When you really start to look closely

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Archive 2009 · When you really start to look closely

dave chilvers
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p.1 #1 · When you really start to look closely

Just of late during some poor weather I took my 1dsmk3 + 24-105 out in the rain and dull conditions. It did very well and I got some good images that I probably wouldn`t have tried with my 5d2 + my MF lenses.
OK! today I needed some fresh air and went for a casual walk along a local beach armed with the 1dsmk3, 24-105 and a few contax lenses just to compare.

Viewing the images in Breeze Browser (that adds some levels and sharpening in full screen view) they all looked acceptable and would be great for web and printing.

Now you start to look at 100% no processing (maybe we shouldn`t do just that) and the difference just slaps you around the face in favour of the MF lenses. It`s only when you have a selection of MF lenses to shoot with alongside the likes of the 24-105 and 17-40 do you realise just why we take the trouble to put up with fine tuning adapters and manually focussing our lenses. It all becomes more important when you have to crop.

My lenses that stand out from the many I have are.

Contax 21 2.8
Contax 35 2.8
Contax 100 3.5
Voigt Ultron 40mm mk2 AI-s(better now I have a decent adapter and have fitted a rubber band around aperture ring for grip)
Leica 50 f2 sumi
Canon 85 1.8
Canon 135 f2 (in good light but needs IS like the 100 just got)
Canon 70-200 f4 IS

Just the musings of an old timer

Oct 29, 2009 at 06:27 PM

Lotusm50
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p.1 #2 · When you really start to look closely

Indeed.

Oct 29, 2009 at 06:44 PM

rachp
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p.1 #3 · When you really start to look closely

I am down to two Canon AF lenses

Another fun part of the entire MF lens thing is trying out something new for a decent price and being Wowed by the results.

Oct 29, 2009 at 06:50 PM

millsart
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p.1 #4 · When you really start to look closely

Couldn't the same be said for some of the modern AF glass though like the 35mm F1.4, 85mm F1.2 mkII etc ?

Nothing against the 24-105, it was a great range and I liked mine before switching to Nikon, but its hardly the sharpest tool in the shed as far as zooms go.

So in some regards a decent but versatile AF zoom lens verse a MF prime really isn't enough to draw a conclusion that MF primes are superior overall because they really are going up against a very worthy opponent.

To each his own of course but I'd wager at the end of the day most people would probably get better overall images (maybe not sharper) from a day of shooting with a 24-105 however. AF, versatile range, IS, convenience probably win out of a bag full of primes.

Horses for courses but I guess it depends if your after one or two stellar shots are being able to capture a diverse range of photos from a day trip

Oct 29, 2009 at 07:05 PM

dave chilvers
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p.1 #5 · When you really start to look closely

millsart wrote:
Couldn't the same be said for some of the modern AF glass though like the 35mm F1.4, 85mm F1.2 mkII etc ?

Nothing against the 24-105, it was a great range and I liked mine before switching to Nikon, but its hardly the sharpest tool in the shed as far as zooms go.

So in some regards a decent but versatile AF zoom lens verse a MF prime really isn't enough to draw a conclusion that MF primes are superior overall because they really are going up against a very worthy opponent.

To each his own of course but I'd wager at the end of the day most people would probably get better overall images (maybe not sharper) from a day of shooting with a 24-105 however. AF, versatile range, IS, convenience probably win out of a bag full of primes.

Horses for courses but I guess it depends if your after one or two stellar shots are being able to capture a diverse range of photos from a day trip

I tend to agree, I certainly wouldn`t have got as many in the poor conditions the other day, camera under coat, out, up to the eye, fire and away again.
Trouble is that after using MF lenses that produce just great IQ you tend to always be looking for it. I did go through a period of not looking at my images at 100% and to be honest I was producing (to me) some very pleasing work. I have owned some very expensive lenses over the years(when I ran a business and could afford what I wanted) and produced some great images from sometimes the most meagre equipment which does prove that the old rule of "F8 and be their" is more important than equipment. So for me at least i still use the 24-105 for the times when I just need to be able to nail the shot and don`t have the time to fuss about. I changed a couple of years ago when I had more time on my hands and started to submit to stock agencies where you need to spot at 100% and so began the road down the MF lenses. I find it`s not just the IQ but the time spent dealing with CA from my Canon lenses although I admit that quite often it`s quick you do find sometimes it can take an age. The other thing that widened the gap between MF lenses and AF was when I moved to 21 million pixels. OK, you are looking at a massive file at 100% and maybe it`s not fair but you can`t get away from (and I`ve seen this so many times) that at times 100% using my contax lenses look almost as if you have processed and sharpened the images. For instance my Contax 35-70 can produce images that are almost ready to go from basic raw convertion and get straight through QC and really look like they have had some sharpening applied.

Thanks for your remarks

Oct 29, 2009 at 08:11 PM

jcolwell
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p.1 #6 · When you really start to look closely

millsart wrote:
Horses for courses but I guess it depends if your after one or two stellar shots are being able to capture a diverse range of photos from a day trip

I agree. I usually take the 24-105L for shooting just about anything on a day trip, or while traveling. I was in Sweden last week with the 24-105L and 5D, plus a Voigtlander 20/3.5 and 180/4, just in case (I didn't even unwrap the Distagon 28/2.8 that was stashed away, in the back of somewhere). By far the majority of my shots were taken with the 24-105L. I used the 20/3.5 quite a lot in the Vasa Museum, and the 180/4 APO for some skyline shots from the hotel (on a tripod). Of course, on my few free hours, I was touring the beautiful and interesting city of Stockholm with my equally beautiful and interesting wife - taking 15 minutes to get 'the shot' was not on the agenda.

Around home and for trips where photography is more of a central theme, I take the 24-105L on 5D and a 70-200/4L IS on 40D - a versatile combination, for sure.

OTOH, when I'm out for a day or more of dedicated shooting, hoping for a few really good images, then the zooms usually stay home and I bring along a case or two of MF alternatives. One of which is the not-so alternative 135/2L. The results are better, but only if you have the time to spare and the patience to get it right. Man, it's a lot easier now than in the 'old days', with a honking big LF camera, or a beautiful Fuji GW670II and handheld light meter (it's easier now with a DSLR, the results aren't necessarily better).

Oct 29, 2009 at 08:36 PM

Sam N
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p.1 #7 · When you really start to look closely

So you're saying primes give better image quality than zooms? Well I'll be...

Oct 29, 2009 at 08:43 PM

jcolwell
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p.1 #8 · When you really start to look closely

Sam N wrote:
So you're saying primes give better image quality than zooms? Well I'll be...

I think it's fair to say that (when you have sufficient time), excellent primes give better results than excellent zooms. OTOH, I've used many good primes (some with excellent reps) that couldn't match the performance of my L-zooms.

Oct 29, 2009 at 08:46 PM

SJMD
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p.1 #9 · When you really start to look closely

the Carl Zeiss 35-70mm might be an exception.

Oct 30, 2009 at 01:23 PM

jaetie
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p.1 #10 · When you really start to look closely

rachp wrote:
Another fun part of the entire MF lens thing is trying out something new for a decent price and being Wowed by the results.

i find this to be scary. i don't like to take the risk of finding out if a lens is good or bad. i prefer to live off the feedback of others

Oct 30, 2009 at 03:46 PM

Greg Feldman
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p.1 #11 · When you really start to look closely

Comparing the lenses in your list with the 24-105 is like comparing Macallan 18-Year with the booze I just cooked up in my bathroom.

Oct 30, 2009 at 04:38 PM

rachp
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p.1 #12 · When you really start to look closely

Greg Feldman wrote:
Comparing the lenses in your list with the 24-105 is like comparing Macallan 18-Year with the booze I just cooked up in my bathroom.

Oct 30, 2009 at 04:56 PM

Jman13
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p.1 #13 · When you really start to look closely

Yeah, I'd say this is more a case of comparing primes vs. a general purpose zoom. The only zoom I've used that is as good as the best primes I've used in the same range is the Canon 70-200 f/4L IS, which is every bit as sharp as the very best primes I've ever used in that range.

I'd also put my new Canon 100 f/2.8L Macro up against anything from a resolution standpoint (though it's also pretty damn good in any other respect as well.)

Oct 30, 2009 at 05:42 PM

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