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Archive 2013 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.

  
 
Tim Knutson
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p.2 #1 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


Well, I have to say thanks. Your review might save me some money.


May 19, 2013 at 09:43 PM
splathrop
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p.2 #2 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


Real improvements (and suspected improvements) that matter to some, maybe not all:

1. Autofocus and tracking of moving targets, day and night better. 5D 3 is a legitimate sports camera contender, or for birds in flight. 5D 2 was a non-contender. With the 5D 3 you can stand at the end of a long-jump pit, turn the camera vertical and choose a focus point near the top of the screen, and get multiple shots of the jumper coming at you in the air, all with the face in great focus, like sitting for a portrait. Not possible with the 5D 2.

2. Focus management improvements. Flexibility in choosing modes and focus points which can notably speed up the way you work in fast moving situations. Also, the selective focus, single point mode seems far more selective than on the 5D 2. I have shots of a song sparrow that was in a tree 20 feet away, completely framed by a looping foreground branch that left almost no space around the bird, left, right, or top. The 5D 3 and 70-200 II with Extender 1.4 nailed focus on the bird again and again. I could never have done that with the 5D 2.

3. Much more usable ISO 400-800. Haven't seen this noted by others, so maybe I'm peculiar about this one. For big prints (>30-inches) I would never use higher than ISO 200 on 5D 2, now with 5D 3 ISO 400 or ISO 640, depending on how much light is available. Rarely feel any need to go below ISO 400 with 5D 3 unless I am trying to keep shutter speed down because I prefer a wide aperture for the shot.

4. Quiet shutter. Even if it had no practical advantage, the aesthetic gain is highly welcome. Why someone who shoots wedding, events, or portraits wouldn't be grateful for that I can't imagine.

5. Improved frame rate.

6. Better organized menus, with more flexibility for custom configuration.

7. Is it just me, or does the rear LCD seem to work better. On 5D 2 I never trusted that I could judge focus (after the shot—live view with magnification is great for manual focus on both cameras) using the LCD. For many situations I can do that with 5D 3. I also think the live view on the 5D 3 does a better job (brighter) showing focus with the lens stopped down manually to check depth of field. Haven't tested, so YMMV.

8. I think the metering works better on 5D 3. In low-dynamic-range situations, or otherwise challenging lighting situations, I think I usually get wider histograms with the 5D 3 than with 5D 2. That could probably be tested, but I haven't done it. It's a subjective impression. I also think auto-white-balance is better.

9. I suspect that autofocus on the 5D 3 works better with certain later Canon lenses than it does on the 5D 2. My only relevant experience is with the 70-200 II, which definitely does focus better for me on the newer camera. Canon has noted those differences officially for some recent lenses (not the 70-200, AFAIK), but not for the whole lineup. Nevertheless, excellent 5D 3 implementation of MA may play a role. I was unhappy with my Extender 1.4 version 2 using the 5D 2, now I use it constantly. May be a MA implementation difference.






Edited on May 19, 2013 at 09:58 PM · View previous versions



May 19, 2013 at 09:43 PM
chez
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p.2 #3 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


snapsy wrote:
I get your gist Dan but if you haven't used the camera first-hand it's hard to give much credence to such generalizations.


Come on. Everyone is titled to their opinions, even if they have never used the product they have an opinion on. You know what to do with such opinions.



May 19, 2013 at 09:52 PM
skibum5
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p.2 #4 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


form wrote:
I am finding only two decent benefits to the 5d3: The shutter has a quiet mode and the autofocus is generally more accurate with outer points as long as the light allows them to actually lock onto something. I suppose it may also lock center point in one-shot mode on slightly darker subjects than the 5d2, but this is debatable...

The focus system is NOT magically a lot better than the 5d2. I don't know what kind of stupid drug Canon sent a bunch of reputable photogs along with their 5d3 purchase...it's better of course, with outer cross-type points, but it
...Show more

UI is a bit better especially with things like auto-updating C1-C3 slots.

Video is definitely better as is and with the ML RAW hack it is infinitely better.

FPS are much better.

Trigger reaction time is a bit better.

High iso DR is somewhat better and it is about 2/3rds of stop better SNR, that said the lowest ISO DR is actually a trace worse (not that you'd be able to tell) and for stills the sensor is sort of a disappointment for that many years of development, for stills the D800 sensor and D600 sensor and so on take it to lunch at low ISO and match it at high iso so long as you don't go cray high iso. (although the ML hack has revealed that the sensor is an almost infinite hardware improvement for video though)

Stills AF is definitely more precise, very clearly so when paired with the new ultra-precision AF lenses.

As for AI Servo it can be much better often but I am noticing some odd things with it too though.

You can use AF assist points for other than center point.

As you mentioned silent shutter is nice as is the ability for outer points to grab much quickly and often.

The sensor improvements had been a major disappointment for me though, at least until the ML RAW hack and now it at least gives me RADICALLY better video quality.


Edited on May 19, 2013 at 09:57 PM · View previous versions



May 19, 2013 at 09:52 PM
Jefferson
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p.2 #5 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


My 5Dc cooks, cleans and brings me cold ones from the refrigerator* … can either the II or III version do better than that? … Yes or No!

*Established in a similar thread…



May 19, 2013 at 09:55 PM
StillFingerz
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p.2 #6 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


Canon gear is simply horrible in general, the only reason I continue to suffer thru the shite designs, continued lack of any aggreeable progress, trashy IQ and feature poor everything is that I'm dyslexic...get stuff backwards all the time

!parc si 3D5 eht swonk enoyrevE



May 19, 2013 at 10:10 PM
saneproduction
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p.2 #7 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


Funny, i had the opposite experience. The 5DIII is miles better in my use case


May 19, 2013 at 10:21 PM
BrianO
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p.2 #8 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


form wrote:
...I don't know what kind of stupid drug Canon sent a bunch of reputable photogs...


...said the disreputable photog who didn't get any drugs from Canon.



May 19, 2013 at 10:45 PM
Chris Anthony
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p.2 #9 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


This crap again...

Either buy a 1DX or learn to understand that no camera is perfect. If auto focus is what you need then you need to buck up and buy the best AF system available. And true to form, your response will be that you can't afford a 1DX, that canon owes you a perfect AF camera at what you perceive is the right price. If your missing "The Shot", then how can you can not buy the best tool available.



May 19, 2013 at 10:47 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.2 #10 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


snapsy wrote:
I get your gist Dan but if you haven't used the camera first-hand it's hard to give much credence to such generalizations.


It is true that I have not used that camera, but I also acknowledge that it is a fine camera and has improved on the 5D2. I'm speaking to a more general observation, and I've used enough cameras, lenses, and other things to understand the general point rather well.

Generalizations are not always bad things, nor are they always necessarily inaccurate or uninformed. :-)

Chris Anthony wrote:
... learn to understand that no camera is perfect


Indeed. Though to read some forums you would imagine that a) this, that, or the other camera is divinely perfect and worth any price, or b) all cameras suck.

Cameras have never been, are not, and never will be perfect. They continue to improve incrementally (not "night and day"), which is a fine thing, but model to model improvements never have the effect on our work that the marketing machine and forum hype might lead us to hope for. Fortunately things other than having the newest shiny thing are far more important to the quality and success of our work.

Take care,

Dan



May 19, 2013 at 10:49 PM
Jeff Nolten
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p.2 #11 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


And the biggest improvement of the 5D3 over the 5D2 is the dual card slots so you can save S1 jpegs on the SD card in additon to the raws on the CF card to download as previews to your iPad to show to all your friends and family immediately because you know they won't give a hoot about your pictures by the time you get the raws all gussied up in Lightroom.


May 19, 2013 at 11:06 PM
Dark Slider
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p.2 #12 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


If a camera that is widely regarded as improved makes little to no difference in your photographic output, the logical conclusion is that you are not camera limited at this point in time.


May 19, 2013 at 11:06 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.2 #13 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


How I rate various areas of the 5D II and 5D III

IQ:
5D II 8.5, 5D III 9 (taking into account high ISO)
AF
One Shot: 5D II 8 (centre) 4 (off centre), 5D III 9.5 (all x-type points at least)
Servo: 5D II 5, 5D III 9.5
Ergonomics and menu
5D II 9, 5D III 9.5
Battery
5D II 7, 5D III 8
Speed, responsiveness
5D II 5, 5D III 8

Overall IMO the 5D III is a markedly better camera and it feels nicer in the handle and feels more snappy, closer to 1 series although still not in that league.



May 19, 2013 at 11:10 PM
corndog
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p.2 #14 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


I admit I was/am kind of disappointed in the upgrade. I used the 5D2 and 200/2.8II for shooting dirt bikes, then I sold a bunch of stuff and bought a 5D3 and 70-200/2.8 II, and sure I have more keepers, but I guess I expected more for five grand. I think the old setup was juuuuuust a hair sharper too.


May 19, 2013 at 11:11 PM
time2clmb
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p.2 #15 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


The whole ramble should have started with, "Based on MY needs and what I shoot blah blah blah blah blah blah". Sorry but to come to an opinion of others needs and perceptions based on your 1 dimensional shooting style is just silly. Your not going to notice as much of a difference with the focusing system as some one that shoots high speed sports or birds in flight and passing your judgement on to their needs is just idiotic.


May 19, 2013 at 11:17 PM
Glenn NK
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p.2 #16 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


Be kind to the OP - I already feel better about the things I've said and wished I hadn't.

I didn't have the money for the 5DIII, so I don't take any action shots with my 5DII.



May 19, 2013 at 11:29 PM
form
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p.2 #17 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


thedutt wrote:
form, which lens are you using it with ? I noticed a huge improvement with the following lenses

1) 300 f2.8 IS V1 + 2xIII
2) Sigma 50 1.4

With others, tracking with 85 1.8 & 135 f2 improved substantially with the III vs II in super low light situation (dancers in a nightclub). Also, the AI Servo as you may know is customizable, you may want to look into that as well as perform AF micro adjustments. Good luck, hope your new purchase works out for you.



Canon 24L, 35L, 50L, 85L, 135L, 70-200 f/2.8L IS. I am just not noticing that much improvement. There is probably some, but not nearly as much as many people have suggested. I work in difficult environments, and AI servo is basically worthless at the light levels at the end of last night's wedding. It hunted, gave up. Even center point was no-go. One-shot did ok with AF assist, but I can do the same with my 5d2's...

I used it yesterday for 35L and 85L. I suppose I didn't really trust it enough with the ceremony processional this time so I used my 5d2s for tracking...they did as well as usual, which is to say OK. Not perfect, but OK.



May 19, 2013 at 11:53 PM
thedutt
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p.2 #18 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


form wrote:
Canon 24L, 35L, 50L, 85L, 135L, 70-200 f/2.8L IS. I am just not noticing that much improvement. There is probably some, but not nearly as much as many people have suggested. I work in difficult environments, and AI servo is basically worthless at the light levels at the end of last night's wedding. It hunted, gave up. Even center point was no-go. One-shot did ok with AF assist, but I can do the same with my 5d2's...

I used it yesterday for 35L and 85L. I suppose I didn't really trust it enough with the ceremony processional this time so I
...Show more

That is a bit surprising, specially with 135L. I am only an hobbyist and my bar for acceptable is likely much lower than yours, but the following shots were not possible with 5DII but I enjoy taking these with 5DIII (salsa dancers can move fairly fast at times):

1. 85 1.8 @ ISO 20000 1/100s f2
http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Sxjyo5iFR1o/T6nzh6AF63I/AAAAAAAAP-4/c5yXvO8aDms/s800/8M4C4442.jpg

2. 85 1.8 @ ISO 25600 1/125s f1.8
http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-bPjxrTIMV5Q/T6nrG5RtJiI/AAAAAAAAUzo/UCDWgOvNHrU/s800/8M4C4308.jpg

3. 85 1.8 @ ISO 12800 1/800s f2
http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-BAw8pXEjtp8/T7r_T5N8xEI/AAAAAAAAQ8Y/7GZx3quC-DQ/s800/8M4C1099.jpg


You can look at larger photos here



May 20, 2013 at 12:09 AM
StillFingerz
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p.2 #19 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


Form, perhaps rent a 6D and test it's center point for AF strength in near dark situations, if it works out perhaps it would be an alternative when the light, lack of light, makes the 5D2/5D3 near useless.

Seems a pretty cheap alternative if there are important shots being missed, your time and monies being lost. The 6D has AFMA, lens profiling just like the 5D3 and given you are using fast L glass you can also get the appropriate focusing screen for those low light tasks.

Just a thought...
Jerry



May 20, 2013 at 12:18 AM
gdanmitchell
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p.2 #20 · 5d3...not much better than 5d2.


corndog wrote:
I have more keepers, but I guess I expected more for five grand.


I think that is more or less what I was trying to say. :-)

Take care

Dan



May 20, 2013 at 12:26 AM
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