clotug wrote:
Roland, thanks for the update. I deliberately didn't read your brief intro and had a look first to see which ones I found to be more noisy and was unpleasantly surprised. To me, it appears the 40D is not slightly but definitely noiser than the 20D, did you shoot these with NR on or off on the 40D? or what's your take on this?
NR was off. Actually, I am not really worried about the noise. You will only notice the difference at 100%. At realistic viewing sizes either on a computer screen or a print, the noise is hardly detectable for both 20D and 40D. That's why I didn't do the 100% crop comparison in the first place but only added it later because there were many requests.
Roland Lim wrote:
NR was off. Actually, I am not really worried about the noise. You will only notice the difference at 100%. At realistic viewing sizes either on a computer screen or a print, the noise is hardly detectable for both 20D and 40D. That's why I didn't do the 100% crop comparison in the first place but only added it later because there were many requests.
Roland
No worries here, I guess for me it's a matter of principle expecting noise to be at least on par with the 20D, which is 2 or 1,5 generations older. But I've seen some shots with NR and it does a wonderfull job, either way it's still better than my 300D.
It was suggested to me to try a lower ISO with the 40D and up the meter +1, which made it acceptible.
I am hoping just a few changes in my style of shooting will work this.
Here is a ISO400 shot I am happy with.
40D+ 300f4,exif below
Date Modified 2007-09-05 01:20:30
Date Taken 2007-09-04 05:17:30
Camera Canon EOS 40D
Exposure Time 0.0006s (1/1600)
Aperture f/4.0
ISO 400
Focal Length 300mm (480mm in 35mm)
Photo Dimensions 788 x 972
File Name sunsetwavw11x14U.jpg
File Size 674.89 KB
jay tieger wrote:
I agree with tug that the 40D is way noiser and softer too than the 20D...I don't understand why this should be so...
I know what you mean, You'd think 2 generations further, the noise should at least be on par, not worse, despite the 2 mp increase. I guess the NR is always on at higher iso with the 20D (can anyone confirm this?) whereas you can turn it on and off with the 40D...The samples I've seen with NR on and off are encouraging, the NR does a good job with hardly any loss of detail.
Sep 05, 2007 at 11:25 AM
Allen Maestas Offline • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
I have seen a few pics on other boards that seemed fairly sharp. I would hold off on the sharpness verdict until more testing is done. It could be a soft lens issue too and not the camera.
IMHO what I have seen noise wise without NR at ISO 1600 isn't all that bad. Too much pixel peeking going on here I think. But to be honest, I rarely go as high as ISO 1600.
I'm very confused. Is this not the same thread where Mr.Castleman linked us to his (in progress) review where he stated "Image quality of the 40D is much better than that of the 20D and slightly better (shadow detail, smoothness of image , less noise) than that of the 400D (Digital rebel XTi)"
So I don't know if anyone has brought this up or I am completely missing something. Did Canon swap the function of the buttons between the FEL and the AEL/Rear focusing * button !!! WTH !!! The FEL used to be to the far left and the focus/AEL used to be the middle. PLEASE someone correct me if I am wrong before I go off on this stupidity!
I have always swapped the focus control to the rear * button and having it be in a diferent spot compared to the 1D's and everything else for that matter will be an issue.
John Straus wrote:
So I don't know if anyone has brought this up or I am completely missing something. Did Canon swap the function of the buttons between the FEL and the AEL/Rear focusing * button !!! WTH !!! The FEL used to be to the far left and the focus/AEL used to be the middle. PLEASE someone correct me if I am wrong before I go off on this stupidity!
I have always swapped the focus control to the rear * button and having it be in a diferent spot compared to the 1D's and everything else for that matter will be an issue.
I need to go chill......Show more →
C.Fn IV 1 and 2 deal with that.
This was probably covered, but how can the crop from the 20d and 40d be the same size?
The 20d has some noise reduction, it's just not user controllable. NR needs to be on for a high ISO comparison.
There's no substitute for going to the camera store with your camera and taking shots for direct comparison.
added
1) Also, resolution is part of sharpness. How do you account for the quality improvement of larger files on screen?
2) There is no true RAW file, so turning everything off and comparing just encourages the manufacturers (clear throat nikon) to not let users control processing. Comparisons should be made by using real work flows.
3) All this and more is why the subjective opinion of expert reviewers is more important than trying to objectively evaluate images under pseudo controlled conditions. This fact is increasingly true as camera images become more sophisticated. On screen we really cant see the forest for the trees.
Edited by dcmiller on Sep 05, 2007 at 03:38 PM GMT
Ah the agony. I was leaving for the airport at 4PM. Fedex came with the 40D at 3:55PM. Ran upstairs, opened the box, stuck on a lens and a battery.
What a weird shutter sound coming from the 40D. The 20D sounded ...um... manly. There were big clunky things going on inside there! The 40D is more of a bzzt. Tried in high speed mode - wow, that is fast.
The screen is embarassingly large as compared to the 20D. A vast amount of real estate. I bet with a simple hack, we could watch movies on the thing. Who needs a video ipod??
Cant touch it until Frday now :-( and then I am off to Japan for a week, probably without it :-)
I am going to purchase a 40D soon. I have read every post here and some of the linked opinions.
A 20D owner and being really inexperienced, there are several ergonomic improvements alone swinging towards the 40D these changes\improvements ironically are in areas that really pain me on the 20D. It will become my backup I guess.
I held out on the 30D and glad I did. Wanting a backup I now have an excuse.
I would like to ask about the B&H rebates. I see two listed with the item. A $100.00 & $50.00. I need clarification. One or both?
Also, the wireless grip? How much? Did I read that right?
Any shopping tips would be appreciated.
therock wrote:
I am going to purchase a 40D soon. I have read every post here and some of the linked opinions.
A 20D owner and being really inexperienced, there are several ergonomic improvements alone swinging towards the 40D these changes\improvements ironically are in areas that really pain me on the 20D. It will become my backup I guess.
I held out on the 30D and glad I did. Wanting a backup I now have an excuse.
I would like to ask about the B&H rebates. I see two listed with the item. A $100.00 & $50.00. I need clarification. One or both?
Also, the wireless grip? How much? Did I read that right?
Any shopping tips would be appreciated.
I think that the US list price will be $800. Personally, I am really disappointed and pissed about this price. It is an item that I could really use. This would be a great product for networking companies to pickup on ... I'm sure a quality wireless grip could be made for $250 - $350. The BG-E2 is $170 at B&H for comparison.
