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Archive 2009 · Mac/PC debate

  
 
millsart
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p.3 #1 · Mac/PC debate


DGC1 wrote:
Bought my first Mac this year after many years of PC. It's an imac. The OS takes getting used to but isn't that tough and as has always been said, the graphics eat PC's alive. Never thought I'd be a Mac person and I hate their commercials but I truly think they have a better mouse trap.



What exactly does "eats PC's alive" mean ?

What type of video cards were you running in your previous PC so we have a baseline of what is being "eaten alive"

There are some very powerful graphics cards for PC's these days and I'd have a hard time believing just an iMac is going to blow away a well built PC



Nov 02, 2009 at 07:34 PM
DragonflyDM
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p.3 #2 · Mac/PC debate


OS Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-920 processor [2.66GHz, 1MB L2 + 8MB shared L3
Memory 9GB DDR3-1066MHz SDRAM [5 DIMMs] from 8GB edit
Hard drive 640GB 7200 rpm SATA 3Gb/s hard drive
Graphics 1GB NVIDIA GeForce GT 220 [DVI, HDMI, VGA]
drive LightScribe 16X max. DVD+/-R/RW SuperMulti drive
Networking Premium Wireless-N LAN card and Bluetooth(R )

This set up is $1,149 at HP

I am all for buying from a smaller company, but you really have to know what you are buying. I don't know the hardware anymore.



Nov 02, 2009 at 07:38 PM
Micky Bill
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p.3 #3 · Mac/PC debate


I don't really understand this question that comes up all the time. At one time there was a reason to chose one over the other but today it really makes very little or no difference. It comes down to a $ factor, what do you want to spend, and which OS feels better to you. If you want to build it yourself that's another thing, there are a lot of DIYers on FM. You can fine tune it to meet your exclusive needs whatever they might be. You won't be constrained by either system either one will be fine.




Nov 02, 2009 at 07:49 PM
emreese
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p.3 #4 · Mac/PC debate


I needed a new laptop and decided to get a macbook pro to fill that need. Interestingly the MacBook Pro is faster running PS and LR and all the other photo aps I have than my 3.2gig duo core PC. Not scientific but the difference is noticable.




Nov 02, 2009 at 10:55 PM
Andre Labonte
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p.3 #5 · Mac/PC debate


DragonflyDM wrote:
OS Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-920 processor [2.66GHz, 1MB L2 + 8MB shared L3
Memory 9GB DDR3-1066MHz SDRAM [5 DIMMs] from 8GB edit
Hard drive 640GB 7200 rpm SATA 3Gb/s hard drive
Graphics 1GB NVIDIA GeForce GT 220 [DVI, HDMI, VGA]
drive LightScribe 16X max. DVD+/-R/RW SuperMulti drive
Networking Premium Wireless-N LAN card and Bluetooth(R )

This set up is $1,149 at HP

I am all for buying from a smaller company, but you really have to know what you are buying. I don't know the hardware anymore.



Sounds like a nice machine. For that price, go for it.



Nov 02, 2009 at 11:00 PM
theYipster
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p.3 #6 · Mac/PC debate


Andre Labonte wrote:
Sounds like a nice machine. For that price, go for it.


I wouldn't. The one item that gives me pause is the RAM. It's an odd (both in number and strangeness) configuration. With the i7-920, you need to run RAM in pairs of 3 in order for RAM to run at its full speed. With only 5 DIMMS (equaling 9GB) in that configuration, you're RAM is going to take a significant performance hit. Either bump it up to 12GB (6 2GB DIMMS) or trim it down to 6GB (3 2GB DIMMS) and you'll be fine.



Nov 03, 2009 at 12:05 AM
eaglewolf
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p.3 #7 · Mac/PC debate


I use both and personally prefer the Mac, but if you consider cost I would go with a PC.

For me, I prefer to just turn on my computer and use it, not futz around with settings to get it to work the way it should. One can generally spend enough time to get a PC to run as well as a Mac, but my experience has been that my PC's have more issues than my Mac laptop. Not usually anything serious, but enough that I prefer the Mac. Being used to the PC, you probably know all that already.

I will say that when I asked a similar question a couple of years ago, for photography the Mac was the hands down winner for recommendations. It wasn't scientific, but it did seem to be about 8 or 9 to 1 in favor of a Mac. Of course with different people it could go the other way as well, so take that for what it is worth.

The biggest drag about having both the Mac and PC is that you end up buying two sets of software. I run Parallels with XP on the Mac, so if I really have to have PC software on the Mac I can run it, but I prefer native Mac software myself. I'm not sure I would recommend that for Photoshop, but the option is there.

In the long run, if you are asking you can probably stick with the PC. If you try the Mac and really prefer it and don't mind the extra expense, go for it. Otherwise stick with the PC. They ultimately do the same thing and the rest is purely personal preference. I'll keep both going, but I'm not really diehard for either one, even if my Mac does often run better than my PC (which is newer.)

David



Nov 03, 2009 at 12:29 AM
Arka
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p.3 #8 · Mac/PC debate


theletterj wrote:
The reason you're getting sluggish performance from your PC is because you're running CS4 on a machine that's 3-4 years old, not because it's a PC. The same would happen on a Mac.


In my experience, that's not exactly true. My aged Windows XP machine, with certain Malware protections and AntiVirus, still ran much slower relative to its new state than my 5 year old G5, which ran at about the same performance level, but without the malware protection or need to reinstall the OS.

Apple barely supports 4 year old machines (PPC-based), so things could definitely be worst.

That is true, and it's the only reason I sold my old G5. I did not sell it because it had slowed down... quite the contrary; I sold it because Apple and Autodesk left PPC behind.

That being said, I hate owning things that look or behave like crap. Perhaps Win7 has improved the Wintel experience in this regard, but I've been using both systems for a long time. Windows is crap, as are most of the plastic-fantastic, bargain-basement systems it runs on. I used to build them, but that takes time, research, and expertise. I can devote that time to my family, clients, food, or art, but not to my computers.

Again, it appears that Windows 7 has obviated some of the more compelling reasons to think about a Mac. I'll certainly be running it on this system. But for as many times as I have thought about throwing my Windows laptops against the wall, I don't think I'll be moving back to Windows as a sole platform any time soon.

Arka C.




Nov 03, 2009 at 12:50 AM
poisonpill
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p.3 #9 · Mac/PC debate


Anthony Kaye wrote:
I think the OS is half of the deal -- I don't have to mess with OS X; Windows CONSTANTLY requires something - and then wants me to reboot. Crap - I don't WANT to be a computer guy, I want to be WORKING.


It's possible that our experiences are just different, but are you serious that your OSX doesn't keep asking you to reboot? My Mac Pro like once a week says it downloaded updates and needs to reboot. No joke. In fact, it happens so often I just leave that box open and drag it into a corner. Haha. The MacBook isn't as bad so maybe it's the specific software on the pro. Still odd.



Nov 03, 2009 at 12:53 AM
hyperion
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p.3 #10 · Mac/PC debate


www.newegg.com

they have easy to follow videos on youtube that show you how to build your own.




Nov 03, 2009 at 01:11 AM
santaliqueur
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p.3 #11 · Mac/PC debate


you can build an i7 rig for less than a base Mac Pro, and I'm sure his completely smokes Apple's current offering
You make it sound like building your own or buying Apple are the only ways to go. Assembling your own is ALWAYS cheaper than buying from someone else, and is frequently used to make Apple look more expensive.

The Mac Pro is a serious machine that is not cheap. But try pricing similar machines (with identical hardware) from other vendors selling workstations. The Mac Pro is usually cheaper. The pricing debate is won by the PC side when you go below $599, because Apple doesn't offer anything below that.

My girlfriend has a MacBook Pro unibody 13", and it cost $1,199. Find me a laptop with the same specifications (build quality included) for that price. There is a place for super cheap plastic Dell notebooks for $399, and there is a place for more expensive notebooks that were milled out of one block of aluminum. Use whatever you like, but understand that the components may be similar, much of the extra cost goes into making the machines as sleek and sturdy as possible.

Her MBP is as sturdy as I've seen any computer. You can pick the thing up with one corner and it doesn't flex at all, nevermind make any creaking sounds like I've heard on every other laptop I've ever used. Add to that little things like the magsafe power connector, and it makes owning a Mac worth it to some people, not worth it to others. Also, Macs are the only machines that run all 3 major operating systems natively.

But above all that, I prefer OS X to any other operating system by far, and that's why I use a Mac. To each his own, until the end of fanboy OS arguments.



Nov 03, 2009 at 01:19 AM
luminosity
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p.3 #12 · Mac/PC debate


I'll be interested to see how the unbodies are doing about four to five years down the road. I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot of them still around and in service.


Nov 03, 2009 at 01:45 AM
santaliqueur
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p.3 #13 · Mac/PC debate


I would expect them to be great utility notebooks since they should remain solid, but their hardware is going to be dated, like all computer hardware eventually.


Nov 03, 2009 at 03:18 AM
Leoric
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p.3 #14 · Mac/PC debate


Here's my recent experience. At work, I had been using an old single core AMD FX-55 processor with 2 gigs of RAM and two 10,000 rpm Raptors, quite an old computer and the company I work for decided to get me a brand new 8-core, 12GB of DDR3 Mac Pro with the last version of Leopard (not Snow Leopard, because Capture NX 2.2 doesn't work). I was expecting a massive boost in performance. Well, bad news. Photoshop actually runs worse than the single core antique PC and that's especially visible when you try the warp function. On the PC, everything is smooth, but on the Mac, it's like I'm running a 386. I've noticed a boost in performance for Capture NX 2, but not something out of this world. ptgui processes my panoramas faster, but when you place control points it's actually slower to match between images.

I know that CS4 only uses 3 GB or ram of the Mac and I've read that ptgui actually knows how to work with several cores. I don't know about how Photoshop and Capture NX 2 benefit from the extra processing power.

Overall, I'm utterly disappointed about the whole Apple/Mac thing. I am aware of the 32-bit limitations when it comes to memory, but even so, the Mac should have had a more consistent boost in performance.



Nov 03, 2009 at 04:11 AM
lou f
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p.3 #15 · Mac/PC debate


to quote dionysis...

dreamworls- pc

pixar- mac

:o)



Nov 03, 2009 at 07:08 AM
lou f
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p.3 #16 · Mac/PC debate


my nx2 snow lepard experience on my 24'' 2.93 imac. nx2.2.1 and view nx (not the latest version) boot in 64 bit mode and its very quick, quicker than 32 bit.


Nov 03, 2009 at 07:12 AM
linathael
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p.3 #17 · Mac/PC debate


panos.v wrote:
If you start thinking how you can get the same performance for less and the words "value", "cost", "benefit" and "ratio" turn up, you don't want the iMac. Nobody buys an iMac for the cost-to-performance benefit. You buy it because it looks nice and runs OS X (which is a personal taste). The fact that it is a pretty good machine too is a bonus. But Dell can most definately sell you something faster for less.

not necessarily with the same quality and reliability.
If Apple is first in customer satisfaction, and Dell way behind there is a reason, and it has a cost.
As a definition you should invest in a computer you feel confident and comfortable with.

After all, one should not restrict "faster" to the clock speed of your processor. In addition, the iMac 27" comes with core i5 or i7 (a quad core CPU unlike stated by the original poster).
Today, performance of a computer is drivent buy the best combination between CPU, RAM and HD (and of course GPU). In other words, it is useless to get a quad core GPU in a Dell if you get a slow HD, as it will be the bottle neck.
In addition multicore hardware are only usefull and user benefits from it when the OS and the application are coded to be multi-core-aware.
Windows XP and Vista are NOT particularly multicpre aware, Windows 7 should improve this topic, but one should be cautious between what Microsoft says and what is finally done.
Linux is multicore aware, and Mac OS X Snow Leopard is too. In other words, the stystem itself will run faster on multicore CPU hardware. If your favorite application is coded mono-threaded (so single core aware), then one one core of your quad core will be used. In this case it could be usefull to have a Core i5 or i7, or any CPU featuring the Turbo Boost mode, able to overclock its cores depending on load and threading of applications.

overall, if you feel that the Mac and its OS X would be nice as a try, then go for it, you will of course be able to sale your hardware at a good price if you change your mind. If you go for a PC, then carefull select a unit with the same specification (meaning true identical motherboard, CPU, HD RAM latency, etc...) than the iMac to really find simlar performance level.

I did the exercice recently, and the iMac or any other Mac hardware is only 10% more expensive than its "true" corresponding PC model. I know some people will argue I am wrong because they simply look at the CPU and its clock speed, and not beyond, but this is a mistake.

I might even think than the original poster might really improve its current hardware by purcahsing the Samsung 24" LED display + fast HD (WD velociraptor, or even SSD) + some RAM modules with low CL.

Have fun, and remember, the best computer is the one that can do the work you want to do without troubles and fights.

PS: If you want to switch to Mac, do it, maybe by step, get a MacBook Pro 13.3" and start discovering how Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard is a real advanced OS, even compared to Win7. Discover why it really matters to get a computer thought as a optimized unit and not assembled pieces. I use both mac and PC, and if you give me the choice, I go Mac as you can get access to plenty of features without the pain of looking for them, better GUI for both beginner and power user.



Nov 03, 2009 at 08:28 AM
linathael
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p.3 #18 · Mac/PC debate


Leoric wrote:
Here's my recent experience. At work, I had been using an old single core AMD FX-55 processor with 2 gigs of RAM and two 10,000 rpm Raptors, quite an old computer and the company I work for decided to get me a brand new 8-core, 12GB of DDR3 Mac Pro with the last version of Leopard (not Snow Leopard, because Capture NX 2.2 doesn't work). I was expecting a massive boost in performance. Well, bad news. Photoshop actually runs worse than the single core antique PC and that's especially visible when you try the warp function. On the PC, everything
...Show more
well, well again not comparing the same thing.
put both Raptor in your Mac Pro, and repeat the experiernce
last but not least, if CS4 run slowwer on your Mac than on your PC, then you have a problem in the installation or something like that.



Nov 03, 2009 at 09:52 AM
Pavel
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p.3 #19 · Mac/PC debate


Well put linathael.


Nov 03, 2009 at 09:54 AM
MichaelKirk
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p.3 #20 · Mac/PC debate


These are the kind of threads that kill us "computer Idiots" that are looking for a new computer!

I'm pretty much in the same boat as the OP, I have a several year old DELL with upgraded ram and HD's. Wife put a nice virus on it that we can't seem to completely get rid of - want to upgrade my monitor to at least a 24" and no sence in doing this if I get an iMac.....I was holding off buying last year to see what MAC came out with. Spent way too much time on the phone over the years with Dell's Tech support. Have always been intersted in switching to MAC. Build your own? Wish I knew how, Comparabible prebuilt PC options??

27" iMac or PC??

You come across these threads and back and forth one is better, no PC is better - no Mac is better...build your own.....man it get confusing I guess it's the Ford vs Chevy vs Imports vs coke vs pepsie vs......

Guess I'll just tag along for the ride a bit longer.

Michael






Nov 03, 2009 at 10:24 AM
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