The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
mahimihi Offline • [X]
p.2 #1 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
Fred Miranda wrote:
From Leicarumors.com:
Latest post:
A quick update on my last post about the upcoming Leica M11-P camera – the latest rumors indicated that the M11-P will be officially announced in November 2023. Stay tuned for updates."
Previous post:
Leica is rumored/expected to announce a new M11-P camera by the end of the year (2023).
Here is the previous release history of digital Leica M cameras:
Leica M10: January 2017
Leica M10P: August 2018
Leica M10M: January 2020
Leica M10R: July 2020
Leica M11: January 2022
Leica M11M: April 2023
___________________
It's likely that the Leica M11-P will be announced soon! Who's planning to get one? I'm still loving my M10-R Black Paint....Show more →
Yep. I’m loving my M10R Black Paint also. I would never ever exchange it for an M11. The only camera that would tempt me would be an M2 that was just CLA’d and repainted glossy black paint by Kanto. Little brassy here and there. With a black paint 35 8E to match and a black paint 50 Lux v2.
p.2 #2 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
1bwana1 wrote:
The traditional light meter has already been removed from the M11. Exposure is calculated directly off the sensor now. It is both more accurate, and more flexible than tradional light meters ever were. No more blown highlights. I would hate to give that up.
You are also free to ignore it and set all exposure parameters by eye using Sunny 16 or whatever. Like Burger King you can have it your way.
You wouldn't lose the metering. As I mentioned, it could be a menu 'option'. This means you'll still have the precise M11 metering, but you'll also have the option to use the camera without metering if you want. In essence, with this engaged, the shutter would stay closed, similar to the M10-R versions, resulting in quicker shutter response (basically cut in half) and faster continuous shooting. I've sent this feedback to Leica but it's still a long shot.
p.2 #3 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
Fred Miranda wrote:
You wouldn't lose the metering. As I mentioned, it could be a menu 'option'. This means you'll still have the precise M11 metering, but you'll also have the option to use the camera without metering if you want. In essence, with this engaged, the shutter would stay closed, similar to the M10-R versions, resulting in quicker shutter response (basically cut in half) and faster continuous shooting. I've sent this feedback to Leica but it's still a long shot.
Since that is essentially a firmware issue ... one that would improve PERFORMANCE ... it could be fitting to release the update on the M11P.
Then a later upgrade the firmware on the M11M, also ... could even do the M11 (for an upcharge, likely).
p.2 #4 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
RustyBug wrote:
Since that is essentially a firmware issue ... one that would improve PERFORMANCE ... it could be fitting to release the update on the M11P.
Then a later upgrade the firmware on the M11M, also ... could even do the M11 (for an upcharge, likely).
Yes, this should be all software. The M11 doesn't have a separate metering sensor; instead, it calculates exposure directly from its own sensor. If Leica added this as a menu option, it would make the M11-P an all-manual camera. This could be helpful for folks who use the Sunny 16 rule or an external light meter. The benefit is faster operation because the shutter works just like it did in older M cameras, opening and closing when you take a photo.
p.2 #5 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
I see Leica Rumors shows an email from Leica which I also received where it seems a new "something" was featured in the issue now embargoed until 30 October. So is it the M11P or an M with EVF?
p.2 #6 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
algrove wrote:
I see Leica Rumors shows an email from Leica which I also received where it seems a new "something" was featured in the issue now embargoed until 30 October. So is it the M11P or an M with EVF?
p.2 #7 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
Fred Miranda wrote:
Yes, this should be all software. The M11 doesn't have a separate metering sensor; instead, it calculates exposure directly from its own sensor. If Leica added this as a menu option, it would make the M11-P an all-manual camera. This could be helpful for folks who use the Sunny 16 rule or an external light meter. The benefit is faster operation because the shutter works just like it did in older M cameras, opening and closing when you take a photo.
EFCS would also do this, only better for most people who like to have a meter. Mind you the M11 isn't really any slower than previous digital M's. It's just perception, not actually a real world difference. The 3/100th's difference between the M10R and M11 is less than most people reaction time.
p.2 #8 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
1bwana1 wrote:
Does that mean my Silver version with the brass top is more rare and valuable?
The silver M11 should be no more rare and valuable than the silver M10 and M9 are compared to their black counterparts – if anything, they take longer to sell. That said, the silver M11 could retain slightly higher value if the M11-P moves to anodized silver on aluminum versus silver chrome on brass, but we have no indication of that as of yet.
p.2 #9 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
RustyBug wrote:
Since that is essentially a firmware issue ... one that would improve PERFORMANCE ... it could be fitting to release the update on the M11P.
Then a later upgrade the firmware on the M11M, also ... could even do the M11 (for an upcharge, likely).
That might be something they eventually offer on an M11-D, but for the M11-P, I think Leica is up to their engineering eyeballs in firmware complexities as it is without adding a new-old shutter mode that also disables metering.
p.2 #11 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
That is why I brought up the subject of an M EVF camera. Overgaard knows people in the know at Leica.
Wonder if an M EVF would sell better than an M11P since a recent sondage suggested 50% would buy an Mevf? And another 9% would buy both M11 and MEVF. No Q&A about an M11P though.
I would try one over an M11P if all the P does is give me another Monochrom look and top engraving.
p.2 #14 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
Here is how I look at it.
I already have the ability to shoot my M11 in three different ways (more if you count special FL view finders).
1.) Range finder. I have reached the point where I am reasonable accurate with focus, exposure, and framing this way. i enjoy it, and shoot this way 95%+ of the time. It is a major part of why I love my M cameras.
2.) From the rear LCD screen. I use this for landscapes, and some portraits where I am shooting from a tripod. This experience is the same as any other high end mirrorless camera. I get WYSIWYG framing, focus, DOF, and exposure.
3.) Through the VisoFlex EVF. The one for the M11 is very much improved. Still, I really only shoot this in rare circumstances like close ups, and very shallow DOF images with longer fast lenses.
So, as far as I am concerned, I already have a hybrid mirrorless camera. If an integrated switchable RF/EVF camera is offered I have little motivation to use it. Especially if it compromises the RF experience in any way. If I wanted to shoot with an EVF rather than a RF I would use my Sony. It is really good at that.
I hope the M11-P has more interesting advancements than an integrated EVF, and paint/fashion options.
p.2 #15 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
1bwana1 wrote:
If I wanted to shoot with an EVF rather than a RF I would use my Sony. It is really good at that.
Problem with this approach - and I also have and use sometimes a Sony MLC - is that some wider M and LTM lenses are problematic to use adapted on an unmodified Sony sensor. Advantage of a Leica hybrid camera with EVF is that the same lenses should be able to be used with same performance as on a traditional M. Similar of using M lenses on a current SL series camera but that hopefully a future EVF-based M/Q hybrid is smaller in size, comes maybe also with M-mount instead of L-mount and complements a traditional M.
p.2 #16 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
retrofocus wrote:
Problem with this approach - and I also have and use sometimes a Sony MLC - is that some wider M and LTM lenses are problematic to use adapted on an unmodified Sony sensor. Advantage of a Leica hybrid camera with EVF is that the same lenses should be able to be used with same performance as on a traditional M. Similar of using M lenses on a current SL series camera but that hopefully a future EVF-based M/Q hybrid is smaller in size, comes maybe also with M-mount instead of L-mount and complements a traditional M.
Out of my 5 M lenses three are Voightlander. Each has a native E-Mount version available. The two Leica lenses I have are the 35mm Lux and the 50mm Cron. Voightlander has E-Mount versions for those also.
I generally don't shoot my M mount glass on my Sony even though I have the adapter. The IQ and the ergonomic experience is just not the same. I do have a couple of E mount Voigtlanders that I shoot for character occasionally.
My point is that I shoot Leica M for many more reasons than the glass. The Range Finder being a big part of that.
Oct 11, 2023 at 07:33 AM
mahimihi Offline • [X]
p.2 #17 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
The one thing they could do is release it in black BRASS. Other than making it not lock up and more reliable I don’t know what else they could do. Making it more complicated I don’t think should be the strategy.
But they have to come up with some gimmick to sell it.
1) mechanical shutter to 1/8000
2) make it in brass for black
3) MUCH faster SD card read/write speeds instead of the crap they have now
4) Bring the internal memory to 256GB
5) all software and hardware problems FIXED for real
6) redesign the ISO dial as a push design to lock/unlock instead of pull
7) the most useful addition to an M camera would be a tilt screen like on the Leica Q.
And the M is a RANGEFINDER camera. Keep EVFs away from it aside from the external option. If you’re going to do anything just improve the rangefinder experience.
For example. Make a zoomable optical viewfinder.go back to 0.68x magnification and instead of the lever preview make it a lever that zooms the finder from 0.68 to 0.91x
p.2 #18 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
1bwana1 wrote:
Out of my 5 M lenses three are Voightlander. Each has a native E-Mount version available. The two Leica lenses I have are the 35mm Lux and the 50mm Cron. Voightlander has E-Mount versions for those also.
I generally don't shoot my M mount glass on my Sony even though I have the adapter. The IQ and the ergonomic experience is just not the same. I do have a couple of E mount Voigtlanders that I shoot for character occasionally.
My point is that I shoot Leica M for many more reasons than the glass. The Range Finder being a big part of that....Show more →
True, but using designated E-mount and Leica M in parallel requires two sets of lenses which I personally rather like to avoid (been there, done this!). The discussion if a hybrid EVF Leica-based camera with exchangeable lens mount is useful or not reminds me on the discussions 10 years ago if higher MP/higher DR sensors are useful - in the end they are set as professional standard now but users have the option to choose from different sensor resolutions. Same now with the EV hybrid camera discussion - good for those who see fit - others can ignore where no fit is seen. In the end such camera will hit the market and will be a success IMO.
Oct 11, 2023 at 07:43 AM
mahimihi Offline • [X]
p.2 #19 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
retrofocus wrote:
True, but using designated E-mount and Leica M in parallel requires two sets of lenses which I personally rather like to avoid (been there, done this!). The discussion if a hybrid EVF Leica-based camera with exchangeable lens mount is useful or not reminds me on the discussions 10 years ago if higher MP/higher DR sensors are useful - in the end they are set as professional standard now but users have the option to choose from different sensor resolutions. Same now with the EV hybrid camera discussion - good for those who see fit - others can ignore where no fit is seen. In the end such camera will hit the market and will be a success IMO. ...Show more →
All they need to do is shrink the SL to a Nikon Z6II size and shrink the lenses too.
p.2 #20 · The Leica M11-P is expected to be released by November 2023
mahimihi wrote:
All they need to do is shrink the SL to a Nikon Zf size and shrink the lenses too.
Problem with the SL lenses is that they are all AF-based and therefore remain larger similar to std DSLR lenses. It remains to be seen if Leica's commitment to the L-mount with bulkier camera and lenses was a good move. Since demand for the SL remains below expectation even after all the advertisement Leica tried to do for the line, I doubt this line will be as much of a success than the M line.
