Hail the king of 24mm

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Archive 2009 · Hail the king of 24mm

globalkiwi
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p.4 #1 · Hail the king of 24mm

Not sure about the sweeping comparisons w/- the Zeiss 21mm. I haven't seem many samples from the ZE version as it's not in stores yet & AFFAIK, mint copies of the CZ version go for less than $1700 (which is still a lot but less than the new TS-E). I think the jury is still out on the ZE 21 vs. TS-E 24 II - for me at least.

Jul 04, 2009 at 05:26 PM

thedigitalbean
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p.4 #2 · Hail the king of 24mm

globalkiwi wrote:
I think the jury is still out on the ZE 21 vs. TS-E 24 II - for me at least.

Without a doubt. As you said I don't think the ZE 21 is even available yet. I suspect that whatever difference will be minor at f/5.6 or smaller. What will be interesting is to see what the distortion looks like.

Jul 04, 2009 at 05:35 PM

Yakim Peled
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p.4 #3 · Hail the king of 24mm

kewlcanon wrote:
I've never owned a TS-E what else can it do ?. BIF ? Portrait ? Macro

Jul 05, 2009 at 06:44 AM

lovinglife
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p.4 #4 · Hail the king of 24mm

Yakim Peled wrote:
kewlcanon wrote:
I've never owned a TS-E what else can it do ?. BIF ? Portrait ? Macro

TS is great for macro.

http://www.aobild.se/externalcontent/ts-e/guitar/tsdemo.htm

Actually, I was so impressed that I went through some ordeal to get it.

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/743122/

Happy shooting,
Yakim.

Yakim - Great examples on that first link.
I still don't understand how u get so much DOF with the tilt+wide open, thats really cool!

Jul 05, 2009 at 07:51 AM

Yakim Peled
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p.4 #5 · Hail the king of 24mm

Me neither but I intend to find out. Finally I have all the equipment I need. Now I need to find enough time to experiment.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.

Jul 05, 2009 at 08:05 AM

SKumar25
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p.4 #6 · Hail the king of 24mm

In non tilted mode, imagine the plane of focus a couple of metres away is like a 1 foot wall, perpendicular to the direction of the guitar. So all within the wall is in focus, hence in this mode you will only get a small part of the guitar in focus.

With the tilt function, this wall of focus can be tilted, even such that it is in the same plane as the guitar. Hence the whole guitar is in focus.

Neat eh!!!

At least this is how it works. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Jul 05, 2009 at 11:41 AM

Jman13
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p.4 #7 · Hail the king of 24mm

Tilt swings the focus plane. You get that DOF by exactly aligning the focus plane with the ground. It creates a 'wedge' of focus when laid on its side, and everything from near to infinity is now IN the focus plane. You can't do this too much if you have tall objects close to you when are laying the focus plane flat, because the tops will be outside the focus plane. The wedge expands as you get further away, so you can get taller objects further away still in focus.

Example shot...I was about 4 inches from the leaves, and it's sharp all the way to the buildings. This was at f/6.3. (24 TS-E Mark I) Note the top of the branches that are close are a bit OOF due to the laying of the focus plane:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Very useful link for how tilt works (there's also another link for how shift works in that article)
http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/tilt-shift-lenses2.htm

Jul 05, 2009 at 11:42 AM

Pixel Perfect
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p.4 #8 · Hail the king of 24mm

Jman13 wrote:
Tilt swings the focus plane. You get that DOF by exactly aligning the focus plane with the ground. It creates a 'wedge' of focus when laid on its side, and everything from near to infinity is now IN the focus plane. You can't do this too much if you have tall objects close to you when are laying the focus plane flat, because the tops will be outside the focus plane. The wedge expands as you get further away, so you can get taller objects further away still in focus.

Example shot...I was about 4 inches from the leaves, and it's sharp all the way to the buildings. This was at f/6.3. (24 TS-E Mark I) Note the top of the branches that are close are a bit OOF due to the laying of the focus plane:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

I guess if you had stopped down to say f/11, the wedge would have enlarged enough to get the branches in sharp(ish) too?

Jul 05, 2009 at 12:14 PM

Jman13
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p.4 #9 · Hail the king of 24mm

It would have enlarged, and would have likely gotten the tree about 40 feet away all the way in focus, but the branches are likely too close to get them tack sharp when the focus plane was tilted this much (I was at max tilt).

Jul 05, 2009 at 12:47 PM

Pixel Perfect
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p.4 #10 · Hail the king of 24mm

Jman13 wrote:
It would have enlarged, and would have likely gotten the tree about 40 feet away all the way in focus, but the branches are likely too close to get them tack sharp when the focus plane was tilted this much (I was at max tilt).

Did you also tilt the camera at all as I think that would also help. The buildings are far enough away that converging verticals shouldn't be an issue.

Jul 05, 2009 at 01:02 PM

n0b0
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p.4 #11 · Hail the king of 24mm

Speaking of which, why did you pick the 45 TSE Whayne? why not the 24?

Jul 05, 2009 at 01:06 PM

Pixel Perfect
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p.4 #12 · Hail the king of 24mm

n0b0 wrote:
Speaking of which, why did you pick the 45 TSE Whayne? why not the 24?

Ah, that's because I'd heard a lot of negative comments on the 24 and the 45 seemed to be better regarded. Also I quite often prefer a longer lens for landscape and on FF I find 45mm quite wide and I can use shift to get a nice pano. I knew it wouldn't be wide enough for a lot of architectural type work though. My experience is the 45 is an excellent lens and mine's even pretty sharp wide open and the corners are excellent for landscape.

I'm am now wondering though whether to get the new 24 or 17, as both look superb

Jul 05, 2009 at 02:29 PM

n0b0
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p.4 #13 · Hail the king of 24mm

Same here Whayne, that's why I'm asking you why you got that one.

Anyway, those tilt shift lenses have to be THE landscape lenses to get... well, one of them anyway, can't afford all of them.

Jul 05, 2009 at 03:06 PM

ILOVECANONL
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p.4 #14 · Hail the king of 24mm

garyvot wrote:
ILOVECANONL wrote:
i'd grab the 14-24mm anyday for a wedding

the new 24L II and 24TSE II looks sweet for weddings too.

16-35, 17-40 not so.

I don't own the 17-40, but the 16-35 II is an outstanding zoom in my experience, and seems to be commonly used for weddings. It's only significant weakness is some softness in the extreme corners at wide apertures, but this almost never detracts from candid photography, and is resolved when stopping down.

For candid shooting, I don't have the patience for adapters, stopped down metering or manual focus, so the Nikkor and the 24 TS-E are simply not options for me. The 24L II is a fantastic lens, but a zoom is often more practical for event work.

16-35 would be a practical solution but for $1600 I rather spend a bit more on a 24L II or 24TS-E II. Or seriously, save that money and go for a 24L I.

I don't have the time to wait for a 16-9 adaptor but for razor sharp extreme corners I'd gladly sacrifice stopped down metering or manual focus. Manual focus isn't that big of a deal at 24mm and F3.5. Focus confirmation works.

Jul 05, 2009 at 04:19 PM

ILOVECANONL
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p.4 #15 · Hail the king of 24mm

SKumar25 wrote:
ILOVECANONL wrote:
i'd grab the 14-24mm anyday for a wedding

the new 24L II and 24TSE II looks sweet for weddings too.

16-35, 17-40 not so.

Really, the 14-24mm (I assume on a Canon), and a 24TSE for weddings!?! What sort of wedding photos would you take with these?

The 24LII would be awesome for weddings, and I've seen some excellent samples.

The 16-35 is prime like across much of the frame on FF, coupled with a very versatile zoom range. It makes for an excellent PJ lens. The 2.8 L zooms are the the mainstay of many a wedding photographer's kit.

14-24G on a nikon or canon would slaughter any wedding. 24TS-E would make for interesting blur effects. I'd use the new 24TSE wide open for photojournalist wedding photos, portraits, landscapes, formals, etc. The list goes on and on.

The 16-35 is a popular lens for many pros and wedding photographers, but that doesn't mean it's a masterpiece. You didn't have much choice between this and the 17-40 for wide angle back in the day. Now that there is a wide variety of better choices, why use the same tools as everyone else?

Jul 05, 2009 at 04:24 PM

dancam
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p.4 #16 · Hail the king of 24mm

Yakim Peled wrote:
kewlcanon wrote:
I've never owned a TS-E what else can it do ?. BIF ? Portrait ? Macro

TS is great for macro.

http://www.aobild.se/externalcontent/ts-e/guitar/tsdemo.htm

Actually, I was so impressed that I went through some ordeal to get it.

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/743122/

Happy shooting,
Yakim.

Great examples Yakim. The TS-E 90 is definately an excellent lens, I love mine. I'll never figure out why it's not an "L", oh well.

Jul 05, 2009 at 05:25 PM

n0b0
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p.4 #17 · Hail the king of 24mm

That "macro" must mean macro photography or close-up photography, starts from 1:3 which is why every damn lens manufacturers can slap the word macro on their lenses with 1:3 magnification. Tamron even went as far as putting it on their 28-200mm with 1:4 mag. Not helping with the general misconception about macro.

Photomacrography itself (or "true macro" as I call it

) starts from 1:1 to 10:1 magnification.

Sorry about the rant.

Jul 05, 2009 at 06:13 PM

skibum5
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p.4 #18 · Hail the king of 24mm

globalkiwi wrote:
Not sure about the sweeping comparisons w/- the Zeiss 21mm. I haven't seem many samples from the ZE version as it's not in stores yet & AFFAIK, mint copies of the CZ version go for less than $1700 (which is still a lot but less than the new TS-E). I think the jury is still out on the ZE 21 vs. TS-E 24 II - for me at least.

didn't the CZ copies go for more ike $3000 for quite a while? before the ZE was announced?

Jul 05, 2009 at 06:33 PM

SKumar25
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p.4 #19 · Hail the king of 24mm

skibum5 wrote:
globalkiwi wrote:
Not sure about the sweeping comparisons w/- the Zeiss 21mm. I haven't seem many samples from the ZE version as it's not in stores yet & AFFAIK, mint copies of the CZ version go for less than $1700 (which is still a lot but less than the new TS-E). I think the jury is still out on the ZE 21 vs. TS-E 24 II - for me at least.

didn't the CZ copies go for more ike $3000 for quite a while? before the ZE was announced?

Makes the current TSE crop look like bargains!

Jul 06, 2009 at 01:01 AM

musclepics
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p.4 #20 · Hail the king of 24mm

Pixel Perfect wrote:
Doug Ball wrote:
Check out this comparison with the 14-24. The 24 TS-E is in a different league.

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/787618

Yes and as I said that 14-24 is not very good. I'm sure the 24 TS-E II is better, but the 14-24 has been shown to be sharp wide open, even in the corners on a 1Ds III. Go to www.16-9.net for comparisons. Only the Zeiss distagon 21 f/2.8 beat it up until now.

I thought Nikon didn't make "bad copies" of their lenses?

Jul 06, 2009 at 01:10 AM

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