p.4 #1 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
NJPhotographer wrote:
That seems fraudulent in a bunch of ways.
Anything has the potential to be fraudulent. Ultimately, this is free markets at play. You don't want a China lens, don't buy it. You don't want the risk of buying a China lens with a replaced front ring- be careful and do your homework.
I was toying with the idea of getting a custom front ring saying "7-Eleven" instead of 7-element, but his price for a full custom ring was pretty high.
At the end of the day, I think it's hilarious how upset some people seem to be getting over all this.
p.4 #2 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
ISO1600 wrote:
Anything has the potential to be fraudulent. Ultimately, this is free markets at play. You don't want a China lens, don't buy it. You don't want the risk of buying a China lens with a replaced front ring- be careful and do your homework.
I was toying with the idea of getting a custom front ring saying "7-Eleven" instead of 7-element, but his price for a full custom ring was pretty high.
At the end of the day, I think it's hilarious how upset some people seem to be getting over all this.
A 7-Eleven ring would be pretty rad, curious as to how much he quoted for that.
A "replica" Leica ring doesn't appeal to me as I'm not trying to prove anything to anyone or pull one over on a buyer who thinks they may be getting a legitimate Leica lens. I also don't care if people see me using a Chinese lens on my M11-P. I do understand some people want to stick to a certain "aesthetic" and would therefore want to change the ring to have a more cohesive look to their gear without having to drop more money than they want to spend. Same reason people wear rep sneakers or knockoff luxury goods. As long as it doesn't cross over into the deception aspect of selling knockoff/rep products as legitimate (which is its own issue) I'm not bothered by what people buy to make themselves happy.
China has been making some high quality lenses that interest me. I don't care what country something is manufactured in if it speaks to me personally. I do think it's funny there are a lot of people who won't put something like LLL which has proven solid quality (aside from some QC) on their M-bodies, simply because they're from China. Then on the other hand LLL removes the "CHINA" previously put on the front ring and some people are upset believing they are trying to downplay the fact it is a Chinese lens and should be more proud of them being a Chinese company making good products.
I kind of like the bright red "CHINA" on my safari 8E because it upsets the purists.
p.4 #3 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
ISO1600 wrote:
Anything has the potential to be fraudulent. Ultimately, this is free markets at play. You don't want a China lens, don't buy it. You don't want the risk of buying a China lens with a replaced front ring- be careful and do your homework.
I was toying with the idea of getting a custom front ring saying "7-Eleven" instead of 7-element, but his price for a full custom ring was pretty high.
At the end of the day, I think it's hilarious how upset some people seem to be getting over all this.
Seems more like deception and illegality than free markets. As you know, misusing/misrepresenting another company's name is wrong. If anyone should be upset it is Leica, who have rights to their name. If anyone should do their "homework", it is the maker of the fake rings, assuming they failed to license the name. Also, buyers of 2nd hand Leica lenses may be rightfully upset at being deceived. If you find their upset "hilarious", that's up to you. It doesn't affect me one way or another.
p.4 #4 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
endergemini wrote:
Is there a way to tell the material without scraping the paint off? I have the brass version of this lens and the focusing tab feels like metal but I'm not sure if it is painted aluminum or brass.
The brass version being $538-618 (depending on accessories) with duties included is a lot more reasonable than the ~$800 I paid which did NOT include duties. I do like the lens and the build quality of mine feels solid, I just have six 35's and have choice paralysis when deciding which to bring with me. I'll try to bring this out with me this weekend so I can hopefully capture some more examples to help potential buyers now that Mandler seems to be interested in selling direct to more customers....Show more →
Thanks for the info, I appreciate it. At least it is metal and not plastic, so that's good news.
It's honestly tough to tell whether it is aluminum or brass just by feel. The only real way I can think of to confirm would be to remove the tab, which means partially disassembling the lens, and then lightly scratch the back side where it won't be seen. Thats a bit of effort though, so I'm not sure it's worth going that far just to satisfy my curiosity.
p.4 #5 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
High end watches have been dealing with this for a very long time. The "Super-Clones" and repo watches where they actually install some factory authentic parts to fool people is a real problem in that industry.
Market like the luxury watch industry, attract fraud like the luxury watch industry?
I am against this kind of thing very strongly, but the World remains as the World always has been.
p.4 #6 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
Here's a couple more samples from this weekend. My weekend was full of car events and usually I prefer to use a CPL for car photos but my 39mm B+W T-Pro does not work with the lens. It seems like this is due to the polarizer being a thin type and there not being enough thread length on the filter to reach the lens threads. I test fit the 39mm UV filter from the LLL 8E and that fit fine.
EDIT: Here's the Flickr album with the Mandler 7E pics I've posted since compression seems to be aggressive - https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjCLa5d
p.4 #7 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
rscheffler wrote:
I find it very interesting that 'Mandler' is another company basically doing the same thing as LLL... and for less.
they are the defector from LLL because they can't put up with Zhou.
There was a Ding, and he parted his way with Zhou.
And later, this Mandler thing came. That tells you something about Zhou
p.4 #10 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
Mandler 35mm f/2 or the LLL 35mm f/2? Or should I just stick with the still good old trusty 1.7 Ultron?
What tempts me about the other two is the classic housing design. The Ultron always looks a bit… special 😄
p.4 #15 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
Got in touch with Mandler today; and because I ordered the LTM version so I can use it on my Canon P and Sony I'll have to wait a while longer. The LTM order will be fulfilled after May 10th apparently.
p.4 #16 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
I ordered a brass one. Curiosity got the better of me. Im a sucker for small brass lenses. I plan to use it as my camping 35. Small and cheap and don’t care if I kill it. Sample photos are good enough for the “memory” photos I’m planning to use it for. I’ll try and post some images when I get it.
p.4 #17 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
My Mandler 35mm came in the mail today. I took it out briefly and got a few photos just at dinner. I opted for the brass with the upgraded accessory kit. I'm actually sort of surprised how nice it is. As far as the build quality and ergonomics go, compared to my 35mm 2.8 Summaron which was CLAd in the last couple years (which I think is pinnacle Leica quality). If the Summaron is a 10/10 in build and ergonomics (exception of aperture ring), the Mandler would subjectively sit as follows in comparison:
9/10 - Overall finish - Paint, Markings, knurling, etc
- It's honestly very very good. The Summaron has deeper and easier to read impressions for focusing scale and aperture.
9/10 - Ergonomics - size, ease of adjustment, finger placement, focus throw, etc
- compact and easy to adjust the aperture and focus while shooting.
8/10 - Focusing
- the focusing is a bit odd. To me it has the perfect damping similar to an old, good condition Takumar. I actually enjoy the focus speed a bit more than the somewhat stiffer Summaron. Where it loses points for me is although smooth, it's got a somewhat grittier feel than the Summaron which is butter smooth. I know that sounds weird. Bottom line is I can't FEEL the grit, but I can hear it
10/10 Aperture Ring
- Great. It has the wings similar to my v2 Lux but they are less obtrusive. Clickier aperture than the summaron and some of my other Leica glass. Hate to say it but it may be clickier than my FLE. But, Credit where it is due
8/10 Focus Tab
- no infinity stop, and I am pretty sure its metal. It's way sturdier than my V2 Lux with the cheap plastic tab which I needed to replace. It doesn't have the precision and body of the summaron tab though which knocks it down a peg or 2
8/10 - lens hood
- I was thinking I would like the round metal hood best, but it had a bit of play in it compared to the metal square hood which has alignment built into it. It seems to snap into the lens a bit better and remains more discreet. Fits more snuggly than my older clip on Leica hoods but obviously not as well as the screw on FLE hood.
This is just initial impressions on a brand new lens. The test of time will be another story. Overall, I can say that it is better built than both my v2 Lux and v3 summicron. Definitely falls short of the summaron and FLE and is maybe JUST below my LLL 8 Element in build quality.
Im hoping to get out this weekend and use it. If the images suck I suppose the build means nothing. I am expecting a nice character lens which I appreciate more than perfection these days. Ive seen enough images that I'm convinced it will work fine for a walk around lens especially when I don't feel like using my expensive lenses or my antiques. For $600 or whatever it came to it's worth a try.
p.4 #18 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
My Mandler 35mm came in the mail today. I took it out briefly and got a few photos just at dinner. I opted for the brass with the upgraded accessory kit. I'm actually sort of surprised how nice it is. As far as the build quality and ergonomics go, compared to my 35mm 2.8 Summaron which was CLAd in the last couple years (which I think is pinnacle Leica quality). If the Summaron is a 10/10 in build and ergonomics (exception of aperture ring), the Mandler would subjectively sit as follows in comparison:
9/10 - Overall finish - Paint, Markings, knurling, etc
- It's honestly very very good. The Summaron has deeper and easier to read impressions for focusing scale and aperture.
9/10 - Ergonomics - size, ease of adjustment, finger placement, focus throw, etc
- compact and easy to adjust the aperture and focus while shooting.
8/10 - Focusing
- the focusing is a bit odd. To me it has the perfect damping similar to an old, good condition Takumar. I actually enjoy the focus speed a bit more than the somewhat stiffer Summaron. Where it loses points for me is although smooth, it's got a somewhat grittier feel than the Summaron which is butter smooth. I know that sounds weird. Bottom line is I can't FEEL the grit, but I can hear it
10/10 Aperture Ring
- Great. It has the wings similar to my v2 Lux but they are less obtrusive. Clickier aperture than the summaron and some of my other Leica glass. Hate to say it but it may be clickier than my FLE. But, Credit where it is due
8/10 Focus Tab
- no infinity stop, and I am pretty sure its metal. It's way sturdier than my V2 Lux with the cheap plastic tab which I needed to replace. It doesn't have the precision and body of the summaron tab though which knocks it down a peg or 2
8/10 - lens hood
- I was thinking I would like the round metal hood best, but it had a bit of play in it compared to the metal square hood which has alignment built into it. It seems to snap into the lens a bit better and remains more discreet. Fits more snuggly than my older clip on Leica hoods but obviously not as well as the screw on FLE hood.
This is just initial impressions on a brand new lens. The test of time will be another story. Overall, I can say that it is better built than both my v2 Lux and v3 summicron. Definitely falls short of the summaron and FLE and is maybe JUST below my LLL 8 Element in build quality.
Im hoping to get out this weekend and use it. If the images suck I suppose the build means nothing. I am expecting a nice character lens which I appreciate more than perfection these days. Ive seen enough images that I'm convinced it will work fine for a walk around lens especially when I don't feel like using my expensive lenses or my antiques. For $600 or whatever it came to it's worth a try.
p.4 #20 · Leica 35mm Summicron KOB copy by ‘Mandler’
endergemini wrote:
Here's a couple more samples from this weekend. My weekend was full of car events and usually I prefer to use a CPL for car photos but my 39mm B+W T-Pro does not work with the lens. It seems like this is due to the polarizer being a thin type and there not being enough thread length on the filter to reach the lens threads. I test fit the 39mm UV filter from the LLL 8E and that fit fine.
EDIT: Here's the Flickr album with the Mandler 7E pics I've posted since compression seems to be aggressive - https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjCLa5d
