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Archive 2009Canon EOS 7D Master thread
p.18 #1Canon EOS 7D Master thread
brainiac wrote:
because let's face it, all AF systems are absolute crap. They can't even focus near the corners, and choosing a focus point is slow, and focus recompose kills the art of spontaneous photography. AF is OK if you are the kind of photographer who always puts his subject in the middle of the picture.
Next you will be telling us that you can MF faster and more accurately on BIF's or fast action sports than the AF of a 1D-series. Or maybe your spontaneous photography consists of static subjects.
I would bet that any DSLR's AF would be better than your MF on fast-moving subjects.
because let's face it, all AF systems are absolute crap. They can't even focus near the corners, and choosing a focus point is slow, and focus recompose kills the art of spontaneous photography. AF is OK if you are the kind of photographer who always puts his subject in the middle of the picture.
Next you will be telling us that you can MF faster and more accurately on BIF's or fast action sports than the AF of a 1D-series. Or maybe your spontaneous photography consists of static subjects. I would bet that any DSLR's AF would be better than your MF on fast-moving subjects.
Sep 02, 2009 at 09:44 PM
p.18 #2Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Tom_W wrote:
While I'm not putting a lot of faith in the rumor, it would be nice to have 24P and 1280 X 720 available as options. It would also be nice if they could, by firmware, reduce the low-ISO read noise that some are noticing (albeit through rather stringent testing).
I'm not expecting anything, but if they're going to do the video thing, I hope that they do it before September 12 when I will be shooting a great deal of video.
as someone said the power switch is off in teh rumor pic, as well, the options don't look at all like as presented by the 7D firmware....
that said, teh dc page did have a canon bigwig leaving the door open.
RGS65 wrote
A 5DII firmware upgrade was announced to update the 5DII according to CanonRumours today ;-)I'm not expecting anything, but if they're going to do the video thing, I hope that they do it before September 12 when I will be shooting a great deal of video.
as someone said the power switch is off in teh rumor pic, as well, the options don't look at all like as presented by the 7D firmware....
that said, teh dc page did have a canon bigwig leaving the door open.
Sep 02, 2009 at 09:48 PM
p.18 #3Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I would not pay more then 2000$ US for cropper 7D...now if the price is 1699$, will buy 7D + new 100mmL(after some nice reviews)..instead buying 5D MarkII. ( I have 50D)
I think that a lot people would choose 5D Mark II if price of 7D would almost the same.
Thank you
Regards,
Andy
Sep 02, 2009 at 09:51 PM
p.18 #4Canon EOS 7D Master thread
brainiac wrote:
But this is the crux of it: Canon refuses to make the camera that we all really want, by throwing everything they've got at it, whereas Nikon decided to stop haemorrhaging users by actually making the best bodies they could. People like cogitech and I don't like big heavy bodies and we do think that accurate manual focus with f2 lenses is crucial, because let's face it, all AF systems are absolute crap. They can't even focus near the corners, and choosing a focus point is slow, and focus recompose kills the art of spontaneous photography. AF is OK if...Show more →
strictly speaking more accurate than the very few 'pixel' level drawun using AF points they could just put # of degrees off from 0 on the bottom where they list iso speed and all the rest and keep a regular focusing screen....
bluetsunami wrote
Don't know why people are angry over the lamenting of a feature offered in lower tiered cameras. If anything, you shouldn't be happy about options being taken away, even if you've never utilized it. Why? Cause watch the 1DMKIV come with LCD Overlay and replaceable focus screens.strictly speaking more accurate than the very few 'pixel' level drawun using AF points they could just put # of degrees off from 0 on the bottom where they list iso speed and all the rest and keep a regular focusing screen....
Sep 02, 2009 at 09:54 PM
p.18 #5Canon EOS 7D Master thread
GeneO wrote:
That's exactly it, and that's why people like Paul (cog) and myself bemoan yet another slightly but annoyingly incomplete offering.
I still believe EOS is the best all-round system, but it's a struggle, whether I'm wielding a 1Ds3 or a 5D2 or a 500D, because Canon will not make one complete affordable bleeding edge camera which doesn't weigh a tonne.Lift some weights. It is less aggravating 
Seriously though you are vilifying Canon for not providing the features you want in a lighter weight body though I, and I think many others, like the balance of th 1D series over the xxD or 5D.
Gene
and you have your massive boat anchors.... we don't have the light bodies.
face it a 1 series is a PITA if you are say running around all day on vacation, kinda bulky
and as for lift weights the problem is if i get in better shape then i simply take longer hikes/do more in a day and the heavier body still feels like a drag....
brainiac wrote
scott f wrote
Personally I think Canon deliberately does this, otherwise we might end up getting a camera that we want, and not upgrading every year or two. Kind of like chasing a rainbow I'm afraid.I still believe EOS is the best all-round system, but it's a struggle, whether I'm wielding a 1Ds3 or a 5D2 or a 500D, because Canon will not make one complete affordable bleeding edge camera which doesn't weigh a tonne.
Seriously though you are vilifying Canon for not providing the features you want in a lighter weight body though I, and I think many others, like the balance of th 1D series over the xxD or 5D.
Gene
and you have your massive boat anchors.... we don't have the light bodies.
face it a 1 series is a PITA if you are say running around all day on vacation, kinda bulky
and as for lift weights the problem is if i get in better shape then i simply take longer hikes/do more in a day and the heavier body still feels like a drag....
Sep 02, 2009 at 09:58 PM
p.18 #6Canon EOS 7D Master thread
timbop wrote:
That's exactly it, and that's why people like Paul (cog) and myself bemoan yet another slightly but annoyingly incomplete offering.
I still believe EOS is the best all-round system, but it's a struggle, whether I'm wielding a 1Ds3 or a 5D2 or a 500D, because Canon will not make one complete affordable bleeding edge camera which doesn't weigh a tonne.Its a step better in many ways than the 50D but this isnt Canons compitition now is it....?"Yes, the competition for the 7d is the d300s, and from what we know so far the 7d exceeds the nikon in far more areas than it doesn't. Once both cameras are in people's hands we will start to see if the key factor - IQ - belongs to the 7d
don't even the 40D/50D already match or beat the D300 sensor? Now maybe the 300S do some tweaks though, but if not all but impossibel for teh 7D to not have the better IQ.
Anyway I think the real issue is whether a nice tele can get more detail from it than from a 50D and whether the AF and fps are that much better than in the 50D
digitalbug30d wrote
brainiac wrote
scott f wrote
Personally I think Canon deliberately does this, otherwise we might end up getting a camera that we want, and not upgrading every year or two. Kind of like chasing a rainbow I'm afraid.I still believe EOS is the best all-round system, but it's a struggle, whether I'm wielding a 1Ds3 or a 5D2 or a 500D, because Canon will not make one complete affordable bleeding edge camera which doesn't weigh a tonne.
don't even the 40D/50D already match or beat the D300 sensor? Now maybe the 300S do some tweaks though, but if not all but impossibel for teh 7D to not have the better IQ.
Anyway I think the real issue is whether a nice tele can get more detail from it than from a 50D and whether the AF and fps are that much better than in the 50D
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:02 PM
p.18 #7Canon EOS 7D Master thread
skibum5 wrote:
That's exactly it, and that's why people like Paul (cog) and myself bemoan yet another slightly but annoyingly incomplete offering.
I still believe EOS is the best all-round system, but it's a struggle, whether I'm wielding a 1Ds3 or a 5D2 or a 500D, because Canon will not make one complete affordable bleeding edge camera which doesn't weigh a tonne.Lift some weights. It is less aggravating
Seriously though you are vilifying Canon for not providing the features you want in a lighter weight body though I, and I think many others, like the balance of th 1D series over the xxD or 5D.
Geneand you have your massive boat anchors.... we don't have the light bodies.
face it a 1 series is a PITA if you are say running around all day on vacation, kinda bulky
and as for lift weights the problem is if i get in better shape then i simply take longer hikes/do more in a day and the heavier body still feels like a drag....
wow, life is tough.
GeneO wrote
brainiac wrote
scott f wrote
Personally I think Canon deliberately does this, otherwise we might end up getting a camera that we want, and not upgrading every year or two. Kind of like chasing a rainbow I'm afraid.I still believe EOS is the best all-round system, but it's a struggle, whether I'm wielding a 1Ds3 or a 5D2 or a 500D, because Canon will not make one complete affordable bleeding edge camera which doesn't weigh a tonne.
Seriously though you are vilifying Canon for not providing the features you want in a lighter weight body though I, and I think many others, like the balance of th 1D series over the xxD or 5D.
Gene
face it a 1 series is a PITA if you are say running around all day on vacation, kinda bulky
and as for lift weights the problem is if i get in better shape then i simply take longer hikes/do more in a day and the heavier body still feels like a drag....
wow, life is tough.
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:04 PM
p.18 #8Canon EOS 7D Master thread
bluetsunami wrote:
Have any of the previewers commented on the focus screen (or what they've discerned from using it). Would be a pleasant surprise if it was appropriate for Manual Focusing (I'm wishing upon a star). I've stated it before but its weird that they would go through all this effort with putting in a Pentaprism with 100% coverage and put in a normal focus screen. May as well just put in 100% coverage without the magnification since the AF would need to be relied on anyways.
my thoughts too kinda of weird to go teh expense to improve it so much only to kill off MF
anyway whatever
so long as they never do taht with the 5/3 series or 7 if it ever goes beyond 1.6 crop.
speaking of which maybe the 7D2 turns into the 3D and the 5D3 turns into the cheap.slow megapixel monster?
Seriously they can't up the MP much more on the 7D, it already does 8fps, they mightnot give us too much more with AF, even if they do only about 1 more step they can take, so unless it gets reallly small 20D->30D type increases it seems kinda stuck no? So maybe they go to APS-H and then FF or maybe straight to FF with the next one? 5D2 sensor at 8fps??
Have any of the previewers commented on the focus screen (or what they've discerned from using it). Would be a pleasant surprise if it was appropriate for Manual Focusing (I'm wishing upon a star). I've stated it before but its weird that they would go through all this effort with putting in a Pentaprism with 100% coverage and put in a normal focus screen. May as well just put in 100% coverage without the magnification since the AF would need to be relied on anyways.
my thoughts too kinda of weird to go teh expense to improve it so much only to kill off MF
anyway whatever
so long as they never do taht with the 5/3 series or 7 if it ever goes beyond 1.6 crop.
speaking of which maybe the 7D2 turns into the 3D and the 5D3 turns into the cheap.slow megapixel monster?
Seriously they can't up the MP much more on the 7D, it already does 8fps, they mightnot give us too much more with AF, even if they do only about 1 more step they can take, so unless it gets reallly small 20D->30D type increases it seems kinda stuck no? So maybe they go to APS-H and then FF or maybe straight to FF with the next one? 5D2 sensor at 8fps??
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:07 PM
p.18 #9Canon EOS 7D Master thread
gene A. wrote:
I would have happily paid $2500 for this body if it were full frame, but I have no interest in this camera with a cropped sensor. The sad fact is it will probably be 2 years before we see these features in a new version of the 5D.
i should hope you;d have paid $2500, that would be less than the 5D2 for a lot more features
I would have happily paid $2500 for this body if it were full frame, but I have no interest in this camera with a cropped sensor. The sad fact is it will probably be 2 years before we see these features in a new version of the 5D.
i should hope you;d have paid $2500, that would be less than the 5D2 for a lot more features
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:08 PM
p.18 #10Canon EOS 7D Master thread
gene A. wrote:
I would have happily paid $2500 for this body if it were full frame, but I have no interest in this camera with a cropped sensor. The sad fact is it will probably be 2 years before we see these features in a new version of the 5D.
And why exactly would anyone buy a 5DII (which is less than a year old) if Canon went and made this FF?
I would have happily paid $2500 for this body if it were full frame, but I have no interest in this camera with a cropped sensor. The sad fact is it will probably be 2 years before we see these features in a new version of the 5D.
And why exactly would anyone buy a 5DII (which is less than a year old) if Canon went and made this FF?
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:09 PM
p.18 #11Canon EOS 7D Master thread
timbop wrote:
I'm sorry for such harsh posts, my annoyance threshold just isn't what it used to be. It's just astonishing that the (I believe) vocal minority keep beating this horse to death (there's another thread on the screen topic), just for the sake of complaining. We all clamored for a non-1 series camera with better than the 9 point diamond AF, and what Canon delivered (admittedly on paper) is pretty amazing if it lives up to billing (RG notwithstanding). When you need a smaller AF point for small birds in trees, it's there. When you need a larger high precision AF...Show more →
yeah, i mean IF the AF delivers it should be quite a camera
i suspect the 7D may even have to evolve into FF for the mark ii
I'm sorry for such harsh posts, my annoyance threshold just isn't what it used to be. It's just astonishing that the (I believe) vocal minority keep beating this horse to death (there's another thread on the screen topic), just for the sake of complaining. We all clamored for a non-1 series camera with better than the 9 point diamond AF, and what Canon delivered (admittedly on paper) is pretty amazing if it lives up to billing (RG notwithstanding). When you need a smaller AF point for small birds in trees, it's there. When you need a larger high precision AF...Show more →
yeah, i mean IF the AF delivers it should be quite a camera
i suspect the 7D may even have to evolve into FF for the mark ii
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:10 PM
p.18 #12Canon EOS 7D Master thread
skibum5 wrote:
i should hope you;d have paid $2500, that would be less than the 5D2 for a lot more features
We may disagree on the 24-105 but on this it is obvious we are on the same wavelength.
gene A. wrote
I would have happily paid $2500 for this body if it were full frame, but I have no interest in this camera with a cropped sensor. The sad fact is it will probably be 2 years before we see these features in a new version of the 5D.We may disagree on the 24-105 but on this it is obvious we are on the same wavelength.
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:10 PM
p.18 #13Canon EOS 7D Master thread
7D overview..
Slow motion test...looks awesome.
Slow motion test...looks awesome.
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:33 PM
p.18 #14Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I will say this. I wish my 5DII had the focus points and the flash control of the 7D. That does make me feel like I got shorted on the 5DII.
Sep 02, 2009 at 10:47 PM
p.18 #15Canon EOS 7D Master thread
bluetsunami wrote:
Have any of the previewers commented on the focus screen (or what they've discerned from using it). Would be a pleasant surprise if it was appropriate for Manual Focusing (I'm wishing upon a star). I've stated it before but its weird that they would go through all this effort with putting in a Pentaprism with 100% coverage and put in a normal focus screen. May as well just put in 100% coverage without the magnification since the AF would need to be relied on anyways.
Not sure about the xxD and 5 series cameras but the evolution of the 1D series stock screen from the Ec-CIII to the Ec-CIV was a substantial change for the better. With the Mark II series (Ec-CIII) I absolutely had to use the Ec-S screen if I hoped to have any chance of manually focusing fast primes like the 85L accurately. Once the Mark III was out I found that the Ec-CIV screen was much, much better and very close to the Ec-S.
Hopefully whatever Canon did with the Ec-CIV also trickled down to the 7D's screen. My concern though is the LCD overlay and whether it might affect critical manual focusing ability, particularly if it makes its way up into the 1D series.
Have any of the previewers commented on the focus screen (or what they've discerned from using it). Would be a pleasant surprise if it was appropriate for Manual Focusing (I'm wishing upon a star). I've stated it before but its weird that they would go through all this effort with putting in a Pentaprism with 100% coverage and put in a normal focus screen. May as well just put in 100% coverage without the magnification since the AF would need to be relied on anyways.
Not sure about the xxD and 5 series cameras but the evolution of the 1D series stock screen from the Ec-CIII to the Ec-CIV was a substantial change for the better. With the Mark II series (Ec-CIII) I absolutely had to use the Ec-S screen if I hoped to have any chance of manually focusing fast primes like the 85L accurately. Once the Mark III was out I found that the Ec-CIV screen was much, much better and very close to the Ec-S.
Hopefully whatever Canon did with the Ec-CIV also trickled down to the 7D's screen. My concern though is the LCD overlay and whether it might affect critical manual focusing ability, particularly if it makes its way up into the 1D series.
Sep 02, 2009 at 11:17 PM
p.18 #16Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Hrow wrote:
And why exactly would anyone buy a 5DII (which is less than a year old) if Canon went and made this FF?
Obviously that would have been significantly more expensive.
Tim
gene A. wrote
I would have happily paid $2500 for this body if it were full frame, but I have no interest in this camera with a cropped sensor. The sad fact is it will probably be 2 years before we see these features in a new version of the 5D.Obviously that would have been significantly more expensive
.Tim
Sep 02, 2009 at 11:21 PM
p.18 #17Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Pixel Perfect wrote:
yeah, MF is the way of the future. I'm buying an S2 - just have to work out which bank to knock over first.
what the deal with M/F anyway?
kewlcanon wrote
FF is overrated....now flame mewhat the deal with M/F anyway?
Sep 02, 2009 at 11:43 PM
p.18 #18Canon EOS 7D Master thread
timbop wrote:
Yeah, it's a real pisser that NO ONE makes a digital rangefinder you like, so Canon owes it to you to make one. I wish that there was leic a m8ker of digital rangefinders with nice MFing lenses....
rumor is 9,9,09 for the M9
======================================================
3D:
FF,
More Dynamic range than the 5D,
Less high iso noise than the 5D,
Less long exposure noise than the 5D,
Full weather sealing like 1D3, 1D4,
Between 12-18Mp
Better AF than 5D, 5D2, 7D, 50D,
Video controls and options like 7D, 1D4,
More fps than the 5D,
I will be more than happy if these features show up.
Come on Canon
Yeah, it's a real pisser that NO ONE makes a digital rangefinder you like, so Canon owes it to you to make one. I wish that there was leic a m8ker of digital rangefinders with nice MFing lenses....
rumor is 9,9,09 for the M9
======================================================
3D:
FF,
More Dynamic range than the 5D,
Less high iso noise than the 5D,
Less long exposure noise than the 5D,
Full weather sealing like 1D3, 1D4,
Between 12-18Mp
Better AF than 5D, 5D2, 7D, 50D,
Video controls and options like 7D, 1D4,
More fps than the 5D,
I will be more than happy if these features show up.
Come on Canon
Sep 03, 2009 at 12:15 AM
p.18 #19Canon EOS 7D Master thread
it's all about time. canon will produce (*will have to* cos of competition) a FF with 7d features (and more) in due course.
nikon will not stand by idly. so competition is good.
nikon will not stand by idly. so competition is good.
Sep 03, 2009 at 12:50 AM
p.18 #20Canon EOS 7D Master thread
matsuib wrote:
I would imagine that the modern internal electronics of a dslr could be more sensitive to some seepage than a film body (even a pro one), such that the equivalent sealing from a physical standpoint doesn't really lead to the equivalent water resistance from an in the field standpoint.
Perhaps, but have you ever seen the electronics in a late modern film camera such as the EOS 3 or 1V? On casual glance one would think it's a digital camera with all the friggen printed boards, ribbon cables, CPUs, etc. Plus the IR film sensors and motor drive electronics. It's really extensive and dense in there. I think a few drops of water inside wouldn't do much less damage than a wholly digital SLR.
I would imagine that the modern internal electronics of a dslr could be more sensitive to some seepage than a film body (even a pro one), such that the equivalent sealing from a physical standpoint doesn't really lead to the equivalent water resistance from an in the field standpoint.
Perhaps, but have you ever seen the electronics in a late modern film camera such as the EOS 3 or 1V? On casual glance one would think it's a digital camera with all the friggen printed boards, ribbon cables, CPUs, etc. Plus the IR film sensors and motor drive electronics. It's really extensive and dense in there. I think a few drops of water inside wouldn't do much less damage than a wholly digital SLR.
Sep 03, 2009 at 01:40 AM