p.23 #1 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
photomadnz wrote:
Yeah its an interesting debate this one. I too had the Loxia 85 which is an incredible lens for what it is designed for. But Ive determined through some lens selling etc that I now want a 85mm that can do double duty and for that I need AF. I love the rendering of the GM and find the bokeh and look hard to go past. Ive looked at every comparison online that I can find and the Sigma seems to run close in various scenarios and doesn't look anywhere near as good in others.
I am yet to have a copy of the Sigma in hand to try so I guess my tests for my uses will be the tell tale. I have a 60x40 inch print hanging in our retail space which is a client's file from a GM, wide open, jpeg only, @800 iso on an R3 and it is phenomenal. So the 'worst' aperture and nothing favourable in the shooting and customers want to rub their nose's close to it, tip their glasses, and after that they are simply in awe of the quality. I think sometimes, we as photographers need to keep the absolute sharpness thing in perspective just a little. ...Show more →
Absolutely. I think the GM, for its purpose, is one of the best 85's ever released. It renders truly great portraits wide open or close to it and stopped down it's sharp as hell...if you believe Optical Limits (Photozone), stopped down it's sharper than the B85 in the centre, as sharp in corners and I thought that lens was a great landscape lens.
My hope is that the Sigma 85 brings used prices down and I can create a GM dream team of the 85 and the 100STF. For what I'd use the GM for, it's basically perfect. I'm an undemanding AF user, though, so perhaps if someone was more interested in AF or tracking performance, the Sigma is a better choice.
p.23 #2 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
I've been testing this lens during a 2 week roadtrip in Italy. No photos to share yet, since I only just got home.
These are some of my thoughts now that I know it really well:
- The sharpness is amazing, even at 1.4
- The lack of CA is impressive compared to other fast 85's
- Very nice size and weight
- The AF is silent and reasonably fast. However: it's clearly a step below my Sony 85/1.8 when it comes to tracking.
The first shot in a burst is spot on most of the time, but the following shots often are not (depending on how fast the subjects move ofcourse). I've seen this behaviour in other Sigma DG DN lenses as well and makes me believe Sigma still has some work to do on their AF algorithm. The first shot is so good and fast most of the time, so it's not that the AF motor isn't fast enough. This is on an A9 so the camera is not the bottleneck here.
- The pincushion distortion really is huge, unseen before in any 85 I've ever used.
- It has VERY strong vignetting. I was surprised that even at F8 you get dark (extreme) corners.
Again something I've never seen before in any of the many 85's I've used.
- The bokeh is mostly good (also helped by the lack of CA), but it can be a bit rougher on the edges when your subject is at mid distance. The GM does offer a smoother look.
p.23 #3 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
Jochenb wrote:
I've been testing this lens during a 2 week roadtrip in Italy. No photos to share yet, since I only just got home.
These are some of my thoughts now that I know it really well:
- The sharpness is amazing, even at 1.4
- The lack of CA is impressive compared to other fast 85's
- Very nice size and weight
- The AF is silent and reasonably fast. However: it's clearly a step below my Sony 85/1.8 when it comes to tracking.
The first shot in a burst is spot on most of the time, but the following shots often are not (depending on how fast the subjects move ofcourse). I've seen this behaviour in other Sigma DG DN lenses as well and makes me believe Sigma still has some work to do on their AF algorithm. The first shot is so good and fast most of the time, so it's not that the AF motor isn't fast enough. This is on an A9 so the camera is not the bottleneck here.
- The pincushion distortion really is huge, unseen before in any 85 I've ever used.
- It has VERY strong vignetting. I was surprised that even at F8 you get dark (extreme) corners.
Again something I've never seen before in any of the many 85's I've used.
- The bokeh is mostly good (also helped by the lack of CA), but it can be a bit rougher on the edges when you're subject is at mid distance. The GM does offer a smoother look. ...Show more →
Spot on! ... and some deeper facts regarding AF as well. I found it to work similarly, i.e. it's usually pretty fast but has trouble keeping up (on A7III though) with my children when they are moving uncontrollably .
I'd say regarding vignetting I never really noticed it because I have correction always on. It's not as bad as Sigma 35mm f1.2, where wide open vignetting is visible even with correction enabled (though I like the effect there)...
p.23 #6 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
I tried hard to like and keep this lens but it's going back. Love the weight and center sharpness and no focus shift but my copy, which I think is characteristic of the design, had unusual/unique edge curvature. Real world shooting for me mimics what I see when I shoot a chart and since I need this lens for both landscape and some cityscapes it's important for the lens to be as planar as possible. When shooting a chart if I focus in the center all four corners are out. If I focus on the corners, any corner, all four corners are in and the center going outward to 4/5 of the image are out. The outer periphery is very unique with respect to the rest of the image area. This must be a design consideration which will not bother some but it sure does me. This, along with the extreme pincushion distortion, caused me to send the lens back.
I also have the Sigma 85mm HSM lens..... big, heavy, ....did I mention big and heavy? My copy is as close to perfect as I have seen in the numerous, numerous lenses I have owned and auditioned. My copy is about as planar as possible with no focus shift and zero distortion. I sure wish it was smaller and lighter but it hits 100% for what I need image wise.
So that's where I'm at with the DN. Hope this adds to the mix of perspective buyers.
p.23 #8 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
Here to confirm that flare and ghost are are no problem with this DN lens.
Instead both are extremely well controlled.
The other point is regarding flat plane.
No issues here as also at 1.4 if the center is in focus all 4 borders are (ARE) in focus and very sharp.
The only concern is related to distortion but as told by others this can be easily and automatically corrected.
If anyone is interested I can provide examples with PRODIBI.
Brief summary: Sigma sharper in the center at all apertures; GM sharper at the edge up to f2.8. The biggest surprise is the Sigma's performance from 5.6 on: it seems their deliberate design decision to move the aperture to a place in the lens where the diameter of the image forming light is greater, to minimize the effects of diffraction, has really paid off here. Kudos Sigma!
These tests were done at 42MP; I'd say the Sigma will pull away even further from the GM on 60MP.
p.23 #10 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
The results are pretty surprising to me, as I never noticed significant sharpness difference across the frame wide open.
... but maybe at this high level of MTF even such a big difference between center and corner is beyond my eye's capabilities .
Brief summary: Sigma sharper in the center at all apertures; GM sharper at the edge up to f2.8. The biggest surprise is the Sigma's performance from 5.6 on: it seems their deliberate design decision to move the aperture to a place in the lens where the diameter of the image forming light is greater, to minimize the effects of diffraction, has really paid off here. Kudos Sigma!
These tests were done at 42MP; I'd say the Sigma will pull away even further from the GM on 60MP....Show more →
p.23 #12 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
Yes, the Samyang is actually the better lens according to ephotozine based on the verdict section...
Maybe they had a less then stellar copy of the Sigma, as the difference in sharpness throughout the frame is hard to explain based on my experience.
p.23 #16 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
The rule with data analysis is to crosscheck several sources, and look for obvious anomalies. In some of these tests at the ephotozine site, the edge (presumably the wide edge, image height 18mm from axis/centre) is stronger than the on-axis MTF. To my knowledge this never happens; occasionally with Zeiss's K-8 results you can see a rise to just off-centre if the 'rules' used permit the operator to do this.
And remember, sharpness is as perceptual as it is also measurable; some lenses look sharper than they test, as compared with others. I see the Zeiss Otus 100/1.4 (among others) is way ahead of the RF 85/1.2 at that site, but the Canon users believe the RF is super sharp. So it's all relative as well.
Looking past methodology, the Sigma appears to a great all round lens, very useful as a travel-landscape lens as well as the wide open fineness. At least, a quick look at these charts dispels the widely believed untruth that 'they are all the same at f8'. No they certainly are not, even if it sounds 'truthy'.
PS Keep an eye on lensrentals blog to test the new DG DN.
p.23 #17 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
For me I’m about about real world performance and couldn’t care less about test charts
I am hopefully meeting with a buyer tomorrow for my Samyang so if that goes through, I’ll just wait for a good sale on the Sigma which will likely be Boxing Day!
p.23 #18 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
The Sigma looks great, and I'm tempted purely because I love having an aperture ring. And the samples on this thread are impressive.
Having said that, I'm on my second copy of the Samyang 85mm and unlike my first it seems to have no issues with AF. I don't see much issue with IQ from the Samyang, and the distortion bothers me a bit on the Sigma.
p.23 #19 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
dave unwin wrote:
The Sigma looks great, and I'm tempted purely because I love having an aperture ring. And the samples on this thread are impressive.
Having said that, I'm on my second copy of the Samyang 85mm and unlike my first it seems to have no issues with AF. I don't see much issue with IQ from the Samyang, and the distortion bothers me a bit on the Sigma.
If you’re happy with the copy you have then I don’t see any reason to switch! In saying that, I have a near perfect copy of the Sigma but the better build quality, sharper corner to corner performance and 11 aperture blades is what makes me want it.
p.23 #20 · In Stock: Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art ($1,199)
Yeah, I compared the two and it really boils down to what you value in a lens.
I'd say as an allrounder, the Sigma is probably a bit better (if you can live with that distortion or accept correction). For people only, I think I'd choose SY (if you can live with the color cast, which is more or less visible depending on the light I'd say along with some randomness in AF reliability under certain lightning).
Also, while heavier, Sigma is rather slim (handling wise it reminds me of a bit bigger 24GM) but Samyang is like an even fatter (volume, not weight) Batis...
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