Alistair1 wrote:
That is very true krobatshov, but sharpness and pixel peeping tell a story about the camera while general impression and composition tell a story about the photographer.
This forum in general and this thread in particular are more concerned with the former. There are many other forums on this site catering very well to the latter.
Well said. Any fair comparison between cameras is going to be a pretty boring shot since it has to reproducible. That eliminates any action shots and most shots with natural light.
With the high ISO capabilities, it will be interesting to see which noise reduction software works best. From the samples I've seen so far, I personally think that shooting raw with good noise removal software, ISO 25600 "should" be able to produce very useable results.
Another wonderful benefit of higher useable ISO, at least for me, is that I won't have to shell out huge amounts of money for faster glass. I have the 24-105 f/4L lens and had been thinking about selling it so I could purchase the 24-70 f/2.8L just for the extra stop. But wasn't looking forward to a much heavier lens, losing IS as well as an extra 35mm of focal length. However, now I can't wait to see what kind of results I can get with the 5D2 at f/4. Also, I was considering the 16-35 f/2.8, but now hoping I can save USD $650 (50%) by getting the 17-40 f/4L instead. Granted, one stop of ISO is NO substitute for one stop of gLass, but financially it can be a great trade-off (especially for those of us who need the extra cash for accessories and to upgrade our hardware/software to process HD video and mammoth images).
So for all those fortunate to get your Christmas present early this year, would you mind shooting raw at 25600 using various noise reduction apps and posting them for us poor envious souls to evaluate (salivate over)?
Roland W wrote:
Here are some 5D Mark II images from JPEG shots at the maximum camera ISO setting of 25600. ... The second is a 100% crop of part of the frame of the same image, with no in camera noise reduction.
Have fun pixel peeping, just as I am doing.
I like the look of the jpeg with minimum noise reduction. Very nice film-like grain. I'm a raw shooter, but that's really a very impressive result straight out of camera, IMO. Thanks for posting.
dcmiller wrote:
Well, Mel, Red puts pressure on Canon and the others to push out products faster. That's a lot better than the trade group all the Japanese imaging companies belong to managing competition for the good of that industry in Japan. A western high tech approach will likely produce different products and a different corporate culture. At least you can be insulted by an American billionaire in public. Senior Canon management has no interest in what you think.
RED isn't competitive with Canon and Nikon. It will cost about $20,000 to buy a RED model with a 24 MP sensor that is also extremely big, clumsy, and heavy, without any of the amenities we take for granted, and even argue about the smallest improvements to.
The ethics of the way he presents his "wares" is open to question as well. Right now, every "product" he has announced is vaporware, most being computer generated images.
If Canon behaved this way, everyone here would be up in arms. If Canon introduced products like these, everyone would be complaining about the prices and lack of modern features.
These are primarily for video, despite his special RAW capture mode and grandiose claims.
If one were interested in buying a still camera in that price range, one would do much better waiting for the Leica .
As I've said, he's less interested in what we think than is Canon and Nikon. He's pretty much confirmed that with his insulting responses to everyone who has questioned his ideas on the subject. Not impressed.
ohyeah wrote:
With the high ISO capabilities, it will be interesting to see which noise reduction software works best. From the samples I've seen so far, I personally think that shooting raw with good noise removal software, ISO 25600 "should" be able to produce very useable results.
Another wonderful benefit of higher useable ISO, at least for me, is that I won't have to shell out huge amounts of money for faster glass. I have the 24-105 f/4L lens and had been thinking about selling it so I could purchase the 24-70 f/2.8L just for the extra stop. But wasn't looking forward to a much heavier lens, losing IS as well as an extra 35mm of focal length. However, now I can't wait to see what kind of results I can get with the 5D2 at f/4. Also, I was considering the 16-35 f/2.8, but now hoping I can save USD $650 (50%) by getting the 17-40 f/4L instead. Granted, one stop of ISO is NO substitute for one stop of gLass, but financially it can be a great trade-off (especially for those of us who need the extra cash for accessories and to upgrade our hardware/software to process HD video and mammoth images).
So for all those fortunate to get your Christmas present early this year, would you mind shooting raw at 25600 using various noise reduction apps and posting them for us poor envious souls to evaluate (salivate over)? ...Show more →
If the mkII responds to CR's noise reduction the way the old 5D does, it should be pretty good. I'm hoping to see enough shots that will show whether the noise is of the same type as that from the old camera. If so, but less, then that will be very good indeed! The 5D looks very good with CR's luminance at zero and the chrominance at the standard 25%.
Mel Gross wrote:
RED isn't competitive with Canon and Nikon. It will cost about $20,000 to buy a RED model with a 24 MP sensor that is also extremely big, clumsy, and heavy, without any of the amenities we take for granted, and even argue about the smallest improvements to.
The ethics of the way he presents his "wares" is open to question as well. Right now, every "product" he has announced is vaporware, most being computer generated images.
If Canon behaved this way, everyone here would be up in arms. If Canon introduced products like these, everyone would be complaining about the prices and lack of modern features.
These are primarily for video, despite his special RAW capture mode and grandiose claims.
If one were interested in buying a still camera in that price range, one would do much better waiting for the Leica .
As I've said, he's less interested in what we think than is Canon and Nikon. He's pretty much confirmed that with his insulting responses to everyone who has questioned his ideas on the subject. Not impressed. ...Show more →
bobbytan wrote:
Don't you think it's rather premature to come to this conclusion?
No.
We've seen enough pre-production shots and now a person who has used a production one. Another user, lecter (Rob Martin?), has posted video using a 24-105 and those are good.
The only thing that could be lacking is the AF capability, but we're all resigned to that now and can live with it. If you want a 5D with a few more features, better LCD and sealed body, 1080p video, and 21 MP resolution, all for under $3,000 USD, then that would be the 5DMkII.
I'm sure the D3x and soon to come 1DMkIV will be better, but at what cost?
How's the UK crowd doing? Read on Northlight that Jessops have contacted first pre-order customers to get their cameras on Friday. I'm just wondering when they will be available for general purchase.
We've seen enough pre-production shots and now a person who has used a production one. Another user, lecter (Rob Martin?), has posted video using a 24-105 and those are good.
The only thing that could be lacking is the AF capability, but we're all resigned to that now and can live with it. If you want a 5D with a few more features, better LCD and sealed body, 1080p video, and 21 MP resolution, all for under $3,000 USD, then that would be the 5DMkII.
I'm sure the D3x and soon to come 1DMkIV will be better, but at what cost?
Sure hope you are right. Can't wait to get hold of the Zeiss ZE 21 Distagon. I emailed B&H but they can't tell me when they will be able to start taking orders. They are currently accepting orders for the ZK version only. The ZE 21 on a 5D II will be a dream team for the landscape photographer!
i hate to be that guy but i just purchased this on ebay for $3100. it does come with 6 "gifts" but they're basically worthless. i would normally never do this and just for wait for availability but i really didnt want to wait in this case! i was actually going to purchase the 1ds mark III used because it seems the 5d mark II wont be available to people that didnt pre-order anytime soon. seems the only significant benefit of the 1ds would be the AF (which IS important and was definitely a factor in deciding) and the build quality/weather sealing (which i dont need or care much about-- i baby my gear). so while it may be a sucker move to buy this $400 over retail price, in a sense i saved 2k + and will have the camera that makes sense for me. i ordered last night and supposedly i will have it within 4 business days latest. good to get that off my chest! ill certainly post some samples once i get it
I went with my local dealer and a pre order, and got an early camera, number 6 out of about 20 they got in the first shipment. But I did pay sales tax, which was more than half of the price premium you paid. I hope your delivery goes smooth, and that you end up with no return issues that could crop up.
The most important part is getting the right camera for your needs. You sound like you have made the right choice, and there is nothing wrong with wanting to get it sooner rather than later, or perhaps even much later.
Here's a little update for you guys... I know everyone is waiting for their new little toy to arrive.
I just received a call from Adorama today, they said the 5D2 is shipping next week. They called to confirm I still wanted the camera. I ordered the kit with the 24-105L lens.
SeanP wrote:
i hate to be that guy but i just purchased this on ebay for $3100. it does come with 6 "gifts" but they're basically worthless. i would normally never do this and just for wait for availability but i really didnt want to wait in this case! i was actually going to purchase the 1ds mark III used because it seems the 5d mark II wont be available to people that didnt pre-order anytime soon. seems the only significant benefit of the 1ds would be the AF (which IS important and was definitely a factor in deciding) and the build quality/weather sealing (which i dont need or care much about-- i baby my gear). so while it may be a sucker move to buy this $400 over retail price, in a sense i saved 2k + and will have the camera that makes sense for me. i ordered last night and supposedly i will have it within 4 business days latest. good to get that off my chest! ill certainly post some samples once i get it ...Show more →
SeanP wrote:
i hate to be that guy but i just purchased this on ebay for $3100. it does come with 6 "gifts" but they're basically worthless. i would normally never do this and just for wait for availability but i really didnt want to wait in this case! i was actually going to purchase the 1ds mark III used because it seems the 5d mark II wont be available to people that didnt pre-order anytime soon. seems the only significant benefit of the 1ds would be the AF (which IS important and was definitely a factor in deciding) and the build quality/weather sealing (which i dont need or care much about-- i baby my gear). so while it may be a sucker move to buy this $400 over retail price, in a sense i saved 2k + and will have the camera that makes sense for me. i ordered last night and supposedly i will have it within 4 business days latest. good to get that off my chest! ill certainly post some samples once i get it ...Show more →
If you are referring to the one from a Hong Kong dealer digital-rev-access, do you know if there is an international warranty?
johnnydanger wrote:
firstsupport: Out of curiosity, what day did you place your Adorama order? I placed mine on sept. 24th and haven't gotten any notification yet. Thanks for the info.
Ordered mine from Adorama on 9/21. I just gave them a call. I was told that they're only calling the folks who pre-ordered "very early" but I couldn't pin her down on what that meant, only that I wasn't gonna be called. As for availability, she said they're due to get a large shipment of cameras in on Friday and the waiting list is long. She couldn't tell me when I could expect delivery of mine.
I ordered mine on the 21st too, and the woman I spoke with at Adorama told me that I'd definitely be in the first shipment to customers, though I haven't received any phone calls.
