p.3 #1 · Sony A7RV or Sony A7IV for Sports Photography
RoamingScott wrote:
Uh...no. Electronic shutter wise, sure, but all non-A1-or-A9 will have that. Mechanical shooting won't have those issues.
It's not just about the electronic shutter. Because of the slow sensor you really notice that the A7RV is not able to do as many AF calculations per second as something like the A1 of A9.
I tried my A7RV multiple times for fast erratic moving subjects and it just wasn't able to keep the subjects in focus. When I then switched to my A9 the difference always was night and day. (Both with the extremely fast focusing 70-200 GM II lens.)
This is why I would never rely on the A7RV for shooting sports.
For slower moving subjects the AF system of the A7RV is fantastic, because of the great subject recognition.
p.3 #2 · Sony A7RV or Sony A7IV for Sports Photography
Jochenb wrote:
It's not just about the electronic shutter. Because of the slow sensor you really notice that the A7RV is not able to do as many AF calculations per second as something like the A1 of A9.
I tried my A7RV multiple times for fast erratic moving subjects and it just wasn't able to keep the subjects in focus. When I then switched to my A9 the difference always was night and day. (Both with the extremely fast focusing 70-200 GM II lens.)
This is why I would never rely on the A7RV for shooting sports.
For slower moving subjects the AF system of the A7RV is fantastic, because of the great subject recognition.
I wasn't addressing that. I was addressing that the A7RV sensor speed leads to warped bats, which it doesn't if used properly, just like every other camera. I'm sure you're right regarding sports in general, as sensor speed is always tied to the speed of AF.
p.3 #3 · Sony A7RV or Sony A7IV for Sports Photography
These days for sports, where lower 24 Mpixel resolution is usually acceptable I would seek out an A9II if you don’t have the money for an A1 or an A9III. This is based on my own experience with the A9, A9II, A1, A7RV, and A7IV. These days I own an A1 and A7RV so I didn’t try to do sports with the A7RV. Not that it can’t be done by the camera if needed but my reflexes are not up to the task as I get older.
Based on what I believe Scott has said make sure you choose a camera with a true two curtain mechanical shutter, with a long life Or a stacked sensor to ensure your images don’t have the distortion caused by rolling shutter. You can be successful with a slower frames per sec of 10 gps but if haven’t shot sports before realize it will take practice to develop the skills that many award winning sports photographers developed over many years of learning. Assume you need the skill / reflexes of an athlete trying to hit that 90-100 mph fastball your trying to capture hitting the bat if baseball your trying to capture. Or the ability to return that serve you were hit to in tennis. (Just my opinion).
Good luck with whatever you buy. Follow up and let us know what you choose.
p.3 #4 · Sony A7RV or Sony A7IV for Sports Photography
Magnum PI wrote:
That may be. My point was his potential budget. Most go from the US based MAP / MSRP and never consider buying from a grey market seller with a proper discount and tax free.
The $2799 price I paid here wasn't grey market. Full receipt from authorized camera store.
p.3 #5 · Sony A7RV or Sony A7IV for Sports Photography
It's once again one of those things that none of us can answer as we don't know what your level of expectation is and what is "good enough." My answer would be neither and to go in a different direction.
p.3 #6 · Sony A7RV or Sony A7IV for Sports Photography
So I have been shooting youth soccer (non-professionally) for over 20 years. (Started with our sons and their friends club and high school teams and now I am shooting my granddaughter's teams.) Over the years I have shot nearly 200 youth soccer games from Saturday after 5-6 years olds to state high school championships. I started with a Canon film camera as digital wasn't available yet. The cost of film alone drove me to the Canon 1D when it was first announced. We all thought it was amazing! 4 MB sensor! Usable images up to 1600. Autofocus? Ha ha. Frames per second? I was happy if I had 5 fps with my lenses. I was amazed with the Canon 1D Mark 1. Until the Mark 2 came out. ! I am sure you know the story. For me, the Mark 1 was perfect - until it wasn't. Because something better came out. Rinse and repeat. I was obsessed with the latest. So I had the Mark 2, Mark 3 and Mark 4.
Over time I started doing landscape photography which led me to Sony mirrorless due to the reduced size and weight for hiking. A7, A7r2, A7r3. Then I started shooting youth soccer again and the "r" series cameras were not fast enough so I jumped on the A1 until it came out. I should have stuck with that. But 90% of my photography was landscape and I was blown away by the ergonomics of the A7r5. Sold the A1 for an a7r5. For landscapes it was great. But for soccer it just felt terribly sluggish. Drove me nuts. I was only doing a 3-4 games a year at that time so I "lived with it". But when the a93 came out I jumped. I LOVED the speed, the af, the fps (although I rarely did more than 30 fps) and especially - and this is huge - the Pre-Capture. So is the a93 the "perfect" camera for youth soccer? ! I just sold my a93 to KEH for $3,200. And ordered an A1 II. Once I have that I will sell my A7R5 to MPB for $2,200. The A1 II will do everything I "need" and for now everything I "want". ;-)
Why the long story? timgagnloff used the term, "good enough". Someone else mentioned something about "the perfect camera". For some of us (me), many cameras have been "good enough" until something new came along.
Is the a7r5 "good enough"? I loved it for landscape work. For soccer, it felt sluggish for me. Especially when I started shooting with the a93. BUT, the a7r5 is way, way better than all those Canon bodies I used for years and with which I captured hundreds of images that were treasured by parents (and grandparents). Do I NEED 30 fps and 50+ MP and AI autofocus and 12 stops of dynamic range and ...? Do I enjoy shooting with faster, more accurate camera bodies that I can crop so as to more easily get shots from farther away. Absolutely. Is it "worth the insane amount of money I have spent on these camera bodies?" !
You (and most on this forum) are much wiser than me. So, as many have suggested, I would start with something used. Maybe through FM's Buy/Sell page, maybe from MPB or KEH or some similar service. After all, there are a good number of A1's that are going to show up on the used market. I personally know of an a93 that is in near-new condition that KEH will be selling, ;-) And my a7r5 will be up for sale through one of those services in a month or two. Buy used. Use the experience to find out what features matter the most to you. And get good glass!!!
p.3 #7 · Sony A7RV or Sony A7IV for Sports Photography
^^^^
I want to underscore for sports the importance of good glass, specifically for AF.
I was shooting some event type stuff for a local food rescue organization and my Samyang 50AFii could not acquire eye AF and track people who were moving boxes of food from a vehicle to a loading dock. Every shot was out of focus. This is with the A9iii. I had the 24GM with me as well that day and it had no problem with the same task. I went back to basically shoot the same scene later that week with the ZA55 and no issues - only one shot out of 50 was out of focus.
! I am sure you know the story. For me, the Mark 1 was perfect - until it wasn't. Because something better came out. Rinse and repeat. I was obsessed with the latest. So I had the Mark 2, Mark 3 and Mark 4.