bobbytan wrote:
The heart of the matter is that an average camera in the hands of a skilled photographer is far better than a high-end camera in the hands of an amateur photographer. All things being equal, FF gives you better IQ than m43 or APS-C. That's a given. Then again, Medium Format trumps Full Frame. There is no end to this IQ debate. I am happy with m43. You are happy with FF, and that's great. And some other people will not settle for anything less than MF.
Since we are in the discussion mood - Bobby, to me, you reach the point of diminished returns in respect to the difference between a FF (35mm format, that is) and MF formats. MF systems are heavy, clunky, clumsy to handle and most of all, very expensive. A completely different beast, IOW and it is definitely not for me, not in my age .
AGeoJO wrote:
I have never owned a m 4/3 body and as such, I have not done any comparison nor I am doing any right now. What I am saying here is solely based on the assumption that in order for you to view an image of the same size, be it on the monitor or on the paper/printing material, you have to magnify more from a smaller sensor than from a larger sensor. As simple as that. Again, all other things being equal. Well, that's the same reason for that pro to choose the A7r. Strictly from the image quality point of view, maybe I would prefer the files from the Nikon 810 but a mirrorless system has its own advantages that are not associated with the IQ. Again, that's strictly my opinion and others may think differently and that's perfectly fine.
My recent largest print from my A7r was 36 inches wide and it is currently hanging over the fire place of the family I gave that enlargement to. ...Show more →
I do not want to seem like I am trying to give you a hard time, but are you a recruiter? I find it very odd to see someone never having used the format expressing favorable opinions of another format. Why do you do it? Insecurity?
AGeoJO wrote:
Since we are in the discussion mood - Bobby, to me, you reach the point of diminished returns in respect to the difference between a FF (35mm format, that is) and MF formats. MF systems are heavy, clunky, clumsy to handle and most of all, very expensive. Definitely not for me, not in my age .
Ha! You could have said the very same thing about M4/3 and FF, unless you Pixel peep.
savingspaces wrote:
I do not want to seem like I am trying to give you a hard time, but are you a recruiter? I find it very odd to see someone never having used the format expressing favorable opinions of another format. Why do you do it? Insecurity?
At 36 wide m4/3 prints tack sharp.
Now, you are reaching.... What recruiter? Why would I do that and for what? Insecurity? Far away from that! You like your 36-inch print? That's fine and more power to you!
My original post was more addressed to Bobby Tan as I know him personally and he is one of my shooting buddies. That's all, not more and not less.
I have shot with an SLR/dSLR for 40+ years and this Grandpa has had enough. Schlepping around bulky/heavy gear is not my thing anymore. And most of my photography these days are travel-related. Give me a good compact and I am a happy camper. Who knows ... in another few years I may downsize to a Sony RX 100 Mk V.
AGeoJO wrote:
Since we are in the discussion mood - Bobby, to me, you reach the point of diminished returns in respect to the difference between a FF (35mm format, that is) and MF formats. MF systems are heavy, clunky, clumsy to handle and most of all, very expensive. A completely different beast, IOW and it is definitely not for me, not in my age .
savingspaces wrote:
Ha! You could have said the very same thing about M4/3 and FF, unless you Pixel peep.
Oh, brother. Now, you got me going - have you handled the Sony A7 series cameras? The A7r is about the same weight and bulk as the EM-1. And have you checked their prices? I would definitely put the two systems as comparable.
I apologize to the other Oly users. I hope I didn't come across as a jerk. I really didn't want to do this on this thread and this is my last post on this matter. Sorry .
AGeoJO wrote:
Oh, brother. Now, you got me going - have you handled the Sony A7 series cameras? The A7r is about the same weight and bulk as the EM-1. And have you checked their prices? I would definitely put the two systems as comparable.
I apologize to the other Oly users. I hope I didn't come across as a jerk. I really didn't want to do this on this thread and this is my last post on this matter. Sorry .
You are a funny guy! Why would I have to have any experience with any equipment? All that matters is my opinion isn't it? FYI, yes I have handled the A7 cameras. I was talking about FF DSLRs VS M4/3
AGeoJO wrote:
Now, you are reaching.... What recruiter? Why would I do that and for what? Insecurity? Far away from that! You like your 36-inch print? That's fine and more power to you!
My original post was more addressed to Bobby Tan as I know him personally and he is one of my shooting buddies. That's all, not more and not less.
Well, tell us why do you have to make such statements about a system you have never tried? Maybe to feel superior?
As far as you addressing Bobby specifically, can't you do that in person? You don't make sense. Especially after seeing Bobby Tan's shots. Let your pictures do the talking. It is disrespectful to put down M4/3 in a M4/3 thread. There is a reason why we chose this sensor, and it isn't because we can't afford a sony mirrorless FF camera/lens.
Hmmmm I've got a 40x27 inch photo hanging on my wall here, captured in 2006 with a 10mp APS-C Nikon D80 sensor and it looks down right freaking amazing.
Modern day m43 and even smaller sensors beat the Nikon D80 hands down. So much as happened. I wouldn't feel worried at all printing large with a 16mp m43 sensor. Question is, how many people would really see a difference in a large print without moving in very very close to the photo? In my opinion, very very few. Of course, if you move in very very close to a 40x27 inch print to check detail you are probably the same kind of guy who checks and compares every picture he sees at 100%-300% and then makes silly comments about "noise" performance.
Simple fact it, if it doesn't show up in print it really doesn't matter. No one will spot a difference between a FF or smaller sensor on the web, most won't see the difference in large prints either.
Shoot what you enjoy and enjoy what you shoot and stop the comparison crap, it's a dead dog that's been continuously beaten ever since it died the poor fellow.
Still waiting to see some shots and thoughts on the A7 Bobby
Only reason it really interests me is this nice Nikon 50mm F1.2 and my Olympus 24mm F2.8
Figured a used A7 could be a good way of getting some more use out of those two amazing lenses even though I have more MF glass those are really the only two ones I really want to use.
Having both systems, I happen to think A7 and m43 are perfectly complimentary. There are times when the A7 and an adapted nikkor 105mm Ai-s feels nice... just as there are times I reach for my Pen with a body cap lens wanting to go minimalist.
Personally I am glad, although it sounds selfish, when people put down either system, just because I am having so much fun switching back and forth. To summarize, A7 and Pen systems have equally made my photos better than they ever were with a dslr, and for that I am extremely thankful.
Thank you! I decided to take only the 20mm 1.7 with me yesterday and we saw these guys on the way home, we had to stop and take some pictures. The sky was very unusual looking yesterday.
There is no end to this IQ debate. I am happy with m43. You are happy with FF, and that's great. And some other people will not settle for anything less than MF. 
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it has been added as part of the software testing. 
