If you don't need the 5D3 for action and/or high ISO, the "upgrade" may feel like a dud. Outside those two areas, the 5D2 is 99% what the 5D3 is.
And I guess that 99% of 5D3 owners disagree with you. Even without the other advantages of the 5D3, the ability to AF at f8 makes it 10% better for many.
I’ll shoot divorces several time a year and the proceedings leading up to them. I need a camera(s) that are cheap in price( disposable), that give very good IQ for friends, family, lawyers, and others interested in the private goings on of the battling couple.
I find that Canon’s 5Dc along with the 30D fits my criteria and perform well under sometimes less than hospitable conditions encountered in such a venue.
Being distracted by features such as LiveView, and a large, bright screen that gives away your shooting location and illuminates you as a target is just not acceptable, and may I say downright dangerous for a clandestine photo shoot when the subject(s) are already on edge and suspicious of events around them.
So no … the 5DIII is not much better than the 5DII and neither one can compete with the 5Dc in the field of invasive photography…
Of course the OP is entitled to his opinion, and it is a valid one for his limited situation; what makes the original post so inflammatory is the statement that anyone else's different opinion is a result of stupidity (ingestion of a "stupid drug", i.e., one that induces stupidity)...
I think it's just that form reads way too much about gear, then buys late.
It's like watching ads about a movie and then listening to people rave about a movie over and over for months and months. Then you finally see the movie and it doesn't live up to all the hype you've been filling yourself with that your subconscious exaggerates.
Nothing can ever hope to live up to what your mind has created.
I think that the difference between 5d2 and 5d3 autofocus...is much smaller than Canon would like anyone to believe. I will modify my OP to be less "inflammatory."
I'm not wholly dissatisfied, but a little bit surprised that the focus isn't better. I will get used to it and see if I can get more out of it with more tweaking and familiarity. It's going to stick around no matter what.
form wrote:
I'm not wholly dissatisfied, but a little bit surprised that the focus isn't better. I will get used to it and see if I can get more out of it with more tweaking and familiarity. It's going to stick around no matter what.
The 5D3 AF is blisteringly good, but it's complex. You really need to microadjust too to get the best out of it
At least now I have a choice of AF points that actually work when I'm shooting people in portrait orientation - more choice than I even had on my 1Ds3 and I'm not having to focus manually or recompose like with the 5D2
I don't shoot sport but if I did there is so much good stuff on the 5D3.
It's a shame Canon didn't boost the IQ a bit but otherwise it's a fantastic camera.
form wrote:
I'm not wholly dissatisfied, but a little bit surprised that the focus isn't better. I will get used to it and see if I can get more out of it with more tweaking and familiarity. It's going to stick around no matter what.
Not sure what kind of shooting you mostly do but coming from a BIF guy like me, the 5D3 AF is a HUGE improvement...The AF alone is worth all the extra money. My data point is against a 50D which I don't think is that much different from a 5D2?
form wrote:
I think that the difference between 5d2 and 5d3 autofocus...is much smaller than Canon would like anyone to believe. I will modify my OP to be less "inflammatory."
In my experience the biggest improvement in the 5DM3's AF is its uncanny ability require no MA on the majority of lenses I've used with it. Others have echoed this experience as well. Canon either did something with the tolerances of the optical path to the AF sensors or invented some type of auto-calibrating mechanism to correct for misalignment. This translates to much better out-of-box AF accuracy. The next biggest improvement was shot-to-shot precision, particularly with Canon's latest generation lenses. Can't speak to the 5DM3's AF servo improvements but you're not the first to report that AI servo in low-light still has room for improvement.
form wrote:
I think that the difference between 5d2 and 5d3 autofocus...is much smaller than Canon would like anyone to believe. I will modify my OP to be less "inflammatory."
That's much like saying there is little difference between the 40D/50D and the 7D, seems an odd statement given the superior AF of the 7D. How do you go from a 9 point AF system with little if any customization, to a 61 point AF system and there not be major improvement...
The 5D3 has 41 cross types, AF expansion points, zone AF and customization's that let the shooter setup the AF system to best fit their personal style. Complex without a doubt, will take time to fully understand it's capabilities of course, requires lots of testing/evaluation to get AF correct. Spend the necessary effort/time with the 5D3, do it and yourself justice by addressing it's highly diverse AF system. Just like the 1DX, it's complex and requires investigation.
Many thought the ECF on the EOS-3 was useless, but once you calibrated it to your eye it was absolutely a joy to use; not as fast as the 1V, but a great AF feature. Maybe call Canon, describe your shooting issues with the AF and maybe they could recommend specific settings...and/or take more time to learn it's features.
There's no doubt your shooting style might be the exception for it's AF system, if so, call/give Canon all the input possible so they can add your style to a future release.
snapsy wrote:
In my experience the biggest improvement in the 5DM3's AF is its uncanny ability require no MA on the majority of lenses I've used with it. Others have echoed this experience as well. Canon either did something with the tolerances of the optical path to the AF sensors or invented some type of auto-calibrating mechanism to correct for misalignment. This translates to much better out-of-box AF accuracy. The next biggest improvement was shot-to-shot precision, particularly with Canon's latest generation lenses. Can't speak to the 5DM3's AF servo improvements but you're not the first to report that AI servo in low-light still has room for improvement....Show more →
Mine has required 5+ MA on all lenses so far. I believe my 85L is currently sitting at +14 or +15 for one-shot and AI servo accuracy.
In the case of superior AF, the parts I look for don't pertain to 70 mph-moving objects, but instead things moving 1-5mph. I'm just not noticing a huge improvement there yet, but I haven't tested it much beyond two weddings.
Imagemaster wrote: And I guess that 99% of 5D3 owners disagree with you. Even without the other advantages of the 5D3, the ability to AF at f8 makes it 10% better for many.
Ok... so add "focusing at F8" to action and high ISO.... if you don't need those 3 things in a FF camera then there's little to attract one to the 5D3 other than a shiny new object. Keep in mind: full fame is NOT where everyone aspires to be with current sensor technology.
All I said was that the things that the 5D3 brings to the table over the 5D2 have no value for me.... It may (rightfully) be the holy grail for others.
I also doubt that I'm in the 1% minority. I know plenty of people that feel as I do and these are people that could also buy any camera they want... (no case of "I cant afford it therefore it sucks" syndrome here)..... I also know plenty of people that have been needing a high-speed/low light FF camera for years and making do with less (5D2) or a crop body. These are the people that swear by the 5D3.......
PCKit wrote:
I could not disagree more. You couldn't pay me three times what I gave for my 5dIII to go back to the II version for even a year and that is after a full year of shooting the 5DIII and having shot with the 5DII for over 3 years. It is like night and day. You must have had the best 5DII ever., or gotten a very defective 5DIII.
I agree with your disagreeing.
I have had the 5Dc, same AF as the 5DII and just in AF I have more than double the keepers, now, the first few weeks I had a hard time understanding the AF setup even after repeatedly reading the manual.
I also used the 5DII for a full wedding and I must say the difference is big in favor to the 5DIII once the light starts going uneven. Not to talk about AI Servo in any sort of setting then going to IQ from ISO 2000 upwards or FPS, two card slots, etc...
Mirror black out, shutter delay, silent mode, etc...
Use it for some few months, go back to the 5DII for one assignment and then tell me if you do not feel the difference.
Just updated my 5D3 to 1.2.1 and took a few random shots in the backyard with 100-400 and 1.4x2. The images were all pixel level sharp and low noise at the ISO 1000 the camera chose for the shaded subjects. They cleaned and adjusted easily in Lightroom the way my 5Ds have always done. Woohoo! This doesn't obsolete my 5D2 but it sure makes the 7D seem less necessary. Still need to play with AI focus at f8, but the 3 sure seems a do it all body.
form wrote:
Mine has required 5+ MA on all lenses so far. I believe my 85L is currently sitting at +14 or +15 for one-shot and AI servo accuracy.
In the case of superior AF, the parts I look for don't pertain to 70 mph-moving objects, but instead things moving 1-5mph. I'm just not noticing a huge improvement there yet, but I haven't tested it much beyond two weddings.
it is interesting that in some soccer games goalie would slowly jog ball out and the dumb 5D3 AF would actually slightly miss a lot of those frames (as would 5D2 or 7D) and then a forward is running fast and the 5D3 hits better than the 5D2 hits better than the 7D.
I'm not sure how to tweak it but it seems like to try to over anticipate or under movements for very slow or nearly stationary objects at time sin AI Servo (5D3). Perhaps.
One shot locks totally static targets with clearly better hit rate.
Under insanely dark conditions the one shot hit rate becomes similar to the 5D2 (both much better than 7D), but under standard (dim) indoor lighting or strong outdoor lighting it definiltey seems to have a better hit rate.
Under crazy dark conditions one shot locks a lot more easily than ai servo.
Archive 2013 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.
And I guess that 99% of 5D3 owners disagree with you. Even without the other advantages of the 5D3, the ability to AF at f8 makes it 10% better for many. 
