Home · Register · Search · View Winners · Software · Hosting · Software · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username   Password

  New fredmiranda.com Mobile Site
  New Feature: SMS Notification alert
  New Feature: Buy & Sell Watchlist
  

FM Forums | Alternative Gear & Lenses | Join Upload & Sell

1       2       3              644      
645
       646              1061       1062       end
  

Leica M/X/T Picture Thread
  
 
rscheffler
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #1 · p.645 #1 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Warning, 50/1.5 Summarit is a low contrast lens.
I do like that it is glowy, though. And you can shoot it wide open in full sun without a ND because it's low contrast. Great for the M9's narrower dynamic range.












Some others from the archive that were posted here last year:










































First at f/2.8 for reference against wide open below it:












And vs. the 50 Lux ASPH, both wide open:












I think you can tell which is the ASPH.

A few more from the Summarit:

















For comparison, the CV40 f/1.4 with somewhat similar framing -







More Summarit:
































Sorry for the image spam.

Also should note that it flares extremely easily wide open - i.e. nasty veiling flare. All of these images were processed to taste to regain a decent contrast range. But you'll note that colour vibrancy for this lens isn't a problem, which impressed me, considering it has simple single coating and is from the 50s...

Edited on Feb 15, 2013 at 04:52 AM · View previous versions



Feb 15, 2013 at 04:46 AM
Gary Clennan
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #2 · p.645 #2 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Such nice colors in your shots Ron. At certain distances, the bokeh from that Summarit reminds me of the 5cm Nikkor ltm f/1.4. I am really starting to appreciate some of these vintage lenses for their unique character. One of my next purchases may be a Summitar.... It has a bit of swirl which I like.

Thanks for the information Andrew on the 50lux. I would only keep it or my 50cron so not really sure what is the best move....



Feb 15, 2013 at 04:52 AM
rscheffler
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #3 · p.645 #3 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Thanks Gary. I also test-shot the Summitar at the Leica store when I did the 50 Lux pre-ASPH and Summarit shots, just never put them online. IIRC, it felt somewhere between the Lux pre-ASPH and Summarit for background blur quality and contrast loss. In other words, it was a bit more restrained than the Summarit. The Nikkor IMO has stronger character than the Summarit due to the Sonnar design. A bit more rounded and lush feeling, and perhaps a bit more energetic background rendering. Contrast is probably also better, though it too will flare, as you know. It's also way more useful on a non-RF EVF/live view system because it focuses so close.


Feb 15, 2013 at 04:57 AM
rscheffler
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #4 · p.645 #4 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Repost of images from last May:

I've read that the Nikkor is optimized for closer focusing distances. My Summarit also is poor at infinity wide open, but stopped down a bit it's quite good. Both lenses blur the edges of high contrast transitions, such as tree branches/leaves against a sky. I actually like this look as it takes a lot of edge off the image. With the Nikkor the bleed has a bit of a blue shift, with the Summarit it's white. With the 50 Lux ASPH, very high contrast situations result in some purple fringing. The Summarit also exhibits a greater tendency to 'cats eyes' in background oof specular points. Both will flare if sun hits the front element, though the Summarit seems to lose much more contrast.

The order in the following images is generally Nikkor then Summarit.












Summarit with front element shaded by my hand:





















The last one above is the 50 Lux ASPH.
















Last is 50 Lux ASPH. The focus in the Nikkor shot is a bit off compared to the other two..
















Last is 50 Lux ASPH. The Nikkor seems to have a bit more close distance glow than the Summarit, looking at the edge of the white stone against the green.

These two are just Summarit and 50 Lux ASPH:












Again, I've adjusted each to get the tonality I wanted from a given scene, so you're not really seeing how flat the Summarit can look.... but one can tweak it to similar end results.



Feb 15, 2013 at 05:08 AM
Andrew Gough
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #5 · p.645 #5 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Ron,

Thanks for posting these, you are dangerous to my wallet



Feb 15, 2013 at 05:24 AM
Jabberwockt
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #6 · p.645 #6 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Thank Ron, I've actually owned the Konica for a long time, I'm a bit slow so sometimes it takes me forever to decide whether or not i like a lens The Nokton 40 will get a lot of real world use before i can decide.

Charles, regarding the 50lux Pre-Asph. I was shopping at a local store and they let me try their copy of the Pre-Asph against my own personal copy of the 50lux Asph. I only had the lens for a few minutes but here are my not so great test shots (Asph then Pre-Asph):


Larger


Larger

Bokeh diffrences aside, they are both sharp enough, but given the right situation I suspect that the Pre-Asph can render very aesthetically pleasing photos. I might one day get one myself, i think the last version that focuses a a bit closer would be most desirable. Anyways, here's one with the Pre-Asph where i like both the bokeh and the overall rendering:

Very large

Edited on Feb 16, 2013 at 03:30 AM · View previous versions



Feb 15, 2013 at 05:27 AM
dalegaspi
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #7 · p.645 #7 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


"And you can shoot [the Summarit] wide open in full sun without a ND because it's low contrast. Great for the M9's narrower dynamic range."

hm...wouldn't the lens's formula (lack of aspherical and coating) account for the low contrast and not because it can capture more dynamic range. I mean, if a Summarit and a Summilux ASPH captures the same scene in RAW the same data would be captured...and not that the Summilux will have abrupt (clipped) rolloff in the shadows and/or highlights, no? AFAIK dynamic range is a property of the camera sensor...there is no glass that can extract data that wasn't there in the first place...that's physics, yes?

BTW that was a question...and my argument could be coming out of my a$$ ...and I'd love to be proven wrong with examples.



Feb 15, 2013 at 05:38 AM
charles.K
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #8 · p.645 #8 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Ron, thank you for the kind words Great examples and comparisons!!! Thanks for sharing. Seriously Ron, you must be working for the sales dept. of Leica...very tempting.
Allen, wonderful example of the M-M at 6400 ISO!!
Ryan, wonderful shots! The red filter is my favourite
Andrew, just love the colours and composition of these shots!
Jaberwockt, I have not had the chance to try the 50 Lux pre Asph. With the lenses having very different styles, it is easy to collect few older 50's along side the 50 Lux Asph



Feb 15, 2013 at 05:49 AM
rscheffler
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #9 · p.645 #9 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Dale, yes, the Summarit's formula/coatings and 50s technology results in lower contrast. The M9's sensor has a rather narrow dynamic range compared to other modern options, and a modern Leica or Zeiss ZM lens with much better light transmission characteristics carry a very broad range of tonalities that can exceed the capability of the sensor.

All I can say is if I shoot the Summarit in full sun wide open, there is usually some highlight clipping, but it is much, much less and almost always recoverable (which is a feat given the M9's dislike for blowing highlights), than if I used the 50 Lux ASPH, where I'd have to stop down to at least f/2.5 if not f/2.8. This would imply the Summarit is not as fast/bright as the aperture indicates. Maybe it's just that my copy is not as clean as it could be. Not sure. I'd have to test it but I want to say the Nikkor 5cm is similar.

Because the old Summarit lens has a fair amount of veiling flare wide open, it basically compresses the contrast range of the scene to fit into a narrower space. I assume this is at the shadow end of the range where blacks are lifted considerably. IIRC, this is also a technique used in motion picture films with low contrast filters designed to compress the brightness range of a given scene.

Thanks for those samples Jabberwockt. I really like the look of the last one. The look of the lens, that is. The guy seems a bit... I don't know.

Andrew: The Summarit is a relative bargain.



Feb 15, 2013 at 05:53 AM
joe88
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #10 · p.645 #10 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Winston, excellent shot of Karri Valley!
Allen, another really nice environmental portrait and I agree ISO6400 is very useable on the MM.
Ryan, love those B&W shots of the walkway with the deep blacks!
Ron, thanks for sharing those again. Really nice and agree with Andrew, you are dangerous for our wallets!! Do you still have the Nikkor? Let me know if you want to get rid of it
Andrew, excellent set with the old truck! Love the rendering and feel of the 2nd shot with the CV21 1.8!

----
M9 50CronV5 @ f/2









Feb 15, 2013 at 02:56 PM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



seekuh
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #11 · p.645 #11 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


rscheffler wrote:
Michael - I'm going to save you $7000. Take a look at this 50 Lux ASPH portrait done at f/2 in Hilmar's Flickr stream and compare it against the neighbouring image done with the 50AA. Hilmar is very kind to upload full-rez files to allow 100% comparisons. I would like to point out that CENTRALLY, the 50 Lux ASPH at f/2 appears to be nearly identical to the 50AA wide open at these distances. From this one comparison it also appears to blur the background slightly more, and might be about 1/3 stop brighter to boot. Where I think
...Show more

I absolutely agree with Ron. After testing the 50 APO for only a few days, I can confirm that it is a very great lens. Having tested it against the 50 Summilux ASPH I can state that it performs better in the outer areas of the frame. However, I don't think the differences are that huge. That's why I sold the 50 APO and kept the 50 Summilux ASPH. I plan to keep my M9 and won't buy the M so I need every extra stop which for me is more important than the little gain in sharpness the 50 APO provides.



Feb 15, 2013 at 04:49 PM
zhangyue
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #12 · p.645 #12 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Andrew, That is paint like rendering from PA50lux.
Ryan, I like the way you use bright spots in your frame. They give life to the foto.
Joe, excellent portrait. I know You want show us there is little point for 50cron APO

Andy, thanks for sharing. Is that Camerawest? The first set, PA50lux is slightly back focused, and 2nd one show that the lens is capable to produce high quality Portrait. Though I feel Zeiss Sonnar might have even more contrast in focus plane. I have to try that lens someday myself.

Hilmar, thanks for the updating. And full size sample. Since I canít afford it or it is not worth that much of money to me anyway, I think you made a good choice. And you have a very good reason for sell it as you said. But why no M240?

Ron, Thanks for those 50mm comparison. To be honest, I am not fond of those classical lens, too much all kind of aberration make me drizzy you must surprise to hear that since I use my set of 50 years lens very often. The 50cron and 35cron I have are indeed old, but they have pretty high performance even compare to modern lens. The slightly lower contrast can be seen but it is also relative easy to tight it up.

And, no, you didnít save me $7000 , I canít afford it even though I like it the best, but not for $7000. I have to pick lens or kids . If it is 1.4, I will sell off my DSLR setup, make the sacrifice to get it At f2, $7000 is way overpriced to me even for its peerless performance. But it is Leica. (maybe Zeiss 55mm) 50mm is never a hard designed focal length. There are tons of reasonable choices around without break bank.

But there are still two points for this lens for some people:

1 is its cross frame sharpness no FC to degrade performance anywhere as well as APO for color fidelity. This could be huge for some people but not so much for me.

2. Free compose, put subject anywhere in the frame at f2 have the same high performance. Make it truly as Leica claimed: only control aperture for DOF, but not performance. This is huge. This is also the reason I value 50lux ASPH higher now, even though we all know it has FC WO, but it still has the best performance in this regard compare any 1.4 lens I have on hand. In this regard, Zeiss MP50 is the best before, with the price at $1200, you can see how much Leica over price this lens



Feb 15, 2013 at 06:48 PM
zhangyue
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #13 · p.645 #13 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread














I have to stop down my 50cron rigid at least f5.6 to be able to do this kind of off center composition. (f5.6 or f8 X3 ND filter used here at full sun. )

Might be WO






Here are two 90Elmarit from Santa Cruz a while back. Again under full sun hush light, not very interesting. Maybe should convert them to BW.














Feb 15, 2013 at 06:54 PM
ryankarr
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #14 · p.645 #14 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


rscheffler wrote:
Thanks Ryan. Do you think there is any risk of strong light sources from behind the camera reflecting off the filter and appearing in images due to the cutouts? 82mm filters would be easier to source and some Canon L lenses now also use that size, so it could work for me.. but would also make the 21 Lux even bigger.



I think that would definitely be a problem if there's a light source actually hitting the back on the filter. The cutouts are fairly large and there's a decent gap between the lens and the filter. I would have much prefered if it was indexed like the lens hood with cutouts only the area that impacts the viewfinder.

Do "Series 8" filters fit inbeween the lens and the hood? I need a 0.6 to 0.9 ND solution for the Summilux and I'd prefer not to use the 82mm adapter for it.



Feb 15, 2013 at 07:08 PM
Jabberwockt
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #15 · p.645 #15 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Great shots Michael. Yes that is CameraWest, I too actually liked the 50sonnar for portraits and its for size, but i have a soft spot for older lenses and a weakness of changing gear occasionally =)


Feb 15, 2013 at 07:18 PM
joe88
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #16 · p.645 #16 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


Thanks Michael and another excellent set of your kids, love all three pics, really beautiful! I prefer the vertical version of the 90 Elmarit shot.

I think the 50APO is probably more compelling for Monochrom users and also maybe the new M240. The M9 might not be able to resolve all of the fine nuances of the 50APO's rendering.

M9 50CronV5








Feb 15, 2013 at 07:37 PM
rscheffler
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #17 · p.645 #17 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


ryankarr wrote:
Thanks Ron!

It's Leica part # 14-481

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/586198-REG/Leica_14_481_E82_Filter_Adapter_f.html

rscheffler wrote:
Thanks Ryan. Do you think there is any risk of strong light sources from behind the camera reflecting off the filter and appearing in images due to the cutouts? 82mm filters would be easier to source and some Canon L lenses now also use that size, so it could work for me.. but would also make the 21 Lux even bigger.

ryankarr wrote:
I think that would definitely be a problem if there's a light source actually hitting the back on the filter. The cutouts are fairly large and there's a decent gap between the lens and the filter. I would have much prefered if it was indexed like the lens hood with cutouts only the area that impacts the viewfinder.

Do "Series 8" filters fit inbeween the lens and the hood? I need a 0.6 to 0.9 ND solution for the Summilux and I'd prefer not to use the 82mm adapter for it.


Yes, a Series 8/VIII filter will fit in the hood, which acts as a retaining ring. Good luck finding someone with that size ND filter in stock. I ended up buying a cheap Tiffen 0.7 ND off the bay. It works, but also adds a bit of a green/cyan overall colour shift, so I'm not entirely happy with it. I tried B&H for a B+W ND (don't recall which version) and was informed by them that they could no longer order it from B+W. I was informed by www.2filter.com that they could get something from B+W, but would take 4-6 weeks. That was back in January 2012 and I didn't pursue it further. As I may have stated before, for Leica to select the old Series VIII format (and Series VII for the 24 Lux), they should at least sell their own UV/ND filters in those sizes to ensure some availability.

If you do find a 0.9 ND in stock, get one for me too.



Feb 15, 2013 at 08:22 PM
naturephoto1
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.645 #18 · p.645 #18 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


rscheffler wrote:
Yes, a Series 8/VIII filter will fit in the hood, which acts as a retaining ring. Good luck finding someone with that size ND filter in stock. I ended up buying a cheap Tiffen 0.7 ND off the bay. It works, but also adds a bit of a green/cyan overall colour shift, so I'm not entirely happy with it. I tried B&H for a B+W ND (don't recall which version) and was informed by them that they could no longer order it from B+W. I was informed by www.2filter.com that they could get something from B+W, but would take 4-6
...Show more

Ron,

What size ND filter do you need? Bob Singh- Singh-Ray filters will make up pretty much anything that you want. But, you may need to supply him with the filter ring to make the filter, in fact they could replace the glass in your Tiffen filter. I have used Singh-Ray filters for quite some time. The filter could probably be made of resin or glass. They make the most neutral filters that I know of for color, what they are either uncoated or single coated I believe. I am not sure of what the cost might be, but a call to Singh-Ray may be in order. I very much doubt that you would have nearly as long a wait. Though when the made up a Cokin P sized 5 stop ND filter they couldn't get the glass from the supplier for quite some time.

http://www.singh-ray.com/index.html

By the way, they finally did get the glass and I have the 5 stop ND filter; they had made a 4 stop Cokin P size ND in resin before I left for my trip.

I hope that this proves to be of value.

Rich


Edited on Feb 15, 2013 at 08:38 PM · View previous versions



Feb 15, 2013 at 08:32 PM
rscheffler
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #19 · p.645 #19 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


zhangyue wrote:
Ron, Thanks for those 50mm comparison. To be honest, I am not fond of those classical lens, too much all kind of aberration make me drizzy you must surprise to hear that since I use my set of 50 years lens very often. The 50cron and 35cron I have are indeed old, but they have pretty high performance even compare to modern lens. The slightly lower contrast can be seen but it is also relative easy to tight it up.


I'm not surprised because you wrote the exact same thing when I originally posted these images last spring. I really like the look of the older 50 Cron, and am even tempted to get one. But at the same time, for me, it's not enough of a jump away from modern performance, which is what the 50/1.5 Summarit and Nikkor offer. I'd like to find something even 'worse' in terms of w/o performance and bokeh quality.

And, no, you didnít save me $7000 , I canít afford it even though I like it the best, but not for $7000. I have to pick lens or kids . If it is 1.4, I will sell off my DSLR setup, make the sacrifice to get it At f2, $7000 is way overpriced to me even for its peerless performance. But it is Leica. (maybe Zeiss 55mm) 50mm is never a hard designed focal length. There are tons of reasonable choices around without break bank.

Tons of choices, but none with that kind of wide open performance. That is the catch. While 50mm lenses can be optically simple and offer good results, none of those are technically great across the frame wide open.

But there are still two points for this lens for some people:

1 is its cross frame sharpness no FC to degrade performance anywhere as well as APO for color fidelity. This could be huge for some people but not so much for me.

2. Free compose, put subject anywhere in the frame at f2 have the same high performance. Make it truly as Leica claimed: only control aperture for DOF, but not performance. This is huge. This is also the reason I value 50lux ASPH higher now, even though we all know it has FC WO, but it still has the
...Show more

I agree the second point is appealing, and is actually coupled to the first point about FC. If cost was a non-issue, I could see myself with the M240/50AA as my primary 50mm solution, then with a bunch of legacy 50s, such as the Summarit, Nikkor and pre-ASPH Lux.



Feb 15, 2013 at 08:37 PM
seekuh
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.645 #20 · p.645 #20 · Leica M/X/T Picture Thread


I do order my filters here. Very recommendable:

http://www.versandhaus-foto-mueller.de



Feb 15, 2013 at 08:38 PM
1       2       3              644      
645
       646              1061       1062       end




FM Forums | Alternative Gear & Lenses | Join Upload & Sell

1       2       3              644      
645
       646              1061       1062       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username   Password    Reset password