p.12 #2 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
RoamingScott wrote:
I have never seen a single photo by all of the serial DR hand-wringers that deserves the mountain of concerns they lay out on a daily basis.
+++10 for that comment!
Also, this thread has veered rather far from the original topic, but I'm fine with that. A lot of it is interesting.
However, if anyone cares about the opinion of someone who has chased quality and performance and supposed excellence of gear for a long time...my personal conclusion is that basically -all- modern cameras and lenses are better than nearly every photographer. If the photos aren't good enough, look in the mirror for the cause.
p.12 #3 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
Back to our program, already in progress...
The 180-600mm lens is inbound. I gave up waiting for one to show up on the refurb site and found a nice one on eBay. It's coming from a Japanese dealer, so I'll get to see firsthand what the tariff thing is all about.
p.12 #4 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
MikeEvangelist wrote: Back to our program, already in progress...
The 180-600mm lens is inbound. I gave up waiting for one to show up on the refurb site and found a nice one on eBay. It's coming from a Japanese dealer, so I'll get to see firsthand what the tariff thing is all about.
Oof, hope you don't get slapped with those fees I keep hearing about. I've stopped buying Japanese for a bit just to hedge my bets even though list prices are cheaper.
p.12 #5 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
RoamingScott wrote:
Oof, hope you don't get slapped with those fees I keep hearing about. I've stopped buying Japanese for a bit just to hedge my bets even though list prices are cheaper.
If my research was adequate, it looks like it will be 15%. (although there is a slight possibility that there will be no tariff, as the harmonized code that applies, seem to be exempt.) Even assuming the higher amount, the lens is still a good price.
p.12 #7 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
RoamingScott wrote:
I have never seen a single photo by all of the serial DR hand-wringers that deserves the mountain of concerns they lay out on a daily basis.
Well... I don't post family photos on social media, but let me aggressively crop for privacy. See the rapid desaturation in the shadowed portions of baby's face? And this is just ISO 720. A BSI sensor under these conditions doesn't produce such results so early. I've made thousands of exposures in the baby room in the last few months under the same light, and I see this difference at ISO800+ all the time. This is not about adding/removing saturation in post, it's about abrupt saturation changes as luminance changes, so-called tonal transitions that medium format aficionados love talking about.
To reproduce, try portraits in a studio at ISO 800 under soft light.
p.12 #12 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
RoamingScott wrote:
The lighting could not be more different in those photos, this shows nothing.
Yes, not exactly the same, but it's the same room and very similar light (always sunny CA). I am not doing instrumented tests (although that was fun when I was in my 20s). Simply sharing the difference that I see on a regular basis in day-to-day shooting, consistently, as you requested.
One doesn't need to pixel peep too hard to compare both cameras at ISO 800-1600 and notice the difference in smoothness of tonal transitions in skintones and mono-colored fabrics.
p.12 #13 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
I'm sorry but while i understand this matters to you it does nothing for 99,9% of other people. Imo this is a poster child example of pixel-peeping(hard or not) and have very little to no impact for most photographers and/or their clients.
I also agree with Scott, this example proves nothing since the lightning is so different. I'll take the very slight(imo) DR hit in exchange for stacked or "semi stacked" sensor and it benefits. YMMV.
p.12 #14 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
3catsinky wrote:
this worrying about DR has to be the dumbest dick measuring ever! Most of you probably post to facebook or IG, and no one cares! Lens choice matters most in how you want your photos to look. These days, all of my photos are only getting printed 5x7 to go on our photo wall. And at that size, no one can tell or care what system they were shot on. The only thing that matters is how much weight are you willing to sacrifice for quality, at least to me. Clients aren't messaging me asking, what was this shot on, i don't see enough DR, or my background is blurry enough. They love the content. ...Show more →
I mostly print (A3 / A3+) ~13x19” to hang on the wall if the photo is good. If there’s an A2/A2+ printer that doesn’t require daily volume printing I would prefer to do A2
Lower DR (high ISO, phone, 1” sensor, APSC) images are printed A4 / 8x10” , and even at the smaller size you can see the image quality is crappier… but we want to print pictures that captured the right moment and that’s what’s the most important.
4x6 or 5x7 is used as part of the proofing process before committing to a large print
Horses for courses I guess, if you only print 5x7 the requirement on equipment is lower. This could be why you are not as concerned about the DR.
p.12 #15 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
You can easily print A3 or even A2 format pictures from any stacked sensor Nikon without any problems. Like seriously... you're reaching here.
Done it many times, for many people. Never once i heard that DR was lacking.
You're really taking this "DR hit" to the extremes. 99,9% people really don't notice such a subtle things unless you tell them to do it(and what to look for exactly) and even then it's not obvious for most people.
p.12 #16 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
Immortal wrote:
I'm sorry but while i understand this matters to you it does nothing for 99,9% of other people. Imo this is a poster child example of pixel-peeping(hard or not) and have very little to no impact for most photographers and/or their clients.
I also agree with Scott, this example proves nothing since the lightning is so different. I'll take the very slight(imo) DR hit in exchange for stacked or "semi stacked" sensor and it benefits. YMMV.
Why would you take any hit at all?
The R6ii sensor is as fast as the z6iii sensor and has up to a stop more dynamic range
The A1 / A1ii sensors are as fast as the Z9 and have up to a stop better DR
I can see no reason to compromise here
Where the compromise kicks in when moving from FF to Hasselblad / GFX medium format. There is no escaping the slow AF and slow sensor readout (for video) with those cameras.
p.12 #17 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
Immortal wrote:
I'm sorry but while i understand this matters to you it does nothing for 99,9% of other people.
This forum, with all our over-saturated sunsets, endless identical bird photos, and bokeh porn does nothing for "99.9% of other people". None of this stuff ever mattered, and as I said earlier, smartphones are the primary tool of photographers in 2025. There are thousands of iPhone-only Instagram accounts owned by "99.9% of other people", with better photographs than galleries hosted here.
This is a gear-obsessed venue, where gearheads endlessly argue about irrelevant micro-crap. Enjoy!
p.12 #19 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
old-gregg wrote:
This forum, with all our over-saturated sunsets, endless identical bird photos, and bokeh porn does nothing for "99.9% of other people". None of this stuff ever mattered, and as I said earlier, smartphones are the primary tool of photographers in 2025. There are thousands of iPhone-only Instagram accounts owned by "99.9% of other people", with better photographs than galleries hosted here.
This is a gear-obsessed venue, where gearheads endlessly argue about irrelevant micro-crap. Enjoy!
Yeah, that's why i pretty much said in half of my posts in this topic - "real world aplications". This forum for obvious reasons does not represent "99,9%" of the people.
Like i said i am yet to meet a client who will notice a 0,5-1 DR difference between current gen cameras even in A2 size prints. It just really is for forum-nerd talks, nothing more.
Also there is nothing weird in a fact that talented people will get good photos even with iPhone or any other smartphone, is it better or worse than galleries hosted here - i'm not gonna be so judgemental as you, as it's a matter of preference. I will however say - there are some amazing photos here too and many talanted people in that regard.
p.12 #20 · After 13 years of all Sony, I'm trying Nikon
j4nu wrote:
Well, we've already learned in this thread that readout speed is overrated.
I guess we will now learn the same about DR ...
Readout speed is a means to an end, not the end goal.
The real objective is to minimize rolling shutter artifacts and banding.
If the electronic shutter achieves this more effectively, use it.
However if the mechanical shutter performs better, use that instead.
...
