He had a d2x, flash with one of the Fong Dongs perched atop, and his wife with another flash on a monopod slaving him. ALL DAY. Obviously not a professional since I imagine a pro would know to stay out of the way and at least be more discrete than this.
The worst was during the ceremony - sitting in the second row, and occasionally the flash on a stick would rise up above and fire off flashes (we don't use flash for the ceremony except when the processional requires it). The most lovely part of all of this was the 5-7 beeps that the flash (I guess? do nikon flashes do this?) made after every fire. The guests were extremely annoyed and clearly many of them thought it was one of us. You would think if he didn't know to turn it off he would just stop shooting, but nope. It completely ruined the mood of the ceremony.
We had several people come to us during the cocktail hour and say, "tell your buddy to turn that $hit off" - some of them (e.g. the bridal party) knew he was family and not with us and were just joking, while other guests had to be told it had nothing to do with us. "Dueling photographers? Wow, I've never seen that before!" I'm pretty sure the B&G knew it was uncle, and we will clear that up when we see them for an upcoming bridal session.
I'm all for family members bringing their gear and having a good time (despite the exclusivity clause we have in our contract), and we don't confront anyone unless they're being really obnoxious, but this not only affected us, it also ruined the ceremony for many of the guests (I'm really hoping the B&G didn't notice, but I'm not sure how they couldn't have).
I felt embarrassed for enthusiast purchasers of pro gear everywhere...
DIdn't he (unlce bob) make a post the other day asking advice about shooting a a family wedding?
Didn't someone tell him if he wasn't allowed to use flash then to sit with the guests and pretend to be a guest?
Check your area - you may have a new competitor now that he has portfolio material
Oasis, yes, slaved Nikon flashes can be set to beep when they are ready to fire again. I will say, if he has a D2X and SB-800's slaved, he most likely is not an uncle bob. Perhaps he is a pro fashion or editorial photographer and doesn't understand wedding photography.. perhaps (more likely), he just didn't care about your shots and wanted to get his own as a "present" for the B&G.
Anytime I shoot a wedding that I am attending, I always stay out of the hired photographers way, introduce myself when its convenient and find out how long they will be offering print sales for so I don't cut into their profit when I deliver my photos to the B&G. I am sure many other do the same but I'm just as sure there are alot of people who don't care.
One thing is for sure.. had he gotten in my way or begun affecting my shots, I would more readily approach him and ask for him to back down seeing as he has pro gear, then I would uncle barney with the P&S.
That's a pretty bad case. My thought is that the couple should have stepped in and stopped them at some point -- and by not doing so, they were giving them permission. Surely somebody in the family knew they were going to do that or certainly they knew that they WERE doing what they were doing.
Sometimes I come home from a wedding and just sit quietly in the dark wondering why did these people just shell out thousands of dollars only to have a 2 or three dozen guests pop around with their cameras shooting everything we shoot. These people have no idea how rude they are to cause distractions when they couple has shelled out a great deal of money for hired pros.
I'll bet all of my last three weddings have multiple key shots with one or more guests in the background sporting a camera head (face covered by a camera held up to their eye). Simul-flashes are so common that the main reason I have to carry a battery pack on my flash is to make sure I get something shot inbetween guest camera flashes. Even trying to shoot the processional from a bit to the side of the center aisle is impossible because there are so many elbows sticking out from the pews by guests taking shots. Shooting pictures is part of the entertainment guests seem to feel entitled to at weddings.
Probably not as bad as I'm making it out to be but it's just so nice to have a handful of weddings where the guest cameras are minimal. There've been a few of those also and they are a joy.
Oh, forgot to add one of our favorite events from the evening. Long story short, we have a photobooth-style setup that uses a backdrop. He was using the backdrop to pose people against for his own shots rather than allowing guests to use the setup.
Prof - Haha, wouldn't be surprised if he's an FMer. That is, if you're a hobbyist and have a Fong on your flash, you've got to be a member of SOME photography forum right?!
I'm betting he is looking to start a wedding business though because he was a little too hell bent on getting everything he possibly could. I'm going to be pretty peeved if I see this wedding in a portfolio somewhere. I bet if he laid out his images, he will have shot the entire wedding.
rockit - yes, he was over my shoulder during the formals, firing off his flash as well. Which did ruin my exposure on several shots. You'd think with the duration of flash and shutters simulflash would be less of an issue but I see at least 5 instances out of roughly 60 images where I appear to have caught his flash in my exposure. He wasn't on the formals list so he actually had no other business being in the room at the time. He was also trying to do some directing. As my partner was trying to pose a large group, the B&G shared a quick kiss. The flash fires off behind me about 0.5 sec too late. "Damn, I missed it! Can you guys do it again?" Meanwhile, my partner is trying to get the couple's attention so we can wrap up formals and get them out to the cocktail hour asap...
Brian - thanks for the Nikon flash info. Figured it had to be the flash. Earlier in the day his wife had told me photography is a "passion" and he's not a pro. And yeah, I actually don't take my camera to weddings anymore - my GF's cousin got married recently and although the couple and several family members requested me to bring my gear, I declined out of respect for the hired.
Aaron - yep, just when you think it can't get any worse.
Peggy - I hear ya. Don't even get me started about the elbows and cams during the processional! I think guests have a right to photograph the wedding and our business is set up in such a way where we don't care about print sales. But when it's causing people in our group shots to look at other cameras or the appearance of camera-head (and flash-arm) in every other shot, it is really frustrating. I can only hope he becomes a hired pro one day and experiences the same joy.
Red - yeah, it's always the Nikon folk.
We've had numerous occasions where guests have had dSLRs (pro and prosumer) and have stayed out of the way. Makes me appreciate those people and weddings even more.
I don't know any pro that would bring all that gear to attend a wedding at which you are a guest at. Caring that stuff around is already enough, and I find myself more often than not leaving all my stuff and not bringing anything to an engagement like this. At most I would bring a P&S, never a body&lens combo.
Looks like uncle Bob wanted to be cool, sucks for you guys. In those situations, where I can see that a particular guest is being annoying with the photos, I will confront the B&G and let them know that he's being a nuisance to the guests, and is making me look bad, as the guests might assume he/she is with me, and that he could potentially interfere with their photos. I've never had to do this, but I have confronted the B&G and told them about guest photography when one was just getting in the way.
I take my gear to weddings I go to as a guest, but usually it it only one body with a fast lens on it so I don't have to use flash and potentially mess with the hired guns gear.
I would be very frustrated with the situation you described.
I have a claus in my contract about guest and family shooting pictures. It states that they are allowed as long as they are not shooting all our posed shots and causing a a problem. There have been several times where I put my foot down about people shooting. It's distracting to me and the people that are having their pictures done. For instance, the other day the groom's sister was looking at someone else's camera. I stopped Dennis and pointed at his camera. I then said..Ladies, this is the camera that has been paid for. These are the pictures that will go in the album. Usually they get the message and so does ther person behind us. Yvette
dennisyvette wrote:
I have a claus in my contract about guest and family shooting pictures. It states that they are allowed as long as they are not shooting all our posed shots and causing a a problem. There have been several times where I put my foot down about people shooting. It's distracting to me and the people that are having their pictures done. For instance, the other day the groom's sister was looking at someone else's camera. I stopped Dennis and pointed at his camera. I then said..Ladies, this is the camera that has been paid for. These are the pictures that will go in the album. Usually they get the message and so does ther person behind us. Yvette...Show more →
Everyone should have this clause. I've never used it, but it doesn't mean I wouldn't, especially in a case like this. I would have also talked to the B&G and told them that uncle bob is going to ruin your pictures if you don't get him to stop.
I'm not paid to confront guests. I don't ask people to stop taking pictures. Thats a fight I won't have with guests. Makes you look like a serious A**. Let the B&G do it. They should be respected by the guests and be able to quickly and quietly take care of the issue.
dennisyvette wrote:
I have a claus in my contract about guest and family shooting pictures. It states that they are allowed as long as they are not shooting all our posed shots and causing a a problem. There have been several times where I put my foot down about people shooting. It's distracting to me and the people that are having their pictures done. For instance, the other day the groom's sister was looking at someone else's camera. I stopped Dennis and pointed at his camera. I then said..Ladies, this is the camera that has been paid for. These are the pictures that will go in the album. Usually they get the message and so does ther person behind us. Yvette...Show more →
I just have to ask one thing, I love photography and all..but pros that bring even the basic of gear when you are a guest at a wedding, do you just LOVE it that much?? Before getting into this line of work I would have never thought of bringing even a point and shoot and now that I'm in this business, I'd welcome going to a wedding as a guest and just enjoy it without a camera!
Uncle bob's (or in our case, younger friends or family members of the couple wanting to get into the business) have been becoming a problem. They just don't know how to be unobtrusive, we end up with quite a few great moments at the ceremony that have a big DSLR sticking out in them.
We're working on some info and sample images that we're going to show clients so they can be aware of it and ward off any of their family that talk about bringing their new Canons.
j.curtis wrote:
I'm not paid to confront guests. I don't ask people to stop taking pictures. Thats a fight I won't have with guests. Makes you look like a serious A**. Let the B&G do it. They should be respected by the guests and be able to quickly and quietly take care of the issue.
I agree, but it's always such a thin line between telling the B&G something to stress them out vs. just taking care of it and telling them later.
And we do have the clause in the contract regarding family members being permitted to photograph so long as they don't interfere/distract us. But, I personally just don't have the cajones to remind the couple of the clause during their big day...
I do like the "this is the camera that's being paid" approach, Yvette....cute and to the point...
ggrtist wrote:
We're working on some info and sample images that we're going to show clients so they can be aware of it and ward off any of their family that talk about bringing their new Canons.
Awesome idea - hope you'll share when you're done.
We're working on some info and sample images that we're going to show clients so they can be aware of it and ward off any of their family that talk about bringing their new Canons.
Yes, we want to make sure they're all Nikons . Just kidding. People are idiots...it's too bad when they have to make your job harder because of it.
I think I just thought of a gold mine... I could produce replacement decals stating "D40", "D40x" and "D50" and sell to Uncle Bobs and these types alike. Nikoners could cover their "D2xs", "D2x", "D200", soon "D3" and "D300", and then claim their harmless intentions because they are using a prosumer camera.
Being serious, that is extremely rude. Photographers HAVE to know their shutter clicks, AF beeps, flash bursts, and flash ready beeps are very distracting.
That is, if you're a hobbyist and have a Fong on your flash, you've got to be a member of SOME photography forum right?!