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Archive 2012 · 1dx and 5D Mark III
  
 
die_kruzen
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p.1 #1 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


Hello All,

What makes the 1DX better than the 5D Mark III when it comes to responsiveness and AF? I know they have a lot of things in common with respect to the AF -- but why would an X be considered an sports/action type camera and the 5D Mark III not so much? I understand the FPS difference..but is that really it?

Pete



Sep 03, 2012 at 05:35 PM
fisherman_188
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p.1 #2 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


Have you compared their specs side by side? That should show you plenty of reasons the 1D-X would be favored in that situation.


Sep 03, 2012 at 05:37 PM
die_kruzen
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p.1 #3 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


I have...to an extent 188. Well, as much as I can comprehend. But, the glaring difference I see is the dual image processors used by the X. Is that responsible for the perhaps lack of a better word -- the responsiveness? Just trying to understand.

Pete



Sep 03, 2012 at 05:45 PM
RobertLynn
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p.1 #4 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


Dual image processors.
Fps.
Spot metering linked to af point.
Increased durability/longevity of the shutter.



Sep 03, 2012 at 05:49 PM
die_kruzen
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p.1 #5 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


When I read explanations like that Robert….it just seems to me that it really is the FPS -- press the shutter and get as many images as possible (taking into account the FPS and shutter longevity) and simply (and most likely rightfully) points to the dual processors. As for the spot metering point -- not sure I understand that and need to do a bit more reading.

Thanks, Pete



Sep 03, 2012 at 06:00 PM
StillFingerz
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p.1 #6 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


RobertLynn wrote:
Dual image processors.
Fps.
Spot metering linked to af point.
Increased durability/longevity of the shutter.

+1
Also the 1DX's AF and metering system has it's own dedicated Digic4 CPU...no other Canon has this!

That's 3 CPUs...it best be responsive



Sep 03, 2012 at 06:01 PM
die_kruzen
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p.1 #7 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


OK SF...maybe that is what I am missing - the third processor.

Thanks, Pete



Sep 03, 2012 at 06:07 PM
arbitrage
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p.1 #8 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


The actual AF processor is not the Digic4. It is an unnamed processor same as the 5D3. However, the Digic4 is used as the Metering processor and if you select EOS iTR AF mode then the Digic4 has some effect on the AF system as an adjunct to the main system. However, EOS iTR AF only works in Zone and All-61pt modes and not in AF expansion or single point modes.

The dual digit 5+ processors are there for the throughput of the data to allow 12FPS and also don't affect AF performance.

With EOS iTR AF turned off, the only AF system differences between the 1DX and the 5D3 will be because of the larger battery in the 1DX.

All this info and more can be found in this lengthy document .... http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/education/technical/eos_1d_x_explained.do

There is a similar article on that site about the 5D3 and a lot of the text is copy and pasted between the two articles showing how similar the AF systems are in the two cameras.

There are a lot of other reasons that the 1DX demands its price premium over the 5D3 (integrated grip, larger battery, better weather sealing, better shutter, better high ISO IQ, FPS, better metering with the Digic4 etc...)but for the most part the AF system is not one of them.



Sep 03, 2012 at 06:54 PM
AaronNegro
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p.1 #9 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


OK, I play

VF is larger
better build and weather sealing.
speed in processing
New metering, that is important as besides having a way more modern system, it is also linked to the AF point.
Seems to have almost 1/2 stop better ISO
Integrated Grip
Shutter delay is way shorter--VERY important this one in my opinion.
400K Shutter
Way larger buffer
12 FPS
Longer battery life

Etc...




Sep 03, 2012 at 07:55 PM
die_kruzen
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p.1 #10 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


At one point, I owned the Nikon D3s. Hands down, a great camera. It was nearly impossible to take an out of focus image. The focus, responsiveness was simply that good. So, now that I see the X and the 5D Mark III sharing similar AF, what makes it that the X have that level of responsiveness (might be better stated as the shutter delay)? People have weighed in about the multiple processors and the battery size.. So, if the X has 12 FPS and the 5D Mark III has 6, is that the reason the III is not the optimal camera for sports/high action?

Thanks again, Pete



Sep 03, 2012 at 08:37 PM
 

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arbitrage
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p.1 #11 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


I think the FPS is a big part of it. If you consider most pros were using the 1D4 at 10FPS and other people using the 7D at 8FPS, then it would be hard for these people (especially the 1D4 guys) to switch to a 5D3 at 6FPS. Before the 1DX was out, the 5D3 got compared to the 1D4 a lot based on the AF system. Most comparisons favoured the 5D3's new AF system and speculation was if the 1DX would be even better. Now with the 1DX being available most comparisons do give the 1DX an advantage in the AF responsiveness. I still think this is mostly just the more powerful battery from everything I've read. However if using the EOS iTR AF then I've read some reports of it being even better at tracking colour or faces.


Sep 03, 2012 at 09:22 PM
WarrenL
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p.1 #12 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


A big difference is increased dynamic range and less banding when pushing a file


Sep 03, 2012 at 09:32 PM
Richard Nye
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p.1 #13 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


The 1Dx camera body in general has less shutter lag, less shutter blackout, higher frame rate, more customizable AF, much better build quality, better AF system (more points, more cross points), better auto exposure system to name a few. In general, the body feels very responsive compared to a 5DIII with better AF and AE systems.


Sep 03, 2012 at 09:51 PM
James Cripps
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p.1 #14 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


Richard Nye wrote:
The 1Dx camera body in general has less shutter lag, less shutter blackout, higher frame rate, more customizable AF, much better build quality, better AF system (more points, more cross points), better auto exposure system to name a few. In general, the body feels very responsive compared to a 5DIII with better AF and AE systems.


Actually they have the same amount of AF points and cross-type points, I do believe. One question though to anyone who can confirm: Do the AF points cover the exact same amount of the frame? I love the 1DX AF point layout. Is the 5DIII identical in this regard?



Sep 03, 2012 at 10:07 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.1 #15 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


WarrenL wrote:
A big difference is increased dynamic range and less banding when pushing a file


There is almost no difference in DR and 1D X shadows although better than the 5D III's still aren't in the D800 league.

The other reason the 1D X feels more responsive is that is has shorter shutter lag and mirror blackout time. As for the fps, it's quite interesting how even the change from 6 to 7fps can make the camera feel a lot snappier. On a 1 series you can alter the Low and High frame rates and on my 1D IV I tried setting Low at 5, 6 and 7 fps and 7 is now my final setting. I was always a bit disappointed 5D III didn't give us 7fps, but 6fps is not too bad.



Sep 03, 2012 at 10:13 PM
thedigitalbean
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p.1 #16 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


James Cripps wrote:
Actually they have the same amount of AF points and cross-type points, I do believe. One question though to anyone who can confirm: Do the AF points cover the exact same amount of the frame? I love the 1DX AF point layout. Is the 5DIII identical in this regard?


Yes and yes.

The only notable difference in AF between the two is that the 1DX has does face detection which feeds into the AF and metering system, the 5D3 does not. The AF unit itself between the two cameras is identical. I suspect there are some firmware differences to account for the higher speed of the 1DX.



Sep 03, 2012 at 10:33 PM
James Cripps
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p.1 #17 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


thedigitalbean wrote:
Yes and yes.

The only notable difference in AF between the two is that the 1DX has does face detection which feeds into the AF and metering system, the 5D3 does not. The AF unit itself between the two cameras is identical. I suspect there are some firmware differences to account for the higher speed of the 1DX.


Thank you!



Sep 03, 2012 at 10:45 PM
stanj
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p.1 #18 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


thedigitalbean wrote:
The only notable difference in AF between the two is that the 1DX has does face detection which feeds into the AF and metering system, the 5D3 does not. The AF unit itself between the two cameras is identical. I suspect there are some firmware differences to account for the higher speed of the 1DX.


Well not just face detection. That's for One-Shot. In Servo mode, it has the "track anything" mode, where you anchor it with one AF point on something, and then it will track it even when that something moves through the frame.



Sep 04, 2012 at 02:36 AM
NCAndy
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p.1 #19 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


I believe the 1DX will focus in lower light than the 5D3.


Sep 04, 2012 at 03:27 AM
Pixel Perfect
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p.1 #20 · 1dx and 5D Mark III


NCAndy wrote:
I believe the 1DX will focus in lower light than the 5D3.


Not according to Canon or the specs: AF to -2EV for both.



Sep 04, 2012 at 04:05 AM
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