I'm using RAW files with Capture One. I am not saying the colors are not accurate, they are very accurate. I am just finding that the images lack saturation and contrast compared to the Nikon lens. I do see this behavior normally with my Sony images but it just seems that it's more so with this lens. The images I am seeing online look pretty good, so I was just wondering whether you guys who have been using it have changed your workflow and have felt the need to boost things a bit in post.
The GM just render a more neutral look. Thats what makes them great but you can certainly give it a little extra pop. Try 3 or 4 points of black and like 9 clarity points. You honestly want things neutral. The A7rII with its huge DR render files flatter thats what you want as it is getting into the dark shadows and leveling it off thats what big DR does. You want punch you need to add it.
No its pretty much the sensor. seriously though when you have high DR files you will also get flatter looking files . It flattens out the curve. Trust me this is good and being a raw shooter you have tons of elbow room. The GM lenses are designed neutral again what you want. You as a raw shooter do not want the camera lens to be doing anything really than render neutral. You can always add but some thing are hard to take away like shadow noise once its there its there
GMPhotography wrote:
No its pretty much the sensor. seriously though when you have high DR files you will also get flatter looking files . It flattens out the curve. Trust me this is good and being a raw shooter you have tons of elbow room.
Spot on Guy. We've discussed this as well with the 85 GM. This shot wasn't with a GM lens, but it shows how much 'pop' is available in the a7r2 raw file - i posted this shot the other day on the 'big' thread - here is a before/after (i went back and dug out the original b/c a friend asked me if the quality of light in Sicily was really that good in May and i said it was good, but not b/c of what you're seeing in the file - that is the result of the Sony sensor)
i may have even over-done it just a touch on this one, but it's so easy to bring out color and pop w/ this sensor (CapOne v9)
Understood but when I compared with the Nikon 24-70 I was using a D810 which is hardly lacking in dynamic range. As many have said, Nikon does something different with the Sony sensors.
i had the d800 (and a ton of Nikon before that) and the a7r - but i find there's something with this BSI sensor, which i think the a7r2 is the first FF to implement (certainly that i've used), that really keeps the colors clean throughout the enormous DR - something i haven't experienced previously. maybe it's just me, but it just seems like i'm able to get the pop i'm looking for without a lot of issues. i also find that adding pop is easier (particularly with the GM lenses) than trying to tone down too much contrast that some lenses (e.g. batis 85) start out with.
ecarlino wrote:
Spot on Guy. We've discussed this as well with the 85 GM. This shot wasn't with a GM lens, but it shows how much 'pop' is available in the a7r2 raw file - i posted this shot the other day on the 'big' thread - here is a before/after (i went back and dug out the original b/c a friend asked me if the quality of light in Sicily was really that good in May and i said it was good, but not b/c of what you're seeing in the file - that is the result of the Sony sensor)
i may have even over-done it just a touch on this one, but it's so easy to bring out color and pop w/ this sensor (CapOne v9)
Very nice! This may not be the place, but can you share what adjustments you did to achieve that? Is it global settings, local adjustments, tone masking? What?
p.43 #10 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
virtualrain wrote:
Very nice! This may not be the place, but can you share what adjustments you did to achieve that? Is it global settings, local adjustments, tone masking? What?
the most i ever do - and this is why i'm loving Cap1 v9 (along w/ the a7r2 files) - b/c the result is a lot cleaner looking than anything i've used previously -
is 'auto', 'clarity', 'saturation', 'highlights', 'shadows' and adding a bit of contrast via a 'curve preset'. sometimes white balance.
on that one, i forget if i painted the sky with a brush to bring it out even more, it looks like i probably did (i.e. apply certain of those adjustments specifically to the sky and others to the foreground).
i took 2300 shots on my last 17 day trip to Italy in May. When i was done playing with the 118 shots i selected to work with, i figured out that i spent an average of 7 minutes on each image. So, i don't spend a lot of time 'fixing' anything. in a year or two when i decide to print a shot for my walls, i'll spend a lot more time on each one, particularly because i print at 30" x 50" and i clean up every dust spec and stupid pigeon that snuck into the shot, etc and selectively sharpen and uprez and so on.
p.43 #11 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
Try color editor next time on your sky. Go to advance mode select a nice blue. Do very little saturation maybe 2 points than use the lighten /darken slider and adjust that to taste. Now for those that don't know when you select that blue it ONLY changes that blue and you can adjust that amount of blue through the whole image. Thats my secret sauce don't tell anyone . Capice
I use it on certain colors to highlight it to darken others and such. EXTREMELY powerful tool. Its kind of like burning and dodging in color
p.43 #12 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
GMPhotography wrote:
Try color editor next time on your sky. Go to advance mode select a nice blue. Do very little saturation maybe 2 points than use the lighten /darken slider and adjust that to taste. Now for those that don't know when you select that blue it ONLY changes that blue and you can adjust that amount of blue through the whole image. Thats my secret sauce don't tell anyone . Capice
I use it on certain colors to highlight it to darken others and such. EXTREMELY powerful tool. Its kind of like burning and dodging in color
Great suggestion Guy. Not sure what "color editor" you're referring to . . . . I'm not familiar with Capture One, for example. In LR you can do much or all of such adjustments in the HSL tab in the Develop module, although I would typically do this type of step in PS and use a color mask, which you of course also referred to. Or an editing brush in LR . . . . many options.
p.43 #13 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
Yea I think its your editing brush. I don't use LR so maybe Fred can expand on this . Basically you want a tool that you can pick certain colors lets say yellow and there are sunflowers in a nice wide landscape shot with tons of sunflowers you select that yellow and only that yellow and do sort a dodge or lightening that up. Than take the browns around it and darken that down. this gives you that pop that really just makes images jump. Ill find a image i did this too and post just finishing up on a long design project at the moment.
p.43 #14 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
NIK vivenza makes selective colour adjustments a breeze. It is free now from Google..try it out...you will never go back to LR / PS for selective adjustments.
p.43 #16 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
chez wrote:
NIK vivenza makes selective colour adjustments a breeze. It is free now from Google..try it out...you will never go back to LR / PS for selective adjustments.
I used NIK Viveza extensively back when I was using Apple Aperture. It was amazing as you say.
Now that I've switched to Capture One , it offers nearly the same ease of selective adjustments (but with more fine tuning) using color selection to create a mask. The power and number of controls available on a masked area is incredible... essentially the full pallet of adjustment tools.
You should give it a try. It took my images to a whole new level. Clarity and structure in Capture One are particularly effective compared to the NIK equivalent.
p.43 #17 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
MJKoski wrote:
What is that issue jlevasseur presented in the previous page? He did not reply after that.
Hi, sorry – so busy at work that I haven't had time to check back here. After posting on Monday, I realized that I may have been seeing condensation on an interior element. I was backpacking in the North Cascades and it got chilly overnight, so while taking pictures at sunrise the lens was quite cold. In fact, at one point the front element fogged up and needed to be cleaned.
It's been overcast here all week, but hopefully some sun peeks out tomorrow and I can run some more tests & update my original post. Very happy with many of the pictures from last weekend, though. Quite an extraordinary (and pricey) lens, worthy carrying even with 40 lbs on your back :P
-jim
p.s. Can't remember who asked, but the artifact occurred with and w/o the lens hood.
p.43 #19 · Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM Rolling Review
Fred Miranda wrote:
Same here. they are both very good starting at f/5.6 for landscapes.
Yea i just tested my 24-70 at 50mm today in the other thread and the zoom is a wonderful lens at 50mm stopped down a bit. We have been so lucky by some of the latest lenses coming to market , the GMs are just outstanding and the new 50 is killer sharp. Keep them coming. Im starting to think having the new 70 -200 2.8 just to have when i need that length.
