I got my CC yesterday and have been playing with 1 WLX1600, 2 WLX800, and one EX580. Compared to other PCB products, I haven't been as pleased as in past.
Pros:
- I can control remotely the power levels of the WLX lights
- I can measure the WXL and EX580 lights
- The user interface is quite logical and fast once you have learned it
Cons:
- The remote controlling of the modelling lights is not working
- When turning the modelling lights on strange things start to happen
- The lights are occasionally disabled
- The lights are occasionally totally locked out of control
- CC went into a strange state when by accident tryed configure a group of lights and the groug was not created (cryptic text and disabled selections)
Unexpected setup:
- I was expecting that the RJ45 alone would be enough, but in practice two cables are required (RJ45 for remote CC control and the classic cable for triggering from CST)
I am expecting that a new F/W version for CC will fix the problem. I am looking forward to expand my studio with ES640 and seamless cooperation between CC and ES640.
Paul Buff wrote:
This is not typical. Please call tech help and discuss it. I'm sure we can solve it.
Hi,
I too have had some issues with the Cybercommander and my AB 800 via the CSR+.
At first they wouldn't allow for any control, but it turned out the CSR+'s need to be replaced, as my CRSB+ did function.
Here is what I discovered via trial and error.
When the new CSR+'s arrived at my office, I had on AB800 with me to test.
All worked fine.
When I brought them home, they were hit and miss. I noticed that my AB 800's were not plugged directly into the wall, but in a powerstrip that had other applicances attached . The set up in my office was directly to the wall plate.
So I decided to separate the light on different circuits and go directly into the wall.
Things all of a sudden started to work. Then I noticed that I couldn't reach the lone wall outlet and used an extension cord the extension cord was a 2 PRONG, vs 3 PRONG cord, hence no ground.
So I proceeded to plug the 2 PRONG extension cord back to the powerstrip that gave me the problem in the first place, and all of a sudden it started to work.
So, maybe there is some leakage back to ground that is dropping the voltage that controls the AB 800. Now, I am not advocating using 2 prong plugs when dealing with electronics, as they serve a safety purpose, but if it solves the problem for now, I am going to use it. (Now kids, don't try this at home )
So, for what it's worth, you both might want to look into this behavior.
Paul Buff wrote:
This is not typical. Please call tech help and discuss it. I'm sure we can solve it.
Thanks Paul, I missed PCB office hours on this week. I will call on next week.
Some of the symptoms seen by others are similar what I saw. When turning the modelling light on in one light, the other lights are starting to fire. This will not happen, when the lights are not sharing the same wall sockets.
In some cases, the same light will start to fire 2 or 3 times per second as long as the modelling light is on.
In some cases, the ready and dump lights are toggling at 0.5 Hz frequency.
Even with all these issues, I am starting to like this little box very much
OllieK wrote:
In some cases, the ready and dump lights are toggling at 0.5 Hz frequency.
FWIW, that's one of the symptoms I saw w/ the quirky B1600 when running off a Vagabond, so I'm assuming it's the same cause.
Try the workaround I found...turn the strobe on and let it get to the ready state, then plug the CC RX into it...
Your house has low voltage or you're chaining too much stuff off that outlet would be my guess...
These problems may be stemming from plugging in both the telephone jack and the 1/8" sync cord. This is not advised. Just plug in the telephone cord only and put only one end of the 1/8" plug in the light, but not the CSR+ (to disable the slave.) A CST should fire the system the same as the Cyber Commander.
If CC is set to a group, the CST or CC will fire only the lights in the selected group. If the CC is set to one channel, it's meter and test (down on the right or left joy stick) will fire only the channel you are set to, but the camera contact on the CC or on the CST will fire all lights that are active and enabled at the CC.
Two wire or missing ground can cause rapid firing even with the LG4X or even with no remote.
Paul Buff wrote:
These problems may be stemming from plugging in both the telephone jack and the 1/8" sync cord. This is not advised. Just plug in the telephone cord only and put only one end of the 1/8" plug in the light, but not the CSR+ (to disable the slave.) A CST should fire the system the same as the Cyber Commander.
If CC is set to a group, the CST or CC will fire only the lights in the selected group. If the CC is set to one channel, it's meter and test (down on the right or left joy stick) will fire only the channel you are set to, but the camera contact on the CC or on the CST will fire all lights that are active and enabled at the CC.
Two wire or missing ground can cause rapid firing even with the LG4X or even with no remote....Show more →
Paul,
I believe all you have said above is true, however, I get misfires without inserting the 1/8" sync cord into the CSR+. Also, I need the the two prong plug to get this unit to work in certain outlets, and I have seen no unwanted rapid discharges.
For now, since I have a big shoot on Monday, I will use the configuration that seems to work for me. But, I do want to point out that CSRB+, which I purchased for my SB800 flash and CC work as you describe, but not my CSR+'s. That's what is puzzling to me. It seems that the internal voltage and /or isolation of the battery unit, is more stable for whatever reason.
These are just my observations at this time. I will experiment with other configurations and if I observe anything of interest, I will report back.
I must say, that I am very pleased with the functionality of this combination, as it has allowed me to produce the desired image in a fraction of the time.
Just plug in the telephone cord only and put only one end of the 1/8" plug in the light, but not the CSR+ (to disable the slave.) A CST should fire the system the same as the Cyber Commander.
My observations with CSR+ and CSRB+ are the following:
- both trigger cable and telephone cord connected
> remote control works (for most funcions)
> the flash can be triggered with
1) local button in CSR+/CSRB+
2) remote button in CST
3) remote button in CC
4) camera with connection to CST/CC
5) test button in WLX800/1600
- trigger cable connected only in WLX800/1600 and telephone cord connected
> remote control works (for most funcions)
> the flash can be triggered only with
1) test button in WLX800/1600
- trigger cable connected and telephone cord not connected
> remote control doesn't works
> the flash can be triggered with
1) local button in CSR+/CSRB+
2) remote button in CST
3) remote button in CC
4) camera with connection to CST/CC
5) test button in WLX800/1600
If anybody has some suggestions for setups that I should try. I think that there could be some reset sequences by removing batteries, turning the devices on in certain sequence, or playing with the buttond in the light back panel.
I have had the CSR+ and CSRB+ modules for quite long time and had lost the original "phone cables". Without thinking, I took 3 phone cables from my "technical heap". All these were with 2 wires.
If you look in the socket in the light and receiver, you can see that 4 wires are used. I did find one RJ11 cable with 4 wires. Once I did use this cabe between WLX800/1600 and a transmiter, the following problems were solved
- I can control the model light remotely
- I can trigger the flash without the trigger cable (just by using the "telephone cord"); just like Paul told
With WLX800 and WLX1600 (1/4 POWER), all model light settings work OK. With WLX1600 (full power with 22" BD), the model light works properly in OFF and FULL postion. With ADJ and TRACK position there are still problems. In ADJ postion, if the light power is under EU5.2 (-1.5f) everything is OK. With higher powers there is a continuous stream of auto triggerings.
I made another experiment related to the power supply by connecting the lights to a 1250 W UPS with 100 Ah battery. This clearly reduced the misfirings between the lights.
Once I will get two more 4 wire RJ11 cables, I will continue with my investigations to find out if the UPS is really required.
Bottom line is that CC is HIGHLY RECOMMENDED.
Today, I took some high key portraits with white background. In that work the white balance management with multiple lights is a challenge. The CC measurement show both the t.1 time and color temperature. This was eye opening to see how the color temperature was changing with the power levels.
With ES640, the color temperature management will be much easier. I am looking to get one of those in my hands and see the real numbers using the CC.
OllieK wrote:
I have had the CSR+ and CSRB+ modules for quite long time and had lost the original "phone cables". Without thinking, I took 3 phone cables from my "technical heap". All these were with 2 wires.
Just plug in the telephone cord only and put only one end of the 1/8" plug in the light, but not the CSR+ (to disable the slave.) A CST should fire the system the same as the Cyber Commander.
My observations with CSR+ and CSRB+ are the following:
- both trigger cable and telephone cord connected
> remote control works (for most funcions)
> the flash can be triggered with
1) local button in CSR+/CSRB+
2) remote button in CST
3) remote button in CC
4) camera with connection to CST/CC
5) test button in WLX800/1600
- trigger cable connected only in WLX800/1600 and telephone cord connected
> remote control works (for most funcions)
> the flash can be triggered only with
1) test button in WLX800/1600
- trigger cable connected and telephone cord not connected
> remote control doesn't works
> the flash can be triggered with
1) local button in CSR+/CSRB+
2) remote button in CST
3) remote button in CC
4) camera with connection to CST/CC
5) test button in WLX800/1600
If anybody has some suggestions for setups that I should try. I think that there could be some reset sequences by removing batteries, turning the devices on in certain sequence, or playing with the buttond in the light back panel.
Here's what I do, and have been successful.
Everytime I introduce an AB800 or other light, here's the sequence:
1 - With the POWER SWITCH OFF, I plug in all the components, such as: CSR+ or CSRB+, 1/8" jack into the AB800, and telephone jack to both CSR+ or CSRB+ and AB800. Make sure you have the proper frequency and channel for this light. REPEAT FOR ALL LIGHTS in your setup.
2- Make sure all buttons on the back of the AB800 are depressed and POWER is set to FULL POWER.
3 - With the Cybercommander in hand, I turn the POWER on the AB800.
NOTE: It should display full power in both modeling and flash intensity.
(These steps are for a COLD start. If the CSR+ and the CC had been activated and is not in sleep mode, you might have control as soon as the light is turned on and lights will defaut to the setting you programmed.)
4- PRESS the flash button CSR+ .
You should get a full power flash. 5. Go to the Cybercommander menu and OPEN PROGRAM from memory.
I setup on of the memory channels to default to the lowest power for both modeling and flash. That way, when the memory is loaded, you will note that all the modeling lights should dim to mimimum power. That shows that they all have accepted program and now fully under control by the CC.
For viewing clarity, I set up my 3 AB800's to channel 1,3, and 5, with my SB800 flash to channel 7.
I can now adjust each light and modeling light individually, and save on another program such as SD2, for later reset.
You can set up groups to fire combos, or quickly set to ALL to fire all units.
One other suggestion:
I would trigger ALL the flash units at least once every 10 min. to make sure that the CSR+'s and CSRB+'s stay awake and ready for action when required.
The step 4 advice to load from program is very relevant. I did observe that there were still some "dropping off control" issues. These were resolved, once I had loaded the settings from the SD card.
With AB800 lights you don't have the full/quarter power issue in WLX1600. Do you have some ideas how it can be handled? I was thinking to create different profiles in SD card to manage WLX1600 settings. The other solution could be to have two channels assigned for WLX1600, but in that case you need to change the channel number in CSR+/CSRB+ in addition of toggling the power level button in WLX1600.
Ollie, it seems that you can save various configurations like SD1 -SD 50 with different Configuration of power for each WL. You might want to consider a naming convention. SD10 -19 Full Power, SD 20-29 = 1/2 power and SD 40-49 1/4 power
The 1x represents full power , 2x for 1/2 power, 4x for 1/4 power conbinations.
I know this is teidious but you can also change via the menu during your shoot for each light in question, but save to an SD address as per convention shown above.
Paul Buff wrote:
Two wire phone cords will cause all these problems, even with an LG4X and no Cyber Commander. Glad you found the source of the problems.
For everyone to be sure: The Cyber system uses a four-wire cable with six-wire connectors...not four-wire connectors. This is the standard set-up these days, but be sure you get it right. I had found a source of some nifty coiled eight-inch telephone patch cables I thought would work, but alas, they had four-wire plugs.
Thanks for a good idea for the mnemonic rules for the power settings.
Now, I have completed my testing with and without UPS using the proper 4-wire cables. Now all WLX lights are working properly as long as the modelling lights are in ADJ mode and the light level is not very high. The UPS didn't make any difference once the model lights were working on lower power levels.
Something went wrong with my EX580 Speedlite. It is still working properly for the actual photos, but I cannot trigger or measure it with CC; except in ALL mode. A couple of days ago, I was able to trigger and measure it. A couple of hours ago I was able to trigger and measure it in GRP mode (but not anymore in CH mode).
My theory was that the CSRB+ batteries could be the reason. The voltage of the original batteries (AA) had dropped to 1.15 V and everything seemed to work OK. I did put in new batteries (1.6 V), but it didn't make any difference.
Another strange thing is the CC power concumption. After few hour usage, I had to replace the original batteries ( AAA). After few days, CC did flash again low battery warning. The voltage had dropped from 1.6 to 1.3. I will keep eye on CC power consumption.
Ollie,
The CC eats batteries, when you are programming and setting up things. Once I have settled on the set up, I tend to force the CC into sleep mode, unless I am metering, changing channels or groups, and waking up any newly installed lights.
Keep extra batteries handy, its the name of the game, as there is no free lunch.
CC battery life is 2-3 hours when you are keeping it awake during programming. When you start using it you can expect weeks or months of battery life in normal use. It will go to sleep by itself in whatever time you set up - typically 10-20 seconds. Once set up, it doesn't wake up to fire lights.
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