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Archive 2009 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors

  
 
katiedis
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p.1 #1 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


I registered my business for weddingwire.com not too many months ago. Things were going along pretty well...got positive, accurate reviews from my previous clients.

However, let me say this...

BEWARE OF WEDDINGWIRE.COM

They are NOT responsible, responsive, or supportive of wedding vendors' businesses.

I am going to share a long detailed story of my personal experience because I think it is important to understand some of the details since it pertains to the weddingwire review in question:

Just like most of you, I have years of great client interactions. Never had a negative experience at all, in fact. Wonderful brides, great rapport. Until *that* one came along. It hits you out of the blue and you just don't see it coming (in fact, I seem to remember Melanie posting that she just went through this same experience of the first "bridezilla" type interaction just recently).

"Beth" booked me for her December 20, 2008 wedding. She opted for a few discounts that I offered her from my standard packages. She chose NOT to have a second shooter (saved $300) and she chose NOT to have a blog slideshow made (saved $100).

I have that well documented in our contract together. As shown below:

http://img.skitch.com/20091021-fksi9dc48jf2fkc5976j1m46xe.jpg

The final payment was due 15 days before the wedding...also a part of the contract language.

http://img.skitch.com/20091021-x2ycpw5nt5ut154xu9uxeethyp.jpg

The wedding day arrived, and I had not been paid. Unlike some people, I do still show up for wedding photography...even without payment. I know this bride wanted her photos taken, and figured that she would make the payment after the wedding. It has happened about 3 times a year, and each time it has been no big deal. The clients just pay after the wedding and it isn't a problem. Most of the time, the clients just get so busy that it is just an oversight on their part. The bride and I had pre-wedding consultations to discuss getting ready, and she gave me this schedule as follows. I was to show up at the event center at 1 pm for the hair and make-up touch-ups and the getting dressed.

http://img.skitch.com/20091021-b5rgsgncyxje24wg6x5hnnwhuu.jpg

I showed up, we did the pre-ceremony photos just like the schedule showed...and then she asks me something about the post-wedding photo stuff...when would she see them, etc. I tell her that once payment has been made, a blog post would go up in about 2 weeks time and the rest of the photos would follow within 6 weeks (per the contract, again). She says "You mean my father-in-law didn't pay you yet?" I respond No. She asks me to go find her father-in-law and he can write me a check.

I explain to her that I am not ok with doing that for several reasons. I don't have a contract with the father-in-law...it is with her. I am plenty busy with stuff to do during a wedding day...I really didn't want to spend time tracking down her father-in-law and his checkbook. I said "don't worry about it, we can take care of this after the wedding. i don't like to discuss money on a wedding day...let's just leave it for after, ok?" I reiterated that I was fine with things...not to worry. If i'd been worried about payment, I would've asked about it myself earlier.

Also during that conversation, I made it clear that payment would need to be made in order to release any photos. AND that I would take a vacation from December 23-January 1st for the holidays. She said she understood. She said she would have her father-in-law contact me to make payment. I said, ok...if he's ok with that. I would prefer payment from you, but if that's how you want to do it...ok.

Wedding goes fine.
I don't hear from anyone before my vacation starts.

Come back to the phone messages on January 1st and they are full of anger. She's pissed off that I have not called her father-in-law about payment, she's wondering where her blog post is, she's angry and yelling.

I call her and explain the issues we'd discussed previously. That I take a vacation for the holidays. She apologized, said she remembered now that I mentioned it again. She was just anxious to see her pictures. We got the balance due, she had the total and said her father-in-law would be sending a check. I said I would call when i got it.

I didn't get a check for the next 6 days. (The father-in-law lives 20 miles away) I leave town to shoot a bride and groom's emergency wedding (remember the one with the groom who died of Stage 4 cancer six days after he got married? Yeah, that emergency wedding). I leave a message on my blog that I am gone on an emergency for a few days and would be back in touch then. Leave that message on my machine too.

You guessed it...bride leaves me screaming message that her father-in-law sent the check and why have I not called to tell her and why is her gallery not up yet?! People...this is on January 12th.

I call her back and explain that I am shooting an emergency wedding out-of-town. I explain the circumstances. Obviously, she'd seen that I was out of town because she'd checked the blog several times. She rants and raves at me that "it's not her fault that I wasn't paid. it was her father-in-law that was supposed to pay. why am i holding it against her that he didn't pay? why??"

She screamed at me on the phone, cried, yelled, and hung up at least once. She didn't like that I restated the payment terms were in the contract and I expected that she could have/should have referred to them before the wedding if she wanted to avoid this delay in blog posting. Eventually, we agree that we should communicate via email for any further issues. (I should have thought of this earlier with her...since she did not seem to remember our previous verbal communications well. I still kick myself that I didn't pick up on that earlier)

When I return home, I drop everything else...process her photos (her father-in-law's check had finally come in while I was out-of-town for that cancer wedding). And, i post her gallery on January 14th, as shown on my pickpic management system, and mailed a DVD the same day.

http://img.skitch.com/20091021-nmi25f27n859c6p9yrt1jayd61.jpg

A couple more emails ensue between us to finalize things. She asks "on a few of the shots it looks like I have a double chin. What (other than a diet) can I do to fix that? Can you photoshop?" I tried, but it did not look natural since that particular photo had some really difficult stuff nearby, making it look odd. I told her that in an email.

Finally, a couple weeks later she sends me an email that says she really likes the photos. She said she was worried after all the stressful phone conversations we'd had that she wouldn't like them...but she loves them. They look great.

Fast-forward 10 months. I haven't heard anything from this bride.

Until she leaves a review on weddingwire.com. She listed me for 5 out of 5 stars on Value, Quality of Photos. But, she gives me a scathing review on professionalism and responsiveness.

While I could be ok with just the "star" ratings...since those are her opinions...the lies that she wrote in the message part of the review, I just could NOT live with.

She wrote that:
I failed to deliver products by the contract deadlines (wrong, gallery delivered in 3.5 weeks...contract gave me 6 weeks).

http://img.skitch.com/20091021-bu2gedp9efjnw11uiymn1jqp9x.jpg

I failed to deliver a blog slideshow (wrong, she specifcally opted out of it to save money).

I failed to show up for the salon preparations (wrong, she told me to come to the event center as the first thing).

I failed to edit the photos (wrong, i simply could not fix a double chin...the rest were all my contract edits).

http://img.skitch.com/20091021-kyuhcm42t6w95simsft6k35bt2.jpg

I failed to communicate and call back (wrong...i did. she neglected to remember that holidays were a part of my business' pre-scheduled time off).

I yelled at her on the phone and hung-up with her (wrong...she was yelling and hung-up).

I was unprofessional for not getting payment before the wedding (umm...ok. Fine? unprofessional for showing up without payment, taking great photos, and telling her not to worry about payment on the day so that she could focus on the wedding itself? yeah, next time I should just invoice her the day before not show up for the wedding?)

SOOOO...now you understand why I am frustrated. I disputed the review with weddingwire.com. They told me that they would review my dispute and the information I provided in support of that dispute. I provided the full contract, photos of the bridal preparations, the bride's schedule for when i was supposed to arrive, the screen shots of when the gallery was posted, emails with the bride, and narrative explaining my interactions with her.

How could weddingwire allow this review to remain posted?

Their policy states that reviews which are fraudulent, vulgar, or malicious will not be permitted.

They "reviewed" my dispute and decided that the review would stay. PLEASE explain to me how this review is not fraudulent?!

Weddingwire.com's dispute review process gives me no phone number to call. No way to further discuss with them. Their suggestion to me via the generic email? Get more positive reviews to even out the bad.

No. Not acceptable. I will not let my company's name be blemished by a bride who lied in her review. I cannot believe that weddingwire.com will allow wedding vendor's to suffer like this.

I've had no choice but to inactivate my account with weddingwire.com. Until they offer some personal form of communication to discuss this failure on their part...I have no assurances that their business is reliable and fair.



Oct 21, 2009 at 11:33 AM
katiedis
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p.1 #2 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


and yes, i have instituted some changes since then. i do a lot more communication via email, less on phone. just in case.

i send out reminder emails about payment now. just in case people fail to read their contracts.



Oct 21, 2009 at 11:40 AM
ContagiousIdea
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p.1 #3 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Wow... I'm sorry! I had wondered how the system worked, I might just send them my own e-mail in your defense.


Oct 21, 2009 at 11:43 AM
dsouzl
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p.1 #4 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Wow...sounds like this bride has some issues that go beyond what's on the surface here.

I'm not sure posting details that may identify the bride in question on a public forum is such a good idea.

Have you tried talking to the bride face to face about the review she left you? Let her know the impact of her review on your business and that you'd prefer to settle the issue with her than to escalate it via legal channels.

It may be easier to get her to change it than to chase down an unknown contact at weddingwire.

..Lew..





Oct 21, 2009 at 11:49 AM
DB
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p.1 #5 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Sorry, Katie. That's terrible. I think that makes my mind up about that.


Oct 21, 2009 at 11:53 AM
jeremy_clay
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p.1 #6 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


..wow. How lame. You should be allowed a rebuttal, IMO.


Oct 21, 2009 at 11:57 AM
davenfl
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p.1 #7 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


You have to make a serious decision if you think this is actually hurting your business in any real way. If so it is well worth $500-600 to go to an attorney and have them write a letter to both the client and weddingwire.com indicating that fraudulent and malicious information was both presented and published and that if the posting is not taken down you will be taking legal action for damages. I understand that while a lawsuit is incredibly expensive a lot of times the strong indication that you are going to file a lawsuit will get one of the parties motivated to cooperate.

As to a followup on your business practices, trusting people will sometimes backfire. Don't hesitate to have phone conversations but always document the facts of the phone call and if bad emotions were involved, note that to in an email back to the parties involved. That way you have documented the ebb and flow. Oh, and never go against your own contract. While a hard line in the sand, always get your money first. Someone involved in the wedding could have found the father-in-law and got you a check.

Dave



Oct 21, 2009 at 11:57 AM
MPLS_photog
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p.1 #8 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


While a hard line in the sand, always get your money first. Someone involved in the wedding could have found the father-in-law and got you a check.

+1 Get your money that day, don't postpone...



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:03 PM
katiedis
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p.1 #9 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


dsouzl wrote:
Wow...sounds like this bride has some issues that go beyond what's on the surface here.

I'm not sure posting details that may identify the bride in question on a public forum is such a good idea.

Have you tried talking to the bride face to face about the review she left you? Let her know the impact of her review on your business and that you'd prefer to settle the issue with her than to escalate it via legal channels.


The bride's wedding date is public knowledge because it was given by her as part of the weddingwire.com review that she submits. I have never revealed previously any of the difficulties she gave me, nor complained about them publicly. I only now discuss it because she herself posted on a public forum. I have the right to respond publicly with sufficient details to describe the events accurately. I could not have described this without explaining the holiday times or the emergency wedding. I have not publicly posted any of her private information that was also included in the contract. Only weddingwire.com has the full contract copy.

I will not discuss things with the bride directly. As you probably expect, my beef is with weddingwire.com

At some point, you just have to accept that the bride has issues on her own. I cannot change them. I have learned that lesson with this bride months ago. I believe she left the review in order to damage my business...I think she believes that I wouldn't have noticed it? Wouldn't have questioned it? Wouldn't have saved the supporting documents to dispute it?

MY issue is the fact that weddingwire.com allows this fraudulent review to stand. I'd rather just never be in contact with the bride again. She can leave me an unhappy review if she wants...but it had better be based in fact, things that actually happened. Not on lies.



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:08 PM
katiedis
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p.1 #10 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


jeremy_clay wrote:
..wow. How lame. You should be allowed a rebuttal, IMO.


I am allowed to post a "response" to her review that appears underneath the bride's text. I do not consider this an acceptable option in this particular case given that the original fraudulent statements would still be posted.

Fraudulent reviews should be removed. If the bride wished to repost a review where she criticized my professionalism based on the actual events (i.e., she believes I should have forced her to pay before the wedding, and sent her reminder emails)...then I would be fine with that. I would be happy to post a response to those issues.



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:11 PM
Stephaniespix
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p.1 #11 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Sorry Katie, that is a rough one, but apart from the bride retracting or getting legal representation, I don't think you can do anything else.

Stephanie



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:16 PM
DB
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p.1 #12 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Katie- I know the PPA covered something similar in a past email. While the bride is allowed to state her opinion, she cannot post clearly false facts and accusations (which could easily be fought in court). In our case, I believe we would probably hire an attorney for something like this because the facts are clear and you can back things up with documents.

BTW - does anyone here keep a phone log?



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:17 PM
katiedis
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p.1 #13 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


MPLS_photog wrote:
+1 Get your money that day, don't postpone...


Yes, yes...that is all water under the learning bridge now. There are loads of lessons to be learned from many parts of this story.

My primary purpose with this post, however, is to warn fellow wedding vendors be aware of weddingwire.com's dispute review process. Make sure you check each review you get for accuracy. Because, if a fraudulent review gets posted...weddingwire.com offers NO PHONE NUMBER to contact them to discuss things. Only generic form emails from a general "support" email address. NO PERSONAL CONTACT EQUALS NO CUSTOMER SERVICE. I typically avoid poor CS vendors. They are on that list now.



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:17 PM
katiedis
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p.1 #14 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


i am not one to sue typically. but, this is about as tempted as i've ever been.

i am giving weddingwire.com an attempt to clear this up. fix their mistake. but, it may not be enough.

i have tweeted this post to them, in the hopes that it might reach a "real" person who can read, rather than an obviously generic automated response system.



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:21 PM
j.curtis
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p.1 #15 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Your beef should be with the slander remarks the bride made, not weddingwire.com

For weddingwire.com it's a matter of he said she said. IMO your anger is being pointed ate the wrong party.



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:28 PM
Ken Vigil
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p.1 #16 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Hey Katie-

I sent you a PM on a strategy you could try to get your issue resolved with wedding wire.

ken



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:33 PM
Mike Mahoney
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p.1 #17 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Libel is a false and defamatory written statement or report. Review sites are popping up all over, and many are inadequately monitored nor provide adequate rebuttal mechanisms.

Thankfully the courts do
I'd sue both their azzes .. today.



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:37 PM
Saad Syed
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p.1 #18 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


Wow and wow... crazy bride + wackness of WW = FAIL.

I have a free listing with them. Good thing I didn't pay for anything. It is outrageous how some of these bridezilla girls act. It's mind boggling how grown ladies can act this unprofessionally. First and foremost, if a client starts yelling at me I would hang up after asking them to call me back once they are recomposed. Unless you're my parents, you don't raise your voice to me - I don't care who you are or how much you're paying me.

The problem I feel as that you were WAYYY TOO nice over and over again and she kept pushing. Moreover, this is one big reason why I HATE doing business over the phone. Whenever I talk to a couple over the phone, I send them an e-mail within the hour restating every thing we talked about: "Hi XX, As per our phone conversation... right?". This gets them to acknowledge the details and I have a written trail of details.

Anyway, you win some and you lose some. It's all good - your work is excellent and you obviously have a wonderful track record. Best of luck!



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:45 PM
katiedis
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p.1 #19 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


j.curtis wrote:
For weddingwire.com it's a matter of he said she said. IMO your anger is being pointed ate the wrong party.


I disagree. It is not he said, she said. There is a contract and other documentation to back this up. Weddingwire needs to act responsibly.

The bride should too...we don't disagree there. I have just given up on expecting *her* to act professionally and adult.



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:50 PM
Saad Syed
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p.1 #20 · WeddingWire.com fails wedding vendors


j.curtis wrote:
Your beef should be with the slander remarks the bride made, not weddingwire.com

For weddingwire.com it's a matter of he said she said. IMO your anger is being pointed ate the wrong party.


While the main issue is with the bride, Wedding Wire is still responsible. It's their site and their responsibility to monitor. For instance, if a bride came onto FM's wedding forum and started flaming you for, the moderators would have to do something about it. They would either lock and delete he thread altogether or try to solve the issue within the thread. Why? Because it's their duty to. Finding a solution to the confrontation would be even more important within the Buy/Sell forum.

You can't just run a review site and not take any responsibility because everything is "he said/she said". The OP mentioned and showed images/details supporting her case. That is a little more than "he said/she said".



Oct 21, 2009 at 12:50 PM
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