True .... and that is because they had no competition. Nikon (finally) caught them with the pants down and Canon does not have time to respond or react, but I am sure they are switching gears and we will see more competitive products from Canon .... starting with Photokina.
jamesf99 wrote:
Feedback from Canon USA is why the prices have been as high as they are....
My biggest complaint with Canon may start to go away in the next month, i.e., the lack of value in their products.....
Congrats, Fred Relaix succeeded to import Mr Müller speculations/self amusement to FM Forum
We, French photo forum users all know Mr Müller for his strange sense of humour, for years, featuring various cameras like the 7D at a realistic price (or not, but you should know this guy, he's wierd!) http://www.muller-photo-service.fr/boutique/canon-boitier-p-2431-1_3.html on his commercial website, it's even possible to add it to your cart, all things wich could send him to the court in the U.S, but here in France it's just a funny idea...................
By the way I went to his shop in person some years ago and bought 2 lenses (he was the sole employee of his business) and he's so wierd, but now he's got his moment of fame on FM!
I told you, he's wierd!
He CAN get some good infos from canon reps, and doesn't hesitate to break NDA, sometimes his speculations are good, sometimes no, he just removes the funny item from his website, et voila!
20 years ago, he was already selling official Sony gear at a much lower price than official MRSP, when "suggested" were actually "ordered" by the manufacturer, got problems but it didn't stop his low cost business. He is/was a kind of pioneer in the discount/low cost photo gear business in France.
Note, if you want to buy his 7D, read the bottom of the page:
Ce produit a été ajouté à notre catalogue le lundi 30 juin, 2008.
Sur Commande Produit sur commande délai (90 jours)
product added to our catalogue on Jun 30th
Product on back order, allow 90 days delay...............
Canon USA probably reads part of the forum. The poor bastards. But no one should believe that Canon Japan is particularly interested in what Canon USA thinks.
This has been demonstrated.
If you've been following Chuck Westfall (Canon USA director of technical media communications) over the years, you'll see him hint rather broadly that Canon Inc doesn't even tell Canon USA what they're planning, much less listen to what Canon USA has to say. Westfall can't even get technical information from Canon Inc about current products--he and his staff have to do their own testing and evaluations.
It's been reported that Westfall got his hand slapped for slipping news of the 40D to Rob Galbraith about 24hrs ahead of time. Nobody else in Canon or any other camera company is as open with the public as Westfall is. Who else has a monthly online question and answer column, for instance?
Then there was the 20D power error debacle. USA and Europe users were complaining for months about problems with 20D power circuits, totally ignored by Canon Inc. It wasn't until Japanese users started complaining that Canon Inc not only paid attention--and within hours profusely apologized, recalled affected cameras, and replaced them. The Japanese language version of the apology said "we're sorry" no less than three times. But until Japanese customers started complaining, Canon Inc turned a deaf ear.
PetKal wrote:
Now, if that is for real, the last bastion of Canon's camera superiority will crumble: megapixels.
interesting...if accurate, the price in us dollars is about $7800...so much for the claims that a nikon megapixel camera would be priced substantially below the 1ds3...if this "pre" ad is accurate, i'll admit to being a little disappointed as i was intrigued by the talk of a modular camera that had been the subject of discussion for the past year or so..
bka20d wrote:
interesting...if accurate, the price in us dollars is about $7800...so much for the claims that a nikon megapixel camera would be priced substantially below the 1ds3...if this "pre" ad is accurate, i'll admit to being a little disappointed as i was intrigued by the talk of a modular camera that had been the subject of discussion for the past year or so..
But it doesn't work that way. 5490 euros may well be about $7800, but look at the D700.
They're selling it for 2490 euros (about $3900), where it sells State side for $2999.
So it may well be in the $6000 range.
If of course it is what everyone assumes it to be.
They have the 7D listed as well for 2999 Euros...
Sean Mills wrote:
But it doesn't work that way. 5490 euros may well be about $7800, but look at the D700.
They're selling it for 2490 euros (about $3900), where it sells State side for $2999.
So it may well be in the $6000 range.
If of course it is what everyone assumes it to be.
They have the 7D listed as well for 2999 Euros...
i guess we will have to wait and see...as you figured i just did the conversion.. and forgot about the potential additional costs that often account for the pricing differentials between us and overseas markets...
I worked for the Noritsu America Corp for 6 years (the worlds largest manufacturer of photofinishing equipment) I can assure that the Japanese had very little respect for there american counterparts. When one of the guys I worked with started learning Japanese he was told by his japanese superiors that if he learned japanese he would be terminated.
We had a situation where we worked on a new high speed photo printer for a week trying to fix a problem with inconsistent color we couldn't figure it out, so finally we ordered a $30,000 CPU rack for the machine. That night we got a call from an anonymous japanese technician explaining that the problem was the negatives were getting to hot in the gate because of the high intensity lamp. He told us to go to a pet store and buy a fish tank bubble pump and run a hose up under the negative gate and it would cure the problem. The bottom line was they knew there was a problem all along but wouldn't tell us until we ordered alot of expensive parts because they didn't want to admit to an error in design.
Even though we worked for the manufacturer we were always very limited as to the information given to us about the machines we were working on. We were simply told to change parts but couldn't get schematics so that we could actually troubleshoot a problem. If we asked a question of japanese technicians with regard to a new piece of equipment the discussions on there end were not about the ansewer but about how much the americans needed to know to do there job. All very frustrating.
tayo wrote:
It might have a better sensor, for example a low-voltage low-noise sensor, and more features. Making the point that higher res is not always better.
Edit: The 1D mk3 also has, at the time of its release, as well as now, a lower resolution than the 5D, but also a lower-number name.
Yes, but that's not how the numbering works - a 7 series is a lesser series than a 5 series, is a lesser series than a 3 series, is a lesser series than a 1 series.
There may well be a 7D released, but the 5D name will live on in a new model too and a 5D will always be a better camera than a 7D, otherwise they should just have random names.
bobbytan wrote:
I disagree with this. Of course they are interested, as the USA is the world's largest consumer market. Camera manufacturers are no different to car manufacturers, and there is a reason why Toyota is #1 .... because they make cars that Americans want. Feedback from Canon USA is therefore vital information for the Canon management in Tokyo.
Thats american thinking. Sorry I do not omit. DSLR Camera sales in 2006 where 50% in Europe 20% in USA and 30% in the rest of the world as far I remeber. Your market is so small that you are delivered at 25% less, we have to pay here. Even your average income is still higher, then for exampel in germany abd you have some 50% more people Canon sold more cameras in gernaby than in US.
Your mentioned company Toyota sells only 32% into US and became No 1?
Correct me if I am wrong.
Edited by Ralph Conway on Sep 05, 2008 at 04:16 AM GMT
Canon USA probably reads part of the forum. The poor bastards. But no one should believe that Canon Japan is particularly interested in what Canon USA thinks.
When I was responsible for video apps of Commodore Amiga in germany we made 47% of the world market. UK did another 27, USA did 6% and Japan another three. When I recieved the newest Amica 3000 computer we could not sell one of them. Because it only supported NTSC video to safe $ 3 on Sonys videochip. When the general manager asked his head of development after I sayd "NO GO" he mentioned that PAL is a unique german video standard. It was world standard 16 years ago. They blew of their market chances because of saving 3$ each machine and ignoring 91% of their market.
I think its not very different today. Except japanese companies try to fullfill their customers needs. You will never hear "We are sorry" from them. But they give us in main, what we want.
Edited by Ralph Conway on Sep 05, 2008 at 03:49 AM GMT
Canon USA or germany or france or wherever are just sales companies. Apple germany imo could easily doubble theire sales. If they would be abel to offer US prices. They get the prices dictated from US mother. They would go bancrupt if they offer that apple stuff at US Market prices. I think its the same with Canon. Or Nikon. Why do we get grey imports at 30-40% off?
Ralph
Edited by Ralph Conway on Sep 05, 2008 at 04:18 AM GMT
Last:
I am happy with the results of my Canon equipment. Handling is acceptable. But the most important button is shutter release. Its far away from beeing ergonomic if you are older than 14 years. And its the easiest thing, to change a bodies shape. Much easier than to create a new sensor. A second class design student would be able to do it with a clay model. Canon cameras are made for asian hands. Its that easy.
Pixel Perfect wrote:
There may well be a 7D released, but the 5D name will live on in a new model too and a 5D will always be a better camera than a 7D, otherwise they should just have random names.
Of course a 5D will be "better" than a 7D. But just like the 1D3 has lower resolution than the 5D, the 5D could have lower resolution than the 7D. The 1D3 even has lower resolution than the G10, and maybe even the 1D4 will have lower resolution.
But the 1D3 is more expensive because it is faster, more robust, etc. Similarly, the 5D could be more expensive than a supposed 7D by having better high-ISO performance, and other features, even if it has lower resolution. Makes sense to me, at least...
