denoir wrote:
I think unfortunately that I really need to send in my M9 for calibration. I've done more careful tests and basically all my lenses front focus to varying degrees. It's easiest to encounter in practice with the 75 Cron due to its thin DOF but the Zeiss 35/2 Biogon is actually worse. The thing is that I think there is more to it than calibration. When I adjust the rangefinder horizontally (with a hex key) for correct focus near MFD it won't converge at infinity (the rangefinder patch won't overlap the viewfinder image and I'm getting a double image at mechanical infinity). So I think the problem may be more serious....Show more →
There are three adjustments on the rangefinder, two of which are relatively easily adjustable on the digital Ms (they are as easy to adjust on film Ms, but you cannot verify what you are doing without developing the film ):
- The vertical alignment (behind the Leica dot) - hard to adjust
- The near/far balance (the eccentric on the elbow) - a bit fiddly, but possible
- Normal focus tuning (the hex bolt) - quite easy
If you want to try it yourself, you need to loosen the bolt at the elbow of the arm, turn the washer with the notch in it which is fastened by the bolt, and tighten again. You should have a modicum of feel for mechanical things before doing this, but it is not so difficult, just fiddly and it could take some time to get right.
Under normal usage conditions, the first two adjustments don't need doing once set properly. The one which goes out most often, sometimes with a bump to the camera, is the easiest one to tune, so I would recommend to anyone with a tiny bit of patience and belief in their ability to use a hex key, to learn how to do that one.
Thanks for that information Carsten! I did not know about the near/far balance thing. What exactly does that control?
What I'm getting is that when I do the normal focus adjustment I can get it correct either at MFD (but then it won't converge at infinity - the images are apart at mechanical infinity) or I can get it correct at infinity (but heavy front focus at MFD). Is that something that elbow adjustment could fix?
h00ligan wrote:
Interesting Luka.. here it is such hard light, most of the day.. and when the day is over and the light may be right - nothing but cloudless, characterless skies. I believe I am going to take a weekend trip in a week to get out of here and have a chance to shoot some things new to me.. and more interesting. If I haven't sold the x1 by then (probably not) i'll give it one more try.. but to be honest, it seems like I like it less every time I shoot with it now... it's bloody frustrating - more blurred shots at 1/60 tonight and I tried to be careful, although I forgot the string monopod by accident (too little time and ran out)...Show more →
Edward, what you describe sounds like there is lot in common with what December-April typically looks here. We then usually have a lot of snow which reflects all light and fools just about any camera metering system. Everything is just white with very little variation in color. I think the trick there is to go for various minimalist compositions where you make use of the barren landscape for effect.
The other option is focus on detail rather than scenery. If you look for instance at Makten's shots in the Zeiss thread you'll see what I mean. He is really the master of finding beautiful and clever compositions in everyday objects.
I do understand your frustration though. I put as much value in the process of taking the photos as the photos themselves. The X1 pretty much robbed me of the enjoyment of the process. It's capable of capturing nice images but it's really frustrating to use. A modern DSLR and the M9 are infinitely more enjoyable to use.
I took a walk today - the weather is as boring as it can be - complete overcast. The nice part of autumn has come and gone and we have only mud and dead leaves that have lost their colors. I chose just one lens, my currently least liked one - the Zeiss 35/2 Biogon in order to get some more practice with it. So the overall conditions for getting good photos were not exactly ideal. Still, I enjoyed the walk and got a few pictures.
Thanks for the thoughts. Another issue here is that everything is new for the most part.. and they build it all brown and dark green to blend in with the desert.. ugh. On the upside, I may have just cost myself dearly as it turns out that on Tuesday Leica Academy has an M9 workshop in a local 'ghost town' - for which I just had to sign up.
The worst possible thing would be for me to leave there thinking the m9 is the greatest camera ever ow my wallet. I am really looking forward to learning from the pros there, the lightroom tips, and most of all getting my hands on a rangefinder for a few hours with product experts to help familiarize. Hopefully I will leave with at least one image with which I am happy. Excited for Tuesday either way!
What don't you like about that lens Luka, looks nice to me. Yes, your overcast is very similar to our bland.. where metering is just lost. The only possible saviour is a polarizer... and even then, it can be tough.
Charles, that first horse shot of the second post (your add on) is very very good. I see a lot of character in that animal (perhaps I'm guilty of anthropomorphizing!). again, great stuff everyone.
Edward, yes one benefit of living in Europe or at least in a European capital is that when you run out of inspiration you can always shoot some old buildings, statues etc.. Stockholm's old town is not all that big though and I'd trade it away for a couple of mountains
As for the 35/2 Biogon, I'm not quite sure but the rendering is weaker than of any other Zeiss lens I've used. The micro contrast isn't what I'm used to and the overall contrast is lower. I'm sort of used to not having to do color corrections and adjustments on Zeiss images but that isn't an option with the 35/2. I have to use it a bit more to see what it is and how to work around it. I know Charles had some issues with its rendering as well..
Good luck with that Leica workshop and let us know how it was.
denoir wrote:
Thanks for that information Carsten! I did not know about the near/far balance thing. What exactly does that control?
What I'm getting is that when I do the normal focus adjustment I can get it correct either at MFD (but then it won't converge at infinity - the images are apart at mechanical infinity) or I can get it correct at infinity (but heavy front focus at MFD). Is that something that elbow adjustment could fix?
Yes, that is exactly what it changes. The elbow pivots around the eccentric, in a normal arc. If the eccentric is adjusted so that the arm is shorter, it will move to a greater angle when the cam on the lens pushes it in. If the arm is longer, the angle for the same cam will be smaller. This is the near/far balance.
To adjust it, first set the normal focus adjustment so that one end of the focus is accurate. Notice how the other end is, too far or not far enough. Loosen the screw on the elbow, being careful to only move the eccentric a little bit at a time while the screw is loose. First turn it one way, tighten again, and re-adjust the normal focus. Now you know if the direction you move the eccentric makes the travel longer or shorter.
Now you can systematically move towards the correct adjustment.
Note that to loosen the screw holding the eccentric you should come in completely perpendicularly. This isn't that easy without taking the bottom off the camera, removing the plastic plate, and popping the little plastic lid allowing access through the "mirror box". It can be done however, with a little care, but be sure not to strip the screw.
I have done all this and it works fine. I have also removed the bottom of the camera, and the top plate, removed the shutter release, disassembled it, and adjusted it to my liking, since it was a bit stiff and abrupt. It is a bit tricky, but a guy named Mark Norton over on the l-camera-forum has done all this and much more (he completely stripped down an M8), and meticulously documented it with photos and text. You could search for "site:l-camera-forum.com Anatomy" if you want to find it.
I'm not going to do it myself, but there is an old Leica expert here in Stockholm that does that type of repairs. If it's just a question of an adjustment then I can have it fixed locally without sending it to Leica for weeks. As it doesn't seem to be a too intrusive change I'm guessing I could still claim the warranty should the sensor crack or something else.
I've sent an email to Leica explaining that I definitely must have the camera back by December 1st. If they can keep that deadline I might send it to them anyway - just to make sure that the 75 Cron is OK as well and to adjust the slight vertical misalignment of the rangefinder.
Charles, superb shots of the horses ! The first and second shots from the first set above are my favorites. And of course, its also a shot with a very nice lens, the rendering on the 1st shot is beautiful!
Luka, very nice shots and composition from this and the previous page. I like the leaves shot with the 75Cron on the previous page and the first three from this page. Keep it up!
denoir wrote:
Thanks for that information Carsten! I did not know about the near/far balance thing. What exactly does that control?
What I'm getting is that when I do the normal focus adjustment I can get it correct either at MFD (but then it won't converge at infinity - the images are apart at mechanical infinity) or I can get it correct at infinity (but heavy front focus at MFD). Is that something that elbow adjustment could fix?
The starting point in evaluating/adjusting M lenses is to make sure the lens focuses at infinity, at the hard stop of the camera. How confident are you, that this is the case for all your lenses. There really shouldn't be a problem with such newer lenses, but you never know. I've had recent Leica lenses that needed shimming to focus exactly at infinity. Once that was done the rangefinder was more accurate at close focus.
My method for testing infinity is something like this:
On a tripod with timer, and at the lens infinity hard stop, and wide open, take a shot at a geometric shape several miles off. View in LR at 100% and compare the shots. A series of 3 with the lens focus backed off a very small amount will help tell when the image is less/ more sharp. If a M lenses happens to focus "at infinity stop" past infinity, it should back focus at closer range. If the lens doesn't get quite to infinity, the effect is to front focus at closer range. There is such a thing as shimming the M lens for proper infinity focus. This is completely independent of the camera rangefinder, at this point. Once the lens is validated for infinity, then one can use the camera rangefinder controls, Carsten mentions for range finder adjustment.
On a perfectly infinity adjusted lens at the hard stop, then the next step is to adjust the 2 rangefinder images to coincide into one. Then, check the cam arm for close focus accuracy. I would suggest being careful with this one as it is set at the factory and usually doesn't need changing.
Jim, the 75 Cron focuses a bit past infinity at the mechanical stop but my other lenses are dead on. The best explanation is the adjustment of the pivot of the elbow.
I may have messed it up myself when I was probing the screws in the range finder mechanism, but it seem to be pretty firmly set. So I don't think I had anything to do with it.
I think I mentioned this previously, but the 75 Cron is one of a few lenses in the M lineup with a floating element, so if the infinity focus is slightly off, there are several possible reasons, some of which could affect the lens performance in general. WIth most of the other lenses, the entire optical assembly moves as a unit, and even if infinity focus is off, the performance should still be correct, if you can focus it properly.
Luka, the 35 Cron ASPH is quite a nice little lens, nothing magic about it, but if you find yourself slowly enjoying the 75 Cron more, perhaps it is worth a try? It is very sharp from wide open, and a bit contrasty. It is also very compact, one of the smallest.
Carsten, I have reason to suspect that the 75 Cron front focuses even with a calibrated rangefinder. In the shop where I bought it both me and the clerk tried it out on three different M9 (mine included) and it appeared to front focus on all albeit less than my first copy. A third copy of the lens that was just bought by a guy who cut the queue and got there before me appeared to focus correctly. Given however that I on his request tried the copy on just my M9 (which definitely front focuses) it's possible that his copy back focuses.
As for the 35 Cron, I don't know. I'm far from ready to give up on the Zeiss - I need to use it much more. Also I have not seen any 35 Cron samples where I liked the rendering. Finally, it's an expensive lens. I'd rather spend €4,000 on a fantastic lens (35 lux asph) than €2,000 on an adequate lens. Actually, I'd rather not spend any more on M9 lenses for a while. It's just the 18/4 left (which should arrive any day now I hope) and then I'll stick with the kit for a while. Generally speaking, I've been loading up on gear for the past six months at an unreasonable pace. I plan to slow down now and take stock of which lenses I use and which are just collecting dust (I have for instance a number of crop-only lenses that I used with my 7D before adding a 5DII). After I'm sure what I want to keep, I can rationalize and reduce the total number of lenses. Then I'll start thinking about what new lenses I want to add.
Thank you Ryan, Edward and Joe Always appreciate the kind words.
Luka, excellent shots! I am now preferring your shots with the 75 Cron. Great shots though with the ZM 35. There is more subtle rendering in the shadows with the 75 Cron.
Some more shots this afternoon of my almost willing model I just thought I would add the sequence of shots. 50 Lux of course
Thanks Charles. Nice portraits, I can see that the Lux is permanently attached to your camera
Regarding Cron vs Biogon, I think what makes the most difference in the shadows is how much I jack up black levels or contrast. I think the 35/2 Biogon actually has an overall lower contrast than the 75 Cron and while it has some Zeiss rendering qualities they are much weaker than the ones found in the 25/2.8.
ow my wallet. I am really looking forward to learning from the pros there, the lightroom tips, and most of all getting my hands on a rangefinder for a few hours with product experts to help familiarize. Hopefully I will leave with at least one image with which I am happy. Excited for Tuesday either way!
