A Tale of Two Rokkors

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Archive 2008 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

cogitech
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p.1 #1 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Happy New Year, everyone!

The following is a comparison of two samples of the famous Minolta MC Rokkor-PG 58mm f1.2. One of the lenses is the 1st generation (serial # 2004xxx) with metal focusing ring and radioactive element (which is obvious in the sample shots). The other is a later version with rubber focus ring and no signs of radioactive yellowing (serial # 2588xxx). I have converted both of these lenses to EF mount using the exact same process. I overshot infinity just ever so slightly on the older one, but that is irrelevant for this test.

All shots taken on my 5D, ISO 100, tripod, MLU, lenses wide open, processed from RAW with Bibble with mild capture sharpening of 150 on a 400 scale (and Bibble doesn't do any unknown sharpening like the other apps do). All crops 100%.

(Note: the full scene shots have had supplemental JPEG sharpening, but not the crops).

Scene 1, older version:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Scene 1, newer version:

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Scene 1, older version, crop:

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Scene 1, newer version, crop:

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Scene 2, older version:

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Scene 2, newer version:

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Scene 2, older version, crop:

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Scene 2, newer version, crop:

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Scene 3, older version (simply refocused shot of scene 2):

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Scene 3, newer version (simply refocused shot of scene 2):

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Scene 3, older version, crop:

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Scene 3, newer version, crop:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Conculsion: Damned fine lenses, right to the edge, wide open! Minor differences in the crops can be attributed to focusing differences, IMHO. I was working with about 1cm of DOF, if that, under the influence of a few festive drinks

Once I give the old version the "window treatment" for a few weeks, it'll be just as good as the newer one. I think this lens is easily the best value ever! It seems silly to even call an f1.2 lens a "value", but this one certainly is!

BTW, the "Aventinus Eisbock" in Scene 3 is a damned good drink, but be careful

(I only had two beers, ociffer!)

Edited by cogitech on Jan 01, 2008 at 06:25 PM GMT

Edited by cogitech on Jan 01, 2008 at 10:04 PM GMT

Edited on Jan 02, 2008 at 03:04 AM

Jan 01, 2008 at 11:14 PM

jmswickard
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p.1 #2 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Cogitech,
Makes me wonder which model my 58/1.2 Rokkor is sn is 2570*** and it does not have the rubber grip on the lens. Interesting I think

As I mentioned in the last thread it can be seen in my avatar.
Jack

Jan 01, 2008 at 11:24 PM

cogitech
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p.1 #3 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

I'm pretty sure they went to a rubber ring at 258xxxx.

I think the point is; "It doesn't matter which version you have."

Jan 01, 2008 at 11:31 PM

cogitech
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p.1 #4 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

With a bit more sharpening and local contrast tweaking on the RAW file (dead simple to do in Bibble) you can get 100% crops like this out of this lens:

Look to the right of the frame, which is nearly the edge of the 5D frame:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

I'll remind you once more (thanks Aventinus!) that this was shot at f1.2!

Edited on Jan 01, 2008 at 11:41 PM

Jan 01, 2008 at 11:39 PM

weekh
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p.1 #5 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

How much is the lens expected to cost?
Also, how about the conversion to Canon mount? Where do I send it for conversion and what's the cost?

Jan 01, 2008 at 11:42 PM

cogitech
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p.1 #6 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Currently the price on the bay is between $200 and $300, which is way up from just a couple of months ago. I've only seen one pre-converted sell on the bay and it went for $400.

I know how you can get it converted, but Fred would likely ban me if I told you.

Jan 01, 2008 at 11:55 PM

Ola_P
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p.1 #7 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

WOW. I'm very happy to have picked one up @ 223$ shipped... Can't wait for it to arrive.

Jan 02, 2008 at 01:00 AM

jmswickard
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p.1 #8 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

I have heard rumors that Cogitech could convert it for you--but the rules require you to contact him by email or private message.
Jack

Jan 02, 2008 at 01:35 AM

adamM
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p.1 #9 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Wow!
Thanks for sharing cogitech

My Rokkor just arrived today. Some pretty heavy bubbling on the black paint around the edge of one of the lens elements... I hope that doesn't effect things much.

Such a brilliant lens! I'm staggered at the wide open performance. Major diamond in the rough here

Jan 02, 2008 at 07:51 AM

joekraft
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p.1 #10 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Do you see any difference in the bokeh quality of the two?

Jan 03, 2008 at 12:16 AM

cogitech
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p.1 #11 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

I haven't tested them directly for bokeh, but I would have to assume they are as close in that regard as they are in sharpness. They have identical optical formulas (except for one having a rare earth element). But, I really aught to test them... hmmm.

Jan 03, 2008 at 12:25 AM

pdmphoto
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p.1 #12 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

How about some tests in strong outdoor light with high contrast, especially at the corners, and something closer to infinity focus? There are many f/1.2 and f/1.4 lenses thast perform well in low contrast or low light, and at close focus distances. It's the performance at/near infinity and demanding lighting situations that make a good lens great.

Edited on Jan 03, 2008 at 02:10 AM

Jan 03, 2008 at 02:09 AM

cogitech
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p.1 #13 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Paul,

I'll see what I can do to test under those circumstances, but I have to admit that I certainly don't plan to use this lens at infinity much. In fact, I can't imagine what I'd be shooting at infinity wide open, so do you mean infinity stopped down to f8 or so?

Anyway, here's a couple samples I took the other day with the old version of the lens while I was testing for infinity focus. Not sure if they really fit your description, but I have them available so...

Wide open, 5D, ISO 100, hand held, 1/2500th:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

f8, 5D, ISO 100, hand held, 1/125th:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Wide open, 100% crop:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

f8, 100% crop:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

The wide open shot obviously shows some light falloff and has lower contrast and lower resolution than the f8 shot. No big surprise there.

But, as you can see, this lens does continue to resolve a very admirable amount of detail even wide open. In the first crop, look at the tree branches in the top left, the paint chipping on the house, the brick and siding on the other houses, etc. This is something I would not expect from many lenses wide open.

Note: No hood was used for either of these shots.

Edited by cogitech on Jan 02, 2008 at 11:43 PM GMT

Edited on Jan 03, 2008 at 04:43 AM

Jan 03, 2008 at 04:07 AM

cogitech
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p.1 #14 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Centre crops from the same images. Again, wide open is not as sharp and contrasty as f8 (as expected) but the tiny tree branches are still resolved and the texture in the tree bark is still visible.

A complete lack of CA, but a bit of "glow".

Wide open

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Edited on Jan 03, 2008 at 04:26 AM

Jan 03, 2008 at 04:25 AM

Anden
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p.1 #15 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Looks like a winner to me.
I am awaiting my copy any day now.

A

Jan 03, 2008 at 02:33 PM

weekh
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p.1 #16 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

For those who intend to purchase the lens, just be aware that there is a 50mm and 58mm version. I was confused and purchased the 50mm version.

I did a search and found a test comparison between the 50 and 58mm:
http://www.rokkorfiles.com/Battle%20of%2050s1.htm

I guess I preferred to have the 58mm version for its bokeh.

Jan 04, 2008 at 10:38 PM

cogitech
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p.1 #17 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Wee,

I have just e-mailed you regarding this;

A strong warning to anyone who is looking to convert (or have converted) the Rokkor 58/1.2, make sure it is the MC Rokkor 58/1.2 NOT the MD Rokkor 50/1.2!

Not only does the 58/1.2 have better bokeh, but the 50/1.2 can not be easily modified to EF mount, as far as I know.

Edited on Jan 05, 2008 at 01:11 AM

Jan 05, 2008 at 12:08 AM

hubsand
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p.1 #18 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

That looks like an awfully protruding rear element . . . have you used the lens on a 5D and 1 Series bodies? Is it clear at infinity? Or is it like the Tale of the Takumar?

Edited on Jan 05, 2008 at 02:33 AM

Jan 05, 2008 at 02:33 AM

cogitech
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p.1 #19 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

I modify the rear element retaining ring to reduce the protrusion as much as possible and I use it on my mirror modded 5D. Not sure about 1-Series.

I can also use my Takumar 50/1.4 on my 5D. (The images above were all taken with my 5D)

After the mount conversion and modification, the rear does not protrude any further than a Takumar 50/1.4. Maybe a bit less, in fact. So, if you can use a Takumar 50/1.4 on your 1-series, then you'll be able to use one of these. It'll make a damned fine portrait lens for croppers, too!

I mentioned all this in my original post on the mount conversion. http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic2/583872

Edited on Jan 05, 2008 at 05:50 AM

Jan 05, 2008 at 05:23 AM

jmswickard
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p.1 #20 · A Tale of Two Rokkors

Wee,
I have checked with Pete Ganzel ( peteganzel@lycos.com ) re modifying the 50mm f1.2 Rokkor MD. He says that he would have no problem modifying this to Canon Eos mount. He has done many to Pentax M42. Once adapted it may not be returned to its former state.
Pete did my 58mm f1.2 Rokkor MC conversion and he did a very nice job.
Jack Swickard

Jan 05, 2008 at 05:38 PM

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