon
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p.4 #13 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Marcel VanEerd wrote:
NO: I think they'll continue to downsize the body, gearing it more and more toward a demanding consumer who want small-without-loss-of-features, but just like we saw with the earlier FD bodies, I wouldn't be surprised if more creative naming of bodies would start showing. (think FT(b), EF, AE1, A1, T-series, 1-series)


Canon is not going to come out with 20 different models. And their models are getting bigger, not smaller. The 7D is bigger than the 50D. The Rebels are not shrinking. The 1D series didn't get smaller either.



Feb 09, 2010 at 09:33 PM
Dawei Ye
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p.4 #14 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


The Toyota Corolla is the worse car I have driven (though I've only driven 3 )


Feb 09, 2010 at 11:02 PM
Marcel VanEerd
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p.4 #15 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Why I think the bodies will become smaller: because they CAN make it smaller. Like any other piece of electronics out there, or cars. Smaller means less raw material, means less cost. When it improves their bottom line, marketing will take care of the convincing the consumer aspect. I also think Canon before long will come out with a live-view-finder only DSLR body.
It's all hypothetical, of course.



Feb 09, 2010 at 11:10 PM
EB-1
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p.4 #16 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Dawei Ye wrote:
The Toyota Corolla is the worse car I have driven (though I've only driven 3 )


Apparently you did not drive that much in Eastern Bloc countries.

EBH



Feb 09, 2010 at 11:14 PM
M Vers
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p.4 #17 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Marcel VanEerd wrote:
Why I think the bodies will become smaller: because they CAN make it smaller.


But a lot of people don't want smaller, and if they do there are other options. The larger xxD body is one of the reasons people choose it over xxxD bodies. Ergonomics plays an enormous role.



Feb 09, 2010 at 11:14 PM
volyrat
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p.4 #18 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Several thoughts:

- I think that there will continue to be something between a xxxd and the xd lines. Canon won't cede the $1000 price point to Nikon.

- I don't think any business trying to succeed would want to use the Auto industry as a guide. Branding / pricing / quality / design / long term viability - let's just say that the auto industry isn't doing so well right now.

- Also regarding the auto analogy - if Canon were to go the "choose the body style and modify" route, I'd like a 5d with the 1d AF system. Maybe that's a 5d Hybrid,



Feb 09, 2010 at 11:35 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.4 #19 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Fat Dave wrote:
Why do you think they will downsize the body?

If you look at 30D -> 40D -> 50D, they certainly didn't downsize the body.

It's one of the key bullet points differentiating the xxD line from the entry-level line.



Well they can't downsize my hands. I could care less if they made a match boxed sized DSLR, I ain't interested. To me the xxD is the minimum size I can handle comfortably and I don't have big hands. 7D is far too much camera for most peoples needs, so a 60D is definitely needed in the lineup IMO. There are numerous areas the 60D can distinguish itself from the 550D without stepping on the 7D's toes too much and thus a $1200 price would be easily achievable.



Feb 10, 2010 at 12:14 AM
Dawei Ye
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p.4 #20 · Is the Canon xxD line finished?


Size issue is interesting, at one stage mobile/cell phones looked like they were getting smaller and smaller, and the tiny phones became fashionable

Now we have a reversal in direction back towards the huge brick like monstrosities of old (e.g. Iphone, Blackberries etc)



Feb 10, 2010 at 01:01 AM
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