This topic is in the 2009 archive. You can read it and like its posts here. It is read only.
Archive 2009Canon EOS 7D Master thread
p.60 #1Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Krosavcheg wrote:
Tried 7D yesterday.
Not really something I would consider buying.
Of course, I didn't have chance to study it's ISO performance using a decent screen, but compared to 5D MkII side by side it wasn't impressive at all.
Holding it in your hand feels like slightly larger Rebel and it does feel a bit like a toy.
Errr... they must have been some really good shrooms you had for breakfast.
Tried 7D yesterday.
Not really something I would consider buying.
Of course, I didn't have chance to study it's ISO performance using a decent screen, but compared to 5D MkII side by side it wasn't impressive at all.
Holding it in your hand feels like slightly larger Rebel and it does feel a bit like a toy.
Errr... they must have been some really good shrooms you had for breakfast.
Sep 19, 2009 at 04:09 AM
p.60 #2Canon EOS 7D Master thread
durandal2 wrote:
and for the pleasure i just dit the whole thing with the 7D raw files, left row is plain 7D raw detected with the correct iso levels by ACR, and on the right, the raw detected only as 100 iso raws.
http://yfrog.com/0w7dvs7dj
Interesting. Thank you!
and for the pleasure i just dit the whole thing with the 7D raw files, left row is plain 7D raw detected with the correct iso levels by ACR, and on the right, the raw detected only as 100 iso raws.
http://yfrog.com/0w7dvs7dj
Interesting. Thank you!
Sep 19, 2009 at 05:13 AM
p.60 #3Canon EOS 7D Master thread
durandal2 wrote:
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
Heh!
It's as good as (and in the case of the D3X apparently better than) at least two FF bodies, at least as presented here.
Embarrasses the D300 too.
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
Heh!
It's as good as (and in the case of the D3X apparently better than) at least two FF bodies, at least as presented here.
Embarrasses the D300 too.
Sep 19, 2009 at 05:25 AM
p.60 #4Canon EOS 7D Master thread
that is interesting to see how much better the D700 is (at least in this comparo) than the 5D2.
i'm not compelled to switch (bodies aren't everything), but what a great camera that D700 is.
i'm not compelled to switch (bodies aren't everything), but what a great camera that D700 is.
Sep 19, 2009 at 06:11 AM
p.60 #5Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Made some Screenshots 7D 100% 5D MkII 92 % (=Diagonalfactor Correction 1.6 vs FF )
My personal view:
The 5D dont have a very big advantage in noise. 7D is more detailed, less smeared
Made prints 53cm ( 7D ) and 57.3cm ( 5D )not a big difference, but 100% Pixelpeeping some.
Left 3200 ISO 7D / Right 6400 5D
Left 6400 ISO 7D / Right 6400 5D
Top 3200 ISO 7D / Bottom 3200 5D ( both from NR Standard)
Can not upload images here, Link:
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=37340&st=40&gopid=311644&#entry311644
My personal view:
The 5D dont have a very big advantage in noise. 7D is more detailed, less smeared
Made prints 53cm ( 7D ) and 57.3cm ( 5D )not a big difference, but 100% Pixelpeeping some.
Left 3200 ISO 7D / Right 6400 5D
Left 6400 ISO 7D / Right 6400 5D
Top 3200 ISO 7D / Bottom 3200 5D ( both from NR Standard)
Can not upload images here, Link:
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=37340&st=40&gopid=311644&#entry311644
Sep 19, 2009 at 06:35 AM
p.60 #6Canon EOS 7D Master thread
durandal2 wrote:
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
Interesting - we can see that the 5D2 retains more sharpness than the D700 but at the expense of a little more noise. It is quite comparable to the D3x. The D700 image appears to have had noise reduction applied.
The 7D has less noise than its two crop counterparts. It appears slightly noisier than the 5D2, but not quite as crisp and the yellow and blue colors are not as vivid.
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
Interesting - we can see that the 5D2 retains more sharpness than the D700 but at the expense of a little more noise. It is quite comparable to the D3x. The D700 image appears to have had noise reduction applied.
The 7D has less noise than its two crop counterparts. It appears slightly noisier than the 5D2, but not quite as crisp and the yellow and blue colors are not as vivid.
Sep 19, 2009 at 08:01 AM
p.60 #7Canon EOS 7D Master thread
durandal2 wrote:
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
The d700 does have less noise, but seems to be a tad softer than the others. Comparing the 7d to the 5d2 and d3x - the 7d looks every bit as good. The d300 definitely looks outclassed. Gotta say that I am loving how this puppy looks
And thank you for scaling the images so we are talking apples to apples comparisons!
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
The d700 does have less noise, but seems to be a tad softer than the others. Comparing the 7d to the 5d2 and d3x - the 7d looks every bit as good. The d300 definitely looks outclassed. Gotta say that I am loving how this puppy looks
And thank you for scaling the images so we are talking apples to apples comparisons!
Sep 19, 2009 at 08:04 AM
p.60 #8Canon EOS 7D Master thread
abam wrote:
that is interesting to see how much better the D700 is (at least in this comparo) than the 5D2.
I'm not seeing that - I'm seeing lower noise on the D700 shot due to a higher amount of noise reduction, as evidenced by the D700 being somewhat softer.
that is interesting to see how much better the D700 is (at least in this comparo) than the 5D2.
I'm not seeing that - I'm seeing lower noise on the D700 shot due to a higher amount of noise reduction, as evidenced by the D700 being somewhat softer.
Sep 19, 2009 at 08:05 AM
p.60 #9Canon EOS 7D Master thread
headroom wrote:
Made some Screenshots 7D 100% 5D MkII 92 % (=Diagonalfactor Correction 1.6 vs FF )
My personal view:
The 5D dont have a very big advantage in noise. 7D is more detailed, less smeared
Made prints 53cm ( 7D ) and 57.3cm ( 5D )not a big difference, but 100% Pixelpeeping some.
The advantage is still there for the 5D2, but I think the larger difference is the small detail. I looked at the 6400 shots (side-by-side) and noticed that the hair on the 7D shot is much softer and less detailed. On the ISO 3200 shot with the bottles and color chart, the difference is smaller but there is more detail on the 5D2 again. I think that at 3200, the difference isn't as pronounced but the lettering on the bottles on the 5D2 shot is crisper and the shadow noise is still a little less.
I have to add that the 3200 shot from the 7D looks a little better than the 6400 shot from the 5D2 in terms of noise. I don't think the detail capture is much different, but the 7D's 3200 is cleaner. I would say, based on this, that the difference in noise performance between the 2 cameras is less than a stop, at least when exposure is correct.
Edited on Sep 19, 2009 at 08:16 AM · View previous versions
Made some Screenshots 7D 100% 5D MkII 92 % (=Diagonalfactor Correction 1.6 vs FF )
My personal view:
The 5D dont have a very big advantage in noise. 7D is more detailed, less smeared
Made prints 53cm ( 7D ) and 57.3cm ( 5D )not a big difference, but 100% Pixelpeeping some.
The advantage is still there for the 5D2, but I think the larger difference is the small detail. I looked at the 6400 shots (side-by-side) and noticed that the hair on the 7D shot is much softer and less detailed. On the ISO 3200 shot with the bottles and color chart, the difference is smaller but there is more detail on the 5D2 again. I think that at 3200, the difference isn't as pronounced but the lettering on the bottles on the 5D2 shot is crisper and the shadow noise is still a little less.
I have to add that the 3200 shot from the 7D looks a little better than the 6400 shot from the 5D2 in terms of noise. I don't think the detail capture is much different, but the 7D's 3200 is cleaner. I would say, based on this, that the difference in noise performance between the 2 cameras is less than a stop, at least when exposure is correct.
Edited on Sep 19, 2009 at 08:16 AM · View previous versions
Sep 19, 2009 at 08:13 AM
p.60 #10Canon EOS 7D Master thread
timbop wrote:
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300The d700 does have less noise, but seems to be a tad softer than the others. Comparing the 7d to the 5d2 and d3x - the 7d looks every bit as good. The d300 definitely looks outclassed. Gotta say that I am loving how this puppy looks
And thank you for scaling the images so we are talking apples to apples comparisons!
Yes thanks man many poeple have no idea about the scaling thing just bump to 100!
I like the 7D every bit. Not only the good picture Quality its a clever new Design with the interface Quick Info Button 4 example the Lock 4 the wheell. Ordered On, wating list says here in Switzerland "End September"
durandal2 wrote
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7Dmiddle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
And thank you for scaling the images so we are talking apples to apples comparisons!
Yes thanks man many poeple have no idea about the scaling thing just bump to 100!
I like the 7D every bit. Not only the good picture Quality its a clever new Design with the interface Quick Info Button 4 example the Lock 4 the wheell. Ordered On, wating list says here in Switzerland "End September"
Sep 19, 2009 at 08:16 AM
p.60 #11Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Tom_W wrote:
My personal view:
The 5D dont have a very big advantage in noise. 7D is more detailed, less smeared
Made prints 53cm ( 7D ) and 57.3cm ( 5D )not a big difference, but 100% Pixelpeeping some.The advantage is still there for the 5D2, but I think the larger difference is the small detail. I looked at the 6400 shots (side-by-side) and noticed that the hair on the 7D shot is much softer and less detailed. On the ISO 3200 shot with the bottles and color chart, the difference is smaller but there is more detail on the 5D2 again. I think that at 3200, the difference isn't as pronounced but the lettering on the bottles on the 5D2 shot is crisper and the shadow noise is still a little less.
I have to add that...Show more →
We have to wait for the first final series. But the Camera has a potential. The color both cams is from jpg and thats not the max. I will sell my D40 because 3200 banding is a big issiue for me. The 5 D MKII ist better in some details in direct comparsion, but in the end when you sell or print nobody cares anymore.
headroom wrote
Made some Screenshots 7D 100% 5D MkII 92 % (=Diagonalfactor Correction 1.6 vs FF )My personal view:
The 5D dont have a very big advantage in noise. 7D is more detailed, less smeared
Made prints 53cm ( 7D ) and 57.3cm ( 5D )not a big difference, but 100% Pixelpeeping some.
I have to add that...Show more →
We have to wait for the first final series. But the Camera has a potential. The color both cams is from jpg and thats not the max. I will sell my D40 because 3200 banding is a big issiue for me. The 5 D MKII ist better in some details in direct comparsion, but in the end when you sell or print nobody cares anymore.
Sep 19, 2009 at 08:32 AM
p.60 #12Canon EOS 7D Master thread
arn_old wrote:
Not really something I would consider buying.
Of course, I didn't have chance to study it's ISO performance using a decent screen, but compared to 5D MkII side by side it wasn't impressive at all.
Holding it in your hand feels like slightly larger Rebel and it does feel a bit like a toy.Errr... they must have been some really good shrooms you had for breakfast.
What makes you say that? Could you be a little more specific?
PS Have a look here for info on Canon Plaza, if you have doubts:
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/cda/other/2008/11/05/9567.html
Anyone is welcome to come in and try latest cameras and printers. Lenses are shelved though, except camera kit ones.
Edited on Sep 19, 2009 at 09:27 AM · View previous versions
Krosavcheg wrote
Tried 7D yesterday.Not really something I would consider buying.
Of course, I didn't have chance to study it's ISO performance using a decent screen, but compared to 5D MkII side by side it wasn't impressive at all.
Holding it in your hand feels like slightly larger Rebel and it does feel a bit like a toy.
What makes you say that? Could you be a little more specific?
PS Have a look here for info on Canon Plaza, if you have doubts:
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/cda/other/2008/11/05/9567.html
Anyone is welcome to come in and try latest cameras and printers. Lenses are shelved though, except camera kit ones.
Edited on Sep 19, 2009 at 09:27 AM · View previous versions
Sep 19, 2009 at 09:20 AM
p.60 #13Canon EOS 7D Master thread
+1
timbop wrote:
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300The d700 does have less noise, but seems to be a tad softer than the others. Comparing the 7d to the 5d2 and d3x - the 7d looks every bit as good. The d300 definitely looks outclassed. Gotta say that I am loving how this puppy looks
And thank you for scaling the images so we are talking apples to apples comparisons!
timbop wrote:
durandal2 wrote
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7Dmiddle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
And thank you for scaling the images so we are talking apples to apples comparisons!
Sep 19, 2009 at 09:21 AM
p.60 #14Canon EOS 7D Master thread
durandal2 wrote:
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
as for the trick with slider and my exif iso editting, I already did that:
on the left, the 30D with the normal exif, detected as a 3200 iso picture under ACR and on the right the same picture but detected as a 100 iso one, still no sharpening applied:
Thanks, man. That's some great stuff to share. Didn't know about ACR secretly applying NR.
Question: what software do you use to cheat the EXIF ISO data in Raw files?
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
as for the trick with slider and my exif iso editting, I already did that:
on the left, the 30D with the normal exif, detected as a 3200 iso picture under ACR and on the right the same picture but detected as a 100 iso one, still no sharpening applied:
Thanks, man. That's some great stuff to share. Didn't know about ACR secretly applying NR.
Question: what software do you use to cheat the EXIF ISO data in Raw files?
Sep 19, 2009 at 09:26 AM
p.60 #15Canon EOS 7D Master thread
a simple hexadecimal editor , the hardest is to find the iso value, it's not always at the same place but on canon files, the bytes orders are inversed, so instead of 0C 80 for 3200 iso, it's writen 80 0C in the file.
, the hardest is to find the iso value, it's not always at the same place but on canon files, the bytes orders are inversed, so instead of 0C 80 for 3200 iso, it's writen 80 0C in the file.Sep 19, 2009 at 09:38 AM
p.60 #16Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Krosavcheg wrote:
What makes you say that? Could you be a little more specific?
PS Have a look here for info on Canon Plaza, if you have doubts:
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/cda/other/2008/11/05/9567.html
Anyone is welcome to come in and try latest cameras and printers. Lenses are shelved though, except camera kit ones.
I was referring to the absurdity of your claim, that the 7D would be anything like a rebel. Something, which might be said for example after digesting some really pretty looking mushrooms
All the x0D series feel way better in hand than the xx0D series.
Unfortunately, I couldn't make anything out of the link that you provided, as I don't speak japanese.
arn_old wrote
Errr... they must have been some really good shrooms you had for breakfast.PS Have a look here for info on Canon Plaza, if you have doubts:
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/cda/other/2008/11/05/9567.html
Anyone is welcome to come in and try latest cameras and printers. Lenses are shelved though, except camera kit ones.
I was referring to the absurdity of your claim, that the 7D would be anything like a rebel. Something, which might be said for example after digesting some really pretty looking mushrooms
All the x0D series feel way better in hand than the xx0D series.Unfortunately, I couldn't make anything out of the link that you provided, as I don't speak japanese.
Sep 19, 2009 at 09:39 AM
p.60 #17Canon EOS 7D Master thread
arn_old wrote:
I was referring to the absurdity of your claim, that the 7D would be anything like a rebel. Something, which might be said for example after digesting some really pretty looking mushrooms All the x0D series feel way better in hand than the xx0D series.
Unfortunately, I couldn't make anything out of the link that you provided, as I don't speak japanese.
It's ok, there are some colorful pictures you can look at.
Oh well, I am sure it felt much better in your hands than in mine. I am glad you liked it, and I will refrain from posting any derogatory comments regarding your experience.
Hope you will enjoy your camera.
I was referring to the absurdity of your claim, that the 7D would be anything like a rebel. Something, which might be said for example after digesting some really pretty looking mushrooms
All the x0D series feel way better in hand than the xx0D series.Unfortunately, I couldn't make anything out of the link that you provided, as I don't speak japanese.
It's ok, there are some colorful pictures you can look at.
Oh well, I am sure it felt much better in your hands than in mine. I am glad you liked it, and I will refrain from posting any derogatory comments regarding your experience.
Hope you will enjoy your camera.
Sep 19, 2009 at 09:54 AM
p.60 #18Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Krosavcheg wrote:
All the x0D series feel way better in hand than the xx0D series.
Unfortunately, I couldn't make anything out of the link that you provided, as I don't speak japanese.It's ok, there are some colorful pictures you can look at.
Oh well, I am sure it felt much better in your hands than in mine. I am glad you liked it, and I will refrain from posting any derogatory comments regarding your experience.
Hope you will enjoy your camera.
There is no reason to act hurt, I'm sure. In my opinion, the feel of a Rebel compared to x0D series and above is like night and day. Already the 50D feels like a very substantial camera compared to a Rebel. It may have something to do with things like hand size, strength, etc. Certainly we all have to choose a camera that feels good in hand and you are perfectly entitled to feel that the 5D mark II feels better in yours, but I don't feel any big difference in 5D II's favor.
arn_old wrote
I was referring to the absurdity of your claim, that the 7D would be anything like a rebel. Something, which might be said for example after digesting some really pretty looking mushrooms All the x0D series feel way better in hand than the xx0D series.Unfortunately, I couldn't make anything out of the link that you provided, as I don't speak japanese.
Oh well, I am sure it felt much better in your hands than in mine. I am glad you liked it, and I will refrain from posting any derogatory comments regarding your experience.
Hope you will enjoy your camera.
There is no reason to act hurt, I'm sure. In my opinion, the feel of a Rebel compared to x0D series and above is like night and day. Already the 50D feels like a very substantial camera compared to a Rebel. It may have something to do with things like hand size, strength, etc. Certainly we all have to choose a camera that feels good in hand and you are perfectly entitled to feel that the 5D mark II feels better in yours, but I don't feel any big difference in 5D II's favor.
Sep 19, 2009 at 10:09 AM
p.60 #19Canon EOS 7D Master thread
If krosavcheg owns a series 1 camera then his perception is entirely understandable.
After owning a 1DMIIn, when I held my former 20d again (a friend of mine bought it) it just felt like a toy.
After owning a 1DMIII and buying a 50d, when I held it for the first time it felt, well, the same.
When I placed a 85L on it for the first time I was amazed how front heavy the combo was.
With the MIII, it balanced just perfectly.
Anyone with a similar experience should be able to understand what krosavcheg meant by his words.
The 7D body appeards to be, at least from what I've seen, basically the same size as the 50d.
And while there is a definitely a difference to the rebel line, the difference to a 1 series is much, much bigger.
After owning a 1DMIIn, when I held my former 20d again (a friend of mine bought it) it just felt like a toy.
After owning a 1DMIII and buying a 50d, when I held it for the first time it felt, well, the same.
When I placed a 85L on it for the first time I was amazed how front heavy the combo was.
With the MIII, it balanced just perfectly.
Anyone with a similar experience should be able to understand what krosavcheg meant by his words.
The 7D body appeards to be, at least from what I've seen, basically the same size as the 50d.
And while there is a definitely a difference to the rebel line, the difference to a 1 series is much, much bigger.
Sep 19, 2009 at 10:24 AM
p.60 #20Canon EOS 7D Master thread
durandal2 wrote:
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
looks like"
D700
.
5D2
D3x
.
7D
.
.
D300
K20D
of course ACR doesn't treat everything the same and IR has a nasty habit of rather altering their lighting everytime they use the scene....
upper left is D700 and upper right the resized 7D
middle left 5D mk2, middle right K20D
bottom left D3x, bottom right D300
looks like"
D700
.
5D2
D3x
.
7D
.
.
D300
K20D
of course ACR doesn't treat everything the same and IR has a nasty habit of rather altering their lighting everytime they use the scene....
Sep 19, 2009 at 10:57 AM