I just posted about late-paying couples in a different thread, and thought this was a slightly related topic.
A few people mentioned the profit level of the wedding should determine my actions when dealing with late payments. On one hand, I don't think that how much I'm making on the deal should matter.
Regardless of what you are paid, I feel like it's a photographers duty to do the best he/she can. But with that said, this late-paying problem wedding is one of those $500 weddings. Yes, I know... WAY too low. But it's one of the very first weddings I booked, and I've done about 25 weddings since then. Rest assured that my prices now are significantly higher.
As far as I'm concerned, it's those $500 weddings that gave me the experience, portfolio, and ability to propel myself to a higher quality and price bracket. So I don't regret taking the lower paying ones as my "dues" to join a better paying bracket. Besides, I've had several referrals from the low cost ones. (Hooray!) So it was probably the best marketing I could have done: showing higher prices on my website and then having all sorts of blog posts showing how many people have hired me and the great results. As far as I'm concerned, going from 1-2 weddings a year to nearly 30 is pretty cool, and worth a couple months of working my tail off.
So while I have a lot to learn (which I'm reminded of every time I log on here!), feedback from my customers shows that they are very happy with the final product. They are happier with it than I am, which I suppose is good. And I suppose in some way, that makes me successful, yes?
(I don't really have any specific questions... just wanted to hear any discussion on this.)
Oh, and one more thing: thanks to ALL of you, I've gained so much knowledge about running a business, improving my photography, and more. So thank you.
Also, thanks to my $500 weddings, I've tripled and quadrupled my prices, bought a new powermac and cinema display, two new (well, used) cameras, a plethora of lenses, new website, and more. And I bought it all with cash- while paying off some of my student loans along the way.
Is it for everyone? No. But $500 weddings got me to where I am today, and I can recognize that.
unforged wrote:
Oh, and one more thing: thanks to ALL of you, I've gained so much knowledge about running a business, improving my photography, and more. So thank you.
Also, thanks to my $500 weddings, I've tripled and quadrupled my prices, bought a new powermac and cinema display, two new (well, used) cameras, a plethora of lenses, new website, and more. And I bought it all with cash- while paying off some of my student loans along the way.
Is it for everyone? No. But $500 weddings got me to where I am today, and I can recognize that.
To each, his own. You seemed to have done pretty well. Congrats, and the best going forward.
It depends what you're giving for $500 (or £295 as it usually is on Gumtree here). Like it or not, word has got to the general public that you can get a disc of the images with print rights to 'make as many copies as you want'. If some people just want that, aren't bothered about an album beyond what they knock up themselves, etc. That's a market that's emerged in the world of eamiling images, consumer-level photo printers, digital photo books, etc.
Assuming semi-automated corrections, perhaps a bit more work on the key images, and a bunch of jpegs on disc, even with travel and wear and tear it's a day rate that trumps most of the jobs out there in the economy.
ShutterLover wrote:
even with travel and wear and tear it's a day rate that trumps most of the jobs out there in the economy.
Except you only get to work a couple dozen days a year…
Somewhere the amount of time to land the job, shoot it, process it, and get the disk to the client need to be entered in. As well as, insurance, travel, utilities, rent, advertising, etc…. the folks doing cheap weddings are screwing themselves *and* the industry.
Daniel... thanks. I just edited my initial post to be a little more clear. But I appreciate your opinion.
I guess my point is that:
a) Regardless of how much I'm paid, I try to do a good job AND
b) As much as $500 are ripped apart, they are a learning experience for those that may make their livelihood from it in the future.
Did those couples get $500 worth of photography from me? Yes. And they got a heck of a good deal as I got better. Did I learn from it? Yes. Did I learn not to do that kind of work for so little pay? You betcha. But all I know is that I wouldn't be booking $1,500-$2,000 weddings (in rural Wisconsin where that's quite high, mind you!) if I hadn't done those low-paying weddings to start with.
I suppose it's a school of hard knocks type learning experience.
I just saw that about 55 of you checked out my site that's linked to my profile here. However, that's my old site... I forgot to update my profile when I got a new site. The new site: www.studionoveau.com.
Thanks for the encouragement- it means a lot to me. And yes, I know I have a long way to go... but I'm learning more every day.
I too have agreed to do a friend of a friend's wedding (my first this coming June) for about the same cost. while i'm nervous and anxious - i am more excited and confident it will both of us will benefit. my friend for a low-cost and (hopefully) great results... and me to build my portfolio and more importantly experience. i figure after some more time and experience - pending the work is good enough - i would raise my rates and follow the same path the OP did.
Lucky_Dog wrote:
Somewhere the amount of time to land the job, shoot it, process it, and get the disk to the client need to be entered in. As well as, insurance, travel, utilities, rent, advertising, etc…. the folks doing cheap weddings are screwing themselves *and* the industry.
Everyone who started in the wedding photography business and who charged $1500 or more on their first gig please raise their hands.
jcolman wrote:
Everyone who started in the wedding photography business and who charged $1500 or more on their first gig please raise their hands.
Of course... I, however, responded to the assertion that it "trumps most of the jobs out there in the economy". I guess that it would if you were able to do $500 weddings day after day, but obviously that is not the case.
Lucky_Dog wrote:
Of course... I, however, responded to the assertion that it "trumps most of the jobs out there in the economy". I guess that it would if you were able to do $500 weddings day after day, but obviously that is not the case.
Of course not, but the point is, we all have to start somewhere and for many of us, it's doing $500 Craig's list weddings.
You also point out that "$500 weddings are screwing our industry". I maintain that there are enough budget brides that have a choice of using Uncle Bob or using a $500 shooter. These brides aren't going to pay a $2,500 rate no matter what. I fail to see how that is hurting the industry.
IMO, it's the same thing as McDonalds and the Chophouse... You can get a burger at both places. Are they producing the same quality? No. Do they cater to different audiences? Yes.
And I was one of those brides that couldn't afford $2,500. I paid for my own wedding, thank-you-very-much. I spent under $1,000 on photography, and I'm a photographer myself! But sometimes the facts are that someone can't afford to drop thousands on photography, as much as they'd like to.
Did I deserve horrible pictures because I couldn't afford it? No. I got good pictures of my wedding. Not great, but good. And in my opinion, my photographer wasn't taking away business from someone who charges $4,000 because there's no way I'd spend most of my wedding budget on one thing.
Of course not, but the point is, we all have to start somewhere and for many of us, it's doing $500 Craig's list weddings.
You also point out that "$500 weddings are screwing our industry". I maintain that there are enough budget brides that have a choice of using Uncle Bob or using a $500 shooter. These brides aren't going to pay a $2,500 rate no matter what. I fail to see how that is hurting the industry.
Dude, I don't come to forums to argue with people. Been there, done that...
If you don't see how performing a service, that *should* cost thousands, for $500 harms the industry then there isn’t much else to say. If the $500 option were not there, they would find a way to pay for photography – trust me, they wouldn’t go without. Anybody that can afford to have a “formal” wedding reception can, and will, find a way to pay for photography *if* it has value to them…. they could serve pizza or sandwiches to their guests to save money, too, but they usually don’t….
unforged wrote:
Also, thanks to my $500 weddings, I've tripled and quadrupled my prices, bought a new powermac and cinema display, two new (well, used) cameras, a plethora of lenses, new website, and more. And I bought it all with cash- while paying off some of my student loans along the way.
I didn't read the other thread, but man, you must've done a lot of wedding for $500 to pay for all that...
Lucky_Dog wrote:
Dude, I don't come to forums to argue with people. Been there, done that...
If you don't see how performing a service, that *should* cost thousands, for $500 harms the industry then there isn’t much else to say. If the $500 option were not there, they would find a way to pay for photography – trust me, they wouldn’t go without. Anybody that can afford to have a “formal” wedding reception can, and will, find a way to pay for photography *if* it has value to them…. they could serve pizza or sandwiches to their guests to save money, too, but they usually don’t….
And I stand by mine. Just like some people drive Chevy's and some people drive Benzes, there is a price point for everyone.
But nevertheless, I didn't come here to argue economics either but I would venture that there are very few people here who were able to collect over $1500 for their very first wedding.
jcolman wrote:
And I stand by mine. Just like some people drive Chevy's and some people drive Benzes, there is a price point for everyone.
But nevertheless, I didn't come here to argue economics either but I would venture that there are very few people here who were able to collect over $1500 for their very first wedding.
I'm not, and never was, talking about a first weding.... heck I did mine for free!
So I don't regret taking the lower paying ones as my "dues" to join a better paying bracket. Besides, I've had several referrals from the low cost ones. (Hooray!) So it was probably the best marketing I could have done: showing higher prices on my website and then having all sorts of blog posts showing how many people have hired me and the great results. As far as I'm concerned, going from 1-2 weddings a year to nearly 30 is pretty cool, and worth a couple months of working my tail off. 
And I suppose in some way, that makes me successful, yes?
