Dream on at best you will get the 5D AF, you are not going to see weather sealing. After the 40D the next upgrade will be the 1dsMKIII which is NOT going to happen until the AF issue with the 1dMKIII gets fixed. The 5D will not be upgraded at least for another 12 months.
Who is talking about weathersealing? 5D AF would be an upgrade to the current 30D AF, wouldn't it?
I agree with you, we will see the 40D in August, 1Ds Mk III in September-October and no 5D Mk II (or however it will end up being called) until PMA 2008. Which is good because I'll be looking long and hard at the 5D MkII as a sibling for my 1D Mk III
Gerry Szarek wrote:
.........The 5D will not be upgraded at least for another 12 months.
Gerry, I think you are right! 12 months at a minimum before there's a 5D replacement
Why does Canon need to one-up themselves on this totally awesome digital FF niche camera that has not one single competitor in the marketplace.
(except, of course, Canon's own 1Ds MkI and 1Ds MkII)
Canon does not need to introduce a 6D / 5DMkII....
except maybe just because they can!
EOSMIKE wrote:
Gerry, I think you are right! 12 months at a minimum before there's a 5D replacement
Why does Canon need to one-up themselves on this totally awesome digital FF niche camera that has not one single competitor in the marketplace.
(except, of course, Canon's own 1Ds MkI and 1Ds MkII)
Canon does not need to introduce a 6D / 5DMkII....
Canon's shareholders might think otherwise. It's the nature of business.
Canon shareholders wouldn't want the 6D introduced before it would actually be profitable to do so. How do you know it would be profitable at this time, or at any time?
I don't know the answer, and I doubt you do either!
(The information that I wrote far above is just my best guess... and trust me, it's a very educated one)
There is no competition for the 5D, but it's getting old. Expect a minor upgrade like the 20d-->30D upgrade - bigger LCD and dust shaker function, DiGiC 3 as well.
40D...10mp, dust shaker, 3" LCD, DiGiC3 are givens.
Probably better battery life, perhaps a new battery.
better AF would be nice and keep it up with the Jones', i doubt live view or weather sealing but perhaps they'll bring out 2 models....the 5D was a surprise when it showed up if you recall. If Nikon can sell D200s at $1800ish and the pattern canon has had suggests the 40D will retail for 1299 when released, there is a $1000 gap to the 5D...room for a 1.6 crop weather sealed live view unit at $1799.
Only time will tell.
And from the Canon folks i've spoken with it's not what we the users want, but what canon thinks it needs to keep the competetion down. They fear sony, not nikon. A 500XTi with anti shake built in would not be too surprising either, but don't expect that feature to migrate up the model line.
Canon shareholders wouldn't want the 6D introduced before it would actually be profitable to do so. How do you know it would be profitable at this time, or at any time?
I don't know the answer, and I doubt you do either!
(The information that I wrote far above is just my best guess... and trust me, it's a very educated one)
I didn't say I knew the answer; I just mean in business it's expected you upgrade products even if technically there's not much point (although Canon seems to take it's own good time and not offer knee jerk reactions to the competition). The 5D is not a great seller despite it's ability. I see Canon possibly splitting the 5D into two lines: a lower cost version that is basically the 5D minus a feature or two sitting just above $2000 and a new one that is a full on upgrade that will sell for around $3000. That way they start realizing their goal of spreading FF into more market areas, but satisfying those that can afford a top of the line FF but certainly couldn't or wouldn't go for the 1Ds III say. Next year will see Sony at least competing against the 5D IMO; they won't target the DX3 or 1Ds III with their FF of course, so the 5D is most likely target, and one thing for sure it'll be very well specced, think Minolta 9D for inspiration.
I'd be surprised not to see a PMA release or announcement for 5D successor(s).
Edited by Pixel Perfect on Jul 17, 2007 at 08:13 AM GMT
timbop wrote:
ISO6400 on the 40D will be too much to hope for, particularly if it is a 10mp sensor (which is likely). It will probably be a different sensor from he XTi, with better signal.noise performance.
A different sensor with a higher IQ would be nice, whatever mp that will be. I would like to see 12mp but 10mp would be fine if it has increased IQ and less noise.
I think you are dreaming in techni-colour!
don't you think TWO (2) full frame sensor dSLRs from Canon is enough
NO body else has even one, and now you want Canon to have THREE!
The 5D is a great camera, but not a "HOT" seller for these main reasons:
1> it's price (you can spend a little more and get a 1D2)
2> for most people a dREB or 30D is all they really need
3> it's a niche dSLR that suits a relatively small group of Pixel Perfect Peeper People (sorry, couldn't help myself.. hey, now say that fast ten times).
That truth is good, because that makes it a very unique product.
EOSMIKE said:
2> for most people a dREB or 30D is all they really need
The reality is that many people prefer high pixel density sensors (like XTi) over FF. It is not only bird shooters but semi-macro aficionados as well..
I want "40 D" with almost everything 1D mkIII has but with 1.6 sensor (I did not mention the price, did I?)
If 40D does not have a good focusing system (from 1d Mk II, at least) than it is not for me. On the second thought, if this new camera gives me clean ISO1600 - I would be interested too.
mfurman wrote:
The reality is that many people prefer high pixel density sensors (like XTi) over FF. It is not only bird shooters but semi-macro aficionados.
NO... mfurman, most people buy the dREBs or 30D not for their high pixel sensors, but their (relatively low) price. $$$$$$. These folks could care less about the 1-series or 5D, only because they do not wish to spend that much on a camera (any camera).
PS That is why Nikon is introducing so many levels of consumer grade dSLRs, I have lost count (D40 / D40x / D50 / D70s / D80 etc. etc).
Regardless of the features, they sell mainly because they are priced to meet the demand.
EOSMIKE wrote:
NO... mfurman, most people buy the dREBs or 30D not for their high pixel sensors, but their (relatively low) price. $$$$$$. These folks could care less about the 1-series or 5D, only because they do not wish to spend that much on a camera (any camera).
PS That is why Nikon is introducing so many levels of consumer grade dSLRs, I have lost count (D40 / D40x / D50 / D70s / D80 etc. etc).
Regardless of the features, they sell mainly because they are priced to meet the demand.
I think you are dreaming in techni-colour!
don't you think TWO (2) full frame sensor dSLRs from Canon is enough
NO body else has even one, and now you want Canon to have THREE!
The 5D is a great camera, but not a "HOT" seller for these main reasons:
1> it's price (you can spend a little more and get a 1D2)
2> for most people a dREB or 30D is all they really need
3> it's a niche dSLR that suits a relatively small group of Pixel Perfect Peeper People (sorry, couldn't help myself.. hey, now say that fast ten times).
That truth is good, because that makes it a very unique product. ...Show more →
Better than wallowing in monochrome.
FF is Canon's long term future; the crop will be for entry level only. I do believe at one stage Canon had several FF cameras, 3 is nothing.
You sound like a snob that would like to keep the 5D in the hands of a tiny few for bragging rights.
EOSMIKE wrote:
NO... mfurman, most people buy the dREBs or 30D not for their high pixel sensors, but their (relatively low) price. $$$$$$. These folks could care less about the 1-series or 5D, only because they do not wish to spend that much on a camera (any camera).
PS That is why Nikon is introducing so many levels of consumer grade dSLRs, I have lost count (D40 / D40x / D50 / D70s / D80 etc. etc).
Regardless of the features, they sell mainly because they are priced to meet the demand.
Those are good points.
I think the market for the 30D is mostly driven by the fact that people do want a DSLR like you say but still the 30D is priced quite a bit higher than the D40, D80, and the Canon Rebels. It's that less than $1000.00 market that Canon and Nikon has so successfully served.
The 30D's price and features do say that the buyer knows a little more than your average point and shoot move up buyer. I know some just go with the price and feel they're getting a much better camera and they are, but you still have those that want to learn a little more about photography and may be moving up from the Rebels, or want their first DSLR to be a better model than the cheaper ones. The D200 is the same on the Nikon side of the fence.
mfurman wrote:
The reality is that many people prefer high pixel density sensors (like XTi) over FF. It is not only bird shooters but semi-macro aficionados as well..
I want "40 D" with almost everything 1D mkIII has but with 1.6 sensor (I did not mention the price, did I?)
If 40D does not have a good focusing system (from 1d Mk II, at least) than it is not for me. On the second thought, if this new camera gives me clean ISO1600 - I would be interested too.
Edited by mfurman on Jul 16, 2007 at 09:02 PM GMT
Yes I want a high density sensor 1.6x 40D with an improved focus system. Hopefully they will improve the viewfinder, I don't care if it is 10 or 12 MP as long as the sensor is low noise. Throw in the lens specific focus micro adjustment and I'm sold. I'm sure we'll get dust removal, Digic III and a larger LCD. Anything beyond that is gravy...
Pixel Perfect wrote:
The 5D is not a great seller despite it's ability.
Do you have published numbers to support this claim? The 5D is selling VERY well in Asia. In Asia, it has been selling steadily since its introduction and competing relatively well against anything else out there including any 1.6x, 1.5x, 4/3 camera out there today. None of this surge of sales at introduction that tails off until a successor is released that the cheaper bodies almost always experience.
For what it is (a very expensive camera), the 5D has sold exactly or better than what Canon expected.
I see Canon possibly splitting the 5D into two lines: a lower cost version that is basically the 5D minus a feature or two sitting just above $2000 and a new one that is a full on upgrade that will sell for around $3000.
You want them to strip down the 5D more?? How would they do that? The CF door on the 5D is already bad enough (creaky). 3 FPS becomes 2? No thanks. No spot metering? ... The 5D by many accounts is already a watered down 30D with a full 35mm frame sensor in it. And don't you remember all the talk about the 5D being "crippled" at introduction to save 1Ds2 sales?
Edited by StevenPA on Jul 17, 2007 at 11:49 AM GMT
mfurman wrote:
If 40D does not have a good focusing system (from 1d Mk II, at least) than it is not for me.
IMO I dont see how that will ever happen. The focusing system of the 1D/1Ds is one of many features that distinguishes a pro-grade camera from a consumer grade camera. My feeling is that may tweak the AF from the 30D but not fully replace it with the AF from the 1D/1Ds.
1> the dREB XTi has better AF etc.
2> the recently introduced 1DMK3 has improved FPS, battery and many other innovative features
3> the 30D replacement looks to move upscale, to compete directly with the D200 (which except for the sensor, Nikon is having great sales success with)
I feel Canon will introduce a new low end body between now and Xmas (below the XTi, such as a dREB "lite") a camera that will offer similar features and pricing of the Nikon D40 / D40x
? 